IL-2 4th Generation Future Titles

[Jackfraser24]

Please excuse me for conversation bating here but I have thoughts on where I think the new IL-2 series will go on in the new future once they have done the Pacific. Feel free to express your own thoughts if you have any about this. 

 

Battle of Britain - Why?

1. Probably the largest single air battle in the history of warfare thus too important to be ignored for too long.
2. The battle (in my opinion) is already due for a 2020s-30s era recreation into combat flight simulation. Cliffs of Dover was good but it was old before its time.   
3. Would appeal to much of the western market as this is a very well known battle in the western world. 
4. The early war planes included in this hypothetical module would be nothing short of exciting to fly.
5. A Battle of Britain module include the Blitz phase of the German air campaign against the British therefore we would get an awesome pilot career mode out of it. 

Battle of France - Why?

1. Never been covered as a proper game or module in combat flight simulation history so if made this module would be unique from the competition.
2. The module would not only cover the invasion of France itself but also the Phony War era as well as the Invasion of The Netherlands, Belgium and Luxembourg. 
3. A module based on the Battle of France would also include some interesting German, French, British and Dutch aircraft not properly included into IL-2 in the past.
4. The map would include all of Northwest Europe like the Rhineland, Low Countries and Northeastern France which could be reused to make a 1944-45 scenario later on.
5. Multiplayer would also be popular here as it would allow people fighting for the RAF and Armee del Air forces to figure out how to stop the German advance. 

Battle of Greece/Crete - Why?

1. Also never been covered as a proper game or module in combat flight simulation, and I think that there is a lot of potential here for profit. 
2. This module would cover the Greco-Italian War, the Axis Invasion of Greece and the Battle of Crete, which would give us a decent and lengthy pilot career mode. 
3. Here IL-2 would include more German, Italian and British aircraft as well as foreign aircraft belonging to the Hellenic Air Force. 
4. A module based around the Battle of Greece and Crete would highlight in pilot career mode the difference in effectiveness between German and Italian methods.
5. The map of Greece and Crete would also be scenic as it would have to add in a lot of ancient features such as the Acropolis, the Pantheon and Mt Olympus. 

Battle of Bessarabia - Why again?

1. In 1941 it was a lengthy battle as Axis Forces struggled to advance on the southern salient of Operation Barbarossa for months so we'd get a decent pilot career. 
2. In 1944 the Soviets conducted a major counteroffensive, so this map would need to have a 1941 version and a 1944 version as well. 
3. The Odessa map being made for Great Battles might be so popular that people may push for a module in the new series. 
4. The plane list would incorporate early and late Eastern Front aircraft, which doesn't seem like much but more aircraft will be added as the series goes on.
5. A Bessarabia module would act as both a good chronological prequal and sequel to the modules we will likely see on the Eastern Front. 

Battle of Moscow - Why again?

1. I think that this module in Great Battles is most deserving of a remake straight away. IL-2 Battle of Moscow was really good but it could have been done better.    
2. This was a turning point on the Soviet struggle against Axis forces and the end point of Operation Barbarossa, so this is too important to be left out. 
3. A module based on the Battle of Moscow needs to incorporate more area including the city of Moscow itself, so all the more reason for a rebooted Moscow module.  
4. A rebooted Moscow module would also have to cover the Battles of Rzhev which lasted from January 8th 1942 until March 31th 1943.
5. Including the Battles of Rhzev, the repositioning of Axis front lines hundreds of km away from Moscow and the city of Moscow itself would make IL-2 Moscow more than just a copy and paste product of the original IL-2 Battle of Moscow. 

Battle of Stalingrad - Why again?

1. Also very deserving of a remake due to its heavy significance to the course of the war on the Eastern Front. 
2. Like Moscow (which I should have mentioned) they already have a good knowledge and resources of the area and movements both Soviet and Axis forces. 
3. A module based on the Battle of Stalingrad would have to include a much wider area to cover the Axis advance to Moscow (Case Blue) and subsequent withdrawal.
4. A new module also based on Stalingrad would dissuade competitors from making their own Stalingrad based module, as I think that this battle is their duty alone to recreate. 
5. I think that Stalingrad will need a remake within ten years as Great Battles will be showing its age. 

Battle of Kursk - Why? 

1. One of the largest tank battles and very much the final turning point of WWII on the eastern Front and thus too important to leave out. 
2. Would also have to include the battles of Kharkov due to the city's close approximation to Kursk.
3. A Kursk based module has not been properly as a module or game in combat flight simulation for a really long time if not ever.
4. A Kursk based module would be a relatively easy map to make as the terrain is largely flat and the building are simple. 
5. Kursk should also be left to IL-2 as the battle occurred on Russian soil and IL-2s were heavily used there. 

