Developer Diary, Part 165 - Discussion

[[CPT]CptJackSparrow]

Pleasing to my eyes. =)

[Rjel]

"Wow" seems to be the most popular reaction to these screenshots. So I'll concur. Wow. It truly is an amazing collection of pictures.

 

One question I've wonder is about the snow covered peaks of the mountains. Are the snow caps just painted on or solid acting in other words, when reacting to objects or do they have "fluff" so you'd sink in the snow slightly like in the existing winter maps? The thought of skiing down the slope with my airplane appeals to me.

[Medicated]

That shot of the clouds beneath the mountain tops gave me an idea, a completely a-historical, silly idea, but it's something that's gotta be tried:

 

Create an MP mission solely for tanks, where you battle for control of a valley. Set the weather to overcast with a low cloud cover. Have each team start on one of two mountain tops on each side of the valley in plain view of one another, since the mountains poke up above the clouds, but have all the objectives down in the valley inside the cloud cover. Now both teams have to drive down there and fight each other in almost complete blindness inside the cloud.

 

Am I the only one who thinks that'd be fun?

I would support this endeavor!

[Chomp]

[71st_AH_Whiskey]

Excellent work.

[Kannichen]

Looks impressive!

[SYN_Speck]

Can't wait. This sim is going to jump up to another level.

[Beazil]

Well,it's going to be a long wait for that map to be released, even if it were tomorrow. You folks appear to have outdone yourselves. S!

[Marcio]

Great landscape graphics!!!

 

Keep the excellent work!!!

 

All the best!!!

[JG300_Olrik]

Amazing work again. Nice job guys. Thx.

[Missionbug]

The map is looking really impressive, congratulations to all involved, really appreciated.

 

 

Wishing you all the very best, Pete.

[HBPencil]

That scenery looks great. As the vicar said to the nun "phwoarrrrr!" 

Edited July 22, 2017 by HBPencil

[Caudron431]

Beautiful landscapes!  Bravo 1CGS!

[Jade_Monkey]

Seems like a lot of mesh is still missing though. Note all the valleys that are flattened out. Maybe it gets improved still.

 

Don't worry, they are waiting to add the final meshes the day before release 

[Custard]

Seems like a lot of mesh is still missing though. Note all the valleys that are flattened out. Maybe it gets improved still.

 

As with any flight sim, it's a compromise between simulation fidelity and practicality. This is still the best looking interpretation of the Caucasus I've seen in a game. You want a super accurate elevation mesh the map is most like;y going to have to be very small.

[54th_Glitter_]

Excellent job! Beautiful. Congrats.

 

(Blasphemy on BOK,... but a RAF skin Spit over this white cliffs....hmmm....tasty flavour   )

 

Congrats again devs! Keep up the good work!

[Pollux]

Very good work !

[JG4_Sputnik]

As with any flight sim, it's a compromise between simulation fidelity and practicality. This is still the best looking interpretation of the Caucasus I've seen in a game. You want a super accurate elevation mesh the map is most like;y going to have to be very small.

 

See, this is what I don't get. 

I have no doubt that the team is doing e great job, but I have freeware meshes for FSX that are at least as detailed as this. Maybe its engine limitation, I don't know.

Also the coastline is not "perfect" (for example in the game the cliffs are convex and in google earth concave to the sea) and there I think it is no issue of accuracy needing performance since the coastline is on both screenshots very detailed but just not "accurate detailed". It's not a huge deal I'm just a sucker for detailed landscapes an all generally in all sims

Edited July 22, 2017 by JG4_Sputnik

[Jason_Williams]

See, this is what I don't get. 

I have no doubt that the team is doing e great job, but I have freeware meshes for FSX that are at least as detailed as this. Maybe its engine limitation, I don't know.

Also the coastline is not "perfect" (for example in the game the cliffs are convex and in google earth concave to the sea) and there I think it is no issue of accuracy needing performance since the coastline is on both screenshots very detailed but just not "accurate detailed". It's not a huge deal I'm just a sucker for detailed landscapes an all generally in all sims

 

No you'r being negative on purpose. Every post you make is a snarky backhanded compliment. Knock it off. Everyone knows we draw our landscape at 50m resolution. That is our compromise so we can add all the combat stuff you like. 

 

Jason

[JG4_Sputnik]

No you'r being negative on purpose. Every post you make is a snarky backhanded compliment. Knock it off. Everyone knows we draw our landscape at 50m resolution. That is our compromise so we can add all the combat stuff you like. 

 

Jason

True! I get so much satisfaction out of "being negative on purpose". 

Yet again I've failed to openly discuss a (minor) "issue" that is important for me concerning my favourite sim with other members of this forum (A sim that I play almost every day).

 

Well then, I'll knock it off, back to pc-forum mode:

 

Well done devs! Bautiful! Most amazing screenshots I've ever seen!

