CheeseGromit Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 I thought we all knew about the unlocks for months and months... I recall this being mentioned many months ago as well. I also recall feedback from those only interested in MP that they had no interest in unlocking things via the singleplayer campaign. None of this negative feedback around unlocks should be news at this point. I've not followed development particularly closely so I can't comment on whether or not it was made completely clear that they heard this feedback but weren't going to change the design based on it. (For the record I'm SP only).
Zak Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 I'm not that bad. I know. Gonna start a kickstarter hold on I'd be glad to help.
IRRE_Belmont Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 I know. I'd be glad to help. Nice, you now have the right to choose the actor who will play your role, Georges Cloney is aleady taken though
Chuck_Owl Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Someone should ask Sean Bean... but that means someone's got to die at the end.
UVPalexej21 Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Hi, Not happy as others, but I will give it a try first before I start to hate it... What about unlocking via Multiplayer ? That would be interesting for me....
Zak Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Nice, you now have the right to choose the actor who will play your role, Georges Cloney is aleady taken though Jude Law could do well I guess. What about unlocking via Multiplayer ? That would be interesting for me.... I personally find the idea really good, but no, it's not in the plans. 2
Mikey Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Am i the only who find this game to be fun since update...? flight models seem better, more sounds...performance increase for me about 10-20fps ...maybe I am crazy?
kaboki Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) I personally find the idea really good, but no, it's not in the plans. So what is the plans then, turn this into another WT to attract COD players and remove the hardcore SIM crowd just as Microsoft tried with MS Flight? What's next, a console release? Well good luck with that. Am i the only who find this game to be fun since update...? flight models seem better, more sounds...performance increase for me about 10-20fps ...maybe I am crazy? I find it more boring because Im forced into SP now. I never really haven't had any performance problems at ultra settings+Nvidia SSGS and can't help to think I even could have pushed more out of this engine, better terrain LOD and more smoke, the trailer is so misinforming with all that fire and smoke over Stalingrad, doesn't look even close in the game, I would go as far as calling it false advertising. Your maybe not crazy, but maybe you have been taking to many "420's" lately... Edited October 4, 2014 by kaboki
dburne Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) MS Flight did not even make it a year. They certainly thought they had the answers, and did not much listen... But they sure had the XP. Edited October 4, 2014 by dburnette
Orfanik Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 I think the campaign is for people who play WT, but makes a mockery of others who support the ROF a few years now and now also BOS. I am between them from the beginning. Regarding the BOS, I should like for example the possibility adjust the mouse sensitivity, or the ability to lock the exterior view of enemy aircraft in flight record, as well as in ROF. Thank you in advance.
Requiem Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 PART 81 DEVELOPPER DIARY IN BRIEF You forgot to put free camera down there with a "Where's Wally" in amongst the crowd. I don't think it will be returning
Zak Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 ...BUT I totally understand the MP-only crowd that feel they are being forced down a road they really don't want to follow. (AI clubbing is no fun etc. etc.) Sooo... is MP totally unplayable without unlocks? Am i the only who find this game to be fun since update...? flight models seem better, more sounds...performance increase for me about 10-20fps ...maybe I am crazy? Good to hear, some more optimizations is yet to come. So what is the plans then, turn this into another WT to attract COD players and remove the hardcore SIM crowd just as Microsoft tried with MS Flight? What's next, a console release? Well good luck with that. BOS is different from COD, this has been obvious from the first dev blogs. And it's not WT for obvious reasons ($94 and AFM at least). No consoles. 1
Rothary Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 For me the campaign itself is not a problem, not even it's unlocking system. I personally find the unlocks quite fitting for it. The problem is, as some have stated, the fact that I have the same unlocks in the other game-modes too, while I can only make them availeable through the campaign. QMB used to be a playground of freedom where I could use whatever weapons, field mods and camouflage I wanted, including an actual winter camo for my QMB opponents. Now QMB is merely a reminder of how I have to play the campaign with every single plane to make QMB the same playground of freedom it used to be. Like I've stated earlier, I'd really enjoy it if the unlocks (atleast weapon mods) were exclusive to the campaign. Default winter skins shouldn't be locked at all IMHO. Ofcourse this is my personal view on this. Not saying it's the right and only option. 2
oblongmushroom Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Listen guys, We have said all along that this was the system that was being built and would be implemented. Why anyone would assume that just because you bought the early access you would be exempt from this system is bizarre. If you want to help us find bugs and test the system great, if you want to complain about something ya'll knew was coming that is not helpful. This is the system Loft was designing all along and is now implementing. There should be no surprises here. Jason I understand your point of view but if your customers give open feedback on this forum you provided then maybe this is valuable information for you, even if its something you don't want to hear or agree with. After all, sometimes its smarter to code for the masses than ones self. This work ethic has been very beneficial to those who follow it in business. Seems you already feel you have the correct plans in place for this titles success?
