Do we have the planeset to create the invasion of Italy? (Wondering if that could be the next expansion)

[Trooper117]

1 hour ago, Algherghez said:

so no Korea either.

 

You is wrong...

[Algherghez]

5 minutes ago, Trooper117 said:

 

You is wrong...

Can you please elaborate on that?

they said piston themed.

 

the war over South Korea where north Koreans were using only piston aircrafts only lasted 25 days and it was basically a turkey shoot. Also US already had jets deployed.

Also “it was almost gonna be Malta” so they probably have documents and sources. Might be something like jugoslavia? 

[BlitzPig_EL]

If anyone remembers, which many of you seem not to, when the new project was first discussed by the devs, they said mostly piston aircraft, not only piston aircraft.

 

This does not rule out Korea in any way.  Italy, however, is right out.  This was indicated early on because of the complexity of the map.

[LukeFF]

[Aleksander55]

On 8/20/2023 at 8:15 AM, Avimimus said:

One of the neat things is that, once one has several modules from one theatre, any new additions often benefit multiple modules (e.g. BoN filled in gaps in BoBP, the I-153 and IAR-80/81 fill in gaps in multiple modules etc.) It is one reason why it would be exciting if they added a couple more Collector Planes at this point

There's also the need of an earlier model of Ju-87. It would be not only for Moscow (a very glaring flaw), but also useful for earlier Channel scenarios if the team ever goes there.

[Mtnbiker1998]

Boy I can't wait for Korea where all the US planes get 1 minute engine timers and no API ammo against the armored soviet planes that can run with the throttle firewalled until the fuels out... 

 

I'd take literally anything else over Korea from these devs in this engine. Would have really loved to go to Italy, and seeing all the blank desert skins that showed up with tactical codes I had so much hope we'd see the Mediterranean, but oh well. I'll still have GB, Combat Pilot is lookin pretty promising, and hopefully Microprose has something up their sleeve.

[LukeFF]

[FuriousMeow]

1 hour ago, Mtnbiker1998 said:

Boy I can't wait for Korea where all the US planes get 1 minute engine timers and no API ammo against the armored soviet planes that can run with the throttle firewalled until the fuels out... 

 

 

I don't care for Korea either, not sure what's in store but that's a no buy from me until maybe its on sale.
 

But if the engine timers comment is because the current crop of many VVS planes can run full throttle/RPM without timers, you may want to compare their MAP and RPM that they are running at compared to other aircraft. Their full MAP/RPM is the continuous/no timer power of many other planes, especially RPM.

[Enceladus828]

On 8/23/2023 at 3:35 AM, JG27_Steini said:

I think italy would be interessting. What were the main (fighter) opponents in the air? You can not make a good product if one side is totally outclassed by number and/or performances.

To be fair the quote is "Any chance of seeing a Battle of France (1940), Italy, Malta as an area of operations" to which LOFT says " You can make the maps too, guys."

 

The response was pertaining to new maps which would be popular amongst the community as a whole, not necessarily excluding these 3 places as being the location of the next installment, though they did say that they wouldn't being doing Italy. Italy imo refers to the Italian Campaign from Operation Achse to May 1945 (Salerno landings, Gustav Line, Monte Cassino, Gothic Line, etc.).

 

I have high hopes that the Invasion of Sicily will be where the next installment takes place as Jason wanted to go there after BoN, hasn't been properly depicted before, would add many Italian planes and make the MC.202 feel less of a white elephant, and would give us a great Allied planeset which we could use most of them for BoN. Players could also use the map which would include Malta to do The Siege of Malta with mainly BoM, BoS and some BoK planes. Pat Wilson would likely add a Battle of Malta career mode for PWCG.

 

TL;DR, I don't believe Sicily has been excluded. 

[ACG_Bussard]

After returning from summer vacation, I would also like to contribute my thoughts here. ?

 

I think it should be clear that we will see as next installment:

 

"Those Magnificent Men in their Flying Machines; Or, How I Flew from London to Paris in 25 Hours and 11 Minutes" 

 

 

Why exactly do I come up with this?

