Pilot Career bugs, Soviet - Moscow and Stalingrad

[Aleksander55]

Tracks are available here - The RAR files contains the tracks and the folder that contains the '_gen.mission' arquive. Please warn me if you can't access the folder:

 

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/15GRPlHCt1pNB67v1Eg00iaL2wYslC3cB?usp=sharing

 

 

 

In escort missions, for bombers or attackers, if I Iet an AI lead, they will always lag behind the formation, at slow speed. The rest of the fighters will form up normaly. If it's the IL-2s the lead may catch the formation back, if it's the bombers it will usually 'lose contact' and start circling at low speed while the rest of the formation goes on. This happens every time.

 

EscortAttackers-AILead-Lags-Behind-After-Takeoff.rar

EscortBombers-AILead-LagsBehind-After-Takeoff.rar

ESCORT-BOMBERS-LEAD-LAGS-STARTS-CIRCLE-200KMH.rar

ESCORT-BOMBERS-FLIGHT-LEAD-STILL-CIRCLING-200KMH-ENEMY-TERRITORY.rar

 

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Still with this AI lead, If dogfights happen before the IL-2s get to the target zone, again the lead might 'lose contact' and start circling aimlessly, this time probably with the rest of the squadron, leaving the IL-2s unprotected. They'll circle at low speed over enemy territory and even close to enemy air defenses.

 

FlightLead-Loses-Attackers-Starts-Circling-Slow-Enem-Terr-1.rar

FlightLead-Loses-Attackers-Starts-Circling-Slow-Enem-Terr-2.rar

 

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In cover missions: The AI lead will again lag behind, at low speed and altitude, when enemy fighters appear. It seems they are always waiting for the rest of the formation to overtake them before they decide to accelerate. They get easily killed even if I put my best pilots as lead. Many examples of this, they almost always get killed

 

AILead-Lags-Behind-Slow-Gets-Easily-Killed-Awacs-109s.rar

 

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In a general sense I can observe this behavior of AI leads, mostly friendly but sometimes even foe, with this 'power down' behavior in many different situations. Circling aimlessly at 200kmh even over enemy territory with flack nearby as well. I'd really like if this ridiculous behavior got stamped out.

 

Enemy-AI-Also-Enters-Dumb-Zombie-Mode-109Fs.rar

 

* In this case I could catch them because they enter the very slow 'Form up' phase, but there's also the rare ocasion where they also seem to be in the same 'blind zombie flying at 200kmhs' as my wingmen often do.

 

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Very slow formation proccess. It has improved but still feels a bit too slow, observing enemy external view, and as the example above shows, it also affects the enemy.

 

 

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If starting in the air, escorting IL-2s: They'll make a single attack, then drop all the rest of the ordinance and go back.

If-Starting-In-Air-Sturmoviks-Ditch-Weapons-After-1st-Attack.rar

 

 

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If starting in the air. escorting bombers: If I set the waypoint higher than 2000 meters (I like to put it to 3000 meters if there's enough friendly airspace for them to climb) they wont climb to this height. It only works starting with a take-off.

 

*I don't have a track for this but it should be easily tested with any escort bomber mission, 'Start in the air', put waypoint 2 to a higher height than 2000 meters, they won't climb above it.

 

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F4 (cover me) doesn't work. It just turns them into slow unreactive zombies.

 

*Again, no track for this, it's part of a general problem with AI under the players command. They have improved but can still become completely unresponsive and unreactive to any player command.

 

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Letting the Autopilot climb my I-16 past 3000 meters it doesn't activate the 2nd supercharger stage. Please verify if AI I-16s have the same problem.

 

*No track, should be easily reproduced with a waypoint above 3000 meters and technochat.

