Who is going to buy and fly the G-6?

[7.GShAP/Silas]

8 Il-2s I don't think they would be possible. I think the only one left is the arrow wing late 1943 type, and that would be it.

 

 

 

 

IL-2M3(arrow wing type, as you put it) and the IL-10.  A man can dream.

Edited February 2, 2018 by 7.GShAP/Silas

[Finkeren]

Don't forget the Yak-9B

[LFL-EightyPLUS]

i think we would need a bit more diversity with regards to aircraft category, not version off a certain type. more cruisers and bombers...Surely you guys would prefer an entire new machine?

[Wolfram-Harms]

...wouldt you rather see a HE219 UHU? or a Arado 234? i know they were quite rare, but then again, so was a 262...

 

That might be a nice field of development for the IL-2 team for years to come - building additional planes, which could be bought single?

 

The Arado was much more rare than the Me 262. Only a bit more than 230 were built (Me 262: 1433).

[Finkeren]

i think we would need a bit more diversity with regards to aircraft category, not version off a certain type. more cruisers and bombers...Surely you guys would prefer an entire new machine?

 

Of course.

 

Fortunately we have the Po-2 coming, but we still need at a bare minimum TB-3, SB-2M, DB-3/IL-4, Su-2, Tu-2S and a B-25 for the Soviet plane set to feel fleshed out with non-fighters.

What about you guys? wouldt you rather see a HE219 UHU? or a Arado 234? 

Not really, no. The Blitz-bomber might be a bit of fun, but it was fairly unicorn-ish, and we have absolutely no practical use of the He 219.

 

Give me a Me 410 or Ju 188.

[Wolfram-Harms]

Give me a Me 410 ...

 

Here comes...

 

[LFL-EightyPLUS]

By the way: I truly cant wait for the PO-2...Currently its the only plane next to the P38 i cant wait for!

 

(edit): the ME410 would be a GREAT and i mean GREAT addon as well....imagine stalking bombers at night....

Edited February 2, 2018 by LFL-EightyPLUS

[Trooper117]

Give me a Me 410

 

 

''Don't open the bomb bay doors!''

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAcgUPjb16Q

[Field-Ops]

8 Bf 109s actually....

 

It is one of the most-produced and iconic fighters, though.

 

I do wonder when we will get to 8 Yaks or 8 IL-2s....

Wishful thinking here, but I could really go for a "yak-pak" for a collectors bundle. Hell, thats a good way of covering a wide range of series of aircrafts unless they wanted to go the "modifications" route. 

 

One day I hope they separate out the mods that make the planes into a different series and actually list the plane as that series in the plane selection screen. I mean in the future if we ever get several series of aircrafts it wouldnt make sense to continue to have the La-5 series 8 turn into an early LA5-F with the activation of the engine mod. As a newer player you'd have to learn the ins and outs of game menu navigation to know that the plane selection is actually quite a bit more diverse than what that menu tells you. "Oh, there is a PE-2 Series 110 hiding in the PE-2 series 87 modifications screen". I can see it getting harder to sell different variants of the planes that require more research than they are worth if they just keep adding modifications to the planes instead. 

 

Alternatively i can see it working out even better if you had a tree of aircrafts to select from. What I mean is have the base LA-5 to select, then within that menu you can choose LA5 series 8, LA5-F (dunno what series of that we have), LA5-FN series 2, and whatever other series they add later. Same with all the other planes. Select the Bf-109 and the tree expands to select the type. Perhaps even add in parenthesis what year that aircraft operated or was introduced.

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

The biggest angst does seem to come from a couple of VVS-only members that try to restrict the most produced, most modded, most widely used and in a way most interesting Bf109 model to a narrow one-month time frame on one map, for whatever made up reasons.

This is precisely the case.

 

Now if the devs prenerfed a collector plane due to dubious reasons and make it a G2 / G4 copy with just different guns and Beulen, how could anyone demand 20€ extra for it. We want the customization appropriate to this plane. If it was a barebone version, people would like their money back, I'm sure of that.

 

G6 version of the Me109 series regards the timeframe of the G6, like the FN of La5 series regards the timeframe of FN, or 1B of the Yak series regards the timeframe of 1B. There is no "map timeframe" in there as a sublayer.

 

 

I fly VVS myself, since December almost exclusively. How other VVS pilots are preoccupied against the G6 is ridiculous. Do they fear competition on the deck? We can still outturn it with the Yaks, catch it on deck with La5FN, outgun it with Yak 7, outfight it at altitude even with the MiG.

 

The VVS Angst is silly, especially since mods are always optional..

Edited February 3, 2018 by SCG_Red_Wolf

[Finkeren]

G6 version of the Me109 series regards the timeframe of the G6, like the FN of La5 series regards the timeframe of FN, or 1B of the Yak series regards the timeframe of 1B. There is no "map timeframe" in there as a sublayer.