 

On 8/15/2023 at 9:08 PM, CountZero said:

 

"And they teased a bunch of stuff for the next one.

 

A. Swimming pilots : desperately needed for this 

B. No carries : Check

C. Needs lot of resourses : Erm, yes!

D. it's not Italy : Hell yeah!

E. It's something new : Yep

F. Piston engine themed : Of course

G. Little to no cities  :They can use the Normandy map, because the map didn't modeled the capital cities of London and Paris. A cheep and quick double dip!

H. Not in the Pacific : Indeed

I. It was almost gonna be Malta if Jason had his way : unfortunatly irrelevant

J. They picked five theatres of war before deciding the final one. " : great choice

 

 

Have a nice weekend and keep flying or tanking! ?

Edited August 26, 2023 by Bussard*

[Mysticpuma]

Imagine if they opened up a modding tool to allow maps to be created. Keep them on the modding forum and then the best could be incorporated into the game officially.

[AEthelraedUnraed]

24 minutes ago, Mysticpuma said:

Imagine if they opened up a modding tool to allow maps to be created. Keep them on the modding forum and then the best could be incorporated into the game officially.

They already have In fact, the old tools they released a long time ago for RoF still work.

 

Don't underestimate how much work it is to create a map though.

[R33GZ]

On 8/24/2023 at 1:17 AM, BlitzPig_EL said:

If anyone remembers, which many of you seem not to, when the new project was first discussed by the devs, they said mostly piston aircraft, not only piston aircraft.

 

This does not rule out Korea in any way.  Italy, however, is right out.  This was indicated early on because of the complexity of the map.

No carriers....

[Monksilver]

On 8/23/2023 at 2:17 PM, BlitzPig_EL said:

If anyone remembers, which many of you seem not to, when the new project was first discussed by the devs, they said mostly piston aircraft, not only piston aircraft.

 

So piston aircraft and gliders then. Gliders were used in Burma in the Chindit operation .....

[Mysticpuma]

2 hours ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

They already have In fact, the old tools they released a long time ago for RoF still work.

 

Don't underestimate how much work it is to create a map though.

So not just reskinning maps, but actual height and elevation as well as shaping tools?

 

[AEthelraedUnraed]

1 hour ago, Mysticpuma said:

So not just reskinning maps, but actual height and elevation as well as shaping tools?

Yes I think I posted them somewhere already, but here is a quick proof-of-concept test of the Lapino map changed into a Malta map using just publicly available tools:

 

Note that the heightmaps are locked, so you can only see them in the Mission Editor. Attempting to load them in the game will result in an error (something about not having bought that map, which technically is true). For the in-game picture on the right, I used the default Lapino heightmaps, which works if you stay high enough but obviously at a low altitude it'll look messed up.

Edited August 26, 2023 by AEthelraedUnraed

[BlitzPig_EL]

4 hours ago, R33GZ said:

No carriers....

USMC Corsairs were operated from land bases in Korea, and if you were focusing solely on the USAF in Korea then you wouldn't need them.

[Juri_JS]

1 hour ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

Note that the heightmaps are locked, so you can only see them in the Mission Editor. Attempting to load them in the game will result in an error (something about not having bought that map, which technically is true). For the in-game picture on the right, I used the default Lapino heightmaps, which works if you stay high enough but obviously at a low altitude it'll look messed up.

You can create a compeletly new map with its own heightmap, for example from SRTM or ASTER elevation data, but you have to ask the devs to connect it with your account. Otherwise it's only visible in the mission editor but not usable in the game and the error message appears when you start a mission.

[Mysticpuma]

30 minutes ago, Juri_JS said:

You can create a compeletly new map with its own heightmap, for example from SRTM or ASTER elevation data, but you have to ask the devs to connect it with your account. Otherwise it's only visible in the mission editor but not usable in the game and the error message appears when you start a mission.

Interesting, so if a modder was interested, they could  create a Malta map but not play it, showcase it in the modding section or effectively be able to play it. 

 

I just wonder then if the devs. would consider enabling the possibility of importing a mod map into the modding section to let players test them with the chance of the devs importing the into the game at some point. 