 

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In a general sense the reactions of my wingmen when I'm in command got a little better, they don't turn into slow zombies as often.  However it can still happen when cruising to and from bombing missions. I'm never sure if they'll react or not. Even only 2 enemy fighters can shoot down 4, 5, 6 of my squadron of zombies. There's no sense of what command to give to 'activate' them, or not to give a command at all. I'd like the team to be clear with what to do to activate my wingmen. I mean I see the enemy fighters coming. I point the formation towards them: We cross front to front. I repeat this mission many times:

 

No command/Attack enemy fighters/Patrol for enemy fighters/Cover me: slow zombies - get easily shot down. I don't know what I'm supposed to do.

 

NoCommand-Zombies-1Comm-Zombies-2Comms-Zombies.rar

 

There are many, many examples of this. I'm never sure if my wingmen will react or not. Please make a guide for players with how they should command AI wingmen to avoid these situations. Many different situations where my wingmen will still act crazy/blind/zombie.

 

i16-SlowsDown-When-CloseToFiringRange-OfBombersFasterThanIt-Around5Min.rar

Idiot-AI-Still-POWERS-DOWN-When-In-Attack-Phase-OLD-BUG.rar

 

 

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Ace AI in 109s maneuver all over the sky when I'm going after them. The closest they have to 'giving up' is when they start wobbling around at low power trying to make me overshoot them.

 

My wingmen, on the other hand, are always making these what I call 'please f*** me'  turns in dogfights, easy open turns that are pretty much invitations to getting shot down, even if they were active just a minute before. Even my best pilots do this:

 

FreeHunt-MyBestPilot-14Kills-TurnsZombie-PleaseKillMeTurns.rar

 

 

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I'd like to know what the 'cover me' is supposed to do. Right now it's a good command to make my wingmen follow after me when I'm fleeing enemy territory. If that's all its supposed to do, that's good enough. But:

 

I'd like a command that unequivocaly puts them in and agressive mode for going only after other fighters.

 

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Enemy fighters have 100% target fixation. Always. Even with some pretty hefty HE holes in their wings plus some leaks they don't break off from my wingmen. Even with ENGINES ON FIRE they don't break off. 2 times they even actually managed to shoot my wingmen down - yes, with their engines on fire. The 'take care of your wingmen' tip is useless both because all of them turn into zombies( so taking care of only one of them is useless, the rest of them is also flying at 200kmh and easily shot down), and also for this 100% target fixation.

 

Extreme-Target-Fixation-IronCross-Engine-on-Fire-4-18.rar

*This is playing Pat Wilson's campaign generator, but the behavior is the exactly the same in the pilot career. Notice that he actually manages to hit my wingman, this time my pilot got lucky. The time mark says 4:18 but it actually starts a bit earlier, I start going after him at around 2:30, complete with my horrible aim.

 

 

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This target fixation can work in my favor in escort bombers missions:

 

ESCORT-BOMBERS-ENEMY-TARGET-FIXATION-INHUMAN-LACK-OF-WILL-TO-SURVIVE.rar

ESCORT-BOMBERS-ENEMY-EXTREME-TARGET-FIXATION-PART2.rar

*This was recorded before the latest update, but it still works exactly like this, I've had multiple missions where I could do this in the last few days.

 

 

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Please, send friendlies (or enemies) with this much damage back to base. It was one of my best pilots too.

 

Please-Send-Planes-With-This-Much-Damage-Back-Home.rar

 

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Please improve both the Moscow and Stalingrad soviet autocannon airbase defenses. I notice that german auto-flak has gotten better, I'm being hit much higher, more energy, faster, maneuvering, (400kmhs+, 2500meters+, diving from 3500+meters-accelerating(350to500kmhs+)-pulling Gs going after enemy fighters)  since the latest patch. While enemy fighters I can make them start turning at less than 250kmhs, at less than 100 meters, right over my airbases autocannons, or making straight passes over batteries of 4 autocannons at less than 50 meters with them following me, still taking ages to be hit.

 

Please-Buff-BOM-Soviet-AAA-and-Enemy-Reactions-to-Damage-Otto-Wolf-8mins.rar

*This is not the worst example. This scenario happens way too often and my airbase defenses are almost always extremely pathetic.

 

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ME109s radiators have gotten way too resistant since a few patches ago.

