Great Battles Future

[DD_Arthur]

5 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Why was Battle of Moscow not successful? What was wrong with it?

 

There was nothing ‘wrong’ with it as a map and plane set. Just not enough people were interested in it. 

Also, the direction taken had become confusing; the original producer had delivered a high fidelity combat flight sim with ‘gamey’ elements.

The core market of combat flight simmers (the guys that do the pre-ordering) hated these elements and when it came out on Steam the gamers  - if they had a joystick - were confronted by something like the La5; an aircraft with a cockpit containing controls for throttle, prop pitch, mixture, supercharger, inlet shutters, outlet flaps and an oil cooler.

 

“Too hard, too hard...sob”

 

It was not a happy mix.

 

[Jackfraser24]

Would the Battle of Tunisia be a wise option for Great Battles?
 

Or would it cause some kind of disagreement with  Team Fusion?

 

Is the entirety of North Africa reserved for Team Fusion?

[Eisenfaustus]

Next to all interesting axis fighters for North Africa are already in the game - any module 1941-1944 with Germany as major opponent in the air will be hard pressed for a viable planeset. 
 

And I don’t think pre Mc 202 Italian birds will bring the necessary oomph

[CountZero]

4 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Would the Battle of Tunisia be a wise option for Great Battles?
 

Or would it cause some kind of disagreement with  Team Fusion?

 

Is the entirety of North Africa reserved for Team Fusion?

Regarding BoM there was differant opinions but i also belive main problem was unlock SP system, and ppl who got BoS just didnt buy BoM until that got sorted out.

 

Regarding Tunisia i think they could benefit more from doing Sicily, and just left africa main land to Clod, if clod continue to go by dates their next step for TF6 is probably El Alamian and 42 Channel, and after that Tunisia in TF7, they can probably add Malta and carriers at some point after TF6.

Edited April 19, 2022 by CountZero

[von_Tom]

2 hours ago, Eisenfaustus said:

 

And I don’t think pre Mc 202 Italian birds will bring the necessary oomph

 

Cr42

G50/G55

C.200

SM84

 

Tag on the

 

Spit II

Hurricane I

Gladiator and Blenheim and you've got early and late Malta.

 

von Tom

[CountZero]

2 minutes ago, von_Tom said:

 

Cr42

G50/G55

C.200

SM84

 

Tag on the

 

Spit II

Hurricane I

Gladiator and Blenheim and you've got early and late Malta.

 

von Tom

But would not make more atractive option to do Malta+Sicily 43 with more modern airplanes, and then add oldr types that fit Malta war as collectable. I just dont see that early war airplanes get ppl buzzing as mutch as older ones.

[von_Tom]

13 minutes ago, CountZero said:

But would not make more atractive option to do Malta+Sicily 43 with more modern airplanes, and then add oldr types that fit Malta war as collectable. I just dont see that early war airplanes get ppl buzzing as mutch as older ones.

 

More options for early war aircraft to be grouped in a bundle, so add the later stuff like a Beaufighter as collectables.

 

von Tom

[FliegerAD]

I would generally head into a later war scenario. Italy could be viable for it is well known enough, has an attractive and - again - known landscape, and it features a number of good aircraft.

 

On the Axis side you get the Bf 109G10 (you need one of those) plus a number of really hot Italian beauties, most of which happen to be competitive. Add a few bombers, and we are there.

 

The Allied side is a little more tricky... what would be a late western Allied European plane set? Not just restricted to Italy?

[Enceladus828]

7 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Would the Battle of Tunisia be a wise option for Great Battles?
 

Or would it cause some kind of disagreement with  Team Fusion?

 

Is the entirety of North Africa reserved for Team Fusion?

All we know about Team Fusion's next installment (TF 6.0) is that it will be something appealing to players and the main map will be an area that hasn't been properly covered before in a combat flight sim, and there will be 1942 Channel Map Ops. My guess is that the centerpiece will be Malta and side dishes will be El Alamein and perhaps the Cyrenaica region (to depict Rommel's retreat after El Alamein). 

