Game version 2.011 discussion: Spitfire Mk.VB, Blazing Steppe, New graphics features

[Sneaksie]

Personally, I would advise using a passive 3D screen like 3D TV especially if you already have one (many LG and I think Phlips 3D TV models use passive tech). 3D Vision supports passive 3D screens too, it is called 3D TV Play. The eye strain for me is much lower with a passive screen than an active (polarization glasses vs shutter glasses).

[III/JG2Gustav05]

Mediocre roll when compared to the 190 A-3, but certainly not when compared to the Bf 109.  The Spit had better aileron authority than a 109.

not only roll rate, I would like to say climb performance is as good as G2/G4. 109 is only good at level speed at altitude marginally.

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

I took the Spitfire information and converted the Metric to Imperial for some of us.

 

Supermarine Spitfire Mk.VB

 

* imperial Conversion

 

Indicated stall speed in flight configuration: 137..144 km/h - 85..89 Mph
Indicated stall speed in takeoff/landing configuration: 129..135 km/h - 80..84 Mph

Dive speed limit: 725 km/h - 450 Mph
Maximum load factor: 12.5 G
Stall angle of attack in flight configuration: 18.8 °
Stall angle of attack in landing configuration: 16.0 °

 

Merlin 46 engine:

 

Maximum true airspeed at sea level, 3000 RPM, boost +9: 457 km/h - 284..Mph
Maximum true airspeed at sea level, 3000 RPM, boost +16: 515 km/h - 320.. Mph
Maximum true air speed at 7400 m, 3000 RPM, boost +9: 597 km/h - 371.. Mph
Maximum true air speed at 5000 m, 3000 RPM, boost +16: 604 km/h - 375.. Mph

 

Service ceiling: 12000 m - 39,370 ft.
Climb rate at sea level: 12.9 m/s - 42 ft/s
Climb rate at 3000 m: 13.1 m/s - 43 ft/s
Climb rate at 6000 m: 12.0 m/s - 39 ft/s

 

Maximum performance turn at sea level: 25 s, at 270 km/h - 168 Mph IAS.
Maximum performance turn at 3000 m: 30 s, at 260 km/h - 161 Mph IAS.

 

Merlin 45 engine:

 

Maximum true airspeed at sea level, 3000 RPM, boost +9: 480 km/h - 298 Mph
Maximum true airspeed at sea level, 3000 RPM, boost +16: 535 km/h - 332 Mph
Maximum true air speed at 6000 m, 3000 RPM, boost +9: 590 km/h - 366 Mph
Maximum true air speed at 3500 m, 3000 RPM, boost +16: 596 km/h - 370 Mph

 

Service ceiling: 11200 m - 36,754 ft
Climb rate at sea level: 14.5 m/s - 47 ft/s
Climb rate at 3000 m: 14.7 m/s - 48 ft/s
Climb rate at 6000 m: 11.4 m/s - 37 ft/s

 

Maximum performance turn at sea level: 22 s, at 270 km/h - 167 Mph IAS.
Maximum performance turn at 3000 m: 28.2 s, at 260 km/h - 161 Mph IAS.

Flight endurance at 3000 m - 9,842 ft: 1 h 45 m, at 350 km/h - 217 Mph IAS.

 

Takeoff speed: 160..170 km/h - 99..105 Mph
Glideslope speed: 145..160 km/h - 90..99 Mph
Landing speed: 130..135 km/h - 80..83 Mph
Landing angle: 12.5 °

 

Note 1: the data provided is for international standard atmosphere (ISA).
Note 2: flight performance ranges are given for possible aircraft mass ranges.
Note 3: maximum speeds, climb rates and turn times are given for standard aircraft mass.
Note 4: climb rates are given for 2850 RPM and boost +9, turn times are given for 3000 RPM and boost +9.

 

Engine:

Model: Merlin 46
Maximum power in Takeoff mode (3000 RPM, boost +12) at sea level: 1100 HP
Maximum power in Emergency Max All Out mode (3000 RPM, boost +16) at 14000 feet: 1400 HP
Maximum power in International power mode (2850 RPM, boost +9) at 19000 feet: 1115 HP

 

Model: Merlin 45
Maximum power in Takeoff mode (3000 RPM, boost +12) at sea level: 1185 HP
Maximum power in Emergency Max All Out mode (3000 RPM, boost +16) at 9000 feet: 1455 HP
Maximum power in International power mode (2850 RPM, boost +9) at 14200 feet: 1170 HP

 

Engine modes:

