La-5 ammo supply

[Finkeren]

The La-5 and its variants (FN especially) has always been my favourite WW2 aircraft. Tough, powerful, compact and with bad-ass looks.

 

There is one detail about this awesome aircraft that has puzzled me lately: The amount of shells carried for the Shvak autocannons. Every source I've seen has claimed that 200 rounds were carried for each gun on every variant up to the Shvak armed La-7, but then I stumbled upon this:

 

http://www.airpages.ru/eng/ru/la5fn.shtml

 

Claiming that 220 rounds were carried on the LaG/La-5, 200 on the La-5F and just 170 on the La-5FN and UTI.

 

Can anybody shed some light on, whether this is accurate?

[ImPeRaToR]

IIRC I read recently that it was about 170 rounds initially for each gun but eventually one and then the other ammo box were enlarged to carry 200 rounds, so you have 340, 370 and then 400 rounds.

On the La7 with three B20 cannons you have less ammo again, which might be confusing.

[Finkeren]

When you say "initially", do you mean initially for the FN-version (they started out by lightening the ammo load when they designed the FN and then increased it again) or for the entire La-5 produktion run (The LaG-5 started out with 170 rounds which was gradually increased to 200 on the FN)?

 

The first would seem to agree with the source, while latter is the exact opposite.

 

Are there any accounts or data showing how these changes affected performance?

[ImPeRaToR]

The latter, initially refering to the La5.
I just checked "Classic Colours - Soviet Air Force Fighter Colours 1941-1945" and it says the LaG-5 had 140 rounds per gun, and I found these references for increased ammo storage:

 

Btw, in September 43 the La5F was still being build, alongside the La5FN, with all the improvements so externally they would look the same, only the markings on the cowling would give away the difference. Especially the very first La5FNs, when compared to the latest La5Fs, did also not actually provide any noticeable performance improvements which was rectified later.

 

Great book on Russian fighters and their camouflage

[ImPeRaToR]

From the same book:

[Finkeren]

Thanks a lot. That was an interesting chard as well.

 

So the initial LaG-5 had only 140 rpg, increased to 170 during the transition to La-5F? But when did they change it to 200 rpg? Did that happen at the same time as the adoption of the M-82FN?

[ImPeRaToR]

The way I understand it they increased the ammo from 2x140 to 2x170 with the first serial La5, which seems to have been the default loadout up until some time during the FN production when some factories either finished the FN with 170 + 200 rounds or 2x 200 rounds.
So I'd say both La5 and La5F would always have 2x 170 rounds, according to how I understand this book. The La5FN also seems to have had 2x 170 rounds initially but I guess when they achieved its full potential by further improving the airframe they also added more ammo with little impact on handling.

It seems much depended on where a certain plane was made, this also heavily applies to the Yaks. Some factories would build them better (smaller gaps etc) or lighter etc. Same with camouflage schemes, there were official templates but some times factories would only follow them partially etc, I guess in order to speed up the production process.

Edited August 11, 2013 by ImPeRaToR

[Finkeren]

Yeah, all war time Soviet equipment depended to a large® degree on where it was made.

 

Thanks for clearing this up. I'm surprised at how no source online (nor in the books I've read) have gotten this simple fact right.

 

I've never bothered to check, but I'm pretty sure the old Il2 sim has 200 rpg for every version up 'till the three gun La-7. I hope they get it right with the La, in thís sim.

[JtD]

I've never bothered to check, but I'm pretty sure the old Il2 sim has 200 rpg for every version up 'till the three gun La-7.

You're wrong.

[Finkeren]

Ok, that's good to know. As I said, I never bothered checking. I usually just shoot my guns till they go click. 

[bivalov]

in "technical description of la-5, part 1, 1942" - 170 rounds per gun... in part 2, 1943 (it's continuation and looks like mainly about late models like la-5 after 9-10 series and la-5f) no any corrections... in other available manuals/technical descriptions for la-5/la-5fn/la-7 no corrections too, exept la-7 with 3xb-20, of course (130 rounds per gun)...

 

etc, like report'42...

 

and personally i know only 3 exeptions from rule - first, it's several rumors/mentions about 200 and 220 rounds per gun for prototypes and first lagg-5/la-5 in 1942 or another variant like 220/200/170 for la-5/f/fn, second, it's mention about ammoload for experimental la-5 with 1 shvak + 1 ubs, from official document, 160-170+200 shells/rounds respectively... plus mention about ammoload for FN from report by Lerche, if i'm not mistaken, 400 rounds in total...

 

in end, here drawing of ammoboxes with indication of max. capacity - 500 in total - ie 220>200>170,  200 for FN, and official 340 number of rounds can be associated at least with weight savings or with other various reasons, technical or not...

 

by the way, here is very well visible belt for shvak, i think it's mainly 3 API+1HEI... and i remembered, "technical description of la-5, part 1, 1942" has similar drawing but without number of shells, ie looks like these ammoboxes with indication it's not prototype...