 

In regards to doing Tunisia, it will not be covered in TF 6.0 as stated by TF and because they said the Fw-190A-1 to A-3 will be included this further eliminates Tunisia as the Fw-190s there were the A-4 and A-5, so as I stated before in this thread if Tunisia or Sicily is the most profitable for the devs then they will go there.

 

2 hours ago, von_Tom said:

 

Cr42

G50/G55

C.200

SM84

 

Tag on the

 

Spit II

Hurricane I

Gladiator and Blenheim and you've got early and late Malta.

 

von Tom

 

Replace the SM84 with an SM79 and replace the G55 with the Reggiane 2001. Also add the Beaufighter, Swordfish, Wellington, Beaufort or Wellington Torpedo version (with the nose gunner section removed) and replace the Spitfire Mk. II with a Spitfire Mk. Vc.

 

As I stated earlier in this thread, doing an IL-2 Battle of Malta probably wouldn't work as the game engine can't handle large amounts of planes and ships; there were 14 freighters and the S.S. Ohio in Operation Pedestal, covered by dozens of British warships and over 70 carrier-borne aircraft, combined with many Italian ships, German submarines and hundreds of Axis aircraft. It's suicide to not include Operation Pedestal and it would be pretty risky to NOT do the Attack on Taranto in the Malta installment.

Malta in this game probably would only work if the devs did an IL-2 Battle of Sicily because then you could do Malta scenarios as it would be part of the map, just like how you can do a 1941 Battle of Britain and 1941-43 Channel Map Ops on the BoN map.

 

 

[357th_KW]

5 hours ago, Eisenfaustus said:

And I don’t think pre Mc 202 Italian birds will bring the necessary oomph

From a sales and popularity standpoint, I doubt any of the possible future theaters could touch the Pacific.  Us hardcore fans here on the forum are excited about Sicily or Malta or Finland or France, but I doubt the average consumer that you want to bring into the fold is.  Even if you only had a couple A6M or Ki43 variants, the blue planes would be a huge seller.

[Jackfraser24]

3 hours ago, Enceladus said:

All we know about Team Fusion's next installment (TF 6.0) is that it will be something appealing to players and the main map will be an area that hasn't been properly covered before in a combat flight sim, and there will be 1942 Channel Map Ops. My guess is that the centerpiece will be Malta and side dishes will be El Alamein and perhaps the Cyrenaica region (to depict Rommel's retreat after El Alamein). 

 

In regards to doing Tunisia, it will not be covered in TF 6.0 as stated by TF and because they said the Fw-190A-1 to A-3 will be included this further eliminates Tunisia as the Fw-190s there were the A-4 and A-5, so as I stated before in this thread if Tunisia or Sicily is the most profitable for the devs then they will go there.

 

 

Replace the SM84 with an SM79 and replace the G55 with the Reggiane 2001. Also add the Beaufighter, Swordfish, Wellington, Beaufort or Wellington Torpedo version (with the nose gunner section removed) and replace the Spitfire Mk. II with a Spitfire Mk. Vc.

 

As I stated earlier in this thread, doing an IL-2 Battle of Malta probably wouldn't work as the game engine can't handle large amounts of planes and ships; there were 14 freighters and the S.S. Ohio in Operation Pedestal, covered by dozens of British warships and over 70 carrier-borne aircraft, combined with many Italian ships, German submarines and hundreds of Axis aircraft. It's suicide to not include Operation Pedestal and it would be pretty risky to NOT do the Attack on Taranto in the Malta installment.

Malta in this game probably would only work if the devs did an IL-2 Battle of Sicily because then you could do Malta scenarios as it would be part of the map, just like how you can do a 1941 Battle of Britain and 1941-43 Channel Map Ops on the BoN map.

 

 

So could a hypothetical IL-2 Battle of Tunisia get the green light and go ahead without unintentionally competing against CLOD DesertWings? Would Team Fusion be okay with it?

 

If so, could the Great Battles engine take it? 
 

And could Jason Williams’s team accomplish it?

Edited April 19, 2022 by Jackfraser24

[Jackfraser24]

On 4/19/2022 at 9:37 PM, Jackfraser24 said:

So could a hypothetical IL-2 Battle of Tunisia get the green light and go ahead without unintentionally competing against CLOD DesertWings? Would Team Fusion be okay with it?

