Jazzed about Flying Circus - Thoughts on Plane Set

[US103_Baer]

Sorry guys, the Halb CL2 is not a recon or bomber. It's a donkey. In RoF form it simply doesn't climb or lift anything. The DFW carries more bomb load, climbs to proper recon height and is miles better for 90% of Central 2 seater work.

 

I agree with Panthercules on the Breguet. It also is a proper bomber/recon suitable for that role in late war scenarios. In fact I think it carries more than 2x the bomb load and is better all round than the Bristol F2b. It's an awesome plane.

 

If you're only going to have 1x 2 seater on each side, then those planes need to perform core roles properly.

Edited November 19, 2017 by PaulLMF

[6./ZG26_5tuka]

Sorry guys, the Halb CL2 is not a recon or bomber. It's a donkey. In RoF form it simply doesn't climb or lift anything.

Which is why I hope it's FM will be refurbishmed tiogether with the graphics.

[PatrickAWlson]

Sorry guys, the Halb CL2 is not a recon or bomber. It's a donkey. In RoF form it simply doesn't climb or lift anything. The DFW carries more bomb load, climbs to proper recon height and is miles better for 90% of Central 2 seater work.

 

I agree with Panthercules on the Breguet. It also is a proper bomber/recon suitable for that role in late war scenarios. In fact I think it carries more than 2x the bomb load and is better all round than the Bristol F2b. It's an awesome plane.

 

If you're only going to have 1x 2 seater on each side, then those planes need to perform core roles properly.

We'll see what the future brings. I think two seaters are a tougher sell in WWI because they are used more for recon and less for blowing things up.  I hope the future shows them some love as the skys seem empty without them. 

 

IMHO the community has to help.  It seems to me that so much is driven by multiplayer match ups.  As long as that remains true WWI recon planes are not going to get built until they become fun to fly in MP.  There has to be some way to make photography and artillery spotting central to winning in MP.  Way back in RB2 I participated in some great online wars.  We had a rule: you had to do a successful recon before flying a bombing mission.  Winning/losing was about recon and bombing and fighters took their natural role - secondary.  The "rule" was a gentleman's agreement.  I hope that something like that can be coded into the game for online play .. i.e. make photography a prerequisite to seeing a viable target.

[SeaW0lf]

We'll see what the future brings. I think two seaters are a tougher sell in WWI because they are used more for recon and less for blowing things up.  I hope the future shows them some love as the skys seem empty without them. 

 

IMHO the community has to help.  It seems to me that so much is driven by multiplayer match ups.  As long as that remains true WWI recon planes are not going to get built until they become fun to fly in MP.  There has to be some way to make photography and artillery spotting central to winning in MP.  Way back in RB2 I participated in some great online wars.  We had a rule: you had to do a successful recon before flying a bombing mission.  Winning/losing was about recon and bombing and fighters took their natural role - secondary.  The "rule" was a gentleman's agreement.  I hope that something like that can be coded into the game for online play .. i.e. make photography a prerequisite to seeing a viable target.

 

I was a recon pilot in ROF and I can say that we had many pilots flying recons on multiplayer in every mission. Perhaps I would venture to say that we were more organized and frequent than the bombers at Wargrounds. Artillery recon was not so popular because it was a bit boring -- we just had to reach the target area. But recons were complex (the number of plates, the camera sight, the necessity to make a neat run to have enough plates for as many targets as possible, the need to land back in an airfield, etc.). And they unlocked targets, aircraft, airfields, etc. The only drawback is that we did not receive any points for a successful recon mission, a mistake that until 2015 was never fixed. Other than that, the recon missions were a lot of fun to make and it was a good time to enjoy the planes (I loved it) if we were not being attacked.