Max Cruising power (unlimited time): 2650 RPM, boost +7
International power (up to 30 minutes): 2850 RPM, boost +9
Emergency Max All Out power (up to 5 minutes): 3000 RPM, boost +16

Water rated temperature in engine output: 105..115 °C
Water maximum temperature in engine output: 125 °C
Oil rated temperature in engine intake: 70..85 °C
Oil maximum temperature in engine intake: 105 °C

Supercharger gear shift altitude: single gear

 

Empty weight: 2415 kg
Minimum weight (no ammo, 10%25 fuel): 2732 kg
Standard weight: 2979 kg
Fuel load: 274 kg / 386 l / 85 gallons
Useful load: 564 kg

 

Forward-firing armament:

2 x 20mm guns "Hispano Mk.II", 60 rounds per gun, 650 rounds per minute, wing-mounted
4 x 7.7mm machine gun "Browning .303", 350 rounds per gun, 1150 rounds per minute, wing-mounted

 

Length: 9.2 m
Wingspan: 11.21 m
Wing surface: 22.48 m^2

Combat debut: Winter 1941 (In Battle of Kuban - at Spring 1943)

 

Additional airplane configurations list:

 

Operation features:

- Engine is equipped with the automatic governor of the manifold pressure that works when the throttle is set to 1/3 position or above. It is necessary to turn the automatic governor off to set the boost value to +16.
- Engine has a single stage mechanical supercharger which does not require manual control.
- Engine is equipped with an automatic fuel mixture control which maintains optimal mixture if mixture lever is set to the forward position. To use automatic mixture leaning to reduce fuel consumption during flight move the mixture lever to backward position.
- Engine RPM has an automatic governor that controls the propeller pitch to maintain the required RPM.
- The water radiator is operated manually, while the oil radiator is unadjustable.
- Aircraft has a neutral static stability. The elevator effectiveness is high, so the aircraft should be controlled carefully, not giving too much flight stick input.
- Aircraft becomes unstable with extended landing flaps.
- Aircraft is equipped with elevator and rudder trimmers.
- Landing flaps have a pneumatic actuator so they can be extended to maximum position only. Speed with extended landing flaps is limited to 150 mph.
- Airplane tail wheel rotates freely and does not have a lock. Since the landing gear wheels are relatively close to each other, it is necessary to confidently and accurately operate the rudder pedals during the takeoff and landing.
- Airplane has differential pneumatic wheel brakes with shared control lever. This means that if the brake lever is held and the rudder pedal the opposite wheel brake is gradually released causing the plane to swing to one side or the other.
- Airplane is equipped with a siren that warns a pilot if the throttle is set to low position with landing gear retracted.
- It is impossible to open or close the canopy at high speed due to strong airflow. The canopy has an emergency release system for bailouts.
- Airplane is equipped with upper and bottom formation lights which can be turned on simultaneously or independently.
- The gun sight is adjustable: both the target distance and target base can be set.
- The gunsight has a sliding sun-filter.

 

* this information is provided by Hans specs what was given to us for this % rate on this particular Spitfire Mk Vb, so a warning to you purist that think otherwise not for discussion.

* as with any performance information- take it with a grain of salt, atmospheric conditions, pilot fatigue, engine conditions, weight, and armament, could change the outcome of your test and condition for any model of aircraft.

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/25993-aircrafts-flight-and-technical-specifications-and-operation/

Edited July 7, 2017 by 71st_AH_Mastiff

[JG27*Kornezov]

The stats are really useless. They compare apples with oranges. For one plane the maximum climb rate is at emergency power and the max speed is at combat. For another it is the inverse.

The same is for the sustained rates. The sustained turn rates for the Spit are for combat power. But we all know that it matters the emergency power and what is the turn rate at maximun emergency power? No answer.

It appears that the spit 45 (5 min = close to eternity in a dogfight) with maximum emergency power is faster than yak 1b and even fw 190 a3, which is ridiculous.

Edited July 7, 2017 by JG27_Kornezov

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

The stats are really useless. They compare apples with oranges. For one plane the maximum climb rate is at emergency power and the max speed is at combat. For another it is the inverse.

The same is for the sustained rates. The sustained turn rates for the Spit are for combat power. But we all know that it matters the emergency power and what is the turn rate at maximun emergency power? No answer.

It appears that the spit 45 (5 min = close to eternity in a dogfight) with maximum emergency power is faster than yak 1b and even fw 190 a3, which is ridiculous.

this information is provided by Hans specs what was given to us for this % rate on this particular Spitfire Mk Vb, so a warning to you purist that think otherwise not for discussion.

 

@Kornezov, so what you may think is or isn't correct; is not up to you..

