The status of the yet-to-be-announced title

[jollyjack]

Did you now just reveal the new name? Stormbird?

On 10/8/2023 at 12:37 PM, szelljr said:

I just hope the N 17 , Alb II Template will be relased before  the new game engine...  

 

[BraveSirRobin]

7 hours ago, ST_Catchov said:

 

So I expect they'll be focusing on SP AI improvements then? 

You are so close to figuring out that the AI will never be as good as you want it to be.  So very close.

[LukeFF]

8 hours ago, Robli said:

My own observations (without actual data) are in line with that graph, too. Multiplayer activity has clearly dropped, forum activity has clearly dropped and most of the people I used to fly with have moved on. I see that some people are somehow convinced that single player community is blooming more than ever, but no such data could be found publicly at least. Another thing that is noticeable about the graph is the trend part. It is clearly pointing downwards. Products generally have lifecycles and I think it is quite rare that products that have been in decline for a couple of years change their course. 

 

Like with MP, most people who buy the game also don't go online and post on a message board. That's also backed up by internal data. ? Just like Twitter isn't the real world, neither are message boards or Discord servers.

 

Yes, every product of course has a life cycle, but the numbers right now are where 1CGS expected them to be. That, and you don't plan for a new title in the series if "players are leaving in droves." 

[LukeFF]

Change of plans: the new title will consist of these two planes, complete with an accompanying soundtrack:

 

(The delay in the announcement was due to securing rights to the music from Herb Alpert's estate).

 

 

 

[ITAF_Artiglio]

Why wasn't my post published in this thread??? I posted it this afternoon around 2.30pm but so far I don't see any trace of it...?

Edited October 27, 2023 by ITAF_Artiglio

[LFL-EightyPLUS]

11 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

Change of plans: the new title will consist of these two planes, complete with an accompanying soundtrack:

 

(The delay in the announcement was due to securing rights to the music from Herb Alpert's estate).

 

 

 

Been pissed of ever since the whole pacific theatre thing is dead...But this is actually a lot better! pre-ordering now!!

[Gambit21]

12 minutes ago, ITAF_Artiglio said:

Why wasn't my post published in this thread??? I posted it this afternoon around 2.30pm but so far I don't see any trace of it...?

Quality Control Algorithm 

[MAJ_stug41]

That flying pancake sits across where charles mohrle would normally do his presentations in the love field museum.

[CountZero]

12 hours ago, ST_Catchov said:

 

So I expect they'll be focusing on SP AI improvements then? 

why , only 90%+ players play SP by their data, why improve that ?

 

if they realy belive what they try to convinc us, they would be focusing imidiatly on improving SP aspects of game insted constant DM FM and so on improvments that dont realy mather when your fighting AI airplanes in state they are now or since game was made, not even to mention lack of any meaningfule control of flights or wingmans.. but 90%+ users are SP ones... yes yes lol

 

[MAJ_stug41]

The concept of the quick mission scenarios, careers, and scripted careers, are all great but the AI is so awful that they are impossible to enjoy. Tried starting the albatross career the other day and within minutes half the flight was gone because they crashed in to one another. There is no effective way to communicate so even if you are "leading" what difference does it make? They do not respond!

Edited October 28, 2023 by stug41

[Lusekofte]

31 minutes ago, stug41 said:

The concept of the quick mission scenarios, careers, and scripted careers, are all great but the AI is so awful that they are impossible to enjoy. Tried starting the albatross career the other day and within minutes half the flight was gone becsuse they crashed in to one another. There is no effective way to communicate so even if you are "leading" what difference does it make? They do not respond!

This is why I cannot fly career. Except I will try LI 2 career. It apparently might contain interesting night missions. Coop and scripted campaigns are this brand good stuff. In coop you get a sense of being backed up, or at least attempts to cover you. Scripted campaigns are tuned to make this software function in best possible way

[LukeFF]

42 minutes ago, stug41 said:

The concept of the quick mission scenarios, careers, and scripted careers, are all great but the AI is so awful that they are impossible to enjoy. Tried starting the albatross career the other day and within minutes half the flight was gone becsuse they crashed in to one another. There is no effective way to communicate so even if you are "leading" what difference does it make? They do not respond!