 

I am not that savvy about two-seaters, but I always wondered why we did not have a Rumpler C.VII with a Maybach Mb IVa egine, which is famously mentioned by James McCudden. Wikipedia (grain of salt) says it was Rubild version, which dispensed the forward gun and was stripped of all unnecessary equipment:

 

"Lately I had noticed that up over 16,000 feet the German Rumplers were every bit as fast as my machine and had a better climb, so I made enquiries and found that the Rumplers' increased performance during the last month or so was due to the fact that most of them were now fitted with 285 h.p. Maybach engines in place of the 260 h.p. Mercedes, and their performance had markedly increased.

 

Therefore I resolved that I should catch them some-how, and I very soon procured a set of high-compression pistons, such as are used in the newer sorts of engine. At this time my new high-compression engine was nearly ready, and I was very keen to get it going, and then go up and see the Rumpler pilots' hair stand on end as I climbed past them like a helicopter" [FLYING FURY: Five Years in the Royal Flying Corps - Major James McCudden].

 

As a comparison, at this time (before the high-compression pistons engine) his S.E.5a at 10.000 feet pushed 120 miles per hour with the new spinner, which made it 3mph faster.

 

Other than that, it would be a good opportunity for them to fix and tweak some of the flight models and improve game play. It is time to get back to the books and e-mails.

[xvii-Dietrich]

{...}  There has to be some way to make photography and artillery spotting central to winning in MP. {...}

 

To do this, you need stats for it. At the risk of adding "Reconwhiner" and "Transportwhiner" to my increasing list of epithets, I will again point out that in IL2:BoX at the moment, there are no stats for recon or transport. Thus although the amazing mechanisms are there (cargo unload, canister-drops, location triggers,  paratroops), you get zero recognition for it. Last night I flew a FW190 with a single-bomb and got more points than my entire lengthy Ju52 career.

 

On the old Storm of War server (IL2:CloD), we had reconnaissance. A recon aircraft was loaded with 4 rolls of film and could do target discovery, damage confirmation and various other things... all of which showed up in the points/stats. We had no shortage of recon pilots whatsoever. As we used to say... "shots were taken, not fired".

 

There is a really neat recon mechanism in RoF. Hopefully, this will be translated into FC1.

 

That would be really cool.

[ShamrockOneFive]

To do this, you need stats for it. At the risk of adding "Reconwhiner" and "Transportwhiner" to my increasing list of epithets, I will again point out that in IL2:BoX at the moment, there are no stats for recon or transport. Thus although the amazing mechanisms are there (cargo unload, canister-drops, location triggers,  paratroops), you get zero recognition for it. Last night I flew a FW190 with a single-bomb and got more points than my entire lengthy Ju52 career.

 

On the old Storm of War server (IL2:CloD), we had reconnaissance. A recon aircraft was loaded with 4 rolls of film and could do target discovery, damage confirmation and various other things... all of which showed up in the points/stats. We had no shortage of recon pilots whatsoever. As we used to say... "shots were taken, not fired".

 

There is a really neat recon mechanism in RoF. Hopefully, this will be translated into FC1.

 

That would be really cool.

 

Recon and transport mechanisms would be a great thing to build in.

 

Updating the scoring system so that it can take into account things like aircraft destroyed, tanks destroyed, kgs of cargo delivered, etc. I think it's a great idea and it will become useful as further types get added like a future Li-2 and Po-2 which are decidedly not frontline fighter types

[Monostripezebra]

While I can see some logic in this somewhat more late-war plane set, I think it lacks some important aspects: the whole reason for flying circuses and "scout" fighters was the very pressing necessity to stop the mission planes.

 

Especially recon and arty direction are the key elements of WW1 airwar and the driving force behind aircraft and airforce development. Artillery killed the most men in the whole war, and beeing able to see "inside" the enemy territory, spotting the defensive lines, the logistic footprint of things brought to the front... thousends of lives where waged on these infos in the stalemate.

