Let's talk about a collector's P-47M

[LuftManu]

 

Hello friends,

Now that the P-47s have been updated, they are being being a blast! The new FM are making this plane really enjoyable.

After seeing the planned Ta-152 and the Spitfire Mk.XIVe, I was wondering if there would be a place for a collector P-47M.

The P-47M saw combat on the last weeks of WW2, and IIRC was in action in our Bodenplatte map late March, last phase.

This aircraft was derived from the P-47D-30-RE.

It would feature:

- A more powerful R-2800-57C engine

- Dive brakes
- Tail fin

- Higher amount of fuel

I believe that now we have just "started again" our P-47 journey, this would be a great product!

[Mtnbiker1998]

I'd be seriously tempted to buy a faster late war P-47, and the TA-152 announcement threw pretty much all arguments about late war superplanes out the window, no reason we shouldn't get it. That being said, the one we have in game could still seriously use some damage model tweaks, so I'd be a bit hesitant to actually pay money for another.

[356thFS_Melonfish]

I'd also add HVAR, and cluster bombs as a weapon option too. I'd say napalm but i'm not sure how it could be implemented in the game engine as is.
the 47 is a wonderful plane and the updates have really helped her find her stride!

 

 

[Charon]

The P-47M also had a new turbo regulator with overspeed protection, didn't it?

 

(Although frankly I don't have much interest in the very late war planes. There's just not enough to do with them historically).

[-250H-Ursus_]

If Ta-152 with less than 50 units built, and a registry of combat almost non existent, is on the plans...

My mind only thinks: Why not P-47M? The plane is great and is less "unicorn", 130 units in total. Also surrounds the same timeframe (Dec 1944).

Edited February 23, 2024 by -332FG-Ursus_

[sevenless]

First P47-Ms flew from 02/1945 onwards. So, please do it!

 

On March 14, three P-47s of the 62nd fighter squadron swooped down upon two low-flying Arado 234B jet bombers. The twin-engine jet bombers were likely targeting the battered Ludendorff Bridge in Remagen over which the U.S. 1st Army was pouring into Germany. The P-47Ms, roughly equaling the Arado’s in speed, shot down both."

America’s P-47M Fighter Had One Goal: To Hunt Down and Kill Hitler's Jets | The National Interest

 

[HR_Zunzun]

It makes sense once you already have the Ta-152. Actually, It was more relevant than the German in terms of numbers.

[nesher666]

A proper P-47M in IL-2 GB would be fantastic, especially in light of the recent Jug changes!

[LuftManu]

Dear friends and team,
 

Here is some more data, provided by @Red_Panda

 

Also, as the plane uses the same fuselage D30 (Last ones converted) we could use the D30 and N manuals
https://www.docdroid.com/LOMVV0N/republic-p-47n-pilot-manual-pdf#page=11
 

Spoiler

 

Kind regards,

[blockheadgreen_]

Yes! This would be fun. If we're talking about allied props serving in low numbers in the last months of the war, I'd take a Spitfire F.21 too ?️

[LF_Mark_Krieger]

Well @LuftManu, you know my preference for early and mid war planes instead of late, specially if they have higher numbers and wider period of deployment. But as has been said, the Ta-152 is already on the roadmap and more planes don't hurt. Anyway I would prefer the work of the developers on previous motors for the Spitfire Mk.IXc so it could be used in channel Battles in late 1942, 1943 and early 1944, or the P-40N, for example. I know technically the map of Normandy is of 1944, but anyway I think It would be good to give it more 1941-1943 planes, specially now that we can edit the textures of the map to adapt it to previous years.

Edited June 23, 2024 by LF_Mark_Krieger

[iflyflightsims]

Yes! A P-47M would make a great collector plane.

[nesher666]

Since the Ta-152 is already released, and the P-47 in-game is now much closer to reality thanks you the dev improvements, we really should get the P-47M, as a late ware high performance allied fighter aircraft. It would require less 3D work than the Spit XIV to XIV teardrop did. Pleasse consider this aircraft suggestion! 

[BMA_FlyingShark]

I'm all for it.

 

Have a nice day.

 

[Oboe]

+1 for the P-47M.    Logical USAAF counter to the Ta.152

[=BLW=Pablo]

I vote yes, but I want a Do335 in return.

[-250H-Ursus_]

I hope my suggestion is already in a sort of To-Do list prior to do this post.

Since Ta-152H-1 addition to the game, i always hoped that allies also got their extremly rare enhanced P-47 (Not rare as Ta-152, at least this were around 130 units or some).
As far i know, P-47M-1-RE's were ready for December 1944.
Not only adding them would be great for the game content, also would be an excellent opportunity to do a check to P-47 FM in general, or minor adjustments to their timers like P-40 had.

If someone has reliable data of P-47M-1-RE, would be great to left it here.
Hope to have the chance to fly them someday

Edited October 16, 2024 by -332FG-Ursus_

[LuftManu]

A collector's I would buy in a second! 

[nesher666]

 

[sevenless]

 

[DSR_A-24]

Some differences between the P-47D-28 and P-47M.

 

-Increase in critical altitude. 24,500ft to 32,000ft
-New propeller gear ratio changing the max RPM to 2800 from 2700, and subsequently a higher military power of 2100hp.
-Slightly longer fuselage due to the new propeller hub, but only by 1/4 inch
-Dive recovery flaps
-Possible differences? Given the P-47M is a P-47N fuselage + P-47D-30 wings. We see a 564mph maximum dive speed at sea level.