 

Mission files ?

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

The whole AI is broken thing is way overblown. Yes, at times, it would seem that way. But we fight them online and they're honestly more competitive than half of the human pilots (noobs).

 

However, by and large, the AI is good for beginners and non-competitive players to enjoy IL-2 by fighting against it in campaigns and such. I began with single player and outgrew it. Once I got VR, online play became viable and worthwhile as I now had depth perception and head tracking to be competitive. If you want a real challenge and truly dynamic experience, come play on Combat Box, TAW, or Finnish. Single player could never compare with Apollo and online dynamic moving fronts and such. The beauty of it is you can do whatever you want... want to fly with 10 players in a large formation of bombers? Do it. Want to do a solo free hunt? Do it. Want to fly stealthily on the deck and bomb an obscure target to help win the mission without seeing another plane? Do it. The possibilities are literally endless.

 

Singed,

A former SP only player

Edited October 27, 2023 by drewm3i-VR

[Lusekofte]

59 minutes ago, drewm3i-VR said:

But we fight them online and they're honestly more competitive

As wingmen. They are utter rubbish. And that is what ruin career mode. As an opponent they are pretty good at bouncing and initial dogfight. As opponents they are better than most competitive brands. I think the lack of communication with them is part of it

Edited October 27, 2023 by Lusekofte

[Ghost666]

4 hours ago, LukeFF said:

Change of plans: the new title will consist of these two planes, complete with an accompanying soundtrack:

 

(The delay in the announcement was due to securing rights to the music from Herb Alpert's estate).

 

 

I got it! Those Magnificent Men in their Flying Machines!

 

[US103_Baer]

22 hours ago, JG27_Abaster said:

Ummmm…

 

As a point of reference. This looks a pretty typical trend given the huge impact that the 'pandemic' responses had on media consumption and is exactly what we've seen in my company.

Until very recently I've worked at a large integrated media group, overseeing all data and analytics services.

40+ sites across a variety of verticals and including the largest in the country. Combined monthly uniques being larger than Facebook here.

 

Chart looks typical for most online media segments and doesn't tell you anything unique,  specific or actionable. 

More useful insight might be gained by analysis of change in various user segments 2019-2023. Segmenting by engagement levels, demographics, play styles, product use, affinities etc.

I'm sure 1C are well on top of that.

 

Edited October 28, 2023 by US103_Baer

[Gambit21]

22 minutes ago, US103_Baer said:

 

As a point of reference. This looks a pretty typical trend given the huge impact that the 'pandemic' responses had on media consumption and is exactly what we've seen in my company.

Until very recently I've worked at a large integrated media group, overseeing all data and analytics services.

40+ sites across a variety of verticals and including the largest in the country. Combined monthly uniques being larger than Facebook here.

 

Chart looks typical for most online media segments. 

More useful insight might be gained by analysis of change in various user segments 2019-2023. Segmenting by engagement levels, demographics, play styles, product use, affinities etc.

I'm sure 1C are well on top of that.

 

Yep

 

 

That was exactly the recent history I was referring to.

[Robli]

2 hours ago, US103_Baer said:

As a point of reference. This looks a pretty typical trend given the huge impact that the 'pandemic' responses had on media consumption and is exactly what we've seen in my company.

 

Could you post data as a point of reference, so we could evaluate it? When I tried to pick random games of various genres for reference from Steam charts, it did not support your claim. I looked at Assetto Corsa, Civilization IV, Counter Strike 2 and Hearts of Iron IV for reference.

 

https://steamcharts.com/app/244210

https://steamcharts.com/app/3900

https://steamcharts.com/app/730

https://steamcharts.com/app/394360

 

 

Actually found another chart for entire gaming industry.

[Robli]

 

Edit: I realised that the previous graph was old and included forecast. Here is a more actual graph.

[Robli]

 

Edit: I also realise that revenue numbers could be bloated due to inflation etc. Another graph showing development in active gamer amounts.

 

Anyway, whatever gaming related graph I look at, it is hard for me to see that it is following the same trend as JG27_Abaster posted about BoX.