Operation Bagration - Why?

1. It was like the Soviet's equivalent of the Normandy Landings as it was a very strategic victory for the Red Forces. 
2. Would cover a large area on the Northern salient of the Eastern Front, which would be a eye catching. 
3. There would be a lot of cities on the map as well as forest and rural land, which would also be eye catching. 
4.  There would a decent pilot career mode for a module based on Operation Bagration as it would be a long one leading up to the Courland Pocket. 
5. The Axis and Soviet planes would be more on par in terms combat capabilities whereas in 1941-42 the Axis were better in combat than the Soviets. 

 

 

[Trooper117]

Jesus Jack... by the time they get through that lot, I'll be dead, not only that you will be dead, and the dev team will have perished too!!!!  💀⚰️

[Avimimus]

5 minutes ago, Trooper117 said:

Jesus Jack... by the time they get through that lot, I'll be dead, not only that you will be dead, and the dev team will have perished too!!!!  💀⚰️

 

Even if you could model the WTO, ETO, and PTO with three modules each (instead of four)... it'd still take about twenty years... there is no way around this fact (unless they are able to double the rate of release). There isn't anything particularly unique to the timeline.

[Aapje]

From that list I think that BoB is the best choice for the first non-pacific module. With the new radar, that battle would be really interesting.

[Zooropa_Fly]

Holy crap.

[LukeFF]

Jack, I suggest you just take a break from these endless lists and just enjoy the fact that we've already announced the first WWII theater to come after Korea. 🙂

[AEthelraedUnraed]

2 hours ago, LukeFF said:

Jack, I suggest you just take a break from these endless lists and just enjoy the fact that we've already announced the first WWII theater to come after Korea. 🙂

I've tried to dissuade him in the past and it didn't work, so now I just enjoy the endless speculation

[Gambit21]

7 hours ago, Trooper117 said:

Jesus Jack... by the time they get through that lot, I'll be dead, not only that you will be dead, and the dev team will have perished too!!!!  💀⚰️

 

You're not covering any new ground there Jack...go play outside and look forward to PTO.

 

[Jackfraser24]

17 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

 

You're not covering any new ground there Jack...go play outside and look forward to PTO.

 

Ok. 

[AEthelraedUnraed]

Oh don't mind 'em Jack. I for one enjoy your hypothesising. Yes, it might have little purpose and we might be going in endless circles, but it's not as if there's much else to do here these days, is there?

[Jackfraser24]

1 minute ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

Oh don't mind 'em Jack. I for one enjoy your hypothesising. Yes, it might have little purpose and we might be going in endless circles, but it's not as if there's much else to do here these days, is there?

Exactly. Not much has been said even about where in the Pacific War they will go. All that LukeFF has said is that the first one will include both naval and land based aircraft. That could mean anywhere like The Solomon Islands, Okinawa, or the Marianas.

 

I understand that my overzealous attitude for future predictions can get irritating at times. At least I keep it to my own threads. 

 

[Avimimus]

3 hours ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

I've tried to dissuade him in the past and it didn't work, so now I just enjoy the endless speculation

 

That's the spirit!

 

Honestly, I enjoy endless speculation too... products might not appear... the future is ever uncertain... but speculation and imagining projects - we'll, there is certainty in that - it won't go away. Especially for products that are on the less likely side of things.

 

  

52 minutes ago, Jackfraser24 said:

I understand that my overzealous attitude for future predictions can get irritating at times. At least I keep it to my own threads. 

 

Yes, keeping it to one thread is a good idea! I think LukeFF's advice about taking things easy is good, but for me anyway, this type of speculation (including reading the speculations of others) is taking things easy...

 

But it is good to temper one's expectations, and be ready to enjoy whatever comes - even if it isn't what we'd like to imagine.

[Gambit21]

5 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Exactly. Not much has been said even about where in the Pacific War they will go. All that LukeFF has said is that the first one will include both naval and land based aircraft. That could mean anywhere like The Solomon Islands, Okinawa, or the Marianas.

 

I understand that my overzealous attitude for future predictions can get irritating at times. At least I keep it to my own threads. 

 

 

 

This is how things get confused on the internet though Jack  ...to be clear Luke said "Navy and Army" aircraft, this is completely different than saying "Naval and land based" since IJN aircraft were land based much of the time. This means you need IJA and IJN, and carriers on both sides operating in a theater, which rules out Guadalcanal/Solomons unless you're talking about Rabaul.

Further some theaters that fall into this category would make little sense due to Japan being on it's knees and the battles severely lopsided. (that doesn't however mean they won't pick one of them)

 

What "makes sense" is open to interpretation of course, but most would say that any theater where the Japan is already essentially defeated should be avoided for obvious reasons. Ideally you want a theater where force parity existed, with a variety of aircraft. This at least is the smart thing to do...again doesn't mean this will happen.

