Brief Room Episode 2: 2023 In Review, Plans For 2024, A Glimpse At The Upcoming Title

[Pict]

1 hour ago, Koziolek said:

 

Do you mean, to do a game in a period when USSR together with Germany invaded Poland and started WW2? The sales might be a bit low in Russia ?

 

There is a precedent for this you know...the original IL2 sturmivik depicted 1939 and Poland in Forgotten Battles, that was a massive seller everywhere and especially in Russia

3 hours ago, Lusekofte said:

In Russia the great heroic war started in 1942. Everything before that is preferred forgotten. 
In my mind it was a lost opportunity not following chronologically from 39. After bodenplatte it was hard to go back to lighter armed and slower airplanes. 

I think you mean June 21st 1941, but I see what your getting at, however like I pointed out above, 1939 was done in IL2 FB...add to that they produced and still sell IL2 CLoD which takes place in 1940

2 hours ago, MAJ_stug41 said:

Didnt work for wwiiol lol

 

Edit - I think 41/42 is a good starting point because by then most of the single seaters are much friendlier to fly. Before then, nearly all require micromanagement of prop pitch, rpm, manifold pressure, rads, mixture, etc, not something that brings in the crowds.

I say this as someone that loves the wonky 30s designs. Pzl 11s and such are super cool to me, but I know that chasing do17s in pzl11s isnt going to thrill many. Spanish war too would be awesome, but again, doesnt sell.

Try flying the Russian gear or the Stuka ot the Me-110 or the Ju-88 etce etc LOL to you too

[LLv44_Damixu]

Korea theatre is not that interesting. 
Please keep the focus on WW2 on various battles.
There's your pay dirt.

[Pict]

2 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

If they had done that they never would have made it to 1942.

Like I said above, they already did it and 1940, yet here we are marching towards 1950

 

==============

 

Seems that the initiation of IL2 Box was similar to Clod, in that they picked a scenario that they perceived would sell, Stalingrad & BoB

 

Such is the way of it, it's a popularity contest governed by casual gamers, the majority of which have no real clue about combat flight history and move on to the next whim or fancy shortly thereafter. I suppose we must just count ourselves lucky to see any content that's not of mainstream historical value at all.

 

=============

 

Funny how I can jump in a plane from 1917 in IL2 BOX right now and noone bats an eye, yet mention 1939 and I get a heap of replies telling my why it could never happen, amusiningly after it has already been done by IL2

[creamersdream]

12 minutes ago, LLv44_Damixu said:

Korea theatre is not that interesting. 
Please keep the focus on WW2 on various battles.
There's your pay dirt.

 

 I agree.  I hope its not korea.

[Trooper117]

Where have you been?... it's Korea. We all know it's Korea, even in the Russian forums.

[YoYo]

Nope, Korea it's a great choice. 

This theater has been overlooked for years and I honestly don't remember when it was featured in simulators. I think the last one it was "Mig alley".

Korea is not only about jets, so anyone who likes piston engine planes will not be disappointed. Personally, I'm super happy with this idea.

 

 

[MAJ_stug41]

58 minutes ago, Pict said:

 

Try flying the Russian gear or the Stuka ot the Me-110 or the Ju-88 etce etc LOL to you too

I fly everything

[Robli]

1 hour ago, Pict said:

There is a precedent for this you know...the original IL2 sturmivik depicted 1939 and Poland in Forgotten Battles, that was a massive seller everywhere and especially in Russia

 

Forgotten Battles was not about 1939 Poland. It was mainly about Continuation War (1941-1944 Finland) and there was also Hungarian side-campaign. 

 

1 hour ago, Pict said:

add to that they produced and still sell IL2 CLoD which takes place in 1940

 

I think Battle of Britain in general has very good appeal for a WWII combat flight sim. It is famous, it was very clearly an air battle, it offers equal match-up between both sides, legendary planes etc, even if it could be kind of one-dimensional at the end, due to the missing ground war. So for CloD it was a goog choice with lots of selling potential - but now also comes with a certain burden due to the CloD history.

[Gambit21]

1 hour ago, creamersdream said:

 

 I agree.  I hope its not korea.

You might as well hope that they didn’t do Moscow.

[BraveSirRobin]

3 hours ago, Enceladus828 said:

At some point yeah... after they do Bagration, Berlin, and add greatly requested planes such as the Bf-110F, IL-4, and early Yak-1.

