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216th_Jordan

Constant negative steam reviews are driving me nuts!

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I just dont get how the game is getting better and better while the reviews are constantly getting worse. Is there any deal to it? I dont understand it and thus don't know what to do about it. I just hope these reviews are not hurting the sales as much as I think they do..

 

Certainly needed some venting here.. :biggrin:

 

Hope general discussion is fine for this.

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Just went and had a look, and overall it seems very positive (the recent ones) The people giving negative reviews are mostly complaining about some VR issue or the Nvidea card bug.

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Well looking at the percentages the reviews went way down. About a year ago they normally never went below 60% for '30 days reviews' since a few months they often hit 55% and in the last 2 months sometimes hit as low as 42%. Sure they sometimes shortly push up but the general trend seems to be opposite. The thing is there are really a lot of bs reviews like: "buy il2 1946", "buy cliff of dover", "devs only doin this for the money", "no optimizations", "doesnt work".

 

In general review rates below 70% are considered bad for games. And Il2 fares fairly low compared to a lot of other games with less quality.

Edited by 216th_Jordan

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Yeah it's BS but are those really recent reviews? I couldn't find any of that kind among the recent ones. You'll find plenty of them from 2014-15.

 

If there really is a current onslaught of negative reviews, my guess is, that we are talking about a bunch of disgruntled DCS fanbois that see DCS-WW2 falling apart and are hitting back.

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Yeah it's BS but are those really recent reviews? I couldn't find any of that kind among the recent ones. You'll find plenty of them from 2014-15.

 

If there really is a current onslaught of negative reviews, my guess is, that we are talking about a bunch of disgruntled DCS fanbois that see DCS-WW2 falling apart and are hitting back.

You need to click 'all languages' then 'show new' on the filtering tab.

 

I had that DCS suspicion too for a short while but I dont see ANY "buy DCS" reviews! Maybe this is all a great conspiracy lol :P

Edited by 216th_Jordan

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I don't know if people are very skeptical when reading online reviews, but I do think they generally overlook the very short ones that simply say "best game ever" or "this sucks" or "buy Il-2 1946 instead", because that doesn't give them any useful information.

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The secret is, don't read the negative reviews if they 'drive you nuts'...

 

If you are loving the game, that's all that matters.

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The secret is, don't read the negative reviews if they 'drive you nuts'...

 

If you are loving the game, that's all that matters.

 

I don't think that's quite right either Trooper. 

 

We who like this sim actually have to do our part to spread the news about the very positive development of the sim. The devs are not a big, wealthy corporation that can afford to heavily advertise their product. They actually have to rely on happy customers sharing their experiences, giving positive (and informative) reviews and getting their friends to join in.  

 

We can't do anything about negative reviews, people are free to write whatever they like about the sim, but we can offer a voice to counter it.

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Problem is that people are very eager to complain even when it is about minor problem. They have zero patiency to look for a solution and solve it. They just immediately lose nerve and blast away in bad review.

 

People who are happy about a product are playing and don't bother to write anything.

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What I mean is, if they are driving him nuts he doesn't have to read them...

I don't go for the negative reviews damaging sales either. If that were true, this and many other games would have gone down the tubes awhile ago.

 

I'm a normal bloke like anyone else, I know full well many negative reviews are written by people with a grudge, or young twats with half a brain cell, or idiots who cruise forums and constantly give bad reviews because they can.

Some negative reviews however are legitimate and raise real concerns.

 

They don't bother me, I simply raise concerns where needed in any game, plus like this game, I give it a thumbs up to anyone that asks about it... swings and roundabouts, swings and roundabouts, that's all :)

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Problem is that people are very eager to complain even when it is about minor problem. They have zero patiency to look for a solution and solve it. They just immediately lose nerve and blast away in bad review.

This is actually a strong point of BoX I think. While it has a steep learning curve it now has very few bugs that are detrimental to gameplay and relatively good performance on a wide range of systems.

 

ClOD, while now much better, still requires some tweaking to get decent performance, has way more bugs and is a real hassle to set up controls for.

 

DCS you practically need a whole manual just to install and get modules activated, to say nothing of performance issues, bugs, lacking DM and AI and performance issues.

 

Pretty much only IL-2 1946 and WT are more accessible than BoX.

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If it's of any help when I'm looking for any gaming investment over $50 I search for reviews by specialised bloggers and the likes. It allows me to see the features on depth and figure out which ones I need and don't.

