Stand alone vs. Expansion

[Bearcat]

Sort of like RoF and IM?

 

What is IM?

 

Surely even without inflation the original IL-2 prices were not so cheap...and BoS /Bom is quite similar to IL-2---Forgoten Battles----Pacific fighters  which were standalone/merged or am I not remembering correctly?

 

Cheers Dakpilot

 

They were .. Standalone PF was ver 3.0 Merged was ver 3.0m but if you had PF IIRC you could not play in a merged version at all... even if they were running PF maps... I am hoping (do not know for sure so don't quote me on this..) that this will be different.. that as long as you have the map and at least some of the planes in the mission you will be able to fly with what you have.. It makes no sense to me to not get the full monty anyway.. especially since BoS will more than likely go on sale before the price of BoM goes up after EA.

[LukeFF]

What is IM?

 

Ilya Murmomets, an addon for Rise of Flight that was originally a standalone game but was recently merged into ROF. It had/has backing from the Russian Military-Historical Society. 

 

http://riseofflight.com/store/aircraft/sikorsky-s22/

Edited May 24, 2015 by LukeFF

[Dakpilot]

How much would it have cost to have bought the original IL-2 and all the add-ons up to 1946...and then corrected to current prices with realistic inflation..it always disturbs me when the price of BoS at this stage, is compared to a discounted version of 1946 at todays price long after it has been 'discontinued' notwithstanding the number of free (5?) patches created by a third party (TD) which have added greatly to 1946 value/content and skewed a lot of the sim community in what is possible with a ''comercial'' venture, the content is much appreciated,   but does give a weird expectation for any other title to compete with

 

Cheers Dakpilot

[voncrapenhauser]

I think if you change your perspective ever so slightly you can view the price in a more positive light. Even if you just look at this as an expansion you are getting seven (in premium) new planes and, for giggles let's call it three new maps, for your 100 bucks. That's 10 dollars per item, even as a DLC expansion pack. Still not bad in my book. The glass is 3/5ths full. 

I agree with you wholeheartedly.

 

I just believe the way that 777 has gone about making it an entirely new game has got peoples backs up...like me.

I have not played this game in any form since this announcement, which is a shame as I really liked this game.

 

I usually play both on and offline, but TBH if the offline campaign is not greatly improved, I will not buy into BOM, but I see no evidence of this happening so far, so I will withhold my money for now with fingers crossed for the future.

@@LukeFF

 

Ilya Murmomets, an addon for Rise of Flight that was originally a standalone game but was recently merged into ROF. It had/has backing from the Russian Military-Historical Society.

 

In my opinion the right way to do this.

[Bearcat]

I think if you change your perspective ever so slightly you can view the price in a more positive light. Even if you just look at this as an expansion you are getting seven (in premium) new planes and, for giggles let's call it three new maps, for your 100 bucks. That's 10 dollars per item, even as a DLC expansion pack. Still not bad in my book. The glass is 3/5ths full. 

 

Actually it isn't even $100 it is $80 and that's actually 6 new aircraft if you take the view (that we know many will) that the P-e2, IL-2 and two 109s are variants of aircraft already in the sim.. Even still though $80 for 6 totally new aircraft and 4 new variants .. and 3 new maps is very reasonable.. but a lot of folks will still opt out and then complain when the price goes up after EA... or wait until the standard edition is released and then complain about not having all the aircraft. IMO given the overall quality of BoS at it's core in spite of it's issues there is no reason for anyone to be running BoM as a standalone product after the sales that we all know are coming. As I said earlier.. at $50 BoS P is a great deal and the absolute best sim bang for the buck going if you are talking about developer supported CFSs.

 

Ilya Murmomets, an addon for Rise of Flight that was originally a standalone game but was recently merged into ROF. It had/has backing from the Russian Military-Historical Society. 

 

http://riseofflight.com/store/aircraft/sikorsky-s22/

 

Ahh! Right I forgot about that because it did not interest me.