 

The planeset that is proposed falls a bit short there. On the superficial level, the game matches two "fighting" twoseaters.. but it is a little bit deeper then that. The brisfit is more a fighter and was not that much of a mission plane and is happy up high hunting scouts.. while the "CL" may have been conceived as "escort" but it never really was. It was a ground attacker, low level strafing aircraft. The funny historical reason, why the CL concept went straight ahead full force, was actually not that these planes could compete with fighters, but that it freed up officiers. In the traditional two seater roles, a full fledged officer had to be observer, with a long career in artillery and the likes, while the CL concept suddently allowed for the introduction of enlisted "airial gunners". And the german army at that time needed officers badly.

 

 

Sorry guys, the Halb CL2 is not a recon or bomber. It's a donkey. In RoF form it simply doesn't climb or lift anything. The DFW carries more bomb load, climbs to proper recon height and is miles better for 90% of Central 2 seater work.

I agree with Panthercules on the Breguet. It also is a proper bomber/recon suitable for that role in late war scenarios. In fact I think it carries more than 2x the bomb load and is better all round than the Bristol F2b. It's an awesome plane.

If you're only going to have 1x 2 seater on each side, then those planes need to perform core roles properly.

 

 

Which is why I hope it's FM will be refurbishmed tiogether with the graphics.

 

THe Halby CLII is a cool plane.. but it will never be a good climber or high alt recce, if historic parameters are observed. It was conceived as "escort" but the everybody knew that it would not really fare well there and the real reason it went ahead was actually other, 2nd thoughts. It soon was employed in ground attack where the good reargunner field of fire and maneuverability made the plane usefull. But having to climb to alt in that thing.. 30-45 min will be drag, as allways.

 

I totally 2nd the notion, that the breguet should be in the starter set. Having a french/american bomber that is more bomber and mission plane will only do good.

 

I also feel that the HP400 and Gothat should be given a consideration. And a Rumpler late high alt plane would do balance a bit good.. even though that would be a new plane to make... I know one can dream ;=)

[jeanba]

We'll see what the future brings. I think two seaters are a tougher sell in WWI because they are used more for recon and less for blowing things up.  I hope the future shows them some love as the skys seem empty without them. 

 

 

In,deed, lot of poeple buyed RoF for Scouts, but continued  playing with of 2-seaters

That's the difficulty

[HagarTheHorrible]

I think the way we have to look at Flying Circus is less to do with WW1, the what's and why for's and instead think of it as nothing more than dogfighting with WW1 aircraft in an up to date and evolving game engine, with extra mapped environments, nothing more. That's not to say it won't ever become more it's just that an opportunity exists to, relatively easily and economicaly, bring RoF aircraft into BoX, it's not perfect and it's not a fully fledged flight sim project but it does keep flying and fighting in WW1 era aircraft alive.

[xvii-Dietrich]

This is a good discussion and it is great reading the other opinions on the set.

 

In the Q&A that Jason Williams did yesterday, he stated that the nominal dateline for the planeset was Spring 1918, so that's what we need to bear in mind. The impression I got was that the career mode would not be ready for FC1, but they would start late and expand to earlier years when it does become ready, thus giving pilots a series of aircraft to progress though.

 

I understand the first step will be a major challenge, so I fully understand why more complex types (Gotha GV for instance) will be omitted.

 

I also get the idea that it will be a dog-fighting game.

 

However, unlike BoBo, which can bring in the A20, Ju88 and other heavies from earlier titles, FC1 will be the only thing in the series. This is why one decent observer aircraft on each side will be important, giving us the option of flying mission-oriented sorties too.

 

 

 

Monostripezebra raises a really good point about the climb rate. My impression from RoF was that the DFW CV was the best Central aircraft from the RoF planeset for that role, but I've got no historical references to back it up.

 

Looking at the Entente side, the Breguet is a good suggestion, but how would it compare for climb rate in an observer role? I don't have any RoF experience or historical figures to judge.

[Royal_Flight]

I agree. The all-fighter gameplay is just shallow. I don’t know why we have to keep saying this.

  

 

It's worth repeating because some people clearly still don't realise the importance of variety to a combat flight sim environment.

Your eco-system analogy is spot-on.