Or next.  There is absolutely no reason why they couldn’t do BoB right now if they can recreate formations of bombers.

2 hours ago, creamersdream said:

 

 I agree.  I hope its not korea.

I have bad news for you.

[Avimimus]

2 hours ago, YoYo said:

Nope, Korea it's a great choice. 

This theater has been overlooked for years and I honestly don't remember when it was featured in simulators. I think the last one it was "Mig alley".

 

Admittedly, Korea has been ignored just as much (or more) than WWI. Lot's of untapped potentials.

 

3 hours ago, BraveSirRobin said:

They couldn’t do BoB with the current game engine.

 

Source?

 

 

 

[BraveSirRobin]

1 hour ago, Avimimus said:

Source?

Anyone who has flown near a formation of more than 3 bombers.

[Avimimus]

22 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

Oh great! So if I want to strafe during day I'm just screwed...yeah thanks but no thanks buddy!!!!

 

Hey - you got a problem with that, talk to the Yaks!

It is the Yaks that'll stop you, not me.

[Pict]

1 hour ago, Robli said:

Forgotten Battles was not about 1939 Poland.

 

Who said it was?

 

I said that Poland 1939 was represented in IL2 Forgotten Battles, are you saying it wasn't?

 

The PZL P.11c fighter was in there and Poland as a nation was in there...what exactly are you saying here? What are you attempting to educate me about?

[Avimimus]

1 hour ago, BraveSirRobin said:

Anyone who has flown near a formation of more than 3 bombers.

 

Battle of Britain, Their Finest Hour was able to do BoB with just six aircraft simulated at a time (It might've been eight - I can't quite remember). So, technically speaking, it has been done. Flyable Do-17Z too.

 

P.S. My machine can handle much larger formations in Great Battles. Albeit not with a lot of time compression. But a dozen bombers works quite well.

[Pict]

1 hour ago, BraveSirRobin said:

Anyone who has flown near a formation of more than 3 bombers.

 

I've flown in formations of way more than 3 bombers on TAW, no problem and I don't have a fast computer.

[BraveSirRobin]

1 hour ago, Avimimus said:

Battle of Britain, Their Finest Hour was able to do BoB with just six aircraft simulated at a time (It might've been eight - I can't quite remember). So, technically speaking, it has been done. Flyable Do-17Z too.

 

P.S. My machine can handle much larger formations in Great Battles. Albeit not with a lot of time compression. But a dozen bombers works quite well.

A dozen bombers is not enough.  They need to do better than that.  And 12 bombers in MP is a stuttering, warping, mess.

[Vishnu]

2 hours ago, creamersdream said:

 

 I agree.  I hope its not korea.

Me too.

[Gambit21]

28 minutes ago, Avimimus said:

 

Hey - you got a problem with that, talk to the Yaks!

It is the Yaks that'll stop you, not me.

 

Yeah they can be a bit of a pest.

I do love me a good Stuka though.

 

[Robli]

27 minutes ago, Pict said:

Who said it was?

 

You did.

 

27 minutes ago, Pict said:

The PZL P.11c fighter was in there

 

Was it? I have no recollection of it being there before IL2 Sturmovik 1946. If it indeed was there, then I still doubt it was the reason of Forgotten Battles being "massive seller everywhere". 

 

P.S. According to this link, Forgotten Battles did not have P.11.  https://gamicus.fandom.com/wiki/IL-2_Sturmovik:_Forgotten_Battles

[Lusekofte]

3 hours ago, Pict said:

1939 and I get a heap of replies telling my why it could never happen, amusiningly after it has already been done by IL2

I wish for SCW very balanced planet with many nations airplane. Then followed up with winterwar. BOF at least then BOB. 
I think this train has left the station, mostly because a loud few repeat its doom judged by their own subjective opinion with no more competence than the rest of us on the field. 
After Korea there will be only one way forward that allow for return in the history. And that is PTO. 
I was hoping for Burma, New Guinea or Philippines instead of Korea. That would have been awesome ? and more in line with everybody here. No need for carriers and a very interesting selection of aeronautical machines. But Korea will make this probably to be Okinawa with yet again late war wonder machines. 
I wish I knew that pipeline, because if I am right I have nothing to do here

[Robli]

Doing some more digging, according to this link, P.Z.L. P.11c was added to IL2 Sturmovik with a patch in 2009.