 

If so, could the Great Battles engine take it? 
 

And could Jason Williams’s team accomplish it?

Yes?

[=gRiJ=Roman-]

I really hope they open a new Front.

[Jackfraser24]

42 minutes ago, =gRiJ=Roman- said:

I really hope they open a new Front.

Like which one are you hoping?

[=gRiJ=Roman-]

3 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Like which one are you hoping?

Any would be fine PTO or Med.

[Jackfraser24]

21 minutes ago, =gRiJ=Roman- said:

Any would be fine PTO or Med.

Where do you think it would be most likely though? 

[=gRiJ=Roman-]

39 minutes ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Where do you think it would be most likely though? 

I prefer the PTO but the Med could be great with the Aeronaval Battle of Malta. But I am very bad at guessing ... based on my previous ones ... 

In short, the MTO Med is more feasible right now and getting Italy in the war would open a new branch of possibilities.

Edited April 26, 2022 by =gRiJ=Roman-

[Jackfraser24]

11 hours ago, =gRiJ=Roman- said:

I prefer the PTO but the Med could be great with the Aeronaval Battle of Malta. But I am very bad at guessing ... based on my previous ones ... 

In short, the MTO Med is more feasible right now and getting Italy in the war would open a new branch of possibilities.

I honestly think (and hope not) that they will do a late war eastern front scenario, such as Slovakia or the Battle of Berlin (or events leading up to the battle).

 

However, I would love the development team to go to the Med. It would mean a change of scenery and aircraft from Northern Europe to Southern Europe. Scenarios like the Allied invasion of Sicily and mainland Italy, or a later Battle of Monte Casino or Anzio, would be desirable for most players. Italian aircraft would be something new for modellers to focus on, and British planes like the Beaufighter would be cool to fly.

 

 

 

Edited April 27, 2022 by Jackfraser24

[Eisenfaustus]

3 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

I honestly think (and hope not) that they will do a late war eastern front scenario, such as Slovakia or the Battle of Berlin (or events leading up to the battle).

Due to the current war I think an eastern front module has become far less likely. I guess any game reproducing killing in Eastern Europe could run into trouble. 
Could of course also be the complete opposite as human beings are mysterious creatures. 

[Jackfraser24]

16 minutes ago, Eisenfaustus said:

Due to the current war I think an eastern front module has become far less likely. I guess any game reproducing killing in Eastern Europe could run into trouble. 
Could of course also be the complete opposite as human beings are mysterious creatures. 

Where do you think they will go? 

[Eisenfaustus]

If Eastern Europe actually was cancelled out and if no unexpected breakthrough in researching Japanese WWII Aviation have been made options are getting rare.

 

Spanish Civil War would propably not sell too well as it is less well known.

Battle of France is my personal hope - yet it seems still not too marketable unfortunatly. And if those early war planes create similar problems to Japanese ones I cannot judge.

So while the Mediteranian my interfer with CLOD it still might be their best bet.

[Jackfraser24]

I’d love to see the Re.2005 in the game. I know that not many were built, and they saw limited operational service, but if Sicily is next, the Re.2005 should be in there. They were present in Sicily at the time. The Re.2005 has been said to be the most beautiful fighter of WW2.

Edited April 27, 2022 by Jackfraser24

[Mavi_IT]

Guys, unfortunately Cloud's map of Africa is not up to their previous work or current simulation standards.

In any case, Malta and Sicily are an absolutely new and different scenario that would lend itself to many campaigns (battle of Malta, landing in Sicily, advance in Italy, battle with convoys in the Mediterranean).

IMHO Sicily's scenario would be the top choice!

[Enceladus828]

37 minutes ago, Ma_vi said:

Guys, unfortunately Cloud's map of Africa is not up to their previous work or current simulation standards.

C'mon, the Tobruk map is the first map TFS made (they improved the Channel map but didn't make it); that's like saying in 2014 when BoS was released that the Battle of Stalingrad map isn't up to standards. And maybe the Tobruk map not up to current standards in your view but to others it is, and when they release their visual update package this summer, there will be 4K terrain tessellation, VR and other things.

