dead 6 pilot kills happen a lot (lately)

[=1stROF=lapwin]

Does anyone else experience this?When I have been shot down from my six o'clock a lot (in my 109, 190 or the 110 which I fly frequently). So there is pilot armour behind me. I might as well ask my mechanics to remove the steel plate, right? 

 

<S> to all Combatbox friend and enemies

 

Lapwin 

[R33GZ]

6 hours ago, =1stROF=lapwin said:

Does anyone else experience this?When I have been shot down from my six o'clock a lot (in my 109, 190 or the 110 which I fly frequently). So there is pilot armour behind me. I might as well ask my mechanics to remove the steel plate, right? 

 

<S> to all Combatbox friend and enemies

 

Lapwin 

Not sure if this is correct or not, but aren't those armour plates only good for stopping .30 cal rounds? A .50 is going to penetrate and frag the cockpit? 

[MaxPower]

If you're shooting dead 6, the bullets might have to pass through fuel tanks, oxygen bottles, radio equipment, fuselage stringers... spare sandwiches...  Not saying that .50 can or can't do that, just saying that hitting that stuff has an effect on the bullet before it gets to the plates.

[R33GZ]

3 hours ago, MaxPower said:

If you're shooting dead 6, the bullets might have to pass through fuel tanks, oxygen bottles, radio equipment, fuselage stringers... spare sandwiches...  Not saying that .50 can or can't do that, just saying that hitting that stuff has an effect on the bullet before it gets to the plates.

True, but I still think odds are on the munition's side... especially if it's a P-47 shooting at convergence range. Then there are 8x .50 rounds all hitting the same spot

[Avimimus]

Might not be dead six either (especially taking into account convergence etc.) In any case, I ask myself: Would I trust a thin metal plate (just a few mm) to protect my neck against a .50 cal round? A 50 cal Browning has about 25mm penetration at close range... one will only lose 1-2mm from penetrating the aircraft skin.

 

As for this topic - it has come up before, multiple times, and you'll find some excellent resources in this thread - complete with detailed references:

 

[the_emperor]

From I own experience  the armour works quite well from dead 6.

During manouvering it the bullet that enters the cockpit through the sides that kills you.

keep in mind we tend to make high high deflection shots and manouver firing that dont reflect real life

If you care to take a look on some gun camera footage (low deflecation, very close range, not that much manouvering compared to what we do in the game):

 

Edited November 28, 2024 by the_emperor

[I./JG68_Sperber]

Yes, these gun cams from 1944, look to me as if the Germans were completely asleep, extremely inexperienced and no longer interested

[LukeFF]

5 hours ago, I./JG68_Sperber said:

Yes, these gun cams from 1944, look to me as if the Germans were completely asleep, extremely inexperienced and no longer interested

 

German fighter pilot quality was overall quite bad by the fall of 1944 - so much so that Hans Dortenmann remarked at one point, "My God, what are they teaching these guys?"

[Trooper117]

Even good Luftwaffe pilots were killed without knowing they were being stalked or attacked...

[ST_Catchov]

Not very sporting I must say. UnBritish. Someone from the colonies was it ...

[BlitzPig_EL]

Well, from my perspective as a Yank, the idea is to end things as quickly as possible, nothing sporting about it old chap.

 

A good cuppa when back to base would be spiffing though.

[R33GZ]

On 12/1/2024 at 1:29 AM, I./JG68_Sperber said:

Yes, these gun cams from 1944, look to me as if the Germans were completely asleep, extremely inexperienced and no longer interested

You have described my experience of flying online... flying straight and level, cruise speed, looking around at the ground trying to figure out where the hell I am, then, whack whack whack whack... what the bloody hell was that!? oh, my wing is gone 😁

[I./JG68_Sperber]

Yes, even worse in VR gg Because of neck pain, the 6 is often skipped.😅

[Sobilak]

On 11/30/2024 at 9:56 PM, Trooper117 said:

Even good Luftwaffe pilots were killed without knowing they were being stalked or attacked...

 Skalski was shot down, on 5th September 1940 in BoB, when he tried to mark on the map where the plane he had shot down moments earlier had fallen to make it easier to report the shooting. Yet he was an experienced fighter ace with 8 kills in WW2 at that moment.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

Lately if I'm shot down in 109 it's 90% wing falling off from few shots and I don't need to pull high g maneuvers, simply rolling or pull within 2 G is enough. Frustrating experience 🙄

[=1stROF=lapwin]

thx feedback gentlemen <S>