VKB Gladiator joystick project

[Sokol1]

Looks Gladiator "vanilla", the extension is DIY, the user made several changes in their stick - include use the base inverted. 

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/4718-modern-talking-gladiator/?do=findComment&comment=508282

Edited March 7, 2017 by Sokol1

[JG13_opcode]

What's the difference between the Gladiator vanilla and the Gladiator Pro?  It's not really clear from the website.

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

What's the difference between the Gladiator vanilla and the Gladiator Pro?  It's not really clear from the website.

 

The gimbal mechanism.

[Sokol1]

Gladiator PRO use the "Next Gen" - all metal (aluminum, steel) ball bearings, CAM - gimbal instead the "pincer" (CH like) plastic gimbal of Gladiator "vanilla".

 

https://flightsimcontrols.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/GLAD_PRO_FINAL_1.jpg

 

This gimbal came with 2 additional CAM profiles and 4 different tension springs.

 

The gimbal connector allow Gladiator PRO swap their KG12-B (3 buttons +POV HAT) grip by Warthog, Cougar, Cobra M5 or future VKB grips.

 

Due this swap grip feature Gladiator PRO loose the "twist rudder" of Gladiator "vanilla".

 

And cost more 146$. 

 

The rest is common in both versions.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Sokol1

[sinned]

Fyi VKB gladiator joystick has one MAJOR FLAW.

 

Trigger, when pressed, it gets stuck. Very often.

 

I searched online and no... unscrewing the trgger lever doesnt work. There are number of others like myself and no avail help.

 

The actual button behind the trigger lever has weak pressure to push the button back out. Thus when a lever attached to the button by magnet, is pressed, it gets stuck.

Not so good when you are in a midst of a dogfight.

 

Amazing how they could oversee this MAJOR flaw in the most important button.

I dont want to discourage others from buying this great stick but this trigger stuck leaves very bad taste.

 

Careless QC.

[6./ZG26_5tuka]

Fyi VKB gladiator joystick has one MAJOR FLAW.

 

Trigger, when pressed, it gets stuck. Very often.

Interesting, I don't have this issue nor heared of it before (got the earlier, less flexible trigger).

 

Don't think this could be the magnet's fault but maybe the friction lock for the 'safe' position engaging mistakenly in firing mode?

 

I just tested it and I got mine to get stuck as well when plling the trigger on the far outer postion (roughly 1 out of 5 times). If you place your finger just a few mm higher and pull it will not get stuck.

Edited March 8, 2017 by 6./ZG26_5tuka

[sinned]

Thanks for comments but I tried all different area of trigger but it gets stuck.

 

Google vkb trigger stuck and you will see results.

 

Good joystick but poor QC on the most commonly used button.

 

If you press the inside button with your tip of finger, you will see pressure out is very weak. That explains the frequent stuck trigger.

 

If you never encountered this problem, thats good for you. It just means russian roulette for next buyers.

[Sokol1]

Chinese QC... 

 

The trigger mechanism:

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-41868000-1475149129.jpg

 

In Slaw review of Javelin (Gladiator OEM) he see this (done by AG):

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-79973500-1475149406.jpg

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-18476000-1475149405.jpg

 

Probable the internal plastic ring on button cover stuck on walls and need the same "tuning". 

Edited March 8, 2017 by Sokol1

[sinned]

I followed your links.

 

 

Thanks for comments.

 

What would you suggest? (I think VKB should put you on their payroll)

Chinese or russia or usa whowver it is, this is poor QC which should be worn by parent company.

 

If VKB gave mandate to some chinese company for manufacuring thier product with their logo and produced this crap, someone at VKB needs to be fired.

[Sokol1]

What would you suggest?

 

If return the product is out of question - considering the difficulties for buy, imagine for return... - open the grip and inspect, the probable culprit is the same plastic ring.

 

Gladiators are manufactured by (Taiwan) Asian Games, supposedly under VKB QC control - probable inspection of samples (EDIT: "We accept production by ISO9001 standard. It makes a random sample (100 joystick) and they were tested.")

Edited March 9, 2017 by Sokol1

[LulaNord]

Hi...i am a new user here. I have some doubts with me. Does wizzo have any benefit for me as a VKB rudder t-peddal mk II user, can I use it to setup the virtual toe brakes ?Also I can seem to find any instructions on how to change the centering cam for the t-rudder mkII, is it possible for this model ?I found stuff for how to do it on mk III and IV but not for mk II.

[Sokol1]

T-Rudder don't allow virtual "toes brakes" ("toe brakes" = press one pedal individually for press right or left brake individually), but allow virtual "differential brakes" = press a button for "wheel brakes" (both),  then move rudder bar for brake only right or left wheel, like work the original brakes in (RL) IL-2 Sturmovik or Yak-1.