 

How much would it have cost to have bought the original IL-2 and all the add-ons up to 1946...and then corrected to current prices with realistic inflation..it always disturbs me when the price of BoS at this stage, is compared to a discounted version of 1946 at todays price long after it has been 'discontinued' notwithstanding the number of free (5?) patches created by a third party (TD) which have added greatly to 1946 value/content and skewed a lot of the sim community in what is possible with a ''comercial'' venture, the content is much appreciated,   but does give a weird expectation for any other title to compete with

 

Cheers Dakpilot

 

IL2FB - $50

IL2 AEP - $50

IL2PF - $40

IL2 Pe2 - $10

IL2- 1946 - $50

 

.. not to mention .. even though it was not a part of the expansion but it was the jumping off point for all of this ... IL2 - $50

 

In total that is $200 .. now granted 1946 had all the previous content and then some in one DVD... but if you were there at the start like many of us were this was the path we took.. and for me .. if I had to trade off the early days of IL2 and the enjoyment I still get to this very day from IL2 for $200 ... well.... What $200?

 

I actuaklky spent more than that because I bought several copies of various incarnations of the combined packs as gifts trying to get some friends into the genre.. remember the IL2 Gold and the IL2 Complete editions.. and there was a meged IL2+AEP edition as well...

 

 

I agree with you wholeheartedly.

 

I just believe the way that 777 has gone about making it an entirely new game has got peoples backs up...like me. I have not played this game in any form since this announcement, which is a shame as I really liked this game.

I usually play both on and offline, but TBH if the offline campaign is not greatly improved, I will not buy into BOM, but I see no evidence of this happening so far, so I will withhold my money for now with fingers crossed for the future.

@@LukeFF

 

In my opinion the right way to do this.

 

I am curious .. how would you have done it if you were in their shoes?

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

@Bearcat - for perspective I was looking at worst case scenario and assuming $100 after EA expires.

 

Another change of perspective should maybe be made in the marketing of BOM. This IS an expansion pack (small print: which may be purchased as a stand alone game if you wish)

 

@vch - I took two months off after the release of BOS and was kind of depressed over how the community was eating it's young over various issues. Then I started to fly again in small doses. Now I'm addicted again. In a good way, other than my laundry pile has grown a bit and my lawn could be trimmed a bit more often. I still eat, go to work and am social with family. So, I think I'm ok.

 

I actually encourage you to take some time away and revisit in a bit if it's got your hackles up. Come back later and have fun again. Even with its many warts, it's well worth playing.

Edited May 24, 2015 by HerrMurf

[6./ZG26_Emil]

@Bearcat - for perspective I was looking at worst case scenario and assuming $100 after EA expires.

 

Another change of perspective should maybe be made in the marketing of BOM. This IS an expansion pack (small print: which may be purchased as a stand alone game if you wish)

 

@vch - I took two months off after the release of BOS and was kind of depressed over how the community was eating it's young over various issues. Then I started to fly again in small doses. Now I'm addicted again. In a good way, other than my laundry pile has grown a bit and my lawn could be trimmed a bit more often. I still eat, go to work and am social with family. So, I think I'm ok.

 

I actually encourage you to take some time away and revisit in a bit if it's got your hackles up. Come back later and have fun again. Even with its many warts, it's well worth playing.

 

Indeed my lawn punished me for my lack of attention yesterday....1 hour later after battling it with strimmer & mower it now looks like a pony paddock

 

I spent £40 ($62) on GTA 5 recently....less than 100 hours hours later I was bored of it and haven't touched it since. I've flown hundreds of hours in BOS already so I know which has given me value for money.

[SYN_Mike77]

Am I wrong in assuming that BoM will be merged with BoS for those of us who own BoS, but will also be a stand alone game for those who do not own BoS?  That's how I read what the devs said.  If so, what is the problem with that?

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Yes and no problem for most. It's a game of semantics otherwise.