 

As an optimist I hope most people looking for a flight sim that has three modules worth $70 also bother to dissect the product instead of going by Steam reviews.

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I find negative reviews where people cry that game is too hard so funny :) it's not only IL-2 but dcs or even games like darkest dungeon and older games where you must read everything, make notes because you dont have magic map that shows you everything.

 

Many of these reviews is about game being too hard, people are just lazy and it will never change, they see pretty graphic, they buy it and then can't take off so they put negative review because he can't play it. A bit off topic but now people except game to do everything for them, we have auto aiming, legal wallhack, marking enemies, AI that is so retarded it should be considered cheating. Today's AI in compare to stalker for example is just sad, enemies will run into your fire while you camp doorway, in stalker they would peak or run from side to side and suppress you, not run away one by one and get killed.

 

Every hard game has reviews like this. Or other kind, only 8 planes, while WT has 1000. I don't really know how some can be so stupid, comparing game from 2001 with BoS where everything is more detailed and yet they keep crying for more.

 

"Only played for a few minutes, but game looks great, pretty realistic (comparing with Microsoft FSX and DCS), and the sound effects are absolutely amazing. But "down vote" for forcing me to register through a long and frustrating process."

took him 5-10min ;)

 

Don't expect much from steam reviews, i have many games that have mixed score yet it was so fun to play and many with super positive would not want even for free.

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As an optimist I hope most people looking for a flight sim that has three modules worth $70 also bother to dissect the product instead of going by Steam reviews.

I hope the same thing, but... just look at the vast majority of people who use steam. The most played games are what: CSGO, Dota, TF2? Also, if you want to get mad, look under the "simulator" category in steam. I bolded the quote because they hardly are simulators there. It's like 90% dating "simulators" and the other 10% is pretty split between the stupid things like grass "simulator" and then actual simulators like MFS or Train Sim. 

 

/end rant

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I have to admit that after I have a look at the general overview of a game, either on Steam or a Games publication, I always read the negative Steam reviews.  Finding out why someone has gone to the trouble of a negative review is often worthwhile.

 

Seems to me that there are three types of reason for a negative review giving different information.

 

1) Game will not work properly. If the complaints are widespread and affect a system similar to mine - no purchase.

 

2) Game is not enjoyable/immersive/whatever. This is obviously very subjective, but many good negative reviews are very clear about what it is that has turned off the reviewer. If he typically likes the kind of games you like, a negative review is persuasive.

 

3) Game is overpriced and/or exploitative (micro-transactions).  I am not price sensitive (lucky me :)) so "sticker shock" will not turn me off, but I do get annoyed when I feel I am being played for a sucker. So negative reviews about micro-transactions = no purchase. 

 

Feedback is a fact of life and developers need to live with it and stop complaining about it.  They need to make sure their games work.  They cannot please everyone (as 1CGS found out) so they need to be clear and honest about what group of players they are targeting.  

Pricing is a tricky one - but I suspect easier if you have got the first two steps right.

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Game is overpriced

heh but people don't have problem spending 60€ on season pass or 2€ on stupid keys to open boxes and in time they spend hundreds of $. Look at steam market, prople buy knife skins for 700€ or more ;) Rainbow six siege got 2nd season pass and people don't complain.

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heh but people don't have problem spending 60€ on season pass or 2€ on stupid keys to open boxes and in time they spend hundreds of $. Look at steam market, prople buy knife skins for 700€ or more ;) Rainbow six siege got 2nd season pass and people don't complain.

 

Perhaps I did not make myself clear. I was talking in generic terms about the type of things that get into negative reviews, not specifically about BoS reviews.

 

Everyone has to make their own value for money judgement based on their own circumstances.  I happen to find BoS + good value (post revolution), I also find some other people's judgments odd - on a dollar/hour basis a SP sandbox type game can be simply amazing value, and of course some MP people spend their entire lives playing.

 

But if huge numbers of people are complaining about the price it suggests either that the price point is too high, or that the developers' marketing is poor. For instance, Rolls Royce might not get negative reviews for it's cars because they are more expensive than a Toyota Corolla, because potential customers know that the valid value comparison is with a top of the line Mercedes or similar.

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Steam reviews should not be the place for anyone to gather their sole information about prospective purchases.

 

IMHO if someone is put off a BoX purchase because of them then they probably wouldn't be they type who'd appreciate BoX.

 

Im not trying to be elitist but Steam reviews aren't always true to life.

