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The P40 thread

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This one for people hanging out for the announced P40. Before we start getting into endless discussions on tech specs and performance, some inspiring art..

 

196992_1156839477_large.jpg

 

RIP Glen Angus 'Gangus': http://gangus.cgsociety.org/ 

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I just read "The Star of Africa", my impression was P40 aka Tomahawk / Kittyhawk / Curtiss -> prey :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:  (Not that the Hurris Mk II and Spitfires Mk V did any better)

 

I just love to fly it in the Original IL2.

Edited by I./ZG15_robtek

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 my impression was P40 aka Tomahawk / Kittyhawk / Curtiss -> prey :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

How can you dare...., it performed so well in the film "Pearl Harbor"! :lol: :lol:

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It's a classic and probably one of the more popular planes in BoM. Maybe I'll get it only for makign some nice murican paint shemes for it :biggrin:

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I like that noseart "Shrak bait".

 

When the P40 arrives, you'll all gonna be "FlyingShark bait" ;) .

 

:salute:

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The P 40 will do just fine.

 

Like any bird, fly to it's strengths, avoid it's weak areas, and you will find success in it.

 

The 325th. did well in it in North Africa, for example.

 

To this day one of my best online fights was in the worst version of it in old IL2, the M.  North Africa scenario on Spits vs. 109s. (I think).  Some "experten" thought his slats, flaps and bazillion horsepower engine would carry the day down low against me.

 

He was wrong.

 

Dead wrong.

 

He tried to sucker me into a scissor fest, but I was having none of his nonsense.  Every time he tried that I simply pulled up gently, then used the P40's good roll rate to invert then drop on him and take a short deflection shot.

I guess his left wing could only hold so much extra lead because it suddenly dropped and he spun in, giving me the kill.

 

The lesson here is that treating any enemy as an "easy kill" can and will backfire on you.

Edited by BlitzPig_EL

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Angus's works was great.. well it still is great.. very unique. What a talent we lost..

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6x12.7

like continuous buckshot stream.
and a sharkmouth.
and a 500 pound bomb.

all win.

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Yes, but the arguments about their effectiveness (.50's) will outstrip the luftwhiners (of which I am a card carrying member) in a matter of days.

 

BALL vs AP vs API vs cannon weight of fire vs machinegun weight of fire vs pattern vs..................................

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Looking forward to a good P-40 3D model. Oleg's version was hopeless. Nose too long, tail too short, and twice the dihedral in the wings.

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Yes, but the arguments about their effectiveness (.50's) will outstrip the luftwhiners (of which I am a card carrying member) in a matter of days.

 

BALL vs AP vs API vs cannon weight of fire vs machinegun weight of fire vs pattern vs..................................

dont make no difference at 30 yards...

 

but we have ricochet technology, so Panzer IV will be TOAST.

Lolz

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My favourite U.S. fighter of WW2.  Simple, rugged, looks like a proper fighter should.  It also saved a lot of bacon when we were all caught with our pants down.  It did very well considering it was outclassed in almost every theater.

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I always feel like I have a chance I that plane. I don't of course, as I am a poor pilot, a worse dog fighter,and an even worse plane spotter. But the plane makes me feel like I have a shot if I'm smart.

But I'm not.

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Every time I see one in a museum I feel like I could just hop in and take off...  Like I flew one in a past life or something...I don't believe in reincarnation in this life..but I did in my last one ;)

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Unless they tweaked the damage model lately, judging by the 12.7mm in the LaGG and Pe-2: 6x .50 will be killer in this game. Removing the wing guns should a loadout option as well. 

Edited by Calvamos

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I wonder if the devs would include a bonus DF map with the P-40 MC-202 etc?   Just a big square of sandy texture with a couple of generic airfields...

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Sort of like that old desert map in CFS 1.. anyone remember that..

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The P-40 is about as interesting as a U.S.-built fighter is gonna get for me. Loads of charisma on that plane.

 

BoM is gonna have us all trian hard to use convergence properly with half the fighters having at least half of their firepower in the wings.

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Looking forward to a good P-40 3D model. Oleg's version was hopeless. Nose too long, tail too short, and twice the dihedral in the wings.

Agreed it was a caricature of a p40.

But fun nonetheless.

My favourite U.S. fighter of WW2.  Simple, rugged, looks like a proper fighter should.  It also saved a lot of bacon when we were all caught with our pants down.  It did very well considering it was outclassed in almost every theater.

+1

What if the P40 receives what some around here call "The Fw190 treatment"?  :lol:

No comment.

Won't comment.

Edited by voncrapenhauser

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So how does the p40 stack up against say, a 109f4? the p40 is an energy fighter right? What are its advantages other than the 50 cals?

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So how does the p40 stack up against say, a 109f4? the p40 is an energy fighter right? What are its advantages other than the 50 cals?

Every fighter is an 'energy fighter'. If you mean BnZer, then no, not really.

 

The P-40E would be inferior in performance to the F4 at all altitudes, but it's fairly sturdy, quite maneuverable (especially in the rolling plane) and heavily armed though the guns are obviously harder to aim.

 

Still, I'd say the F4 has a definate advantage, but no more than it has against the Yak-1.