 

I fly VVS myself, since December almost exclusively. How other VVS pilots are preoccupied against the G6 is ridiculous. Do they fear competition on the deck? We can still outturn it with the Yaks, catch it on deck with La5FN, outgun it with Yak 7, outfight it at altitude even with the MiG.

 

The VVS Angst is silly, especially since mods are always optional..

Sorry, but this is silly. Noone “fears” the G6 other than perhaps a few LW-only pilots who fear it might not be good enough for their taste. Even if it had the MW50 it wouldn’t change things up too much. A well-flown 109 would still be nigh untouchable and a poorly flown one would still get seal-clubbed.

 

The thing about the equipment of a plane pertaining specifically to that plane type, I disagree with. This is not DCS, plane types in this game don’t exist in a vacuum. They fit in within a historical set of other planes and maps within a specific time frame. The only real exception to this rule are the skins. This goes for regular planes and collector’s planes alike.

 

Also: If we were to go by this logic, we lack a hell of a lot of modifications for other aircraft - most noticably the Spit Mk. V - but also the Soviet fighters. Strictly speaking, the entire production run of, for instance, the Yak-1 from late 1940 through early 1944 is one type of aircraft (there never was an official designation of what we call “Yak-1b” - they were all Yak-1’s) Should we demand, that the entire production run of the Yak-1 be represented through mods? No, of course not, we have 2 planes representing roughly series 69 and series 127, and each fit within a specific timeframe. That’s how this sim has always handled things.

[ShamrockOneFive]

Thing is, when you look at the make-up of the VVS fighter corps you see that they have a whole bunch of different aircraft. From the 1930s I-15/I-16s and then the new generation triplets which resulted in the MiG-1/3, LaGG-3 and Yak-1/7 and then two of those evolving. That's already a lot of aircraft and that doesn't even begin to cover all of the different lend lease types. IL-2 is doing a pretty good job of covering what the VVS fighter corps uses on a per battle basis.

 

The Luftwaffe is a different case from an aircraft diversity standpoint because they pretty much standardized on the Bf109 and the FW190 as their fighters with a lot of iteration. I don't see there being too many Bf109s when its THE fighter of the Luftwaffe. Especially for the first two years of the war. If you want to simulate a key battle you don't leave out the key player in it.

 

Career mode will benefit greatly as we'll be able to progress from Bf109E and F through to the mid G series all on the eastern front from Moscow though Stalingrad to Kuban. Incrementally upgrading to the newest aircraft as time goes on experiencing that incremental change that the pilots in those units sometimes experienced.

[=EXPEND=Tripwire]

Wait? 8!??

 

So thats: E4, F2, F4 ,G2, G4 G6, G14, K4...ooh yeah...8 sorry..

To me i see 2 nearly identical machines in one expansion pack a bit as overkill...What about you guys? wouldt you rather see a HE219 UHU? or a Arado 234? i know they were quite rare, but then again, so was a 262...

 

Nope. More 109's the better. Each one has appreciable differences and can't wait to fly them all.

 

[CUJO_1970]

Anyone who thinks 109s are all the same don't fly them very often.

 

I can tell quite a difference even between G2 and G4 and the way you handle them in a fight can be quite different.

 

And the G14 will be nothing like the G6.

[Mac_Messer]

Without making a statement: havent you guys seen enough BF109's? i mean including Operation Bodenplaten, the total count is at no less then 7 BF109's which all differ marginally from eachother...ive olways seen the last few BF109's as fillers, just to make the list look bigger...Or am i missing something?  

You do have a point with the 109G4 for example. In an of itself, the aircraft is not nearly enough of a novum for a 109 pilot to order Battle of Kuban, especially if one already owns earlier titles. I`ve been against modelling it so the 109G6 could be a standard aircraft. So i paid 15$ to get a single aircraft because devs denied me that in the Standard/Premium version of the game.

 

For me as 109 virtual pilot almost exclusively there is no possible shortage of the Messerschmitt. If future BoX titles don`t feature the 109 (instead giving us Arado or the Uhu), I don`t buy the game. Especially for the Western theatre Luftwaffles need urgently 109 versions that apply both for low altitude and high altitude combat, and that requires 109 AS types.  Some people on the forums already demand that LW players fly Late 1942/Early 1943 109 models against 1944 VVS aircraft which I find strange. As a customer buying BoK i paid for the Yak, for the P39 and for the Boston, so they aswell could be honorable enough to pay for my favorite plane.

[BlitzPig_EL]

About the only way to break up the 109/190 hegemony (for lack of a better word) would be the HS 123, and well, umm...  after that I got nothing.