(I hope those inputs help making a better sim in the future! )

Cheers

Edited July 22, 2017 by JG4_Sputnik

[Juri_JS]

Also the coastline is not "perfect" (for example in the game the cliffs are convex and in google earth concave to the sea) and there I think it is no issue of accuracy needing performance since the coastline is on both screenshots very detailed but just not "accurate detailed".

 

I am not sure the Google Earth elevation model is more accurate than the one in the game. The last time I checked, the digital elevation model in Google Earth used SRTM3 data, which has a 90 m resolution. If they haven't changed to SRTM1 or ASTER data in the meantime, the games elevation model is probably more accurate. Concerning the coast line, I think it's mostly the use of aerial images as overlay that makes Google Earth look more accurate compared to the game, but not the DEM. Put the games textures on the Google Earth DEM and you would notice, how inaccurate it really is.

 

Edited July 22, 2017 by Juri_JS

[AndyJWest]

I am not sure the Google Earth elevation model is more accurate than the one in the game. The last time I checked, the digital elevation model in Google Earth used SRTM3 data, which has a 90 m resolution. If they haven't changed to SRTM1 or ASTER data in the meantime, the games elevation model is probably more accurate. Concerning the coast line, I think it's mostly the use of aerial images as overlay that makes Google Earth look more accurate compared to the game, but not the DEM.

 

 

I was about to post much the same comment. The Google Earth image isn't a photograph and the software can produce strange results sometimes. In any case, as Jason says, the map level of detail is a compromise, necessary for performance reasons. Though I'm sure that if he had the same level of funding that Google does there would be room for improvement.

[JG4_Sputnik]

Thanks for your constructive posts. This is an issue I wasn't aware of. 

I'll look into that, since I'm very interested in virtual worlds vs. the real one, be it in flight sims or others like Train Simulator etc.

 

However, since the big Chief deleted the image comparison, I think this means we should avoid this topic now. Must've hit a delicate topic  

 

BTW: Despite Jason's comment, I wasn't aware of the 50m resolution - is this better or as good as in BOS/BOM? Does anyone know if those also have a 50min resolution?

Edited July 22, 2017 by JG4_Sputnik

[CAPSLOCK_ON]

Amazing! Very looking forward to try this map out, some sightseeing for a nice start. :D

[sinned]

JG4_Spermleak,

Let me also make comments that furnish me with taste of satisfaction.

[Edited]

 

 

Enough with the personal attacks already.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Bearcat

[Royal_Flight]

JG4_Spermleak,

 

Whingewhingewhinge

 

Wind your neck in kid, there's absolutely no need for that sort of discourse here.

If you want to complain about the relentless negativity of some users then you could bear in mind your own little tantrums every time someone mentions the Ju52.

 

Incidentally, there is a good point raised here, namely people making observations or raising what they perceive as issues which is then taken personally as criticism and resulting in a curt response and the stifling of discussion.

 

Doesn't come across as a particularly good exercise in PR and is quite off-putting.

 

But all else aside, sinned, there's no cause for that sort of behaviour especially if there's no useful contribution coming from yourself.

[sinned]

Wind your neck in kid, there's absolutely no need for that sort of discourse here.

If you want to complain about the relentless negativity of some users then you could bear in mind your own little tantrums every time someone mentions the Ju52.

 

But all else aside, sinned, there's no cause for that sort of behaviour especially if there's no useful contribution coming from yourself.

No, you are flat wrong. I contribute with gifts. I write objective yet very positive reviews of this game at international forums. I encouraged BOS offliners.

When I just gave away Vive to my concierge's son, I asked him to return the favor by buying BOS and its sequels.

I just try to give out behind curtains unless ignorant organism that is worth less than a used Q-tip makes false assumptions and provocations.

 

Its interesting how everthing that BOS offers needs fixing; DM, FM, campaign, landscape, view distance, cockpit shadow, refraction, gtx 780, weapon damage, AI... etc.. oh u name it. Seems like everything needs fixing except one. Community.

 

I think everything else is in good and capable hands of developers.

 

Some of these [Edited] individuals are just riot starters that stur up other content users to think such a AAA game is flawed.

 

Nothing wrong with JU52, a great plane.

Do u have one? If not, sell your cloak and buy one. I dont know how many times i have to say it. My distaste is with those lala dreamers who asked for it, thought it brought high sales and asked for another transport.

 

Now, go contribute with gifts my friend.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Bearcat

[Semor76]

JG4_Spermleak,

 

Let me also make comments that furnish me with taste of satisfaction.

 

Your current and past "negativity on purpose" shows that you are a nothing but a cimex, a parasite insect that only survives by sucking blood of a host.

Your claim that snarky and pedantic criticism aimed to improve the sim is equalvent to a cimex claiming its parasitic activity is to improve victim's immunity.