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/25993-aircrafts-flight-and-technical-specifications-and-operation/

Edited July 7, 2017 by 71st_AH_Mastiff

[=EXPEND=CG_Justin]

I just flew for a bit after this update and I have a gotten a pretty good performance boost. Way to go Devs! Great update!

[JG27*Kornezov]

The hans specs are misleading for comparison because for the same thing they use in different planes different measurements. The same standard has to be used for all planes.

Edited July 7, 2017 by JG27_Kornezov

[VSlash]

The hans specs are misleading for comparison because for the same thing they use in different planes different measurements. The same standard has to be used for all planes.

You can view them as comparison and think that they are wrong/could be optimized/improved or you can think about them as an introduction to the plane, which they essentially are.

 

Their main goal is not in providing a benchmark, but in giving somebody who flies the plane for the first (-ish) time the basic idea of what to expect. For that purpose they are very much ok.

Edited July 7, 2017 by VSlash

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

The hans specs are misleading for comparison because for the same thing they use in different planes different measurements. The same standard has to be used for all planes.

as much as your engineering mind wants to, not for discussion! warning

[KARAYA1]

I flew the spitfire yesterday, amazing! But to day the Launcher says "Failed to download"?  so I can't log on :/

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

I flew the spitfire yesterday, amazing! But to day the Launcher says "Failed to download"?  so I can't log on :/

yes hotfix is out, update your launcher.

[Barnacles]

The hans specs are misleading for comparison because for the same thing they use in different planes different measurements. The same standard has to be used for all planes.

 

That would be nice.

[Barnacles]

I took the Spitfire information and converted the Metric to Imperial for some of us.

 

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/25993-aircrafts-flight-and-technical-specifications-and-operation/

 

Cheers Mastiff,

 

Also made me think, why does the Spitfire have a centigrade temperature gauge? I would have thought a British plane of that vintage would have used Fahrenheit. I have a 1968 bike and everything is imperial on it.

[KARAYA1]

yes hotfix is out, update your launcher.

Download a new launcher and install the game? Close it and start it again don't work

[Barnacles]

The stats are really useless. They compare apples with oranges. For one plane the maximum climb rate is at emergency power and the max speed is at combat. For another it is the inverse.

The same is for the sustained rates. The sustained turn rates for the Spit are for combat power. But we all know that it matters the emergency power and what is the turn rate at maximun emergency power? No answer.

It appears that the spit 45 (5 min = close to eternity in a dogfight) with maximum emergency power is faster than yak 1b and even fw 190 a3, which is ridiculous.

 

I've tested it on the deck and it definitely isn't faster than the Yak 1b or especially the A3, even at 100% balls out mega emergency mode. At altitude maybe it is not rediculous as even with the 45 Merlin it is still a fighter designed with higher altitudes in mind.

Edited July 7, 2017 by 71st_AH_Barnacles

[Matt]

The hans specs are misleading for comparison because for the same thing they use in different planes different measurements. The same standard has to be used for all planes.

In which case any of the planes without combat, emergency or take-off power or boost mode would be way superior in those stats. For instance, i don't think anybody is interested in a Bf 109 or Fw 190 vs Yak-1 comparison on nominal power, because no 109 or 190 would use that during climb or combat, while the Yak-1 would.

[unreasonable]

Cheers Mastiff,

 

Also made me think, why does the Spitfire have a centigrade temperature gauge? I would have thought a British plane of that vintage would have used Fahrenheit. I have a 1968 bike and everything is imperial on it.

 

Centigrade has been the preferred choice of engineers and scientists for a long time, well before it became standard/compulsory in the UK. I was taught to use it at school in the 60s - actually I have no idea what the Fahrenheit equivalents are.....

 

If your bike had a Fahrenheit temperature scale that was probably partly because they (Triumph?) wanted to sell to the Yanks. 

Edited July 7, 2017 by unreasonable

[LLv24_Zami]

Another amazing update - thanks devs!

 

Great (really great) news - the infamous "bubble of blur" that has plagued us (OK, at least me) all these years is (almost) gone !! There's still a small trace of it, but it's been pushed much farther away from your plane and has become almost unnoticeable on the summer maps and only slightly more noticeable (if you really look for it) on the winter map.  FINALLY!!  Looks like I've lost my excuse not to spend as much time in BoS/BoM as I've been wanting to all this time.

 

Yeah, this is a great improvement 

 

And no any noticeable performance hit with my setup.

[Spuks]

After even hotfix, graphic driver reinstalations for 840m card it still unplayable, even on the lowest presets. So there is some conflict between 840m drivers and game engines, or simple minimum system requirements became much higher after 2.011 update?