Edited October 28, 2023 by Robli

[AEthelraedUnraed]

Great, people without any in-depth knowledge of the data they're looking at and without using any advanced statistics, trying to interpret said data?

 

By the way, did you guys know climate change is caused by the decline in the number of pirates?

 

13 hours ago, drewm3i-VR said:

The whole AI is broken thing is way overblown.

Agreed. Of course, the AI still has issues, many of which are well-documented by now. But I'm not ashamed to admit I regularly get shot down by veteran or even average level AI. Only when flying an aircraft I'm well accustomed to and fight *very* disciplined, meaning I constantly watch my energy and never get greedy, can I more-or-less consistently defeat Ace level AI.

[CountZero]

13 minutes ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

Great, people without any in-depth knowledge of the data they're looking at and without using any advanced statistics, trying to interpret said data?

 

By the way, did you guys know climate change is caused by the decline in the number of pirates?

 

Agreed. Of course, the AI still has issues, many of which are well-documented by now. But I'm not ashamed to admit I regularly get shot down by veteran or even average level AI. Only when flying an aircraft I'm well accustomed to and fight *very* disciplined, meaning I constantly watch my energy and never get greedy, can I more-or-less consistently defeat Ace level AI.

great, but you do not get any contol or cooperation from them, one vs every enemy ai is boring realy fast.  

Edited October 28, 2023 by CountZero

[Lusekofte]

The lack of support by wingmen is this game #1 immersion killer. Soon you do not care for the wingmen yourself. The feel of a dead environment is caused by this. Communication with wingmen and ground control are essential. 
You should care for the unit you fly in, if not there is no simulation of air war that make sense. This must be fixed in this new thing they are making

[AEthelraedUnraed]

1 hour ago, CountZero said:

great, but you do not get any contol or cooperation from them

And I agree, the AI should be more team-minded. There are also some other clear issues occasionally playing up, such as (but not limited to) aircraft flying into each other, or the near-impossibility of sneaking up to an AI.

 

However, in my book that's a far cry from the "AI iS bRoKeN aND tHIs gAme sUx!!!1!11!!one!!1 " attitude that some people seem to have. None of those issues spoil my enjoyment of the game; whenever they do occur I just pretend it was caused by well-documented real-world issues such as fog of war. Nor do the AI issues make it boring for me to fight enemy aircraft; if you're good enough that fighting ace-level AI is boring to you, then that says equally much about your own level than the AI's.

 

Above all, I want the AI to be realistic and one could argue that even the rookie AI is better than most of the 1944 Luftwaffe teenagers.

[Zooropa_Fly]

26 minutes ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

or the near-impossibility of sneaking up to an AI

 

Possibly the game's biggest failing in my humble..

[RNAS10_Mitchell]

10 minutes ago, Zooropa_Fly said:

 

Possibly the game's biggest failing in my humble..

I've noticed while flying on the Flugpark that at some AI defended ground targets,  you can sneak up on them.  In fact, they seem to be asleep.  While at other targets, they are very much awake and alert.  I've never created a mission,  so I don't really know why that is.  I suspect that when posting an AI plane at a location,  you can specify if the plane is novice, average,  or expert.   It's interesting though.  If my assumption is correct (big if), then it would appear that what is missing is some type of randomizer.   Coding that would in effect "roll the dice" to determine what happens.   Programming wise, this is nothing new, and a random outcome generator would be extremely beneficial to other events.   Ie gun jams, engine fires, etc..  

[BlitzPig_EL]

I agree that human to AI communication is totally lacking, but the AI can put up spirited engagements, though I find it is very aircraft type dependent.  

I have mission I built where an Allied airfield (Taman on the Kuban Map) is attacked by successive waves of Axis AI flights. This happens at the beginning of the mission, so as you spawn in you have to scramble.  It's multiplayer so I have tried it alone, and with 3 or 4 of the BlitzPigs.   Anyway, after several waves of attackers, I have a pair of Bf 109 G14s set at Ace show up.  They put on a really good demonstration of proper energy tactics, and gunnery proficiency.  If I am alone they do a really good drag and bag by working together in a way that would make most human pairs blush.  They are not quickly defeated if you are alone.  I much prefer to have one of my friends flying with me when the G14s show up.  

