Developer Diary, Part 113 - Discussion

[bokepacha]

I'm looking forward to see this out!

[=CFC=Conky]

Release the Kraken! 

 

Er, I mean the 110   .

[AndyJWest]

I think Han's post makes the objectives of the developers clear enough. They are adding tanks to an air combat simulator, not creating a tank sim. There are fundamental limitations implicit in doing this (most obviously in the incompatibility of level of detail required for a dedicated tank simulator with the scale of maps needed for air combat), and we need to bear this in mind. If people are promoting Bo'X' as a 'new WW2 tank sim', they are probably going to be disappointed - instead, they should look at tanks as a bonus, with maybe some possibilities for added gameplay (online and offline) provided one understands the limitations, and what the developers' priorities are. I'm certainly looking forward to trying them out.

[LLv24_Zami]

Something like this you had in mind?    

 

Nice! Really a close range tank killer 

[Rjel]

I'm really eager for the tanks to come in to BoS. Even if they aren't designed to be accurate to the nth degree, the potential for adding a tremendous amount of game play value is there. I hope it's a successful experiment that will be considered for expansion in the future. I'd much soon have a state of the art flight sim with lesser quality ground vehicles than the other way around.

[clayman]

All great news ... you guys are right on the mark! Thank you 

[Avimimus]

This looks very good. It looks as well done or better in many respects than most tank sims.

 

 

Tiny comments:

 

1) It would be nice to see coarse and fine traverse/elevation for turrets (i.e. the big wheel for turning the turret quickly, and the smaller wheel for making finer adjustments to aim). This would also improve the modelling of anti-aircraft guns. At the very least this could be modelled by adding a slight tendency to move too far or too little when turning a turret quickly (whereas slow turns would allow accurate adjustment).

 

2) It'd be nice to see the optics get dirty after a bit.

 

 

The big issue:

 

AI: It really matters. A big problem with Combined Arms in DCS at the moment is that enemy AI can see through trees and also reliably find targets (rather than being effected by camouflage, gunner error etc.)

 

With ground combat the AI becomes more apparent. It is also increasingly advisable to have some type of command AI that can give orders to advance, retreat to cover or flank as a group.

 

Generally speaking (aircraft) AI has been one of the most difficult (and least satisfactory) experiences in Rise of Flight (and to some extent BoS). So that is the one area I'd view as being most important.

 

Generally speaking I'm very excited to see you guys experiment. I want a drivable boat (even if you have to invent the cabin)!

 

 

P.S.

We're still missing the U-2, the Il-4, the FW-189, and maybe the MBR-2... So I'm also excited about more aircraft. I'd certainly buy a flyable Ju-52 btw. That might also be worth something of a kickstarter like test - will people buy a transport aircraft? Give us a chance and see if we come through!

[7.GShAP/Silas]

This is very, very cool.  Especially for something created essentially out of spare time and on initiative. Congratulations! If you were to charge, I'd happily pay.

 

 

I can assure that my group of 7 guys and myself would happily take a group of tanks and drive over an enemy airfield or objective! The only thing I wish were included(and doubt is) is the ability of a single player tank to lead at least one or two AI tanks. Four tanks vs. four sturmoviks is daunting, though I suppose that's part of the idea!

[Livai]

---> Tanks will be fun if you use it right. Why? Tanks open more possibilities than planes. How? A huge tank gun create nice big holes into your plane. Use the forest to hide near enemy airfields waiting for planes or for the who appear close to your big gun. If thats not enough wait near a Objective where planes fly low to meet your big gun again! And if thats not enough you upgrade your WW2 tank to a much better & more effective tank like this one here ---> http://www.facebook.com/il2sturmovik/photos/pb.100672376677296.-2207520000.1447494998./616926365051892/?type=3&theater

 

Its time to roll out!

 

 

 

[ER*Stefan]

Flakpanzer IV for airfields

[Feathered_IV]

Flakpanzer IV for airfields

I can just imagine that. It would need some extreme arcade aiming assists to compensate for the lack of range finding equipment. It would also involve a hell of a lot of waiting about until an enemy aircraft wandered into range.