 

The Luftwaffe in some ways did itself a favor by standardizing on the two main types, but they sure didn't do us flight sim fans hoping for more diversity of aircraft types any favors.    

 

The Regia Aeronautica does offer up the opportunity for more different single seater types, as do the Finns, with their eclectic collection of fighters.

[Rolling_Thunder]

Hey lets drop the G6 as so many folk seem so disapointed and worried about its "mods". How as its a collector plane so shouldnt fit a timeframe or battle, how there are too many 109s already.

Lets drop the 109 and have a hurricane or a typhoon or any british aircraft, how about an american aircraft. No? It has to be german and it has to have ALL options available doesnt matter on timeframe?

[Rolling_Thunder]

I guess sarcasm doesn't translate too well.

[Dakpilot]

  Some people on the forums already demand that LW players fly Late 1942/Early 1943 109 models against 1944 VVS aircraft which I find strange. As a customer buying BoK i paid for the Yak, for the P39 and for the Boston, so they aswell could be honorable enough to pay for my favorite plane.

 

Total hogwash....

 

which 1944 VVS aircraft are you talking of?

 

There are none, even the "collector" La-5 FN is a July 43 Model series 2, same as Yak-1b "collector plane" , even earlier introduction

 

All VVS aircraft in Kuban pack are all models compatible with G4 timeframe if not earlier, the FN and G6 just add 2nd half of 43 aircraft as far as Kuban is concerned (when the main "famous Kuban air battles" had already died down anyway) very useful and nice to have but not essential

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

[LukeFF]

Some people on the forums already demand that LW players fly Late 1942/Early 1943 109 models against 1944 VVS aircraft which I find strange.

And exactly which 1944 Soviet planes are those?

[Finkeren]

And exactly which 1944 Soviet planes are those?

I don’t get this way of argument. It’s like the question I got about where the discussion was about the upcoming mods for the La-5FN, when there are pretty much no potential mods to discuss for that plane.

 

Why make up stuff like that?

[ShamrockOneFive]

Someone doing the hyperbole thing again?

 

Every single aircraft lined up in IL-2: Battle of Kuban fits the scenario. Even the G-6 and La-5FN. They are the appropriate sub models and types to all fit in there properly.

[Panthera]

Only thing I'm missing from Kuban is the 1.58/1.65ata FW190A5

[CUJO_1970]

Only thing I'm missing from Kuban is the 1.58/1.65ata FW190A5

 

Oh man don't do that, their heads will explode and this thread will never die

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

...except there already is a 1.65 ata A-5 in the game.

They mean the later one used for fighters, it was 1.58 ata at first supercharger gear, and 1.65 ata at second supercharger gear I think (or the other way around). If it was used during the Kuban campaign it would be good to have it. A couple other goodies would be a torpedo mod for the Ju 88 and a La-5F with the mid-1943 airframe (bubble canopy, etc), this one was more prominent than the early La-5FN and would give some performance improvements over our current "field mod" La-5F.

[JtD]

If it was used during the Kuban campaign it would be good to have it.

It wasn't. It's mid 1944. A bit earlier than widespread use of MW50 on 109's.

[Finkeren]

It wasn't. It's mid 1944. A bit earlier than widespread use of MW50 on 109's.

And here we go again. Buckle up for another 10 pages of whining about “pre-nerfing” and “why do you want to limit content?”

 

Thanks for the clarification though JtD.

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

Finkeren, if you would actually play the game instead of play on the forums, you'd also be more interested in a diverse planeset, especially if you were playing Luftwaffe as well.

 

With everything revolving around mostly the 109 airframe, you'd see that diversity comes through mods.

[Aap]

And here we go again. Buckle up for another 10 pages of whining about “pre-nerfing” and “why do you want to limit content?”

 

So where do you see these tens pages of whining about "pre-nerfing"? Just want to stir up another argument, while clearly being one of the biggest whiners about possible mods for a plane that has not been even released yet and that you probably won't even use much?

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

That's the point. "One he won't use much."

 

If there was a whining award for these forums, he'd bear it on his chest, big golden #1.

[Dakpilot]

Always a shame when eventually it drops down to attacking the person rather than discussing the subject

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

[Aap]

Always a shame when eventually it drops down to attacking the person rather than discussing the subject

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

Seriously? What "subject" was Finkeren on, when she turned JtD's simple fact into "tens of pages of whining about pre-nerfing"? Or you mean it is a "subject" when someone derails a thread by making clearly understandable but indirect false accusations, but it is a shame if he/she gets called out for it? Edited February 4, 2018 by II./JG77_Kemp

[Trooper117]

It's up to the individual whether they like to discuss their ideas, their perceptions, and their preferences for this game and their interest in WWII aviation at length on this forum...

I see nothing wrong if people spend more time in the forums than playing the game.