[Juri_JS]

22 minutes ago, Mysticpuma said:

Interesting, so if a modder was interested, they could  create a Malta map but not play it, showcase it in the modding section or effectively be able to play it. 

 

I just wonder then if the devs. would consider enabling the possibility of importing a mod map into the modding section to let players test them with the chance of the devs importing the into the game at some point. 

If you really had a map project that's advanced enough for testing in the game, I am sure the devs would find a way to make it possible. In earlier phases of such a project it's easier to look for issues by using the mission editor.

 

The real problem is the amount of time it takes to build even a medium sized map. I don't think it can be done in a reasonable amount of time by a single modder who's only working on it in his free time. You will need to form a team of highly motivated people with different skills (Photoshop, GIS, 3D modelling, historic research, etc.). That's the reason why we haven't seen more community maps yet.

[Mysticpuma]

1 hour ago, Juri_JS said:

If you really had a map project that's advanced enough for testing in the game, I am sure the devs would find a way to make it possible. In earlier phases of such a project it's easier to look for issues by using the mission editor.

 

The real problem is the amount of time it takes to build even a medium sized map. I don't think it can be done in a reasonable amount of time by a single modder who's only working on it in his free time. You will need to form a team of highly motivated people with different skills (Photoshop, GIS, 3D modelling, historic research, etc.). That's the reason why we haven't seen more community maps yet.

Thanks for the clarity. 

I did wonder as there are obviously a lot of great modders and groups out there ?

[357th_KW]

4 hours ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

Yes I think I posted them somewhere already, but here is a quick proof-of-concept test of the Lapino map changed into a Malta map using just publicly available tools:

 

Note that the heightmaps are locked, so you can only see them in the Mission Editor. Attempting to load them in the game will result in an error (something about not having bought that map, which technically is true). For the in-game picture on the right, I used the default Lapino heightmaps, which works if you stay high enough but obviously at a low altitude it'll look messed up.

This is incredible!  What would it take to build this out as a community project?  I’d love to pitch in.  Malta is a great option for this, as it’s quite small, and you just need Malta and Gozo and a small chunk of Sicily to make something that would be playable.

[AEthelraedUnraed]

28 minutes ago, 357th_KW said:

What would it take to build this out as a community project?

Time, and plenty of it ?

 

- First, you (i.e. someone from the modding team) would need to do historic research. Find period maps, aerial photographs, find information about the airfields and the like. Decide on an exact date/timeframe, as all of the above may change as new airfields get built/expanded etc.

- Then, you need to get heightmaps. Make sure they are OK for commercial use. Decide on the exact size and coordinates for your map. Do the basic texturing, according to 800x800m tiles (it's what they use in IL2; I don't think this size is hardcoded).

- Next, draw water and forest maps according to the maps you found during the research phase.

- After that, you can draw villages, roads and railways and blend the tiles using surface files.

- Then it's only finetuning and contacting the Devs to "unlock" the heightmap.

 

Note that this is only enough for maps you can do with the assets already in game (such as a Smolensk map or something; you could reuse the BoS/BoM/BoK models and textures). For many other cases (like Malta) it will be necessary to also create additional 3d models.

 

(If there are experienced 3d modelers who are sure they can do some Malta buildings, I'm willing to help with/do a lot of the other stuff )

Edited August 26, 2023 by AEthelraedUnraed

[BlitzPig_EL]

Who is going to build the Gladiator, Cr42, Mc.200 and SM.79 models you will need?  Plus proper British ground assets and ship types?

Yes we can use existing stuff, and fudge it in, but, well, you know...

Edited August 26, 2023 by BlitzPig_EL

[R33GZ]

5 hours ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

USMC Corsairs were operated from land bases in Korea, and if you were focusing solely on the USAF in Korea then you wouldn't need them.

USN played a huge role in the Korean War. To try and make a module without them would be a waste of time

[AEthelraedUnraed]

31 minutes ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

Who is going to build the Gladiator, Cr42, Mc.200 and SM.79 models you will need?  Plus proper British ground assets and ship types?

Yes we can use existing stuff, and fudge it in, but, well, you know...