Madov Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) Am i the only who find this game to be fun since update...? flight models seem better, more sounds...performance increase for me about 10-20fps ...maybe I am crazy? No, you're not the only one. Flight model seems tightened up, performance increase even on my system is noticeable. Those amongst us who had bothered to properly listen to all the developer information have no surprises here. It is as they said it would be and I am feeling more confident that there is a real future in this franchise. The road is laid as they said they were going to do it. We here are not the customers that will come this way, we are simply observers who have bought the access rights to see what's going on. We have no rights or entitlement to anything other than what they said we would have and here it is. Edited October 4, 2014 by MADOV 2
wellenbrecher Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) Sooo... is MP totally unplayable without unlocks? No, but you're missing a good bit of the functionality of the game. Want to do some JaBo? Too bad. IL2s abound aplenty and need pods? Too bad. German tanks encroaching on your territory but the presence of enemy fighters makes Il2s too vulnerable to attack them? Too bad. Think the default green skin isn't viable on a winter map? Too bad. Want the sheer fun of going low and blasting things with rockets? Lol nope. Do you get killed all the time while doing so because you can be spotted from half the map away in your summer camo? Get good. That kinda stuff. Edited October 4, 2014 by [JG2]G3_wellenbrecher 3
Mikey Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 So what is the plans then, turn this into another WT to attract COD players and remove the hardcore SIM crowd just as Microsoft tried with MS Flight? What's next, a console release? Well good luck with that. I find it more boring because Im forced into SP now. I never really haven't had any performance problems at ultra settings+Nvidia SSGS and can't help to think I even could have pushed more out of this engine, better terrain LOD and more smoke, the trailer is so misinforming with all that fire and smoke over Stalingrad, doesn't look even close in the game, I would go as far as calling it false advertising. Your maybe not crazy, but maybe you have been taking to many "420's" lately... If anything i have not taken enough of my "420's" today but i do not have top of the line setup, i7-3770k but only a gtx570 struggles with most games coming out recently. regardless im sure big improvements will come to the singleplayer campaign and the unlock system..just not gonna happen overnight.
kaboki Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 BOS is different from COD, this has been obvious from the first dev blogs. And it's not WT for obvious reasons ($94 and AFM at least). No consoles. I was just being sarcastic and I ment attracting the "Call of Duty" crowd... I just mean, what players are you really trying to get into this sim/game...
1./JG42Nephris Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) Sooo... is MP totally unplayable without unlocks? No, MP is useless as long as one has to unlock stuff before. Yes without unlocks you create an unfair situation. Yes, without unlocks you create problems in mission creating and logics - open at least the possibility for earning XP in MP. As you may have noticed, a lot of MP players feel really bothered by being forced, to play a seriously boring and spiritless campaign. Enough people out there that can invest 3h a week at max to follow their beloved hobby - flight sims. And enough people are interested in MP only, so it is hard to accept and understand, the developer force us to waste time in a useless SP campaign to get unlocks in MP. That much headwind in a short time since the DD81 should give 777 an idea, that their made decision here seems to be slightly off. Noone wants the unlock to be canceld, but maybe a compromise into the correct direction, like opening XP, at least in MP. Edited October 4, 2014 by 1./JG42Nephris 3
dburne Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 That much headwind in a short time since the DD81 should give 777 an idea, that their made decision here seems to be slightly off. You would think , but that certainly does not appear to be the case.