Edited July 8, 2017 by waiduooklis

[Blutaar]

So no one complains about the short emergency power cooldown with the Merlin engines. 

It jumped me in the face on my first try in this plane but no one talk about that.

I guess its cool then and in the next patch we will see this in all limited engines the same way. I really hope it will.

[Finkeren]

So no one complains about the short emergency power cooldown with the Merlin engines.

It jumped me in the face on my first try in this plane but no one talk about that.

I guess its cool then and in the next patch we will see this in all limited engines the same way. I really hope it will.

I agree. Doing this for all engines with time limits would be a useful compromise to the engine limit issues.

[KARAYA1]

yes hotfix is out, update your launcher.

I love to fly in real life and as a full time sailor and chief officer on big sailing ships I can navigate around the world with a sextant... But when the computer says "Error" I'm completely lost!

 

Thank you for your help, it works now. I love this game!

[dburne]

The clarity of the cockpit instruments for me in VR is certainly a lot better in 2.011, nice improvement to include!

 

Still can't read Russian though lol.

[Barnacles]

I love to fly in real life and as a full time sailor and chief officer on big sailing ships I can navigate around the world with a sextant... But when the computer says "Error" I'm completely lost!

 

Thank you for your help, it works now. I love this game!

 

Sextants are cool, I hope they have one in Battle of Midway/the Pacific

[downquark]

Great another update. Although for me the real good news is the game runs smoothly in ultra mode on my, yes indeed,  Imac again!  Thanks to bootcampdrivers.com. Cheers.

[=EXPEND=CG_Justin]

So no one complains about the short emergency power cooldown with the Merlin engines.

It jumped me in the face on my first try in this plane but no one talk about that.

I guess its cool then and in the next patch we will see this in all limited engines the same way. I really hope it will.

Am I missing something? Does the spit have short cooldown for after boost? Even it does, what real advantage does it give against 109s and 190s that outclass it in speed at every altitude? Not being sarcastic, its a genuine question.

[III/JG2Gustav05]

Some materials suggest that spitfireVB's 16lb boost time limit is 3mins, but in game manual it shows 5 mins, This is a typo or not?

Am I missing something? Does the spit have short cooldown for after boost? Even it does, what real advantage does it give against 109s and 190s that outclass it in speed at every altitude? Not being sarcastic, its a genuine questiｏｎ

at least I am sure that spitfire with 16lb is faster than 109 on the deck.

[CAPSLOCK_ON]

Amazing work, team!

 

Lost some hours of sleep last night to try out the Spitfire and oh boy, it was so much worth it!

 

The Spitfire is pleasant to fly, in this sim it matches the reports we're used to read from pilots and her handling is so nice. Even CEM'ing (I consider myself a newbie to this CEM stuff) her is a breeze, barely looked at the temps while keeping radiator at 20~60% during combat after frying up the engine on my first flight trial. LOL

 

The tweaked graphics and new mirror in full is amazing, didn't notice any performance hits so far, even with the grass on the airfields. I don't and didn't need to update my drivers since March as the latest drivers (from April, May and June) killed my fps. R9 270x running at steady [locked in options] 60 fps, graphics settings in High @ 1080p with HDR and SSAO turned off (but AA via Reshade on). Full screen and Vsync off as well. Steady performance as GPU load floats between 60~85% with VRAM (2 GB) all taken. Sometimes the timeframes get above 17ms (I consider 15ms and below the best experience) which gives the impression of stuttering even without fps drops, but that's my GPU calling for an upgrade, maybe next year. All in all, I feel that this update made the performance increase.

 

The only thing I can ask is to be able to open only the canopy for landing, without having the door opening as well. 

 

Congrats, this is a great update to a great product! :D

Edited July 7, 2017 by CAPSLOCK_ON

[HighStick]

Spitfire,

worth waiting for,

thank you for a job well done.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

How do I not spin on landing? Everything is great until I get to about 35mph, then spinspinspin. How much throttle should I have at that point? I've been chopping it, and I know that's wrong.

[Blutaar]

Am I missing something? Does the spit have short cooldown for after boost? Even it does, what real advantage does it give against 109s and 190s that outclass it in speed at every altitude? Not being sarcastic, its a genuine question.

Its just unfair that the Spit has such a short Boost cooldown timer while every other engine with an engine limitation has long cooldowns! Speed alone is not everything. I know there are many people who love the spit but dont be unfair, there are other people loving other planes too. Limit all engines equally or get rid of engine limitations but not this way just because people love the spit. Im sorry but thats my opinion!