 

41 minutes ago, Ma_vi said:

In any case, Malta and Sicily are an absolutely new and different scenario that would lend itself to many campaigns (battle of Malta, landing in Sicily, advance in Italy, battle with convoys in the Mediterranean).

A Battle of Sicily IMO can work. But as I've stated before in this thread, the game engine can't handle large amounts of ships and planes (there were over 70 carrier-borne aircraft and hundreds of Axis aircraft in Operation Pedestal), so it therefore it wouldn't be worth doing Malta in this game.

 

Lastly, it all boils down to profitability and feasibility: if doing Sicily was more profitable than Bodenplatte or Normandy then the devs would have done Sicily instead; if doing a late war Eastern front is more profitable and feasible than Sicily then they'll do a late war Eastern front.

[Jackfraser24]

1 hour ago, Enceladus said:

C'mon, the Tobruk map is the first map TFS made (they improved the Channel map but didn't make it); that's like saying in 2014 when BoS was released that the Battle of Stalingrad map isn't up to standards. And maybe the Tobruk map not up to current standards in your view but to others it is, and when they release their visual update package this summer, there will be 4K terrain tessellation, VR and other things.

 

A Battle of Sicily IMO can work. But as I've stated before in this thread, the game engine can't handle large amounts of ships and planes (there were over 70 carrier-borne aircraft and hundreds of Axis aircraft in Operation Pedestal), so it therefore it wouldn't be worth doing Malta in this game.

 

Lastly, it all boils down to profitability and feasibility: if doing Sicily was more profitable than Bodenplatte or Normandy then the devs would have done Sicily instead; if doing a late war Eastern front is more profitable and feasible than Sicily then they'll do a late war Eastern front.

Could the developers enhance the game engine to handle more planes and ships?

[357th_KW]

ACG has been doing some BIG high alt bomber missions lately:  

 

I’d think there is plenty of potential for optimization in this area, seeing as big bomber formations have never been a priority in past BoX modules.

 

I personally would love to see the pacific at this point, even if it means a more limited Japanese plane set.

[Mavi_IT]

On 4/28/2022 at 9:15 PM, Enceladus said:

C'mon, the Tobruk map is the first map TFS made (they improved the Channel map but didn't make it); that's like saying in 2014 when BoS was released that the Battle of Stalingrad map isn't up to standards. And maybe the Tobruk map not up to current standards in your view but to others it is, and when they release their visual update package this summer, there will be 4K terrain tessellation, VR and other things.

 

A Battle of Sicily IMO can work. But as I've stated before in this thread, the game engine can't handle large amounts of ships and planes (there were over 70 carrier-borne aircraft and hundreds of Axis aircraft in Operation Pedestal), so it therefore it wouldn't be worth doing Malta in this game.

 

Lastly, it all boils down to profitability and feasibility: if doing Sicily was more profitable than Bodenplatte or Normandy then the devs would have done Sicily instead; if doing a late war Eastern front is more profitable and feasible than Sicily then they'll do a late war Eastern front.

 

On 4/28/2022 at 9:15 PM, Enceladus said:

C'mon, the Tobruk map is the first map TFS made (they improved the Channel map but didn't make it); that's like saying in 2014 when BoS was released that the Battle of Stalingrad map isn't up to standards. And maybe the Tobruk map not up to current standards in your view but to others it is, and when they release their visual update package this summer, there will be 4K terrain tessellation, VR and other things.

 

A Battle of Sicily IMO can work. But as I've stated before in this thread, the game engine can't handle large amounts of ships and planes (there were over 70 carrier-borne aircraft and hundreds of Axis aircraft in Operation Pedestal), so it therefore it wouldn't be worth doing Malta in this game.

 

Lastly, it all boils down to profitability and feasibility: if doing Sicily was more profitable than Bodenplatte or Normandy then the devs would have done Sicily instead; if doing a late war Eastern front is more profitable and feasible than Sicily then they'll do a late war Eastern front.