[216th_Lucas_From_Hell]

Not to mention the chance of a trigger happy player zapping a friendly out of the sky as they come in to land after a tough mission. Then both sides come square off at the forums.

[Asgar]

I can just imagine that. It would need some extreme arcade aiming assists to compensate for the lack of range finding equipment. It would also involve a hell of a lot of waiting about until an enemy aircraft wandered into range.

lack of range finding equipment? excuse me?

 

there is your rangefinder

[Feathered_IV]

Thank you Asgar.  I am aware of the apparatus.  Are you suggesting the player will be using one of these?

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

-snip-

 

I can assure that my group of 7 guys and myself would happily take a group of tanks and drive over an enemy airfield or objective!

 

-snip-

 

Gee, I sure hope you and your seven are filling the empty servers of this flight simulator, too.

[Jade_Monkey]

This is very, very cool. Especially for something created essentially out of spare time and on initiative. Congratulations! If you were to charge, I'd happily pay.

 

 

I can assure that my group of 7 guys and myself would happily take a group of tanks and drive over an enemy airfield or objective! The only thing I wish were included(and doubt is) is the ability of a single player tank to lead at least one or two AI tanks. Four tanks vs. four sturmoviks is daunting, though I suppose that's part of the idea!

I dont see why not. You can already lead a group of AI planes in SP, and you can do that by linking them to you with a target in the ME.

[Asgar]

Thank you Asgar.  I am aware of the apparatus.  Are you suggesting the player will be using one of these?

why not, the tanks can be crewed by multiple players. the driver once in position can switch to the range finding position and range the target for the gunner. I'm sure it would make for interesting gameplay

[t4trouble]

 

 

tanks can be crewed by multiple players. the driver once in position can switch to the range finding position and range the target for the gunner. I'm sure it would make for interesting gameplay

 

I hope they make muti crew an option in the tanks and be able to lock positions, unless the crew is on ts together, it doesn't work and quite frustration.

[Willy__]

I think the multi crew on tanks will work just like multi crew on planes, which means the pilot will be able to switch positions, but the people who join in as a gunner (or other position) will be locked on that position.

[6./ZG26_Gielow]

Ehm...no:

 

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_87#Ju_87G

There were no gun pods on Stalingrad. Thanks for agreeing with me. Edited November 15, 2015 by KG62_Gielow

[7.GShAP/Silas]

Gee, I sure hope you and your seven are filling the empty servers of this flight simulator, too.

 

 

Gee, we sure are. If one big-boy server with at least a few people on it 24-7 is the most we can get, I'll take it.  Better than anything else around, no?  I hope you're right there on WoL with me, though I somehow doubt it.

 

 

Actually including some love for the real war on the ground is only going to be an improvement, however minor.  Nice attitude, though.  Snark is very endearing.

Edited November 15, 2015 by Silas

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

Gee, we sure are. If one big-boy server with at least a few people on it 24-7 is the most we can get, I'll take it.  Better than anything else around, no?  I hope you're right there on WoL with me, though I somehow doubt it.

 

 

Actually including some love for the real war on the ground is only going to be an improvement, however minor.  Nice attitude, though.  Snark is very endearing.

 

Not entirely sure what you're getting at but somebody must have woken up on the wrong side of the bed.

[LukeFF]

There were no gun pods on Stalingrad. Thanks for agreeing with me.

 

...and you totally missed the point of my post.

[johncage]

...and you totally missed the point of my post.

if the qualification is that it must have operated at the battle of stalingrad, then indeed you are still wrong and whatever point you're trying to make is moot.

[Dakpilot]

if the qualification is that it must have operated at the battle of stalingrad, then indeed you are still wrong and whatever point you're trying to make is moot.

 

The discussion was never about it (G1/D-3 with 37mm's) being operated at Stalingrad

 

Cheers Dakpilot

[Cybermat47]

I know what music I'll be playing when I start up a T-34 for the first time...

 

[Neil]

Great Update.