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

The Spit at +16 boost does have around 20-21 m/s climbrate (109G level) in the ww2 aircraft performance webpage they talk about a test with a Spit Mk Vb achieving that climb rate with that boost level. At +18 with the very similar Merlin 50M engine it could go up to 24 m/s at very low altitude. There is another test showing a Vc with 16 boost doing 18.8 m/s (F-4 level), but they recall that in different tests they got variable results.

 

 

The +16 boost was cleared in late 1942. A truly 1941 Mk V would only be limited to +12 and that maybe features the performance most people were expecting of it? Similar to how the Yak-1 and LaGG with the PF are better than the most known P/PA engined ones from 1941 and might surprise newcomers in that regard. Having the Merlin 45 instead of the Merlin 46 also makes it a much better climber at low altitudes.

 

Apparently from what I heard the 5 min limit is with 3000 RPM only, even at lower boost like +9 for example.  3000 rpm and +16 would have the actual 3 mins.

Edited July 7, 2017 by -=PHX=-SuperEtendard

[Freycinet]

How do I not spin on landing? Everything is great until I get to about 35mph, then spinspinspin. How much throttle should I have at that point? I've been chopping it, and I know that's wrong.

35mph!?

[Willy__]

How do I not spin on landing? Everything is great until I get to about 35mph, then spinspinspin. How much throttle should I have at that point? I've been chopping it, and I know that's wrong.

 

 I chop the throttle to land and have no problems with spinning... Perhaps be a bit of more active on rudder like all taildraggers with no tail wheel lock ? 

 

-edit- 

You could also pull back on the stick, but I dont know if it helps.

Edited July 7, 2017 by JAGER_Staiger

[ICDP]

How do I not spin on landing? Everything is great until I get to about 35mph, then spinspinspin. How much throttle should I have at that point? I've been chopping it, and I know that's wrong.

 

You are referring to a ground loop and it is a big problem with tail draggers like the spitfire.

 

After touchdown I let speed drop a bit before raising the flaps, then brake to slow down and once you notice the rudders becoming less effective give some throttle to keep airflow over the rudder.  It can help to use differential braking quite liberally and above all keep practicing.  Obviously in aircraft with a tail-wheel lock it is much easier.

Edited July 7, 2017 by ICDP

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Pull back on the stick to plant the tail and ADD a little throttle after touchdown to keep air moving over the tail. Also be more active on the pedals and stay ahead nose while it sways.

[=EXPEND=CG_Justin]

Its just unfair that the Spit has such a short Boost cooldown timer while every other engine with an engine limitation has long cooldowns! Speed alone is not everything. I know there are many people who love the spit but dont be unfair, there are other people loving other planes too. Limit all engines equally or get rid of engine limitations but not this way just because people love the spit. Im sorry but thats my opinion!

I think it's pretty accurate and by no means OP. Fighting in the Spit or against it is all going to come down to pilot experience, competency, and tactics. But I don't feel the cool down is going to make it OP. IMHO, it's just as competitive as any red fighter, WHEN USED PROPERLY.

[DD_Arthur]

Some materials suggest that spitfireVB's 16lb boost time limit is 3mins, but in game manual it shows 5 mins, This is a typo or not?

 

 

Apparently from what I heard the 5 min limit is with 3000 RPM only, even at lower boost like +9 for example.  3000 rpm and +16 would have the actual 3 mins.

 

The actual pilots notes covering the Spitfire Vb state combat boost - by using the boost cut out - was available between 2850 and 3000rpm with upto +16lbs. of boost,  with a five minute limit.

 

I'd post a copy here but.....photobucket     

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Thank you for all the ground spin advice guys!

[Blutaar]

I think it's pretty accurate and by no means OP. Fighting in the Spit or against it is all going to come down to pilot experience, competency, and tactics. But I don't feel the cool down is going to make it OP. IMHO, it's just as competitive as any red fighter, WHEN USED PROPERLY.

So i guess the P40s engine boost recovery timer is ok then? Or the P39 which will have the same engine and its limitations? And the 109 with its 60 seconds Boost and 10min or more (i dont really know, i never use 1.42 ATA) recovery timer. What about the Mig3 and IL2s?

Its not about overpowering its about fairnis with other engines. If the Merlin engine have a shorter boost recovery timer then the duration of its 5 min full boost timer, then there is soemething wrong. It feels like balancing what we dont want in this genre or am i wrong, do we want balancing?

 

I dont talk about the 5 min duration, i just talk about the recovery timer which is a lot shorter then on any other engine!

Edited July 7, 2017 by Ishtaru