 

The MC 202 set on Ace also never fail to give an entertaining showing for themselves.   So the issue isn't that the AI are not competent at fighting, but that they are not good team players when flying with humans on their side.

[tvcasualty]

On 10/27/2023 at 12:20 PM, LukeFF said:

....That, and you don't plan for a new title in the series if "players are leaving in droves." 

 

Hold the phone!  That's what I *needed* to read.
This definitely says more BOX to come.

Will be buying what I'm missing shortly (also I'm noting that steam purchases don't show on the campaign ribbons to the left).

[Jaegermeister]

7 hours ago, Lusekofte said:

The lack of support by wingmen is this game #1 immersion killer. Soon you do not care for the wingmen yourself. The feel of a dead environment is caused by this. Communication with wingmen and ground control are essential. 
You should care for the unit you fly in, if not there is no simulation of air war that make sense. This must be fixed in this new thing they are making

 

Not necessarily true... "Gabby" Gabreski said it best when he was leading a Sabre group in Korea. "Wingmen are there to absorb firepower".   

[Gambit21]

13 hours ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

Great, people without any in-depth knowledge of the data they're looking at and without using any advanced statistics, trying to interpret said data?

Pretty much - only without any basic knowledge or beginning statistics if we’re being honest. 

 

 

It’s cold here today - we’re heading into an ice age!!!!

[Robli]

Believe me guys, a trend chart is very basic stuff. Very basic. People without any kind of mathematical background can generally understand it. 

[deathmisser]

On 10/27/2023 at 7:59 PM, LukeFF said:

Change of plans: the new title will consist of these two planes, complete with an accompanying soundtrack:

 

(The delay in the announcement was due to securing rights to the music from Herb Alpert's estate).

 

 

 

Spanish flee 

 

Guys it's the war the Ha-1112 was used in lmao 

[kraut1]

15 hours ago, Jaegermeister said:

 

Not necessarily true... "Gabby" Gabreski said it best when he was leading a Sabre group in Korea. "Wingmen are there to absorb firepower".   

When creating intercept missions with EMG I define the flight (Schwarm): Lead flight 2 planes (1 .Rotte) and Escort flight 2 planes (2. Rotte).

I don't have communication with Escort flight but they are always nearby (some hundret meters above and they are helping me often. My wingman has to stay with me or to attack. Covering by wingman does nort work. Some warnings during combat I get by my "Wingmen audio messages" . When planes of my nation are within 2,5 km distance I get warnings when enemy planes are closing at e.g. 5km, 3km, 1500m, 500m, warnings only with random probabillity of ca. 50% to 80%

[Canvas25]

5 hours ago, Robli said:

Believe me guys, a trend chart is very basic stuff. Very basic. People without any kind of mathematical background can generally understand it. 

 

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."

[ZachariasX]

1 hour ago, Canvas25 said:

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."

It's incredible how little of a concept about math people have today to actually give some merit to that statement.

[dburne]

3 hours ago, Canvas25 said:

 

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."

 

Nah - when it comes to that, a lie is a lie. Can't change that.

[Gambit21]

11 hours ago, Robli said:

Believe me guys, a trend chart is very basic stuff. Very basic. People without any kind of mathematical background can generally understand it. 

You’d think.

 

 

[BraveSirRobin]

7 hours ago, Canvas25 said:

 

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."

I always cringe when I see someone post this.  Statistics are one of our best tools for understanding the world around us.

[AndyJWest]

14 minutes ago, BraveSirRobin said:

I always cringe when I see someone post this.  Statistics are one of our best tools for understanding the world around us.

 

They can be. But only when you can distinguish what they tell us from what they don't. If you get to do that, you can make good money from people who think they understand statistics...

[BraveSirRobin]

1 hour ago, AndyJWest said:

 

They can be. But only when you can distinguish what they tell us from what they don't. If you get to do that, you can make good money from people who think they understand statistics...

Yeah, fake statistical analysis can definitely fool morons.  But that is a different issue.  Real statistics are invaluable.