 

14. New flyable: P.Z.L. P.11c Polish fighter (third-party development).

[Pict]

13 minutes ago, Robli said:

Doing some more digging, according to this link, P.Z.L. P.11c was added to IL2 Sturmovik with a patch in 2009.

 

14. New flyable: P.Z.L. P.11c Polish fighter (third-party development).

 

OK well done, now what came first 2009 0r 2024?

23 minutes ago, Robli said:

You did.

 

Show me exactly where I said that Forgotten Battles was about 1939 Poland.

Edited January 10, 2024 by Pict

[LukeFF]

1 hour ago, Pict said:

Who said it was?

 

I said that Poland 1939 was represented in IL2 Forgotten Battles, are you saying it wasn't?

 

The PZL P.11c fighter was in there and Poland as a nation was in there...what exactly are you saying here? What are you attempting to educate me about?

 

The PZL was a third-party project (one of the first, actually) and didn't really fit any of the other content for IL2 released back then by 1C.

[LukeFF]

Alright, PZL P.11 discussions aside, let's please (again) get back on topic. ?

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

7 hours ago, MAJ_stug41 said:

Didnt work for wwiiol lol

 

Edit - I think 41/42 is a good starting point because by then most of the single seaters are much friendlier to fly. Before then, nearly all require micromanagement of prop pitch, rpm, manifold pressure, rads, mixture, etc, not something that brings in the crowds.

I say this as someone that loves the wonky 30s designs. Pzl 11s and such are super cool to me, but I know that chasing do17s in pzl11s isnt going to thrill many. Spanish war too would be awesome, but again, doesnt sell.

This. If I have to alternate between fine and coarse pitch continuously like in the Spit 1 in CLoD, I honestly just would rather not play. You can't even dogfight with that BS going on.

2 hours ago, Pict said:

 

I've flown in formations of way more than 3 bombers on TAW, no problem and I don't have a fast computer.

Online is different as the server bears the burden of simulating/computing the AI.

Edited January 10, 2024 by =DW=_drewm3i-VR

[Gambit21]

3 hours ago, Vishnu said:

Me too.

 

It's Korea, be sure.

Sorry Mitchell.

 

 

[DD_Arthur]

2 hours ago, Lusekofte said:

I wish for SCW very balanced planet with many nations airplane. Then followed up with winterwar. BOF at least then BOB. 
I think this train has left the station, mostly because a loud few repeat its doom judged by their own subjective opinion with no more competence than the rest of us on the field. 

Luse, do you really think a couple of dozen talking heads on forums have prevented developers from making combat flight sims featuring the Spanish civil war or the battle of France??

[Avimimus]

3 hours ago, LukeFF said:

The PZL was a third-party project (one of the first, actually) and didn't really fit any of the other content for IL2 released back then by 1C.

 

Ah, I remember now! It was actually the start of a revolution. It was already extremely surprising to see new content in patches (such a thing wasn't common in 2002)... but implementing the programming for 3rd party modules... it was really unexpected. The PZL also showed the possibility of this kind of collaboration to create less common aircraft. It was pretty wonderful. ? I recall the excitement to see something so novel and strange.

[Lusekofte]

20 minutes ago, DD_Arthur said:

Luse, do you really think a couple of dozen talking heads on forums have prevented developers from making combat flight sims featuring the Spanish civil war or the battle of France??

No not really , but a discussion without overestimates is boring. 

38 minutes ago, Gambit21 said:

 

It's Korea, be sure.

Sorry Mitchell.

 

 

There are no longer any doubts. I had wished for south east Asia ww2 but it was no IL 10 there 

[Enceladus828]

4 hours ago, BraveSirRobin said:

Or next.  There is absolutely no reason why they couldn’t do BoB right now if they can recreate formations of bombers.

Even if they can or that never stopped them from going there, why cover it after Korea when another game has it covered very well with even the Regia Aeronautica depicted? I'd be more interested in seeing late war Soviet planes like the IL-2M, Tu-2, later Pe-2 model, and P-39Q than doing something that's already covered very well.

 

If anything we wouldn't be seeing an IL-2 GBs BoB until 2030 at the earliest.