Orfanik Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 For me the campaign itself is not a problem, not even it's unlocking system. I personally find the unlocks quite fitting for it. The problem is, as some have stated, the fact that I have the same unlocks in the other game-modes too, while I can only make them availeable through the campaign. QMB used to be a playground of freedom where I could use whatever weapons, field mods and camouflage I wanted, including an actual winter camo for my QMB opponents. Now QMB is merely a reminder of how I have to play the campaign with every single plane to make QMB the same playground of freedom it used to be. Like I've stated earlier, I'd really enjoy it if the unlocks (atleast weapon mods) were exclusive to the campaign. Default winter skins shouldn't be locked at all IMHO. Ofcourse this is my personal view on this. Not saying it's the right and only option. Exactly so. I have the same opinion.
39bn_pavig Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Just did a bomber escort in the Lagg. Excellent mission. Missed the drop as the lead pe2 was about to get boomed by a 109. Everything behaved as it should. Great immersion. Unlocked some bombs for ground attack. Sweet! Single player looks great. (Can't wait for potential coop.) Looking at the way the unlock system is structured though it struck me - MP players don't actually need to unlock anything at all. If you stick to the role each plane was designed for, the base load outs are perfectly fine. Even so, I managed to unlock some stuff just while tuning/testing my HOTAS/pedals/trackir. The big advantage of SP is you can pause to fiddle with stuff like that. For the MP folk who don't want to play SP at all, I don't know why they don't ignore it completely. They can just celebrate the improved frame rates that also turned up for many people today. The advantage of the SP campaign is that it is a development vehicle for the tools which will later be used for the design of MP missions by the community. It has to be secure, robust and flexible enough to ensure everyone is playing without exploits and the missions can be complex, varied and interesting enough to sustain the life of the sim. All the elements I've seen so far contribute to this, and today BoS took a great leap towards being a structured gaming platform with more longevity than a mere death match arena with good physics. Sandboxes and arenas are dime a dozen on steam, but BoS is showing itself to be a serious platform. As someone who predominantly plays MP, I have quickly fallen in love with the campaign. The quality of players on MP servers varies, and there have been plenty of times when I have logged off due to poor sportsmanship, poor RP, imbalances, etc. The quality of AI doesn't compare favourably to good MP players, but it is certainly preferable to bad ones. At least it mostly stays on mission, and has skills somewhat consistent with real pilots. Do we really imagine that playing against human opponents who have the advantage of never dying while they skill up to ace level represents reality? What I am really looking forward to is when we see greater integration between MP and AI (hopefully in coop.) When this develops the battlefield will start to feel truly populated and as if we are immersed in an ongoing war. I have seen the start of this some of the MP missions which are beginning to develop. Stalingrad is big - far too big to populate with MP players alone and create a truly immersive experience. Seeing some of the tricks the campaign system is bringing to the table gives me hope that we will see more development along these lines. Hats off to the developers (and mod makers). This release is awesome. 6
SYN_Haashashin Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Sooo... is MP totally unplayable without unlocks? Not at all, at least that my point of view. Its totally playable IMO. I have not done any unlocking and just got out of our server to see how unlocks can affect, yeah it does, but not to the point where is totally unplayable. I was able to pick up a Pe-2 with standard bomb load (2 bombs) and the same with the He-111 (4 bombs), note that I didnt play any SP with those planes. I see myself just flying in SP the planes I want for MP the most and in case I have to fly other plane which I dont have any unlocks, well I will use the standart load out.
