Thoughts of a Channel Aircraft Pack?

[JG7_X-Man]

I'd say 1CGS could easily squeeze 200 USD out of me with this lineup:

 

• RAF

1. Spitfire IXC

 

•  Luftwaffe

1. Fw 190A-4

 

Then throw in a late 1942 single player campaign for those of us that like period correct aircraft variant matchups and offline play.

Edited February 20, 2024 by JG7_X-Man

[Enceladus828]

Umm... we're already getting the Spitfire IXc and $100 USD for both planes???

[ICDP]

6 hours ago, Enceladus828 said:

Umm... we're already getting the Spitfire IXc and $100 USD for both planes???

On the face of it this does seem a strange request other than the campaign.  The existing Fw190-A3 already fits the time period of late 1942.  The IXc we are getting is more suited to mid 1943 from a 3D model perspective (later elevator and longer air filter) but neither of those things seriously affect performance or even the FM that much.   From a performance perspective the IXc with Merlin 66 started making an appearance from around late Feb 1943.

 

If we want a true Channel front late 1942 campaign, then an earlier Spitfire IXc would be required.

[the_emperor]

I guess a clipped Spit V of the existing one would do. (or where they operational by late 42?)

The Spit IX would need some 3D rework and the 15lbs Merlin 61. 

 

[Avimimus]

The Battle (Operation Jubilee):

- Dieppe (1942) involved landings of thousands of troops in France. Unlike at D-Day the German defenses were effective and the landings failed.

- It led to one of the largest air-battles of the war over the landings (denser than the Battle of Britain) and some historians have even claimed that a major motivation for the landings was to draw out the Luftwaffe.

- It had the last massed daylight attack by Luftwaffe bombers on the Western front.

 

Aircraft:

Mustang I: P-40 style Allison engine for good low altitude performance, 20mm cannon. Used mainly for low altitude recon.

Boston III: A-20 variant.

Spit IXc (early): Minor changes, earlier engine. Rare (only two squadrons)

Typhoon (early): No bombs or rockets, earlier cockpit. Rare (only two squadrons)

Fw-190A4/U18: Short nosed like the Fw-190A3, but equipped with bombs and drop tanks for anti-ship work.

Do-217E4: Heavier bombload and higher wing loading than existing bombers, newer guns (options for two MG-131 defensive guns, as well as fixed and flexible forward firing heavy machineguns or cannons).

 

Other aircraft present in large numbers: Spit VB, Hurricane II, Bf-109F-4, Fw-190A3, Torpedo bomber variants of the He-111 and Ju-88, Blenheims (laying smoke).

 

Note:

This is currently planned by Team Fusion (Cliffs of Dover). Unfortunately it looks like it will be missing the Do-217E (which means that the massed bomber raids can't be accurately represented). It would have been nice for Great Battles as well though. I'm sure people would enjoy a Mustang I Collector Plane, and the Fw-190A4 and Do-217 could find use on other fronts. It'd also have provided a justification for improving the Normandy map (back dating it and include more accurate targets in England)l But considering Team Fusion is working on this it might not make as much sense now.

 

Still, it is interesting to think about what a 'half-module' would have looked like (and could still with the right 3rd party dev).

 

As for me - what I'd really want is a WWI Channel map (so a 3rd party could transfer the floatplanes/seaplanes from Rise of Flight, and also so we could fly biplanes along the Cliffs of Dover).

[[CPT]Crunch]

Team fusion even have jack to do with 1C anymore?  Heard they were sold off for 10 Cents.

[Enceladus828]

13 minutes ago, [CPT]Crunch said:

Team fusion even have jack to do with 1C anymore?  Heard they were sold off for 10 Cents.

They were sold to Fulqrum Publishing. 

At this point I’d rather see a flyable B-25 or IL-4 and the WW1 Channel Map along with the remaining 3 seaplanes (would be simpler than other FC installments) before doing a pack trying to simulate Operation Jubilee. 
 

Throw in a Bf-110F and P-51A and you have my money. The 110F can be used on the Eastern Front and the P-51A is often neglected in combat flight sims so they’d be great to have.

[CUJO_1970]

There is a whole pile of aircraft for channel front that could be added - none of the early US fighters like P-38 E/F/G/H are there and no P-47C or early D models.

Also for Allies - the A20 (Boston III) was the first bomber missions flown, while attached to the RAF.

 

For FW190A-4 - yes it is a good draw for channel (also EF) as it has option for adjustable engine cooling, and also /U8 variant to include wing bomb racks so you get a better bomb load than A3.

[Mtnbiker1998]

Agreed with some of the above, some early US fighters would be great to have. The updated P-40 engine model has me craving a P-51A more than ever!

[357th_KW]

A Bf109G-1 with GM-1 and an early Fw190A (-0, 1 or 2) would make great additions as well.  
 

[FliegerAD]

Seeing the Fw 190 was initally mistaken for a captured P-36... is there any chance for a captured French plane in German service? I know they were used for training only or shipped to other Axis powers, but could they be on the map?

[EAF19_Marsh]

Booooring! ?