 

I replied by stating that IMHO the "Desert Wings - Tobruk" product is absolutely out of the market in terms of quality (even referring only to 2020, not to mention 2022) and price.

Not surprisingly, unwanted responses are deleted.

Enjoy it.

 

 

 

On 4/28/2022 at 9:15 PM, Enceladus said:

C'mon, the Tobruk map is the first map TFS made (they improved the Channel map but didn't make it); that's like saying in 2014 when BoS was released that the Battle of Stalingrad map isn't up to standards. And maybe the Tobruk map not up to current standards in your view but to others it is, and when they release their visual update package this summer, there will be 4K terrain tessellation, VR and other things.

 

A Battle of Sicily IMO can work. But as I've stated before in this thread, the game engine can't handle large amounts of ships and planes (there were over 70 carrier-borne aircraft and hundreds of Axis aircraft in Operation Pedestal), so it therefore it wouldn't be worth doing Malta in this game.

 

Lastly, it all boils down to profitability and feasibility: if doing Sicily was more profitable than Bodenplatte or Normandy then the devs would have done Sicily instead; if doing a late war Eastern front is more profitable and feasible than Sicily then they'll do a late war Eastern front.

Are you saying that the map meets the standards of 2014 or those of today?
In your opinion the reviews about that product (for example on Steam) are correct or not?
In your opinion, players who would like a Mediterranean map could be satisfied with Tobruk's TFS product?
Thank you for the answers to the individual questions.

Edited April 29, 2022 by Ma_vi

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

My prediction continues to be Fall of Berlin and the latest of the late war aircraft (bordering on experimental for the Germans - not quite SWOTL but Ta-152’s etc) to close out the war in the East. Allied will likely include examples from both east and west.

[Enceladus828]

55 minutes ago, Ma_vi said:

In your opinion, players who would like a Mediterranean map could be satisfied with Tobruk's TFS product?

It's clear to me that you don't like Tobruk/IL-2 Dover series, so why are you spamming the forum with your hatred for Tobruk?

[BraveSirRobin]

15 hours ago, Enceladus said:

It's clear to me that you don't like Tobruk/IL-2 Dover series, so why are you spamming the forum with your hatred for Tobruk?

This thread is in the Great Battles section of the forum.  Lots of us would like to see Clod go away so that GB can include the Med.  

[FliegerAD]

20 hours ago, II/JG17_HerrMurf said:

the latest of the late war aircraft (bordering on experimental for the Germans - not quite SWOTL but Ta-152’s etc)

 

Not necessarily:

 

Bf 109G10

Bf 109G14/AS

Fw 190A9

Me 210 (Hungarian operated)

Ju 87 D5 (yeah, those were still around even in 45)

Ju 188 (though not many were used as bomber this late in the war, some in Norway e.g....)

 

I mean, I would not mind the super-late stuff like the Fw 190D13 or the He 162, but there are still enough not-so-late German aircraft left for at least one late war module.

 

[Jackfraser24]

15 hours ago, FliegerAD said:

 

Not necessarily:

 

Bf 109G10

Bf 109G14/AS

Fw 190A9

Me 210 (Hungarian operated)

Ju 87 D5 (yeah, those were still around even in 45)

Ju 188 (though not many were used as bomber this late in the war, some in Norway e.g....)

 

I mean, I would not mind the super-late stuff like the Fw 190D13 or the He 162, but there are still enough not-so-late German aircraft left for at least one late war module.

 

Would the Fw 190 D-13, He 162 and the Me 163 be worth being made for the game?

[Eisenfaustus]

3 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Would the Fw 190 D-13, He 162 and the Me 163 be worth being made for the game?

Depends on what makes a plane worthwhile for you. 
They played no important part in the war. So in Tanya realistic career approach they only can have a minor role. 
Yet they were technically interesting aircraft that have never been recreated with BoX level of fidelity. From that perspective they could be quite worthy 

[=621=Samikatz]

4 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Would the Fw 190 D-13, He 162 and the Me 163 be worth being made for the game?