 

109-radiator-resitance-starting-from-11-min.rar

109-Radiators-Ironbloodinium-LeftSide-11-50.rar

*These are not the best examples. I have multiple times gotten very good aimed bursts of MG at close range, and they still didn't puncture, but I didn't record it. (Time marks: 11mins nad 11:50)

 

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For the I-16 I'd really like if firing a red flare would activate an 'agressive behavior' for a few minutes. Give me back the rabid chihuahuas from AQM that would go after dogfights kilometers away.

 

 

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Enemy bombers and attackers in intercept missions are indestructible if friendly fighters get to them before my flight and we are far away (I don't know the exact distance). This is probably not a bug but a concious decision due to limitations in the mission scripting. It's ridiculous, artificial, unrealistic and has no place in a sim of this caliber. I want to have the possibility of getting to a bomber or attacker formation that already has less bombers/attackers/escorts. But if it's due to the many problems with mission making, then please, make the friendlies go after the fighter escort.

 

Intercept-Bombers-Invulnerable-Distance-Wingmen-Commands-Bug.rar

 

 

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Related: I didn't expect this to happen but it did recently: This 'Indestructible' value got bugged and I found a true ironbloodinium 109 in one of these missions(Time mark - 10 mins):

109-Indestructible-to-Player-10mins-TheoZoch.rar

 

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From before the last patch but could still be happening: Enemies spawning way too close, and despawning right besides me.

 

FreeHunt-Magic-Spawns-and-Despawns-Right-In-Front-Of-Me.rar

 

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Older bugs seem to have been solved. My wingmen don't go away cruising slowly right in the middle of enemies when 'mission complete' appears. They got better in intercept attackers/bombers as well.

 

 

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Cover missions seem to be ending early many times. When what we have to cover is close to the airbase many times we circle for a very short time and go back still with a lot of fuel, with enemies bombers/attackers being spawned far away right when 'mission complete' appears.

 

 

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EDIT: Awacs guided interceptors and enemy airforce interceptors concentrating only on players squadron:

 

The 'awacs guided' interceptors is something i've seen complained about before, they can track the players flight even if I start making crazy routes at low altitude deep inside my own territory.

 

The 'enemy airforce interceptors 100% for players flight' is part of a deeper problem with the pilot career. The name is pretty self explanatory.

 

This will happen in any kind of mission. It gets ridiculous to the point that they bypass friendlies (very close by, less than 1 kilometer sometimes) patroling right over the frontline (even passing close to enemy ground units) to come for us.

 

Even in cover missions with up to 3 other friendly fighter flights nearby, interceptor flights usually come only for my squadron. Even in the middle of an already chaotic ocurring dogfight they can distinguish the chaos and home in perfectly only on my wingmen - even if one of the other squadrons is using the same plane type. It's as if they have an incredible awacs guidance, high resolution syntetic radar and transponder put by traitors on my units planes too. Which usually results in a decimation of only my squad. To complement this my wingmen usually turn letargic zombies after the 1st dogfight, making their job easier.

 

No tracks for this, but it happens in pretty much every mission with enemy interceptors being spawned.

Edited January 22, 2024 by Aleksander55

[Aleksander55]

I forgot about this, please notice, very important: After starting a career with the I-16 unit in Stalingrad, when we get to 02/10/1942 the campaign skips directly to 21/01/1943 without giving us the option to transfer to another unit like in Moscow. Almost 4 months, almost the whole winter period. This is from before the last update but it could still be working this way.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 24, 2024 by Aleksander55

[LukeFF]

16 hours ago, Aleksander55 said:

I forgot about this, please notice, very important: After starting a career with the I-16 unit in Stalingrad, when we get to 02/10/1942 the campaign skips directly to 21/01/1943 without giving us the option to transfer to another unit like in Moscow. Almost 4 months, almost the whole winter period. This is from before the last update but it could still be working this way.

 

 

 

 

That's not a bug but rather a reflection that this regiment was withdrawn from the front before returning to action several months later.