Nothing to get worried about

[Dakpilot]

Sriously? What "subject" was Finkeren on, when she turned JtD's simple fact into "tens of pages of whining about pre-nerfing"? Or you mean it is a "subject" when someone derails a thread by making clearly understandable but inderict false accusitions, but it is a shame if he/she gets called out for it?

 

But there has been ten pages of why the G6 "collector plane" should be treated differently to all the other released collector planes have been, including the yet released FN

 

and then another comment of needing out of time period mods on the A5 being missing, it was a bit of a facepalm moment, but yet you still have to make it personal with He/she slights

 

quite simply no aircraft have been released with enough 'mods' for them to represent +1 years of development they are all pretty time specific

 

Yes the G6 could be used in Bodenplatte with MW-50, but without AS engine late Erla canopy and tall tail it would be out of place, but very few would EVER use it due to K4 G14 etc.

 

to call for all those features to be included with G6 is beyond scope of any other aircraft released, it already has 30mm added (unhistoric for kuban) due to public demand, Mw-50 is a lot more work than adding a different calibre gun.

 

Even with all evidence of G6 and FN being intended for expanding Kuban planeset people still want more, it bothers me not one bit if it came with all mods, I would enjoy it just the same, and be happy with the added value

 

but the end result is the same, calling for a mid 44 aircraft be it 109 or now 190 would leave it an outlier without any contemporaries, hence the added work for dev's is redundant, and also would set a precedent of expectation for all further aircraft to be all encompassing in time scale

 

Ultimately justifying personal attacks when your own view is disagreed with is not defensible

 

end of the day is that it will be available soon and is way to far down the production line for any customer 'sway' to have effect on what the product is, 

 

the whole derailing of this thread started with some wanting MW-50 for use in Kuban, when this was shown to be not correct, it continued with the need for it anyway, which certainly is debatable, if we get it great, it can be restricted as has been said, but it is not needed, just as 30mm, but there was no great backlash against that.

 

give an inch take a mile..

 

G4 released for Kuban 

 

But not fair we need G6 for latter part of campaign

 

G6 announced as collector plane

 

must have 30mm

 

30mm announced as available for G6

 

But it must have MW-50....

 

FN announced as collector plane

 

cool we have mid 43 La-5 for Kuban

 

Cheers, Dakpilot

[Aap]

But there has been ten pages of why the G6 "collector plane" should be treated differently to all the other released collector planes have been, including the yet released FN

 

"But, but", now you try to change the subject again? "But" okay, where are these ten pages of that?

 

Let's keep the topic short.

1. Bf109 G6 is a separate collector plane. Clear and simple and easily verifiable fact. Some people try to make a case against that fact.

2. It would be nice to have as many historical mods available for that plane as possible. My opinion, shared by some other players. A big problem and reason for argument for some people on the forum.

No need to drag it on any further.

Edited February 4, 2018 by II./JG77_Kemp

[Finkeren]

Finkeren, if you would actually play the game instead of play on the forums, you'd also be more interested in a diverse planeset, especially if you were playing Luftwaffe as well.

 

With everything revolving around mostly the 109 airframe, you'd see that diversity comes through mods.

The personal stuff aside, where exactly do you see me being against diversity? As I said a few posts back, the only thing that feels a bit redundant is the G2/G4 split, and even that makes sense when you consider the format of the sim.

 

The reason i personally think the MW50 doesn’t belong (and it is just that: my personal opinion) is because it falls outside the timeframe of the sim as it is now.

 

Oh and BTW: I fly LW planes a lot. The Fw 190 is my second favorite fighter after the MiG-3. In MP I usually fly for the side that’s currently losing or underpopulated when I log on, and that means that I probably fly VVS more than LW, but not by much.

[Aap]

Ultimately justifying personal attacks when your own view is disagreed with is not defensible

About the personal attack part, when someone clearly directly quotes me "don't understand why someone wants to limit content" and combines that quote with "tens pages of whining" and "pre-nerfing" and gets called out for it, that is a personal attack? I challenge you to find any post where I whine about any possible mod being included or excluded on any planes. Look instead who has the most posts in this thread AGAINST some possible mod. Who is whining exactly?

Just curious, if I posted, just in general, that some people don't understand the kindergarten level difference between words like "fitting somewhere" and "restricted to it", then it is of course just a general statement and nobody should comment on it?

[Field-Ops]

Take it this way. La5 did not receive engine mod until Kuban was in development for some time. I dont expect the G6 to have MW-50 until Bodenplatte is in its full development cycle. 

[Finkeren]

Come on Kemp: You know perfectly well, that I understand your point of view, I just disagree.

 

What ticks me off is when you claim to have some kind of “facts” about how collector’s planes are to be treated differently than other planes. There are no such “facts”, just opinions.