 

Two D-13s were in service, both in the last few irrelevant days of the war, the He-162 was in combat for less than three weeks, and the Me-163 program had extremely few succesful intercepts considering the aircraft was in service for nearly a full year (and its only target isn't in the sim, either)

 

I think it's much healthier for the sim to focus on aircraft with real combat records that you can build actual scenarios out of and regarding Germany I'd much rather see stuff like early war attack aircraft, 1944 fast bombers, etc.

[Jackfraser24]

1 hour ago, Eisenfaustus said:

Depends on what makes a plane worthwhile for you. 
They played no important part in the war. So in Tanya realistic career approach they only can have a minor role. 
Yet they were technically interesting aircraft that have never been recreated with BoX level of fidelity. From that perspective they could be quite worthy 

What about the Dornier 335? They played no important role in the war, but that could be worth doing. People would be willingly to buy and fly a plane with such an unusual design. And a piston engined plane that is capable of extremely fast speeds (750+km/h) would be cool to have.

Edited May 1, 2022 by Jackfraser24

[Jackfraser24]

34 minutes ago, =621=Samikatz said:

 

Two D-13s were in service, both in the last few irrelevant days of the war, the He-162 was in combat for less than three weeks, and the Me-163 program had extremely few succesful intercepts considering the aircraft was in service for nearly a full year (and its only target isn't in the sim, either)

 

I think it's much healthier for the sim to focus on aircraft with real combat records that you can build actual scenarios out of and regarding Germany I'd much rather see stuff like early war attack aircraft, 1944 fast bombers, etc.

I hear a lot of people want the Battle of France to happen. Parts of France and the Low Countries have already been done. All that needs doing are the lands between the Rivers Seine and the Rhine. I’d like to see aircraft in there like the 

• Bloch MB.150
• Morane-Saulnier 406/410
• Potez 630
• Dewoitine D.520
• Hurricane Mk.1
• Bf 109 E-3
• Bf 110 C4
• He 111 H-2 
• Ju 87 B-1
• Ju 88 A-1

 

Independent Collectors for 1939-June 1940 aircraft could include

• Bf 109 E-1
• He 111 P-2
• Do 15 Z-2
• Bloch M.B 200
• Bloch M.B 210
• Bréguet 690
• LeO 451
• Baulton Paul Defiant 
• Spitfire Mk.1
• Curtiss Hawk 75
• and more…

Sorry if I seem to be repeating myself everyone. Thanks for reading anyway.

 

 

Edited May 1, 2022 by Jackfraser24

[Enceladus828]

On 4/30/2022 at 8:48 AM, BraveSirRobin said:

Lots of us would like to see Clod go away so that GB can include the Med.  

CloD isn't blocking IL-2 GBs from going to the Med, that's just your own delusion ?

 

CloD isn't blocking anybody from doing any theater as the devs are able to do Battle of Normandy (which like CloD Blitz includes the Channel Map). The devs can still cover the Battle of El Alamein, Invasion of Sicily and 1944-45 Italy.

Even if CloD wasn't rescued/went away right now I doubt the devs would go to the Med anytime soon due to game engine limitations, not very profitable compared to other theaters, likely would have to charge us $150 US to do Tobruk or Malta, lack of knowledge of the area compared to other places like Eastern front late war Western front and Pacific, to make a proper Pilot Career mode as stated by Jason.

Edited May 1, 2022 by Enceladus

[AndytotheD]

Didn’t know there was such a block in place against the Med. If that’s the case then I can see know where else for the series to go other than back East or to the Pacific.
 

Personally speaking I’m hoping for a New Guinea 43-44 scenario, but if that happens I’ll eat my own hat. 

[AndyJWest]

1 hour ago, AndytotheD said:

Didn’t know there was such a block in place against the Med. If that’s the case then I can see know where else for the series to go other than back East or to the Pacific.
 

Personally speaking I’m hoping for a New Guinea 43-44 scenario, but if that happens I’ll eat my own hat. 

 

There is no 'block'. 

[BraveSirRobin]

3 hours ago, Enceladus said:

CloD isn't blocking IL-2 GBs from going to the Med, that's just your own delusion ?

 

Great, then hopefully the next GB module is in North Africa.   Because there are absolutely no game engine issues that would prevent BoNA.