[Aleksander55]

I started a pilot career with an IL-2 unit to see what kinds of missions they are given and to see if the low speed they cruise at when we escort them at Stalingrad is a bug.

 

1st: Yes, it seems the low speed when we escort them is a bug. The autopilot puts them to cruise at the speed ditacted by the waypoint, 350kmhs (TAS).

 

While when we escort them they cruise much slower:

 

 

So please correct their cruise speed when they are escorted, they are not obeying the waypoints speed, way too slow.

 

The second thing is... They are escorted at Moscow in every mission. Including by I-16s. Then I started a Pe-2 career at Moscow too... And they also get escorted every mission, including by I-16s as well.

 

Luke... guys... you shouldn't punish your customers like this. You shouldn't cut a whole feature because of some unpolite posts of some rude customer or the other. All this time... the IL-2s and Pe-2s have been escorted at Moscow.

 

Just... Just... Just give us back the escort missions at Moscow... Ok? Please?

 

Please?

[LukeFF]

19 hours ago, Aleksander55 said:

The second thing is... They are escorted at Moscow in every mission. Including by I-16s. Then I started a Pe-2 career at Moscow too... And they also get escorted every mission, including by I-16s as well.

 

That's because the majority of the Soviet fighter regiments on the Moscow map are equipped with I-16s.

 

19 hours ago, Aleksander55 said:

Luke... guys... you shouldn't punish your customers like this. You shouldn't cut a whole feature because of some unpolite posts of some rude customer or the other. All this time... the IL-2s and Pe-2s have been escorted at Moscow.

 

Just... Just... Just give us back the escort missions at Moscow... Ok? Please?

 

Please?

 

What? I'm not following you here.

[Aleksander55]

A long time ago escort missions for I-16s in the Moscow map were completely disabled.

 

 

 

You said it was because of the distances involved, but it should be possible to have these missions when Starting at Rzhev, Vlasyevo and other airfields that are close to IL-2s and Pe-2s bases. It's about the same distances as between  airfields at Stalingrad that allow escort missions. Right now there are no escort missions at all for I-16s at Moscow, no matter where/when you start.

 

Starting at Rzhev:

 

I'd say that for the AI, the maximum distance when escorting IL-2s is about 100kms, since the IL-2s loiter in the target area for at least 5 minutes. That's more or less the same maximum distance for cover missions when starting at Klin.

 

 

 

For escorting bombers, that fly at higher altitudes and go to the target and immediately back, I'd guesstimate the maximum distance for the AI I-16s is some 110 to 120kms depending on wind/temperature, etc.

 

 

Both distances could be higher for the player, but since the AI doesn't lean the engine and keeps throttling back and forth it has to be these maximum distances.

 

 

When we transfer to Vlasyevo both distance to bomber/IL-2s airfields and distance to frontline also apply:

 

 

 

 

Please reactivate these and other escort missions for these and other airfields. As long as the round trip for I-16s is between 200 to 240 kms depending on escort type the AI is able to do it.

 

edit: To keep it really safe for AI I-16s I'd say a maximum distance to target of 90kms when escorting IL-2s and of 110kms when escorting Pe-2s.

Edited January 29, 2024 by Aleksander55

[LukeFF]

1 hour ago, Aleksander55 said:

A long time ago escort missions for I-16s in the Moscow map were completely disabled.

 

For the player, yes, because they will otherwise run out of fuel. The spawn logic of AI fighter escorts is different so there is no problem with having them show up that way. 

 

Besides that, it was a rare thing for Soviet fighters to provide bomber and attack plane escort in the fall of 1941, largely because the Soviets didn't have enough planes to meet the demands of the front. So, for this time frame, it's far more accurate to portray fighters like the I-16s providing defensive coverage over their own lines and not straying into enemy territory. It really wasn't until about the summer of 1943 that the VVS started permitting their fighters to cross over the front lines to engage in combat with the Luftwaffe. 

[Aleksander55]

11 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

 

For the player, yes, because they will otherwise run out of fuel. The spawn logic of AI fighter escorts is different so there is no problem with having them show up that way. 