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I suppose I should pull my finger out and write a steam review. 

 

Il2 has swallowed up an enormous amount of my free time since April (VR)

 

at the moment I don't have any interest to even play anything else.

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The best source of information IMHO is to talk about a game with a friend who has played it for a few days at least.  When you know each others' interests and preferences, a personal recommendation is persuasive.  I have found a couple of games that would not usually be on my radar like that.

 

The point about looking at Steam reviews is that you get a large sample of feedback.  If one person says "the GUI sucks", for example,  you can ignore it because perhaps he just likes a different kind of GUI. Some people like lots of screen icons, I like a clean screen.  If lots of people say "the GUI sucks" - it probably does. At the very least, it indicates that it might be a good idea to find out what the GUI is like in detail and if that is a game breaker for you.  

 

With a large sample the biases tend to cancel out and you are left with real information.

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We who like this sim actually have to do our part to spread the news about the very positive development of the sim. The devs are not a big, wealthy corporation that can afford to heavily advertise their product. They actually have to rely on happy customers sharing their experiences, giving positive (and informative) reviews and getting their friends to join in.  

 

We can't do anything about negative reviews, people are free to write whatever they like about the sim, but we can offer a voice to counter it.

 

This is a good point and I agree.  There are plenty of little things about this sim (and a couple of big ones) that I believe drive down the attractive-ness of this sim; things that would NOT be hard to fix, and I have made my opinions of dissatisfaction apparent --- HERE.

 

When the opportunity arises elsewhere, I make a point of letting people I interact with how much I enjoy this sim and how good it actually is.  Because, it is worth the few dollars investment in the game itself and I have no problem giving it a good review and recommending it

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ClOD, while now much better, still requires some tweaking to get decent performance, has way more bugs and is a real hassle to set up controls for.

 

:scratch_one-s_head: While I agree there are more bugs, most are rather minor.  The tweaking to get better performance is no more of a hassle than what BoX requires, and the control setup is pretty straight-forward. But I agree BoX is more accessible than CLoD....CLOD's user interface isn't the most intuitive and plane start-up is slightly more complex than BoX.

 

 

As to the negative reviews, take them with a grain of salt.  BoX, DCS and CLoD are not for the average Steam user, most of whom are into instant gratification games.  Learning curve is too steep for some....they want Ace Combat or War Thunder Arcade Mode, not a simulator.  And this isn't just an issue with BoX.....I chuckled while reading some of the negative reviews for Aces High III on Steam recently.  Several of the reviews stated AH III was "too much of a simulator".  :lol:  :lol:  This is a riot when you consider the game itself in comparison to BoX/DCS/CLoD.  Is the AH flight model a bit more complex than, say, War Thunder Arcade or even Sim Battles?  Yes it is...but it isn't even in the same league as BoX (and don't get me started on the graphics).  But all this just reinforces my original statement:  BoX, and "simulators" in general, just are not for everyone.

Edited by ATAG_Invictus
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People think their opinions are the shit, South Park nailed it with the Yelp jokes in that aspect.

 

 

The low Steam reviews bother me too, especially when they are not well supported by arguments.

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I suppose I should pull my finger out and write a steam review. 

 

Il2 has swallowed up an enormous amount of my free time since April (VR)

 

at the moment I don't have any interest to even play anything else.

I just did. My first ever Steam review (i think) 10 mins of my time is not alot to ask :)

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I think a problem with the steam reviews is, that most fans of the series havent bought it via steam and therefore the steam reviews are skewed.
Also i have seen a lot of troll reviews with barely any play time consisting of a single sentence.
I dont know who buys this game just to complain about it, but if they pay the full price just to complain im happy.

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I dont understand people who give negative review because the game is too hard for them. What did they expect when buying BoS? Some arcade flight sim that you can learn in 5 minutes?

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I think a problem with the steam reviews is, that most fans of the series havent bought it via steam and therefore the steam reviews are skewed.

Also i have seen a lot of troll reviews with barely any play time consisting of a single sentence.

I dont know who buys this game just to complain about it, but if they pay the full price just to complain im happy.

Premium complaint tier

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Steam reviews in general are useless unless you want the opinions of fourteen-year-old boys who expect every game to work like a first-person shooter that you can learn in fifteen minutes.

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I dont understand people who give negative review because the game is too hard for them. What did they expect when buying BoS? Some arcade flight sim that you can learn in 5 minutes?