[BraveSirRobin]

Just now, Enceladus828 said:

Even if they can or that never stopped them from going there, why cover it after Korea when another game has it covered very well with even the Regia Aeronautica depicted? I'd be more interested in seeing late war Soviet planes like the IL-2M, Tu-2, later Pe-2 model, and P-39Q than doing something that's already covered very well.

 

If anything we wouldn't be seeing an IL-2 GBs BoB until 2030 at the earliest.

They can do it after Korea because they will supposedly have a better ability to simulate large formations of bombers.  By that time it will have been at least 15 years since anyone released a BoB game.  Time for a new one, as far as I’m concerned.  
 

I know lots of people expect PTO next.  But I’m not as sure about that.  I’m not saying it won’t happen, but I don’t think it’s certain.

[sevenless]

 

5 hours ago, BraveSirRobin said:

A dozen bombers is not enough.  They need to do better than that.  And 12 bombers in MP is a stuttering, warping, mess.

 

Exactly. The "old" titles like IL-2 CloD can handle large formations and Il-2 1946 can handle that too. And SP is even more important than MP (assuming 90% of their customer base is SP). Besides AI and other shortcomings of the GB engine they have a lot of work ahead for their next release to convince the audience that they can catch up to 10+ year old standards in this department. I am really interested what they will announce in spring and how convincing that will be.

[US103_Baer]

Ok, Korea is the new Sim. Then what? I mean is there realistically enough content for more than 1 Korea module and still be commercially exciting?

Where does content development in the new Sim go after that? Backwards in time to WW2 Pacific or forwards to, er, Vietnam? Or roll out GB modules ported to the new engine, or some combo of the above?

 

You'd imagine there would be a logical dev  timeline where capabilities created in earlier modules were built upon for later releases.
 

Edited January 11, 2024 by US103_Baer

[BraveSirRobin]

I think pre-complaints about future modules are not made available until the currently announced module is completed.  But with Jason gone maybe the pre-complaining period will be expanded.

[ACG_Bussard]

As it seems company policy, it can be predicted that existing aircraft will be offered in further sub-variants. As the past has shown, this pays off well.

 

How about a Taiwan street crises DLC with brandnew subvariants of the Sabre and Fagot? That would certainly please once again the stakeholders such as licensors and potential new customers from the land of the Rising sun.

 

...and remember: forwards ever, backwards never!

 

 

 

[Enceladus828]

4 hours ago, BraveSirRobin said:

By that time it will have been at least 15 years since anyone released a BoB game.  Time for a new one, as far as I’m concerned.  

Wrong. A new BoB came out in 2019 with a Battle of France expansion last year: https://www.wingsoverthereich.com

 

I’m keen on a late war Eastern front and then late war PTO after Korea.

[Gambit21]

10 hours ago, Enceladus828 said:

Wrong. A new BoB came out in 2019 with a Battle of France expansion last year: https://www.wingsoverthereich.com

 

I’m keen on a late war Eastern front and then late war PTO after Korea.

Gotta let go of late PTO.

 

Again, they’re not going to enter PTO with the Ki-84, Japanese home islands etc etc. I doubt you’ll ever see this, let alone first. 
 

Look for Solomons, New Guinea or even CBI, Philippines at the latest.

 

12 hours ago, US103_Baer said:

Ok, Korea is the new Sim. Then what? I mean is there realistically enough content for more than 1 Korea module and still be commercially exciting?

 

Doubt it.

 

12 hours ago, US103_Baer said:

Where does content development in the new Sim go after that? Backwards in time to WW2 Pacific

 

Likely

 

12 hours ago, US103_Baer said:

or forwards to, er, Vietnam?

 

Not a chance.

 

12 hours ago, US103_Baer said:

 

Or roll out GB modules ported to the new engine.

 

“New engine” remains to be seen. We don’t know what this looks like yet. Likely development on the current engine thus making it “new”  Compatibility with legacy content in any case is the question, perhaps due at least in part to PBR textures going forward.

 

12 hours ago, US103_Baer said:

You'd imagine there would be a logical dev  timeline where capabilities created in earlier modules were built upon for later releases.

 

With tech yes, content no.

 

 

Not necessarily anyway.

[ACG_Bussard]

Vietnam not a chance?

 

more here: 

 

Forwards ever, backwards never!

[Gambit21]

6 minutes ago, Bussard* said:

Vietnam not a chance?

 

more here: 

 

Forwards ever, backwards never!

Not a chance any time soon, I didn’t say “ever”