In the end the practical result is similar, but the way to do is different.

 

In BoS you don't need extra software for do this "differential brake" because game allow set in this way for all planes, including ones that in RL use "toe brakes" (Bf 109, P-40) - this possibility is a bless for players with twist rudder joystick.

 

For DCS or CLoD planes like P-51, Bf 109, Fw 190... T-Link virtual "differential brakes" is useful.

 

What you need is T-Link and not Wizzo. Wizzo is exclusive for Gladiator, and is (IMO) a worthless soft, since VKB DevCfg do the same thing that Wizzo do and in better (advanced) way.

 

T-LInk download: http://ftp.vkb-sim.pro/Programms/T_link_v0_66_2.zip

 

About change CAM in Mk.II depends, seems firsts series don't allow this. Can you post a picture?

Edited March 9, 2017 by Sokol1

[Sokol1]

Gladiator Mk.II MagzTV review

 

[sinned]

I was wondering if anyone has feedback on metal trigger.

 

My mk2 has very sticky gun trigger.

Does metal help?

[Dutchvdm]

I was wondering if anyone has feedback on metal trigger.

 

My mk2 has very sticky gun trigger.

Does metal help?

 

I have the MKI model and i'm using the metal trigger. For me it never sticks and is quiet lose. I even tighten the screws to the side a bit.

 

Grt M

[Sokol1]

Is need attach a small magnet in back of metal trigger for held then against the button internal spring.

 

The upgrade metal trigger version for Gladiator "vanilla" Mk.I/II came with magnet:

 

http://vkbcontrollers.com/?product=vkb-gladiator-pro-replacement-trigger-metal

Edited April 4, 2017 by Sokol1

[sinned]

I contacted vkb support for a diy solution.

 

Suggestion is to put a tape (to lessen the magnetic force).

 

Tried and no joy.

Trigger suddenly stuck in the heat of battle leaves....frustrating results......

[Sokol1]

If this "My mk2 has very sticky gun trigger" means that firing button under the trigger lever was locking pressed, try stretch their internal spring a bit for force the button back a bit more.

 

This trigger work (more or less) like this draw:

 

 

The spring is inside the button (blue).

 

 

Or maybe are some burr in the plastic ring that hold the button cap - or in the cap - that cause this lock.

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-41868000-1475149129.jpg

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-18476000-1475149405.jpg

 

Apply plastic safety grease (silicon) inside this ring.

 

 

The spring is inside the button (blue).

 

[sinned]

If this "My mk2 has very sticky gun trigger" means that firing button under the trigger lever was locking pressed, try stretch their internal spring a bit for force the button back a bit more.

 

This trigger work (more or less) like this draw:

 

 

The spring is inside the button (blue).

 

 

Or maybe are some burr in the plastic ring that hold the button cap - or in the cap - that cause this lock.

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-41868000-1475149129.jpg

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-18476000-1475149405.jpg

 

Apply plastic safety grease (silicon) inside this ring.

 

 

 

The spring is inside the button (blue).

Thank you sokol, for suggestions and an excellent diagram.

 

I seriously think some of these joystick manufacturers should put you on their payroll.

[xThrottle_Geek]

Is there any news about the throttle quadrant? I bought the rudder pedals and I'm very happy with the purchase. Would definitely be interested in other products.

[Sokol1]

Nope, probable for Q4 2017 or next year, after Gunfigther - no finalized yet - the priority is MCG grip, only after came the throttle(s).

[Dutchvdm]

I would like the throttle as well. There are not that many nice options out there for a throttle. The TMW throttle looks nice, but i would kind off feel silly to only buy the throttle, and the other Thrustmaster throttle looks a bit gamey.

 

Grt M

[Sokol1]

 

 

The TMW throttle looks nice, but i would kind off feel silly to only buy the throttle, and the other Thrustmaster throttle looks a bit gamey.

 

Game wise TWCS (the "gamey") result more effective than TmW throttle. 

[Dutchvdm]

Game wise TWCS (the "gamey") result more effective than TmW throttle.

That still doesn't make it pretty . What about the custom throttle. There was someone that made them. Can't remember his name.

 

Grt M

[Sokol1]

GVL 224 - but they are ugly like WW throttles, difficult will fill your prerequisite that a good throttle should by "pretty".

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/23758-iron-mechanic-throttle-motor-control-axes/

 

BTW - TmW throttle is sold and can be used as standalone throttle.

Edited April 14, 2017 by Sokol1

[Dutchvdm]

GVL 224 - but they are ugly like WW throttles, difficult will fill your prerequisite that a good throttle should by "pretty".