Salutations,

 

Many people are simply lazy and unwilling to learn which requires some effort. "I have to think to play this simulation?"

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There are plenty of mature and articulate people who give out negative steam reviews.  The important thing is to read them and find out why the writer is negative.  If the things the writer does not like are also things I tend not to like, the review is valuable to me.

 

If I had not purchased BoS from very early on in early access, and had read a steam review commenting on the initial campaign mode discussing pilot levels that the player could not reset, unlocks, and the complete lack of role play, I can honestly say that I would not have bought the game.   TBH, not only did I think that the game was almost worthless for SP at launch, but that I had been not so subtly misled, in a way that would not have been possible if I had waited for release and the chance to read some user reviews.

 

Casually dismissing steam reviews because some of them are written by idiots - or perhaps just by people with very different preferences - is illogical self-harm. Taken as a whole, they contain a great deal of valuable information, and in my experience, the negative reviews are the most useful. 

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There will always be people who criticize and they will always be dissatisfied.
It 's in the nature of people.
It is easier to criticize than to say the good things.
For me the game is very good is it is constant improvement.
The game offers an excellent quality.

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Well, I didn´t write any negative review and I am not willing to do so, but what drives me mad, and I can imagine that can push someone to write that kind of review, is amount of CTDs I'm experiencing playing this game. I´ve been playing PC for al least 20 years, but amont of BOX CTDs is i think 10 times more than in every other games I´ve played together. It can be very frustrating sometimes.

 

Imagine a situation. You have some time, so you decide to fly some quick online sorties. So i take my MSFFB2, turn on trackIR. I run the game, log on. Than I try to connect to WOL, which sometimes take some time. After some unsuccessful attempts I´m finally there so i choose loadout and skin for my Bf110 and click on START button (= cca 15% chance of CTD). In case of no CTD, i begin the startup procedure (I guess it last 4 or 5 mimutes for twin engine plane?), roll to runway a begin the take off. During the takeoff in most cases I find my flight stick vigorously shaking  because of the FFB bug. To get rid of it, you have to alt+tab (= at least 50% chance of CTD, works only sometimes), get to game menu to controls and key bindings, there change nothing and hit cancel (= at least 50% chance of CTD, works only sometimes), or go to input devices, turn FFB off and then turn it on again (= at least 50% chance of CTD, works only sometimes).

 

So you get usually at least 1 CTD, if you want to play. After the CTD I usually get angry and forget to wait some time for track IR to load after the game crash, which I do not notice until i get to cockpit, so I have to quit the game and start from the beginning. When I get the same CTD after this, believe me, it´s hard not to throw ouf of the window everything around me, and I am calm personality. So, instead of quick flight you get 45 mins of anger.

 

I know the cause of this is propably MSFFB2 (+ TrackIR maybe), which is old stick. But it is still popular stick and this is flight simulator, so IMHO it should work.

 

Well nevermind, I had to put it out and I hope this way is better than bad review....

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Well, I didn´t write any negative review and I am not willing to do so, but what drives me mad, and I can imagine that can push someone to write that kind of review, is amount of CTDs I'm experiencing playing this game. I´ve been playing PC for al least 20 years, but amont of BOX CTDs is i think 10 times more than in every other games I´ve played together. It can be very frustrating sometimes.

 

Imagine a situation. You have some time, so you decide to fly some quick online sorties. So i take my MSFFB2, turn on trackIR. I run the game, log on. Than I try to connect to WOL, which sometimes take some time. After some unsuccessful attempts I´m finally there so i choose loadout and skin for my Bf110 and click on START button (= cca 15% chance of CTD). In case of no CTD, i begin the startup procedure (I guess it last 4 or 5 mimutes for twin engine plane?), roll to runway a begin the take off. During the takeoff in most cases I find my flight stick vigorously shaking  because of the FFB bug. To get rid of it, you have to alt+tab (= at least 50% chance of CTD, works only sometimes), get to game menu to controls and key bindings, there change nothing and hit cancel (= at least 50% chance of CTD, works only sometimes), or go to input devices, turn FFB off and then turn it on again (= at least 50% chance of CTD, works only sometimes).

 

So you get usually at least 1 CTD, if you want to play. After the CTD I usually get angry and forget to wait some time for track IR to load after the game crash, which I do not notice until i get to cockpit, so I have to quit the game and start from the beginning. When I get the same CTD after this, believe me, it´s hard not to throw ouf of the window everything around me, and I am calm personality. So, instead of quick flight you get 45 mins of anger.