 

Besides that, it was a rare thing for Soviet fighters to provide bomber and attack plane escort in the fall of 1941, largely because the Soviets didn't have enough planes to meet the demands of the front. So, for this time frame, it's far more accurate to portray fighters like the I-16s providing defensive coverage over their own lines and not straying into enemy territory. It really wasn't until about the summer of 1943 that the VVS started permitting their fighters to cross over the front lines to engage in combat with the Luftwaffe. 

 

The Pe-2s and IL-2s are getting escorted by I-16s in their careers. Stalingrad shows it's possible for the AI within the parameters I've shown. Please, see if it's possible to add a small percentage of chance of getting these escort missions with these airfield types and these distances - similar to what we get in Stalingrad. Between IL-2s and Pe-2s it should be possible to get at least a few escort missions every once in a while.

Edited January 29, 2024 by Aleksander55

[marcobona]

Hello everyone. Even if we're talking about Soviet planes here, I want to report the following problem in the Moscow scenario: while piloting an F-4 as commander of the unit II/JG 52, after each takeoff at least one or two planes (sometimes even three if the formation is of 8  ) have their flaps jammed, remaining at a distance and compromising the mission. So I have to abort the mission and start over and over again until every plane doesn't have this problem anymore. In the same scenario piloting an E-2 as commander of the unit II./JG 26 I've never had any problems.

Is this all intentional for the 109s or is it a bug?

Edited February 3, 2024 by marcobona

[LukeFF]

3 hours ago, marcobona said:

Hello everyone. Even if we're talking about Soviet planes here, I want to report the following problem in the Moscow scenario: while piloting an F-4 as commander of the unit II/JG 52, after each takeoff at least one or two planes (sometimes even three if the formation is of 8  ) have their flaps jammed, remaining at a distance and compromising the mission. So I have to abort the mission and start over and over again until every plane doesn't have this problem anymore. In the same scenario piloting an E-2 as commander of the unit II./JG 26 I've never had any problems.

Is this all intentional for the 109s or is it a bug?

 

Do you happen to have the mission or a track file showing this issue? A track file would be especially helpful to track down what is going on.

[marcobona]

On 2/3/2024 at 7:59 PM, LukeFF said:

Do you happen to have the mission or a track file showing this issue? A track file would be especially helpful to track down what is going on.

 

So this is a typical situation: scenario Moscow, phase Last Assault, mission intercept attackers, me at command. My wingman 6 has flaps jammed and remains behind. I attached a track of this mission. 

 

 

career-40-1941.2024-02-04_19-19-54_00.rar

Edited February 4, 2024 by marcobona

[LukeFF]

Thank you!

[marcobona]

21 hours ago, marcobona said:

So this is a typical situation: scenario Moscow, phase Last Assault, mission intercept attackers, me at command. My wingman 6 has flaps jammed and remains behind. I attached a track of this mission. 

 

 

Just two days after, same mission type, intercept attackers, flight of 7, me at command, now wingman 6  & 7 with their flaps in open position remain behind.

 

 

[marcobona]

Now in Bomb Railway Junction mission with 5 110s, Moscow, Last Assault phase, me at command all my four wingmen have flaps down!!

 

Spoiler

 

 

[marcobona]

Nothing changed with the new update, same problems with flaps jammed. Only if I start a mission in fly, then all it's ok. But if I start a mission on runway then all my wingmen have flaps down after take-off and during all the mission. Moscow Scenario, phase 3 and 4, every mission for II./ZG26 with Bf-110E-2.

[LukeFF]

20 hours ago, marcobona said:

Nothing changed with the new update, same problems with flaps jammed. Only if I start a mission in fly, then all it's ok. But if I start a mission on runway then all my wingmen have flaps down after take-off and during all the mission. Moscow Scenario, phase 3 and 4, every mission for II./ZG26 with Bf-110E-2.

 

This issue has been acknowledged and is being investigated for a potential solution.