1C wanted Okinawa before, which is just stupid...for so many reasons...so who knows what their marching orders will be. 

 

Let's assume however that they do pick a theater and time frame (early to mid war) where both sides are on equal footing (the smart thing to do) and IJN and IJA aircraft are present along with carries on both sides.

Now your time frame is limited, and theater choices are quite few. Sooooo....if you know your history then you can narrow it down quite easily, and arguably to one very good choice, with the caveat that this area is quite large and can be subdivided into 2 or more "theaters" or maps.  I'm not going to comment on these further here, and will just wait and see what happens as they can change their minds, do something unexpected, get unwise directives from bean counters at 1C again etc etc.

Edited November 20, 2024 by Gambit21

[LukeFF]

1 hour ago, Gambit21 said:

I'm not going to comment on these further here, and will just wait and see what happens as they can change their minds, do something unexpected, get unwise directives from bean counters at 1C again etc etc.

 

The particular region is pretty much set in stone at this point, and I am fully confident it will be one that everyone will like. 🙂

[AEthelraedUnraed]

6 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

Now your time frame is limited, and theater choices are quite few. Sooooo....if you know your history then you can narrow it down quite easily, and arguably to one very good choice

Battle of the Aleutians: IL-2 Series!

 

- Early war (1942-1943)

- Both army and navy aircraft on both sides (some Japanese Army incendiary balloons were shot down there in 1943)

- US home soil, which must appeal to US customers while their Russian customers can surely appreciate the cold, harsh winters.

[Jackfraser24]

58 minutes ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

Battle of the Aleutians: IL-2 Series!

 

- Early war (1942-1943)

- Both army and navy aircraft on both sides (some Japanese Army incendiary balloons were shot down there in 1943)

- US home soil, which must appeal to US customers while their Russian customers can surely appreciate the cold, harsh winters.

I'd like that.

[Avimimus]

My basic apprehension regarding doing New Guinea first (without the Solomons already being completed) is that they might end up having to use some of the aircraft list for aircraft that were in both theatres... and this might mean leaving out some very interesting aircraft. It'd be great to see New Guinea with fifteen or so flyable aircraft and a few AI aircraft... it'd feel more complete and varied.

 

So if they do New Guinea first - I'd hope they'd split it into two modules (e.g. early and late) so that we could get something a bit more complete.

[Jackfraser24]

If the dev team really wanted to do a Vietnam War module they could, right? Would they have trouble modelling in things like missiles and the aircraft themselves which had become much more technologically sophisticated? What hurdles would they have to overcome? Sorry if I have asked this question before, I can't remember. 

[Gambit21]

That’s a loaded question - there’s a lot to break down there.

Looking forward to PTO.

[Avimimus]

6 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

If the dev team really wanted to do a Vietnam War module they could, right? Would they have trouble modelling in things like missiles and the aircraft themselves which had become much more technologically sophisticated? What hurdles would they have to overcome? Sorry if I have asked this question before, I can't remember. 

 

I'm sure they could. They're very technically competent.

 

But there are challenges - supersonic flight models, complex radar and systems modelling, much more extensive avionics... it might end up with just one or two flyable aircraft.

[Aapje]

@Jackfraser24

 

I think that they would then take on more than they can chew, and also compete with DCS too directly. Better to stick with the earlier stuff.

[Jackfraser24]

11 hours ago, Aapje said:

@Jackfraser24

 

I think that they would then take on more than they can chew, and also compete with DCS too directly. Better to stick with the earlier stuff.

Yeah, probably. But I’d say that there is a lot of potential in a Vietnam War based module. Think of what the pilot career mode would be like. And multiplayer. AQMB would be fun too. I think that it would sell really well. But you’re right about them potentially committing to a project too large to complete, and it would most likely take 2-3 times longer than a Korean War, WWI and WWII based module. Still though I’d pay for a Vietnam War based module. I believe Vietnam should be covered by a game like IL-2 because I like the way IL-2 does their gameplay where you can do Pilot career mode, AQMB, and multiplayer and the planes have no clickable cockpits. 

Edited November 21, 2024 by Jackfraser24

[Jackfraser24]

On 11/21/2024 at 12:44 AM, Avimimus said:

My basic apprehension regarding doing New Guinea first (without the Solomons already being completed) is that they might end up having to use some of the aircraft list for aircraft that were in both theatres... and this might mean leaving out some very interesting aircraft. It'd be great to see New Guinea with fifteen or so flyable aircraft and a few AI aircraft... it'd feel more complete and varied.

 

So if they do New Guinea first - I'd hope they'd split it into two modules (e.g. early and late) so that we could get something a bit more complete.