[SharpeXB]

 I will never pay $80 for a game, no game is worth that much

Then you probably won't be buying any more flight sims. Really all the work in this genre goes into the aircraft and maps themselves, the FM and 3D work. So the developer sells the planes and maps. The game engine is secondary, it could even be free as in RoF and DCS. That's what's different compared to the old days when all this work was much easier to do since PCs didn't have the capability of handling elaborate models and physics. So the original IL-2 sold for probably $40 and had 30 planes in it. They sold the game, not the content.

Today's flight sim prices for any of them range from as little as $10 per for non click pit versions (like BoS) up to $50-60 (DCS X-Plane etc). So BoS is right in the range of the market today.

And War Thunder is not "free" there are people who spend over $1,000 on content for it.

[361fundahl]

War thunder IS free... I've been enjoying it and haven't paid a cent.

And I've unlocked multiple vehicles just through the game.... GMC with 75mm is fun....

[SharpeXB]

War thunder IS free... I've been enjoying it and haven't paid a cent.

 

Well just because WT is "Free to Play" doesn't mean people aren't spending lots of money on it. If they were not it would be out of business.

And the BoS planes cost less than the WT extras. A single plane at the WT store is $26

Edited May 24, 2015 by SharpeXB

[Urra]

Well just because WT is "Free to Play" doesn't mean people aren't spending lots of money on it. If they were not it would be out of business.

And the BoS planes cost less than the WT extras. A single plane at the WT store is $26

And they have raised the prices repeatedly since the start, so there must be a market.

[SharpeXB]

And they have raised the prices repeatedly since the start, so there must be a market.

Sure. Someone needs to pay for the development. The thing with F2P is that the paying players subsidize the free ones.

Honestly for what you get, the WT planes seem a bit pricey. DCS has planes with professional flight models for $10

[361fundahl]

Yes DCS definitely is at another level lol. 

[Reflected]

Guys, a quick question:

 

Those who have BoS but not BoM: will they be available to see BoM aircraft in game as non-flyable? I mean as AI in QMB or fight them online. If not, it will split the community, and that will be the end of MP IMO.

 

Thanks!

[Bearcat]

Well just because WT is "Free to Play" doesn't mean people aren't spending lots of money on it. If they were not it would be out of business.

And the BoS planes cost less than the WT extras. A single plane at the WT store is $26

 

There is a guy on this forum who has said that he has spent close to 1K on WT.. with the golden eagles and all.. KI have nop idea what he is talking about because I walked away from WT when it was in Beta and have not looked back one bit.

 

Sure. Someone needs to pay for the development. The thing with F2P is that the paying players subsidize the free ones.

Honestly for what you get, the WT planes seem a bit pricey. DCS has planes with professional flight models for $10

 

When you factor in sale prices of both DCS and this series it becomes a no brainer...

 

Guys, a quick question:

 

Those who have BoS but not BoM: will they be available to see BoM aircraft in game as non-flyable? I mean as AI in QMB or fight them online. If not, it will split the community, and that will be the end of MP IMO.

 

Thanks!

 

I was wondering about that as well...

[6./ZG26_Emil]

Guys, a quick question:

 

Those who have BoS but not BoM: will they be available to see BoM aircraft in game as non-flyable? I mean as AI in QMB or fight them online. If not, it will split the community, and that will be the end of MP IMO.

 

Thanks!

 

This question was asked on the questions for developers. Zak replied and I think he said that BOS plane owners can fly on servers with BOM plane owners so yes you can see them and shoot them but he didn't say anything about the BOM AI aircraft for BOS owners.

[Reflected]

This question was asked on the questions for developers. Zak replied and I think he said that BOS plane owners can fly on servers with BOM plane owners so yes you can see them and shoot them but he didn't say anything about the BOM AI aircraft for BOS owners.

 

Aha, so MP should be OK as long as it's not the Moscow map. QMB is a question but oh well.

 

I'm asking because BOM is reeeallly pricey, and I'm reluctant to pay because many major issues in BoS are still there despite all the complaints (such as G-2 throttle, hit sounds, etc...)

 

I will probably still buy it, I just want to be sure it's a good investment (like RoF was)