 

  

Much as I love the Pfalz D.III, I would prefer to see each side lose one fighter for a Corps recon.  DFW or something new (LVG) for the Germans and RE8 for the British.  Takeout the Dolphin and Pfalz.

 

Regardless. I am just happy to see WWI getting some love.  I do hope that later products will have more two seaters.

  

 

That would be a great idea, and make for a brilliant plane set on both sides. From the iconic (Camel and Dr.1) to the workhorses (Albatros and SE.5a) to the high-end late-war hot rods (SPAD and DVII) for fighters, then a fast, agile two-seater for strike and air-to-air (Halberstadt and Brisfit) as well as a slower one for observation and maybe bombing (RE.8 and DFW).

Rally well-rounded and something for everyone.

 

As for later releases, you could neearly fill a set with two-seaters (FE.2b, DH.4, Breguet and more).

 

To do this, you need stats for it. At the risk of adding "Reconwhiner" and "Transportwhiner" to my increasing list of epithets, I will again point out that in IL2:BoX at the moment, there are no stats for recon or transport. Thus although the amazing mechanisms are there (cargo unload, canister-drops, location triggers,  paratroops), you get zero recognition for it. Last night I flew a FW190 with a single-bomb and got more points than my entire lengthy Ju52 career.

 

On the old Storm of War server (IL2:CloD), we had reconnaissance. A recon aircraft was loaded with 4 rolls of film and could do target discovery, damage confirmation and various other things... all of which showed up in the points/stats. We had no shortage of recon pilots whatsoever. As we used to say... "shots were taken, not fired".

 

There is a really neat recon mechanism in RoF. Hopefully, this will be translated into FC1.

 

That would be really cool.

  

 

That sounds awesome. The Storm of War campaigns sound like they were brilliant, makes me feel like it's a shame I wasn't around then to get involved.

I've been hoping for a way for this to be included in BoX, I'd volunteer for the first set of recon flights over enemy lines... the same goes for transport. Also will give the Li-2/C-47 pilots (like I intend to be) something to do when it finally arrives.

 

While I can see some logic in this somewhat more late-war plane set, I think it lacks some important aspects: the whole reason for flying circuses and "scout" fighters was the very pressing necessity to stop the mission planes.

 

This is true. In fact itis basically the entire reason for having a varied and balanced set in every release, as opposed to just endless waves of fighters.

The fighters are only there in the first place so the bombers, recon, strike, transport and CAS aircraft can get on with winning the war.

Don't get me wrong, I appreciate our fighter colleagues, and there's no better sight to see than a friendly fighter off your wing when you're limping home on the wrong side of the lines full of holes and trailing smoke and fuel, but fighters are part of a greater whole and not an end in themselves.

[Lusekofte]

I will buy this pack , wait for it....... wait a bit more..... when the bombers and seaplanes come. I bet they will eventually. I got all planes in ROF and I must say I loved fly those heavy beast

[Avimimus]

I agree with the overall observation: Having more two-seaters makes sense - and lower performance aircraft.

 

I'm still very eager to pre-order though.

[1./KG4_Blackwolf]

I was a recon pilot in ROF and I can say that we had many pilots flying recons on multiplayer in every mission. Perhaps I would venture to say that we were more organized and frequent than the bombers at Wargrounds. Artillery recon was not so popular because it was a bit boring -- we just had to reach the target area. But recons were complex (the number of plates, the camera sight, the necessity to make a neat run to have enough plates for as many targets as possible, the need to land back in an airfield, etc.). And they unlocked targets, aircraft, airfields, etc. The only drawback is that we did not receive any points for a successful recon mission, a mistake that until 2015 was never fixed. Other than that, the recon missions were a lot of fun to make and it was a good time to enjoy the planes (I loved it) if we were not being attacked---Snip.

 

 

The 20thBG did both recon and bomb. I remember many flights helping Seawolf with the recons, trying to land them.  Everyone figured out to take down the recons quick. We were bombers but organized...sort of! I hope we can see that type of fun in FC1. 