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I just read "The Star of Africa", my impression was P40 aka Tomahawk / Kittyhawk / Curtiss -> prey :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:  (Not that the Hurris Mk II and Spitfires Mk V did any better)

 

So how does the p40 stack up against say, a 109f4? the p40 is an energy fighter right? What are its advantages other than the 50 cals?

That is fairly simple, 109 pilots preferred vertical maneuvers in which P-40 was terrible. Soviet pilots could go into horizontal fights with P-40s but never into the vertical. This is mainly because of power to weight ration and general statistics.

 

 In tests performed at Wright Field, Dayton in Ohio in summer 1941 - "MEMORANDUM REPORT ON  Pursuit Single Engine P-40E, A.C. No. 40-384" it achieved top speed of 342 mph (550 km/h) at 3474 meters and 340 mph (547 km/h) at 4700 m altitude. Time to reach the altitude of 3000 m was approximately 4 minutes and 26 seconds and to 6000 meters it was 11 minutes and 49 seconds. 

However, the RAAF performance trials shown that plane does not meet given performance figures.
Report No. A.&A. E.E./783. For RAAF about Kittyhawk A.K. 572 powered by Allison V.1710 F.5.R (39) indicated :
Maximum rate of climb of 1640 ft/min at 11,400 ft ( 8,33 m/s at 3500 meters), time to 3000 meters was 6 minutes and 12 seconds, time to 6000 meters was 14 minutes and 12 seconds. The maximum speed was about 331 mph ( 532 km/h at 3000 m).
 
The worst climb performance I saw was P-40E with a Hydulignum bladed propeller, maximum rate of climb was 1350 ft/min at 12,000 feet. Plane reached 20,000 feet (6000 meters) in 17 minutes and 25 seconds. There are bombers which have a better climb performance ...
 
But in horizontal turns Soviet pilots were sure they could outmaneuver 109s, they also praised the high comfort of the machine and rugged construction. 
 

I'm afraid P-40 will be a bit complicated to use, will require a lot of discipline in combat. And it will take ages to climb in it ...

 

Yes, but the arguments about their effectiveness (.50's) will outstrip the luftwhiners (of which I am a card carrying member) in a matter of days.

 

BALL vs AP vs API vs cannon weight of fire vs machinegun weight of fire vs pattern vs..................................

I am afraid of discussions and comparison between M2 .50 caliber vs 12.7 mm Berezin vs 12.7 mm Breda-SAFAT, we will come to a very old disputes 

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Most of what I have read about the lend-lease P-40 gave me the impression that Russian pilots didn't care for it too much and preferred the P-39 over it.

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"Two myths about the P-40 were that it was slow and not maneuverable. Compared to later American and German aircraft with 400+ mph top speeds, a mere 345 mph at 15,000 feet (the top speed of the P-40C) doesn't seem that impressive. But remember, in 1940-41 the Warhawk's top speed essentially matched that of the Spitfire 1A (346 mph at 15,000 feet) and Bf-109E (348 mph at 14,560 feet), and surpassed the A6M-21 Zero (331 mph at 14,930 feet) and Hawker Hurricane II (327 mph at 18,000 feet)."

 

"In Italy the 325 Fighter Group, commonly know as "The Checker-Tailed Clan" amassed one of the best kill to loss ratios of any fighter group in the European Theater. In 1943 the 325th won two major engagements. On July 1, 22 checker-tailed P-40s were making a fighter sweep over southern Italy when they were jumped by 40 Bf-109s. After an intense air battle, the result was half of the German aircraft shot down for the loss of a single P-40. There was a similar situation on the 30th of July, again over Italy, when 35 Bf-109s ambushed 20 P-40s. On this occasion, 21 German fighters were shot down, again for the loss of a single P-40. Because the pilots of the 325th were trained to maximize the P-40's strengths and minimize its weaknesses, it became a lethal opponent for the German fighters. The final record of "The Checker-Tailed Clan's" P-40s was 135 Axis planes shot down (96 were Bf-109s), for only 17 P-40s lost in combat."

 

H

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interesting, so on two sorties, not just one lucky sortie, but twice!

 

Thanks for the post!

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"Two myths about the P-40 were that it was slow and not maneuverable. Compared to later American and German aircraft with 400+ mph top speeds, a mere 345 mph at 15,000 feet (the top speed of the P-40C) doesn't seem that impressive. But remember, in 1940-41 the Warhawk's top speed essentially matched that of the Spitfire 1A (346 mph at 15,000 feet) and Bf-109E (348 mph at 14,560 feet), and surpassed the A6M-21 Zero (331 mph at 14,930 feet) and Hawker Hurricane II (327 mph at 18,000 feet)."

The top speed is not the best thing to point, it is a sort of "corner". How often you reach it ? Most of the time you are either below the top speed (maneuvering) or over it (diving). From my perspective the more important, when the differences in top speed are not big (345 mph for P-40, 348 mph for 109 E or 346 mph of Spitfire I) but rather really minor, close to a production margin ... the more important aspect is acceleration. And in this case P-40 was inferior, due to its draggy airframe and weight.

 

What can turn the tables might be the proper tactics and discipline. I am looking forward to fly this warbird, just to see what it can do :)

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If it means anything, the RAF gave serious consideration to replacing all it's Hurricanes with P40s.

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