 

Your comment didnt hit any delicate topic. It is merely a pile of feces that attracts flies, maggots and other filthy disease contracting abominations - the likes of you.

Jason has just taken out the garbage to keep out other filthy organisms.

 

You want to contribute to the better future of this sim and do something that give you satisfaction? Go wash some dishes, earn some money and gift out BOM.

 

  .....need a doctor?

 

Reported @ Admins.

Edited July 23, 2017 by Semor76

[sinned]

.....need a doctor?

 

Reported @ Admins.

The very individual in need of a doctor is who looks at these BOK landscapes and complains that it needs to get better because "negativity on purpose gives so much satisfaction".

 

Who do you think really needs a therapy?

[ITAF_Rani]

Ok devs ..you are doing really good things..go on in this way and you ll be the main Sim for the WW2 era..

Congrats

[Livai]

Overall 3D maps are really time demanding specially if you want real world maps put inside the game. I have seen many very high poly 3D maps from real worlds but soon I start to compare it with real world photos from the same spot vs in-game still the real world photos are more accurate no matter at what resolution the 3D map was created. You are forced to take photos from the real world scenery to correct everything by hand in your 3D map only this way you reach with some luck 100% accuracy but never if you go back the timeline the scenery changed already many times. You can be lucky if someone from this timeline made some photos or documents because without this you are really helpless!

[Adj]

Thanks for the update and the screenshots.

Can't wait to fly the Kuban campaign.

[Brano]

I can't wait to jump into my Gustav of our 13./JG52 (slowakische) together with Jan Reznak in his "gelbe 9" and Jan Gerthofer in his "gelbe 6" leaving Anapa airfield at our six

[JG4_Sputnik]

Hmm, let's recapitulate:

 

- I compared the coastline from google earth with the one from the screenshot and said that they don't quite match (note that I also wrote that I really like the way the river was done and how the water looks...).

- My post gets deleted and I'm being called "snarky" and "negative on purpose" by the chief.

- Then I get called "parasite", "filthy", "abomination" (I know that this guy doesn't represent the whole community, but still).

 

What this means for us as a community I left people decide themselves.

 

Soooo, what's left to say?

I think that I'll go with "good job devs" for the next several Dev diaries again, maaaaybe I'll try again around "Dev diary 175" or so to actually try to discuss some aspects of the game that go beyond honey dripping. 

 

Looking forward! 

[Freycinet]

Really stunning looking screenies worthy of a modern-day Aivazovsky! Wow wow wow. Will definitely be the best-looking flight sim map ever.

 

Only quibble I have are the piece-of-string-looking dirt roads. They are a bit too uniform and perfect. If you could intruduce slight variation in width and colouring of the tracks that would be good. A few wobbles in the perfect lines and curves too. As it is, they slightly break the immersion. 

[Lusekofte]

- I compared the coastline from google earth with the one from the screenshot and said that they don't quite match (note that I also wrote that I really like the way the river was done and how the water looks...).

this is one of the best simulators when it come to this. absolutely stunning flying low over rivers

 

Personally I was not aware of the facts you presented , all though they are quite obvious, but I am not known to notice such things. I see the improvements and cheer those. I have learned that my perspective of things is not the one reflecting by most people, I do not expect much to begin with, and everything better than expected get cheered by me, if anything there was a slight negative tone to your post in the beginning of it, all though in my opinion it was constructive and very polite. I think Jason overreacted.

If any lessons have to be learned from it, I would have turned your post upside down, start with the positive and end with constructive part. 

Edited July 23, 2017 by 216th_LuseKofte

[sinned]

[Edited]

Edited July 24, 2017 by Bearcat

[Freycinet]

Hmm, let's recapitulate:

 

 

You unfortunately seem incapable of understanding a few very simple facts, which makes your postings tedious and non-productive:

 

- These maps need to be rendered at a very fast clip in a combat flight sim. As such, they are an excercise in compromises, to preserve the frame rate.

 

(Using a finer mesh is a sure way to bog down the rendering. Using bigger textures does the same. Expanding the draw distance does the same. Etc, etc, etc. Please try to understand it. You can disagree with the choices of compromises made, but you can't just ask to "add on more", because computing doesn't work like that).

 

- The goal of these maps is not to replicate Google Earth.

 

(The users of these maps will use them for combat flight simming, not for perusal side-by-side with Google Earth. Apart from the above-mentioned technical limitations, there are time and budget limitations as well. Time and budget spent on spurious sidetracking, such as compliance with Google Earth, don't help advance the project).

 

...Try to think of these aspects the next time you post comments, they will be the better for it. 

[sinned]

It amazes me how many lala land "negativity on purpose gives me satisfaction" defuncts dwell here.

[ST_ami7b5]

shhhhhhhhhh...