 

I know the cause of this is propably MSFFB2 (+ TrackIR maybe), which is old stick. But it is still popular stick and this is flight simulator, so IMHO it should work.

 

Well nevermind, I had to put it out and I hope this way is better than bad review....

 

Hey, thermoregulator,

have you posted this to the bug/problems forums? Its important for the devs to know the issues and circumstances this happens in. I had my first CTD in a year last month, so its quite the opposite for me but there appears to be a crowd of people with problems like yours.

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Well looking at the percentages the reviews went way down. About a year ago they normally never went below 60% for '30 days reviews' since a few months they often hit 55% and in the last 2 months sometimes hit as low as 42%. Sure they sometimes shortly push up but the general trend seems to be opposite. The thing is there are really a lot of bs reviews like: "buy il2 1946", "buy cliff of dover", "devs only doin this for the money", "no optimizations", "doesnt work".

 

In general review rates below 70% are considered bad for games. And Il2 fares fairly low compared to a lot of other games with less quality.

 

 

I think the simple fact is that, however hard it may be to face up to, this game lacks an incredible amount of polish, and gamers these days are less tolerant of roughness around the edges.

 

It's a good simulator, and I personally understand that there are often teething issues with new engines, but if you look at it objectively we have:

 

- horrible dedicated server performance

- random crash bugs that have persisted for years with no fix

- graphics bugs that have come and gone, and seriously broke the game for certain card owners

- AI problems

- random sound glitches

- a really demanding game, graphically and cpu-wise (people are accustomed to being able to run at max settings these days)

 

and on top of that, we have

 

- no community/squad/player management tools in game (only the vote ban that basically doesn't work at all)

- awful in game server browser

- no way to configure certain options that were present in the old games (icons, etc.)

- problems with cheating

 

And all this is compounded by overly-aggressive forum moderation and a dev team that, even though they're all nice people, are just frankly not so good at communicating with the community which leads to frustration.

 

Finally, after all is said and done, this game is really expensive.  To get all the content/aircraft costs serious money, whereas most gamers are now conditioned to expect games at the $59.99 US price point, or perhaps $79.99 for premium titles.  To get all the content in this game you're looking at close to $300, plus you need TrackIR/stick/pedals/etc.

 

Like I said, it's a good game but it lacks polish in a big way.  A lot of us who fly sims are used to this, because we realize that sims are huge investments, and this team in particular seems small, with a lot on their plate.  But your average gamer who started out on CSGO and tried war thunder and is now maybe thinking about picking this game up has a completely different perspective.

Edited by JG13_opcode
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(...) even though they're all nice people, are just frankly not very good at all at communicating with the community which leads to frustration.

.

Yeah no

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If you haven't put up a review, do it. If you have an old review up, delete it and put a new one up. Describe the recent positive changes, this will also change the recent review percentage.

Edited by StickMan
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This one is by far my favorite.

 

This asshat gave it a negative review because its not casual. Wait...what? So, he read the description, bought it anyway knowing what it entailed, and then decided to write a negative review based on what it isn't and not what it is? Talk about the epitome of asinine. Dudes' got some severe congenital mental handicap to formulate a negative opinion based on that sort of extremely flawed logic.

 

It's like saying I read everything I could on the Subaru WRX, went out and bought one and then drove it off a cliff in anger because it wasn't like the BMW 545i.

 

giphy.gif

Edited by detcord12b
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I think the simple fact is that, however hard it may be to face up to, this game lacks an incredible amount of polish, and gamers these days are less tolerant of roughness around the edges.

 

......

All very good points, imo.  (I don't think the game is too expensive though)

 

The developers and marketers of this game should pay particular attention to feedback like this if they want this ^^^ to be a success.

 

Most of the issues I have with this game have to do with "polish".  The core of the game is great, but it is so rough around the edges I can easily see how this is a turn off for casual players.

 

If I was not a long time hard core simmer, and I just bought the latest version, I'd probably on have given it a little attention and I sure wouldn't have raved to all my friends about how they just had to have it because it is so much fun

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If you haven't put up a review, do it. If you have an old review up, delete it and put a new one up. Describe the recent positive changes, this will also change the recent review percentage.

 

 

Absolutely.  The only way to fight negative one-liner reviews is to put up mature positive reviews that are realistic, free of hyperbole, and talk about what's important.

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