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/23758-iron-mechanic-throttle-motor-control-axes/

Yes! That one.. Thnx.

 

Maybe pretty is the wrong word. I mean they look sturdy and heavy. A bit industrial if you catch my drift..

 

I will check those out.

 

Grt M

[LLv44_Kanttori]

I am building universal "heavy duty" metal throttle consoles for fighters and two motor aircrafts. These "vintage WWII style" metal chassis goes together very well for. ex. with the Slaw Device rudder pedals and Baur's Bf 109's KG13 Grip or VKB Gladiator stick. Click the link picture below!


 

[71st_AH_Mastiff]

I have the MKII pro and no issues with my metal trigger doesn't stick for me.

[Sokol1]

 

FYI - VKB controllers available - for a while, at least - in Flightsincontrols (Netherlands):

https://flightsimcontrols.com/store/

[312_JS]

If this "My mk2 has very sticky gun trigger" means that firing button under the trigger lever was locking pressed, try stretch their internal spring a bit for force the button back a bit more.

 

This trigger work (more or less) like this draw:

 

 

The spring is inside the button (blue).

 

 

Or maybe are some burr in the plastic ring that hold the button cap - or in the cap - that cause this lock.

 

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-41868000-1475149129.jpg

https://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/uploads/monthly_09_2016/post-12288-0-18476000-1475149405.jpg

 

Apply plastic safety grease (silicon) inside this ring.

 

 

The spring is inside the button (blue).

Stretching the spring is actually going to make things worse.

It is the spring (red), that is pushing the actual electronic button (gray), not the plastic button (blue). So if you stretch the spring, it will still be blocked by the plastic button from the right (as it can't go any further right due to it resting on its rim) and since the spring is longer now, the only way it can extend/push is to the left, where the electronic button is. That results in the electronic button being pressed permanently. Been there, done that.

I personally hate the trigger, it's extremely light. I'm going to try to replace the electronic button with something stiffer (like the shift button).

Edited September 26, 2017 by 312_JS

[KG200_Volker]

I had the sticky trigger problem too, solved by 90% by loosing up the screw that holds it in place and lubricating the sides of trigger that come in contact with the body of grip with a drop of wd40. From the time that I replaced it with the metal one the problem disappeared even thow it's far heavier! The only thing with the metal one is that it can't flip over by its own when you have it in the safety position.

 

PS. I also sanded the sides of the trigger to remove any impurities from the plastic and made it as smooth as possible.

Edited September 27, 2017 by KG200_Volker

[Sokol1]

Just FYI, Gladiator "vanilla" (non PRO) is now available in Europe (flightsimcontrols).

 

 

 

 Eduard VKB FSC » Tue Oct 31, 2017  - "Now we sell Gladiator also in EU market."

[Danziger]

Will they now make a Fokker grip for Rise of Flight players?

[Sokol1]

Maybe in... 2025, because the next in the list is "Kosmosima" grip, after an F-14 grip...

[Wolfram-Harms]

Does any of you guys know more about this stick?

(The ASIAN GAMES website is rated as "unsecure" by my FIREFOX; the video looks promising - but I cannot find it at AMAZON or anywhere else to buy.)

 

[SCG_Space_Ghost]

 

Does any of you guys know more about this stick?

(The ASIAN GAMES website is rated as "unsecure" by my FIREFOX; the video looks promising - but I cannot find it at AMAZON or anywhere else to buy.)

 

 

 

I believe this HOTAS was cancelled early on.

[Sokol1]

It's a early VKB project - postponed indefinitely, seems not a good idea in the resulting price range, a "console" or "monoblock" for compete against  HOTAS (Saitek's X-5/6x).

Edited January 24, 2018 by Sokol1

[Wolfram-Harms]

Ah, okay - thank you both!

 

Another question: can anyone "lead me to the water" - a thread about making joysticks longer?

[Sokol1]

Another question: can anyone "lead me to the water" - a thread about making joysticks longer?

 

If this "longer" you mean add a extension in joystick, this is feasible and benefit some models but not all - some make this difficult due integrate "twist rudder", or springs used have no force for deal with the leverage created.

 

Latest joystick gimbal designs like VKB , BRD and VPC (VirPIl) consider extension use in their projects.

 

For Warthog was a 'add-hoc' solution adopted by players to address their stiction issue, easy to implement due their removable grip  - with good success, although the original project don't did not anticipate this use. Are various options of ready to use extension kits in the market.

 

This old issue of Computer Pilot Magazine has a article about, with suggestion t on how to do in a "entry-level" joystick.

 

http://www.pcaviatornetwork.com/files/CP143MT6FZ6A.ZIP

[SJ_Butcher]

We need the throttle guys! something that can look like the gladiator mk2...