The Halbi is good, I'd rather see the DFW and the Breguet, but I'll take whatever we get just to have it in VR! (throws money at the screen)

[Avimimus]

By the way, one of the issues with Rise of Flight was that some fighters were at a disadvantage due to engine power relative to others.

 

One way to provide more balance is to build in code to allow swapping out the engine:

https://riseofflight.com/forum/topic/32263-comprehensive-list-engine-variants-existing-aircraft/?hl=%2Bavimimus+%2Bengine+%2Bvariants&do=findComment&comment=457418

[fdswer]

Never really got into ROF so interested to see how the reboot is.

[Feathered_IV]

I will buy this pack , wait for it....... wait a bit more..... when the bombers and seaplanes come. I bet they will eventually. I got all planes in ROF and I must say I loved fly those heavy beast

The lack of recon and bomber aircraft is my only complaint about the Jason's strategy for Flying Circus. You need to work them in there like a parent who needs to disguise the vegetables so that their fussy child will eat them. The MP players may think they can live on junk food, but in the long run it isn't good for them. It will cut into Jason's future sales too, because a bomber or two now would be accepted without complaint, but trying to shift an entire package of them later would be far more difficult.

[Lusekofte]

but trying to shift an entire package of them later would be far more difficult.

 

Well I do not how this Circus will be made, I just assume they have to convert those ROF models over. But the word Convert can be understood as easy. And I think it is not. In attempts to import models into old IL 2 , the experience showed that it might have been easier to just build from scratch.

I think they will be very careful to promise anything, I think this is a test pack to see if can pay off.

I think by now everyone knows where I stand , to me a sim without bombers is not worth the time. Bombers and the teamwork between them and fighters is essential for proper wargame in servers.

I am willing to bet, there gonna be bombers added to this pack if enough people use it 

Edited November 20, 2017 by 216th_LuseKofte

[Lusekofte]

BTW. I can imagine a Oculus Rift will be a real treat in this game. Easier spotting and identification , not many instrument , just flying in tight turns. I think I will invest in one just for this game. All functions can be fitted in a standard joystick.

[Feathered_IV]

Jason said in the live chat that the Dr1 model was already put into the game and looked good. He also mentioned that they tested it with the Fw-190 FM. For the lulz.

[JG1_Butzzell]

S! All

 

The small map and limited plane set is a project they know they can complete on time and give people a taste of what the future product can do. The plane set was picked as late war being the most popular.The next product is the Western Front map and more planes. Eventually all the RoF planes will be moved over and then work starts on new planes. The good news is that professional third party groups will now be helping with the work. This may speed up the availability of planes.

[BraveSirRobin]

It's worth repeating because some people clearly still don't realise the importance of variety to a combat flight sim environment.

No, it’s really not worth repeating. We all know how important bomber and recon aircraft are. The problem is that they’re not as popular as fighters, so they don’t generate as much revenue. So the developer has to generate as much revenue as possible with fighters, then hope that enough guys who prefer fighters will help subsidize the bombers.

[ShamrockOneFive]

I would hope at some point the Handley Page Type 0 and Gotha G.V reappear in the lineup. I know they didn't go for that now but could easily do that in the Vol 2.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

No, it’s really not worth repeating. We all know how important bomber and recon aircraft are. The problem is that they’re not as popular as fighters, so they don’t generate as much revenue. So the developer has to generate as much revenue as possible with fighters, then hope that enough guys who prefer fighters will help subsidize the bombers.

"But muh niche pet plane!"

[BMA_Hellbender]

The current planeset will be excellent for giving mainly WWII pilots a taste of WWI, and it'll keep us RoF flyers happy for a while to come.

 

I hope that German squadrons in particular will temporarily trade in their 109s and 190s for D.Vas, Dr.Is and D.VIIs. If we can get to see that level of teamwork carry over to that era, us Brits in SEs, Camels and Biffs are going to have a target-rich environment field day.

 

[Feathered_IV]

Sorry guys, the Halb CL2 is not a recon or bomber.