Good job on the 110 and the ju88

I love this idea of "experiment" tanks.

Keep going!

[unreasonable]

I wondered how long it would take for Girls und Panzer to rear it's head...

[Cybermat47]

I wondered how long it would take for Girls und Panzer to rear it's head...

It's such a bizarre show that I constantly have to remind myself that it exists

[Finkeren]

I know what music I'll be playing when I start up a T-34 for the first time...

 

If we're gonna post videos of grown Japanese mens' repressed pubescent fantasies, at least let's get the full version. That one also has some fairly good bits of animation. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIY36UbDbQQ

 

(I can only imagine how that rendition of Katyusha must sound to a native Russian speaker. I know how it sounds to me, when Japanese actors are trying to speak German in anime  )

Edited November 16, 2015 by Finkeren

[Cybermat47]

If we're gonna post videos of grown Japanese mens' repressed pubescent fantasies...

And here I was, thinking it was normal to have a crush on a T-34-85

 

 (I can only imagine how that rendition of Katyusha must sound to a native Russian speaker. I know how it sounds to me, when Japanese actors are trying to speak German in anime  )

I saw an anime movie recently that had small parts where characters spoke in English.

 

I'm glad that there were subtitles

Edited November 16, 2015 by Cybermat47

[Finkeren]

I saw an anime movie recently that had small parts where characters spoke in English.

 

I'm glad that there were subtitles

 

The first anime series I really watched back in the mid-late ninetees was "Neon Genesis Evangelion" (the "English" title alone makes me cringe - though the series itself is spectacularly good)

 

One of the main characters is a 14 year old German girl named "Asuka" (which is not a name in Japanese but meant to sound like "Oscar", which is a Gaelic masculine name, not a German feminine one) The first time they had that character speak German in the series, I litterally thought she was meant to be speaking some otherworldly, alien language, it was completely unrecognizable. 

 

Sorry for the off-topic

[Gump]

has anyone mentioned how the mix (tank/plane) of players is planned to work out?

.

i mean, with a max player limit (84 now), how many slots are going to be taken by tank-ops?

.

if the max # is boosted to handle an easier tank model, what happens when/if those slots are taken by pilots?

.

or, will there be a different 'entry point' to a server MP mission for tankers and pilots?

.

i guess i wonder if the player limit will actually diminish for pilots, as some slots will now be acquired by tankers?

[=362nd_FS=RoflSeal]

has anyone mentioned how the mix (tank/plane) of players is planned to work out?

.

i mean, with a max player limit (84 now), how many slots are going to be taken by tank-ops?

.

if the max # is boosted to handle an easier tank model, what happens when/if those slots are taken by pilots?

.

or, will there be a different 'entry point' to a server MP mission for tankers and pilots?

.

i guess i wonder if the player limit will actually diminish for pilots, as some slots will now be acquired by tankers?

I have a feeling it would be up to the servers themselves.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if we see tank-only servers.

[Finkeren]

or, will there be a different 'entry point' to a server MP mission for tankers and pilots?

 

I'd definately like to have this as an option for mission designers.

[Brano]

I want that evil bunny painted over my T-34 ,dont argue with me about realism 

 

[Feathered_IV]

Hmm.  I wonder if the tanks can be skinned like aircraft. 

[Finkeren]

Hmm. I wonder if the tanks can be skinned like aircraft.

My guess would be yes. Just imagine the joy of the WoT/WT crowd when they discover, that they can paint their tank any color they like without having to pay 200 gold.

[Sunde]

My guess would be yes. Just imagine the joy of the WoT/WT crowd when they discover, that they can paint their tank any color they like without having to pay 200 gold.

Untill they realise that no one else can see their awsome paintjobs ;/

[Finkeren]

Untill they realise that no one else can see their awsome paintjobs ;/

Yeah that is a bit of a bummer, but then again, it works to your benefit, that your tank can look fabulous on your own screen, while a Sturmovik above doesn't immediately spot your bright pink with lime green polka dots-skin.

Edited November 17, 2015 by Finkeren