I think New Guinea would be a great place to start in their journey for covering the Pacific for several reasons.

1. The terrain on the map would vary from jungle, mountain ranges and volcanoes to ocean and offshore islands. Touring the map would be an enjoyable experience.
2. The plane list would be nothing short of an excellent selection. You'd have aircraft like the A6M5, Ki-43, Ki-45, P-38, P-39, P-40, etc... I won't go on here.
3. The New Guinea campaign was lengthy so we would get a good pilot career out of it spanning the war in the Pacific from 1942 to 1945. 
4. Adding to the former point this would give aircraft from other 1942-45 era Pacific based modules a place in Pilot Career in this New Guinea campaign. 
5. Various types of ships from Japan, Australia and America would have to be modelled in. If AQMB was added in anti-shipping would be a difficult task to do. Exciting!

[BlitzPig_EL]

Don't forget the Kawasaki Ki61.  It made it's combat debut in New Guinea, and sent the USAAF into a panic as it handily out performed the P39 and P40. It created a flurry of communication between General Kenny and Washington to get P38s in theater ASAP.

 

Edited November 24, 2024 by BlitzPig_EL

[Jackfraser24]

4 hours ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Don't forget the Kawasaki Ki61.  It made it's combat debut in New Guinea, and sent the USAAF into a panic as it handily out performed the P39 and P40. It created a flurry of communication between General Kenny and Washington to get P38s in theater ASAP.

 

Whoops! Forgot about the Ki-61. Thanks for reminding me. 

[Jackfraser24]

Would it be possible for the IL-2 Development team to make a module based on Operation Torch? What kind of hurdles would they have to overcome? Would it be worth it all? 

[Gambit21]

13 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Would it be possible for the IL-2 Development team to make a module based on Operation Torch? What kind of hurdles would they have to overcome? Would it be worth it all? 

Have you read anything about Operation Torch? 

 

[Avimimus]

23 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

Have you read anything about Operation Torch? 

 

 

Have you? 😛 

 

(Edit: I figure, if you can ask the question, you may equally as well be asked it)

[Gambit21]

18 hours ago, Avimimus said:

 

Have you? 😛 

 

(Edit: I figure, if you can ask the question, you may equally as well be asked it)

Yes

[Trooper117]

Don't worry, Jack will have thought up another half dozen new dlc's and theatres by the weekend!  

[Avimimus]

1 hour ago, Trooper117 said:

Don't worry, Jack will have thought up another half dozen new dlc's and theatres by the weekend!  

 

Now there is an interesting (if academic) question: How many theatres are truly possible?

[=MERCS=JenkemJunkie]

69, and Jacks not allowed to stop posting until the whole forums thinking about his 69 with anticipation.

[Jackfraser24]

4 hours ago, Avimimus said:

 

Now there is an interesting (if academic) question: How many theatres are truly possible?

Not known. Only time will tell. 
 

Question. Would Operation Torch not be worth doing? If so, why? Would the map be too big? Would we get a pilot career mode that is too short? 

Edited November 27, 2024 by Jackfraser24

[Gambit21]

2 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Not known. Only time will tell. 
 

Question. Would Operation Torch not be worth doing? If so, why? Would the map be too big? Would we get a pilot career mode that is too short? 

 

 

[Jackfraser24]

7 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

 

 

I see. Probably not going to happen because it is not worth the risk.

[Avimimus]

13 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Not known. Only time will tell. 

 

I meant theoretically possible... leaving out the fact that there is a limited amount of time and resources.

  

4 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

I see. Probably not going to happen because it is not worth the risk.

 

That is your interpretation?

 

I'd interpret it as 'you can make anything fly if you put enough engines on it'.

 

Btw. Do either of you recognise my profile picture?

[Jackfraser24]

21 hours ago, Avimimus said:

 

I meant theoretically possible... leaving out the fact that there is a limited amount of time and resources.

  

 

That is your interpretation?

 

I'd interpret it as 'you can make anything fly if you put enough engines on it'.

 

Btw. Do either of you recognise my profile picture?

The Wright Flyer, right?

Edited November 29, 2024 by Jackfraser24

[Trooper117]

On 11/28/2024 at 7:26 AM, Avimimus said:

'you can make anything fly if you put enough engines on it'.

 

I thought so... and eventually they will fly ''fly little piggy, fly''... 😬

 

 

[BlitzPig_EL]

Of course Pigs fly, we just don't fly as often as we used to.

[Holtzauge]

Well if piggy just speeds up a bit he will do just fine: I estimate his ear-area as 0.012 square meters and assuming his ear-profile gives a Clmax of 1.35 then he needs to go about M=0.65 or 799 km/h (497 mph).