Does anyone remember that link to the P-47M pilot interview? I remember him claiming some pilots of his squadron were over boosting their engines to 76"Hg. This practice may have been pretty common with the 56FG as Robert S. Johnson's P-47D was boosted to 2700hp in 1943.

Ta-152H-1 vs P-47M
 

[354thFG_Panda_]

9 hours ago, DSR_A-24 said:

Some differences between the P-47D-28 and P-47M.

 

-Increase in critical altitude. 24,500ft to 32,000ft
-New propeller gear ratio changing the max RPM to 2800 from 2700, and subsequently a higher military power of 2100hp.
-Slightly longer fuselage due to the new propeller hub, but only by 1/4 inch
-Dive recovery flaps
-Possible differences? Given the P-47M is a P-47N fuselage + P-47D-30 wings. We see a 564mph maximum dive speed at sea level.

Does anyone remember that link to the P-47M pilot interview? I remember him claiming some pilots of his squadron were over boosting their engines to 76"Hg. This practice may have been pretty common with the 56FG as Robert S. Johnson's P-47D was boosted to 2700hp in 1943.

Ta-152H-1 vs P-47M
 

There's this from some of the engine troubles it had. (Point d.) Also aileron difference 

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/p-47/p-47m-20march45.jpg

 

 

Edited December 10, 2024 by 356thFS_Red_Panda

[DSR_A-24]

5 hours ago, 356thFS_Red_Panda said:

There's this from some of the engine troubles it had. (Point d.) Also aileron difference 

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/p-47/p-47m-20march45.jpg

 

 

 

Spoiler

 

 

Spoiler

 

Pretty much all aircraft of any sorts have teething issues during their introduction, but in this case the majority of engine failures were likely due to rust thought to be caused by poor preparation of the engine during shipment.

"It appears that when installing the ‘C’ model engine, supplying toughened leads had been overlooked. Replacing the ignition harness on all M-models took some time, and it meant that 61st FS pilots had to revert to flying the D-models still employed by the remaining two squadrons within the 56th. The lack of power at high altitude was a different problem entirely, and was found to be caused by the correlation of throttle and turbo-supercharges settings – another problem that had been encountered with the P-47C."

"Technical problems that plagued the aircraft on this and following missions eventually led to a grounding of all P-47Ms on the station later in the month. Defective carburettor diaphragms and engine cylinder over-cooling were the next problems identified, although the most worrying discovery of them all was the corrosion found in the cylinder bores of an engine recovered from a crashed aircraft.

Similar corrosion was found in other ‘C’ engines, and it was deduced that they had lacked insufficient protection from the elements during shipment from the USA. A programme of engine changing was begun that eventually involved three-quarters of all the P-47Ms at Boxted! While so many aircraft were grounded, mission strengths were much reduced, with only the retained D-models of the 62nd and 63rd in use."

"This created a nightmare situation for the engineering officers, with a combined total of 140 D- and M-models on the station, plus a dozen war-weary P-51Bs which were brought in to give the pilots conversion training in case the problems with the new Thunderbolt could not be cured. By the middle of March all three squadrons were able to put up whole formations of P-47Ms, and by 24 March, when the Allies launched Operation Varsity and crossed the Rhine, the remaining P-47Ds and the P-51s had gone."

Imagine getting the P-47M in IL2:GB with 76"Hg :). It comes to no surprise that pilots were nearly reaching 500mph in the P-47M. Also, it would be interesting to know the effects of the altered ailerons for the D-30+. Could they have been adjusted for higher speeds? Here is the P-47D-30 with 30lbs of force(Yellow-Green)

Continuing the story of that series of documents you posted.
April 10th http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/p-47/P-47M_Difficulties.jpg
May 9th http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/p-47/p-47m-9may45.pdf

[FeuerFliegen]

I would absolutely love a P-47M.  

 

It kinda sucks not having a P-47 that can dogfight on somewhat equal terms to the other fighters in 1945 / Bodenplatte.  

 

Off topic, but I've also been thinking the same thing about the P-38; I recently read that the later P-38s, such as the L, had more horsepower, and could do 70" manifold pressure compared to the J-25 we have now.  The J-25 seems better suited to a 1944 / Normandy time.  I love the P-38 and I find that it's a shame that it's slotted into a time period where it's starting to fall behind in performance; I was doing some testing at lower/medium altitudes, and the P-51 at max continuous power is able to basically match the P-38J-25's speed at full emergency 3000rpm/60" manifold pressure, and once it's been running hard for a while or it's summer, the water radiator flaps will open fully and bring it's speed quite a bit lower.  It seems that in a competitive environment, people only take the P-38J for it's bomb load and use it as a ground attacker; if you are going to take a clean fighter in that same environment, the P-38J is rarely used, and that's a shame.  It definitely shines in scenarios from about a year before, but we don't have a scenario and planeset for that timeline that it can compete with.  

 

I just wanted to bring that up about the P-38J because I feel like it shares a few things in common with the P-47D because of the timeframe and scenario they have been put into.

[Jackfraser24]

I'd also like to see a P-47M done for Great Battles. I would also like to see the dev team expand more on the P-47 in general. But I know that the dev team wants to move on as fast as they can to Korea and beyond so I respect that fact.