 

That's true.  It's a nuisance raider for harassing infantry that do not appear in-game.  It has almost no gameplay value whatsoever.

[6./ZG26_5tuka]

I would hope at some point the Handley Page Type 0 and Gotha G.V reappear in the lineup. I know they didn't go for that now but could easily do that in the Vol 2.

Don't forget about the Felinxstowe!

 

Flying the Gotha with 4k textures would surely be thrilling though.

[SeaW0lf]

The 20thBG did both recon and bomb. I remember many flights helping Seawolf with the recons, trying to land them.  Everyone figured out to take down the recons quick. We were bombers but organized...sort of! I hope we can see that type of fun in FC1. 

The Halbi is good, I'd rather see the DFW and the Breguet, but I'll take whatever we get just to have it in VR! (throws money at the screen)

 

Those were fun missions! Many times we had to glide back trying to find an airfield to land.

 

If they are porting the flight models with a certain ease, they can sell Gothas and Pages (and others) as collector planes.

[TG-55Panthercules]

If they are porting the flight models with a certain ease, they can sell Gothas and Pages (and others) as collector planes.

 

Will be interesting to see how they handle the marketing concepts of packaged volumes versus individual "collector planes" - I'm not sure which way would actually make the most marketing sense, but I hope they figure out a way to use either the "volume" concept or the "collector plane" mechanism as a way of introducing an occasional new plane type that never made it into RoF, in addition to porting over the ones that did.

[SeaW0lf]

Will be interesting to see how they handle the marketing concepts of packaged volumes versus individual "collector planes" - I'm not sure which way would actually make the most marketing sense, but I hope they figure out a way to use either the "volume" concept or the "collector plane" mechanism as a way of introducing an occasional new plane type that never made it into RoF, in addition to porting over the ones that did.

 

I think it is the way to go. Star Citizen has a lot of special packs for sale and they made a lot of money with it (I know, different game, different market, but it is working). If they are not going to have the trouble to make the ROF FMs from scratch in general, it is a win win and we would buy it all for sure.

[LukeFF]

 

 

It has almost no gameplay value whatsoever.

 

Nonsense. It can be used quite well against artillery positions and vehicle convoys, which are roles it fulfilled in the real war.  

[Ribbon]

I would exclude Sopwith Dolphin, there is no single person i know that likes to fly it.

[Royal_Flight]

No, it’s really not worth repeating. We all know how important bomber and recon aircraft are. The problem is that they’re not as popular as fighters, so they don’t generate as much revenue. So the developer has to generate as much revenue as possible with fighters, then hope that enough guys who prefer fighters will help subsidize the bombers.

Like I said, worth repeating as long as people don't get it.

 

Non-fighters don't sell as well as fighters, sure. This is due to a combination of factors including but not limited to the glamour of air-to-air combat, the competition between high scorers in MP servers, and people who think that anything that isn't a fighter is a niche pet plane.

 

But you've got it backwards, and you've just made the case for why the base plane set needs to have variety, i.e. more than just fighters.

If you release a set of fighters and try to sell separate niche pet planes as a collectors, with a longer and likely more expensive development time, they will need to shift more units to break even. And as they're less popular the chances of that are less likely.

Thus, you start to get less of them released and maybe eventually none.

You acknowledge yourself that bombers/recon etc are important. Where does that leave the sim then?

 

If you follow the format of past releases, which has loosely been two fighters, an attacker and a bomber plus a fancy collector plane for each side, then everyone gets a wide range of tools and the niche pet planes bankroll themselves in a neat and unobtrusive manner. I've certainly never heard anyone complaining thst past releases haven't had enough fighters, or saying they have no interest in buying BoK because it has bombers in it.

 

And if any fighter jocks feel slightly aggrieved at paying for bombers they have no interest in flying, then spare a thought for people like me. The only 109 I've ever flown has been the Emil, and even then maybe only two or three times and always with bombs.

This sim has a preponderance of 109s and I know that as I've paid for all the damn things so I can get my hands on a pair of Peshkas and an A-20.