Afwastus Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 No, but you're missing a good bit of the functionality of the game. Want to do some JaBo? Too bad. IL2s abound aplenty and need pods? Too bad. German tanks encroaching on your territory but the presence of enemy fighters makes Il2s too vulnerable to attack them? Too bad. Think the default green skin isn't viable on a winter map? Too bad. Want the sheer fun of going low and blasting things with rockets? Lol nope. Do you get killed all the time while doing so because you can be spotted from half the map away in your summer camo? Get good. That kinda stuff. Spot on.
kaboki Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) If anything i have not taken enough of my "420's" today but i do not have top of the line setup, i7-3770k but only a gtx570 struggles with most games coming out recently. regardless im sure big improvements will come to the singleplayer campaign and the unlock system..just not gonna happen overnight. If they just had opened the graphics settings you could have tweaked it to work perfectly fine with you humble GTX570, but instead they dumb down the ultra settings(read: optimizing) so people like me doesn't get any benefit from having updated hardware and so people like you can play on ultra settings. Oh my god I wish I had some medicine now even if the clock hasn't turned 420 yet:(. Damn Hells Angels who can't even supply up here anymore...frikking amatours.. Edited October 4, 2014 by kaboki 1
wellenbrecher Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) Not bothering with it and just miss out on a sizeable amount of customisation (skins until we can get custom ones), fun (alternative play-styles -> JaBo, rockets), functionality (head-rest in the 109s and JaBo) and plain old content we actually all paid for. Also what 1./JG42Nephris said up there. It leads to bad situations balance-wise and makes the job unnecessarily harder for the mission designers. Edited October 4, 2014 by [JG2]G3_wellenbrecher
89- Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (very?) young fan of Il2 BOS http://youtu.be/N3m4gMQ3cCs?list=UUdDGB4juty3GNR50xaS8_AA New blood is always good. Also, looking through his videos its funny how evolution of taste goes - WT arcade with mouse , realistic battles WT, ROF with trackir and joystick, IL2:BOS. 1
kaboki Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (very?) young fan of Il2 BOS http://youtu.be/N3m4gMQ3cCs?list=UUdDGB4juty3GNR50xaS8_AA New blood is always good. Also, looking through his videos its funny how evolution of taste goes - WT arcade with mouse , realistic battles WT, ROF with trackir and joystick, IL2:BOS. Im not sure how happy I am having the "squekers" abord , but I guess we need new blood.
wellenbrecher Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Ok, so in the Russian forum a dev said they're going to wipe all progress on release. Here the thing, IMO you can keep the bloody unlock system in the game as you seem to be rather bend on having it in anyway so I am not sure all the outrage in the world would make you change it. But please, for the love of whatever god you might believe in, do not make us play all of it twice if we want to use the stuff in MP. It's not fun to a sizeable amount of your customers, do not make us go through that twice for no reason. The bad blood you'd create with that could easily kill the game before it even properly begins. Please, just don't. 2
IRRE_Belmont Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 ATTENTIONEXCLUSIVE FOOTAGE OF BoS : THE MOVIE
Afwastus Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) But please, for the love of whatever god you might believe in, do not make us play all of it twice if we want to use the stuff in MP. It's not fun to a sizeable amount of your customers, do not make us go through that twice for no reason. The bad blood you'd create with that could easily kill the game before it even properly begins. Please, just don't. Brecher please, my ingame autopilot, who I've named Hans, is perfectly capable of grinding through the campaign for me again. Edited October 4, 2014 by Afwastus
Trinkof Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) Seriously guys : The unlock is not that hard ... 1 hour for unlocking ALL unlock including skins for 1 plane. Just play in expert / short mission-> for only the most "useful" one, such as bombs etC... it takes around 30 minutes.I agree I do not like to have to unlock things, but seriously, this is not a big deal at all AND : it forces you to test the campaign and give feedback to developer. Some people talk without knowing about War Thunder , about those "immature kid" want to have to have fun, like unlock (This is basically not true at all for instance, unlock in WT are very painful and long, unlike here... and they are seen as a bad side of the game) I come from War Thunder, and do not fool yourself, after the hainous and stupid posts made since the 81 dev diary on BOS ... well ... We are no better here.I might be the only one to say this , but Thank you to the team, I may not agree with every choice you made, but this is your game, and it is intense fun for me Quick question about unlocks : Wha we unlocked in early access will stay unlocked after release ? Or will there be a wipe of our progress ? Edited October 4, 2014 by LAL_Trinkof 1