 

Allies:

Westland Whirlwind

Bristol Beaufighter

A-20 variant? What would be a good US / UK option for a light / medium?

P-51A

Early P-47 / P-38 variant

Collectors - Bristol Beaufort / Bristol Blenheim

 

German:

Fw-190A4

ME-109....something

Me-110.....something

Do-217

Errrr....

Collectors - Open to suggestions

 

Now that is a Channel ops pack

 

EDIT: Swapped Fairly Swordfish for something sensible like an A-20 and dropped the D.520 as the Luftwaffe never actually used them in combat over the Channel (or at all?)

 

Anyway, that list would be kick-ass IMHO. And has zero chance of happening.

 

Edited February 24, 2024 by EAF19_Marsh

[JG7_X-Man]

On 2/22/2024 at 11:14 AM, CUJO_1970 said:

There is a whole pile of aircraft for channel front that could be added - none of the early US fighters like P-38 E/F/G/H are there and no P-47C or early D models.

Also for Allies - the A20 (Boston III) was the first bomber missions flown, while attached to the RAF.

 

For FW190A-4 - yes it is a good draw for channel (also EF) as it has option for adjustable engine cooling, and also /U8 variant to include wing bomb racks so you get a better bomb load than A3.

BINGO! Someone that gets it! It was the Fw 190A-4 stared replacing the Fw 190A-3s in fall of '42, right when the USAAF arrived on the scene. So any of the early 8th airforce's early fighters would do - especially the P-47C-5-RE would go well with the Spitfire IXb (which is what I meant vs the IXc - which I know we are getting)

[Jade_Monkey]

The A4 is the same plane as the A-3 for IL2 purposes. 

 

I sure am happy you are not in charge of the game's roadmap.

[EAF19_Marsh]

People do realise that the nominal date of a new version was not indicative of it entering service, yes? Many squadrons laboured on for years with what became pretty out-matched models.

 

The current aircraft version range / selection is pretty strong across the reality of what was used. Having the Fw-190A3 model 4667 vs. the Fw-190A4 model 0238 is of minimal significance.

[ShamrockOneFive]

17 hours ago, JG7_X-Man said:

Spitfire IXb

Fun fact. There's technically no such thing as the Spitfire IXb. There's just the Spitfire Mark IX and then later on they started using LF, F and HF designation infront of the mark number to denote engine type (F for 61 and 63, LF for Merlin 66 and HF for Merlin 70) and then a letter, either 'c' or 'e' to denote wing/armament type. No official designation for clipped or non-clipped. Now, there are references to a Spitfire IX-B in some log books and that's because the record keeping decided to mark off Spitfire IX models with Merlin 66 as IX-B until the official nomenclature came down. Esoteric, I know

 

TL;DR: You're asking for a early model 1942 Spitfire F.IXc with a Merlin 61 or 63 engine.

[EAF19_Marsh]

On 2/27/2024 at 10:03 PM, ShamrockOneFive said:

Fun fact. There's technically no such thing as the Spitfire IXb. There's just the Spitfire Mark IX

Not disagreeing. My understanding was that the ‘B’ simply indicated Hispanno fit and had been used for the Mk. I to differentiate from the 8 x .303s. But perhaps that is a post-war interpretation?

 

As I doubt there existed any IXs with the all MG wing this label would be redundant and as you said the specifics would be engine-based.

 

Except, obviously, for the ‘X’ wing designation with the quad KX-9 armament developed in anticipation of the Ta-183 but that did not see wartime service. Rumour has it that a few were used in Korea and were offered to Israel around the time of Suez but I suspect that they were simply scrapped owing to lack of spares and the service entry of the Hawker Hunter.

[310_cibule]

Map of the Mediterranean would be great. Many planes are in the game already.

[ShamrockOneFive]

13 hours ago, EAF19_Marsh said:

Not disagreeing. My understanding was that the ‘B’ simply indicated Hispanno fit and had been used for the Mk. I to differentiate from the 8 x .303s. But perhaps that is a post-war interpretation?

With the Spitfire I-V there was the B-wing type and that was indeed used to describe those fitted with Hispano cannons (and 60 round drum magazines rather than the belt feed introduced with the C-Wing). So Spitfire Mark Ib or Spitfire Vb or... Spitfire LF.Vb (with one of several Merlin's featuring cropped superchargers for low altitude performance) were all considered official designations. Where it gets confused is when you read a log book and see a Spitfire IX-B in the book and all they mean by that is that it's got a Merlin 66 engine it - and not a B-wing ala the earlier marks.

 

Took me a while to get my head around it. So many books incorrectly repeat the IX-B designation. So I assume it will never go away. But we try

[EAF19_Marsh]

Just to add something interesting while looking for whether the ‘D’ wing was ever an official designation. Some quotes of official docs towards bottom of thread:

 

https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235005862-spitfire-d-wing-questions/

[JG7_X-Man]

This is all conversation anyway - the devs are gonna do what the devs wanna do anyway.

[EAF19_Marsh]

10 hours ago, JG7_X-Man said:

This is all conversation anyway - the devs are gonna do what the devs wanna do anyway.

 

That is about 97.42% of posts on this forum. But that does not matter, so cheer up ?