Not that I'm complaining, a combat flight sim with only level bombers would get very dull very quickly, but as the niche pet plane pilots are funding your fighters as well the least we can expect is a bit of reciprocity.

 

We also know that fighters will always sell as collector planes.

Case study: the proposed Po-2/Li-2, those notorious niche pet planes. The latter isn't even confirmed yet so it's uncertain as to whether we'll even see it, and there's no known timescale for the former but it won't be soon. Despite this they have a core of dedicated fans who are looking forward to them, and broad indifference from everyone else besides the one guy who seems to passionately hate transport aircraft.

Compare and contrast with the La-5FN and Bf 109G6, which appeared out of nowhere, jumped to the head of the queue and had people tripping over themselves to request a preorder for months, despite both being a modification of a version of an existing aircraft that's already available anyway.

"But muh niche pet engine/armament".

 

At the end of the day I'll buy BoBo anyway, and probably Flying Circus, but I reserve the right to keep advocating for aircraft I'd like to see included in the sim environment, just like we all get to.

[Monostripezebra]

I would exclude Sopwith Dolphin, there is no single person i know that likes to fly it.

 

That is not true.. I almost always flew it online and it has a great FM and is imensely fun to fly. You just need to land it right and handle it´s spins with a calm hand. It is one of the best planes in RoF

[Lusekofte]

 

 

Don't forget about the Felinxstowe!

 

I did not dare bringing it up, this is the plane I constantly fly in SP in ROF, what a delight. But since we have no sea plane in this sim, I guess it is not happening 

That is not true.. I almost always flew it online and it has a great FM and is imensely fun to fly. You just need to land it right and handle it´s spins with a calm hand. It is one of the best planes in RoF

Well I read about this plane, if it is like that it is pretty much how it was in real life. The Camel and Dolphin was the kind of plane that made you either dead or a ace, nothing inbetween

[ZachariasX]

I would exclude Sopwith Dolphin, there is no single person i know that likes to fly it.

I beg you pardon? You can put 6 guns on that crate. You have a great view.  It also has a good substained turn. It climbs. It is quick.It is lots of fun.

[Feathered_IV]

I would exclude Sopwith Dolphin, there is no single person i know that likes to fly it.

I would have said keep it, as it's rather good for intercepting bombers. But as there are none, the Dolphin could certainly go.

Edited November 21, 2017 by Feathered_IV

[xvii-Dietrich]

I did not dare bringing it up, this is the plane I constantly fly in SP in ROF, what a delight. But since we have no sea plane in this sim, I guess it is not happening

 

What?

 

I, for one, am not giving up, and intend to keep campaigning for a seaplane.

 

The Devs said that Pacific Theatre would be delayed. The reasons that gave were 1) ships (especially aircraft carriers) and 2) research on Japanese aircraft.

 

At no stage have they said that it was because they couldn't do seaplanes.

 

And we know seaplanes have worked in RoF (in fact the RoF implementation is the best aircraft-water-handling of ANY sim ever... yes, even including P3D, X-plane, etc.). And we know that seaplanes were commonplace and played a significant role during WWI. The case has also been made about the value of diversification of the planeset.

 

 

I fully accept that a seaplane will not make sense in Flying Circus 1. We know the map is a limited area of France, there are (a few) more iconic aircraft, and there is a need to cover important land-air-war roles. However, Flying Circus 2 is a different story and, as I have mentioned, I would say there is a very strong case for including seaplanes therein, as well as introducing them to the Eastern Front in WWII. The time to start raising awareness is now.

[Cpt_Cool]

I never could figure out the Dolphin's spin though. I liked it but I'm afraid I killed myself more often in that one than any other ROF plane.

[Lusekofte]

 

 

What?

 

Well I just see what we get, gotten. Seaplanes do not seem to be a priority. I will join in a seaplane squad no matter witch side if we ever get one. I do not even care if there is nothing else than mine clearing to do

 

I would do it all  night long