Afwastus Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) Unlocks will be wiped, at least based on what the developers have posted in the Russian forums (use auto-translate to read): http://forum.il2sturmovik.ru/topic/1974-obsuzhdenie-81-j-chasti-dnevnikov-razrabotchika/?do=findComment&comment=208126 Player comment: Damn, and wipe it on the release of the why? IMHO a worthy reward testers, those who have time naotkryvat. Since I gave away all the bricks and suspensions unique Developer reply (BlackSix): That at the time of release were all equal in the initial conditions, the standard practice for games with RD Edited October 4, 2014 by Afwastus
duko Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (very?) young fan of Il2 BOS http://youtu.be/N3m4gMQ3cCs?list=UUdDGB4juty3GNR50xaS8_AA New blood is always good. Also, looking through his videos its funny how evolution of taste goes - WT arcade with mouse , realistic battles WT, ROF with trackir and joystick, IL2:BOS. way too young to go to war dat cheer when he got an unlock
wellenbrecher Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) Brecher please, my ingame autopilot, who I've named Hans, is perfectly capable of grinding through the campaign for me again. I would've though he was called Ingvar But no, even if you do not actively play it, there's reason to make us invest that amount of time. If it's just for testing the mechanics, keep it in SP. Easy and should be obvious. Also, I keep seeing these posts by either mods or devs and even some users that keep seeming to put down the "hardcore" element of the userbase for some reason. Guys, take a look at Guild Wars 2 and it'll be easily apparent what happens if you try to keep that part if your fan base out of your game. Or heck, WarThunder if you absolutely have to. The hardcore element pays for servers, makes mods, finds even the most ridiculously obscure bugs, makes guides and strategies and generally sticks with a game for utterly unreasonable amounts of time. Plain and simple, they're needed and effectively telling them to suck up or leave, will hurt you in the long run. Yes, they can be annoying, yes they often has unreasonable ideas about what should be done, but they're still needed. Please don't become the GW2 of flight sims... Edited October 4, 2014 by [JG2]G3_wellenbrecher 1
kendo Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) Ok, so in the Russian forum a dev said they're going to wipe all progress on release. Here the thing, IMO you can keep the bloody unlock system in the game as you seem to be rather bend on having it in anyway so I am not sure all the outrage in the world would make you change it. But please, for the love of whatever god you might believe in, do not make us play all of it twice if we want to use the stuff in MP. It's not fun to a sizeable amount of your customers, do not make us go through that twice for no reason. The bad blood you'd create with that could easily kill the game before it even properly begins. Please, just don't. If (?) that is true then I have to shake my head in disbelief. It's painful watching this. I really don't want to see any more needlessly silly decisions alienating and annoying people. The basics of the sim are great. But these decisions....?!? Today is starting to remind me of COD's release day. Not good. Edited October 4, 2014 by kendo
LastRightsXIII Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 Who says I am a SP forcing you to play the campaign, you get headrest with one mission, winter cammo with the next ....in the time you have been on the forum here you could have all the unlocks you "need" for MP on 109F, in two weeks you will have forgotten that pain have just done that while checking the forum not using 16X either Cheers Dakpilot Aint that the truth.
oneeyeddog Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 This is a thread started by Blacksix on july 5th 2013 that goes on for 315 posts. It seems to make the unlock system clear, so the Single Player campaign that was released yesterday should come as no surprise.
Y-29.Silky Posted October 4, 2014 Posted October 4, 2014 (edited) I come from War Thunder, and do not fool yourself, after the hainous and stupid posts made since the 81 dev diary on BOS ... well ... We are no better here. Whaaat? We are way better off here. BoS has yet to break a promise for one thing.. Edited October 4, 2014 by Silky
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