Well, we do have the aircraft to do a believable early 1942 scenario (the rather heavy fighting connected to the German bombing campaign). Hurricane Mk.II and Spitfire (Vb instead of Vc) vs. Bf-109F, MC.202, Ju-88, Ju-87 (also flown by Italy) and the occasional Bf-110 and He-111. If you leave out the Italian torpedo attacks (for which you'd need the SM.79), you can go all the way up to Operation Pedestal without many shortcuts needed, besides the Spitfire

 

Regarding ship types, well yes, you'd need to use the American destroyer. There's already a lot of British ground assets; not sure if they're correct for the period but I don't think that's as important as the closest I get to them is flying 100m overhead at 300kph.

Edited August 26, 2023 by AEthelraedUnraed

[357th_KW]

1 hour ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

Well, we do have the aircraft to do a believable early 1942 scenario (the rather heavy fighting connected to the German bombing campaign). Hurricane Mk.II and Spitfire (Vb instead of Vc) vs. Bf-109F, MC.202, Ju-88, Ju-87 (also flown by Italy) and the occasional Bf-110 and He-111. If you leave out the Italian torpedo attacks (for which you'd need the SM.79), you can go all the way up to Operation Pedestal without many shortcuts needed, besides the Spitfire

 

Regarding ship types, well yes, you'd need to use the American destroyer. There's already a lot of British ground assets; not sure if they're correct for the period but I don't think that's as important as the closest I get to them is flying 100m overhead at 300kph.

 

This exactly.  Battle of Bodenplatte released with no American bombers and no Typhoon (the most common RAF fighter bomber of the period).  We shouldn't refuse to play a scenario just because we don't have every possible plane or ground asset.

 

I'm working on some Malta themed mp scenarios right now using Kuban as a stand-in.  Having an actual Malta map would be a huge improvement, even if it wasn't perfect.

[DBFlyguy]

2 hours ago, R33GZ said:

USN played a huge role in the Korean War. To try and make a module without them would be a waste of time

There is enough USAF and UN action to not "need" the USN air operations for an early Korean War "Battle of".  It would be less interesting IMHO... but it is doable. 

 

I'm not convinced it is Korea for several reasons not worth going into but maybe we'll all know what this "new project" is before 2024... maybe?

[BlitzPig_EL]

Maybe a redo of 1946?  Late super props with a smattering of early jets.

[deathmisser]

On 8/15/2023 at 8:08 PM, CountZero said:

We have the airplanes, considering what little they said about next new project its clear they are avoiding anything Italy, so only way we gona get anything Italy map in this game is if players making Leningrad map decide to make it after they finish that, so in next 5 years maybe...

 

Its Korea ?

 

 

found the post that sums up what they said in that great last first live stream from last year:

"I think the frustration is due to the fact that they told us that they know what it is, they are already working on an aircraft for it.

 

And they teased a bunch of stuff for the next one.

 

A. Swimming pilots

B. No carries

C. Needs lot of resourses

D. it's not Italy

E. It's something new 

F. Piston engine themed

G. Little to no cities

H. Not in the Pacific

I. It was almost gonna be Malta if Jason had his way. 

J. They picked five theatres of war before deciding the final one. "

 

 

 

already 9 months pased LOL, maybe in a year time we gona get to see what they are working in secret all this time ?

 

Up for a late night stroll as I wanted to see how things have gone for the past few months. Surprisingly someone used my list ?

[Trooper117]

4 hours ago, DBFlyguy said:

but maybe we'll all know what this "new project" is before 2024...

 

I honestly don't really care anymore... I'll carry on with what we have, there is still fun to be had with some of the great SP campaigns out there, and if something arrives in the future that I like I'll buy into it, but I will not buy the new project just to 'support' them, those days are gone... there's an information desert out there, and they keep pouring more sand into it day after day, so the less I want to cross it...

[BraveSirRobin]

10 hours ago, Mysticpuma said:

Thanks for the clarity. 

I did wonder as there are obviously a lot of great modders and groups out there ?

Generally if you’re wondering why something hasn’t been done even though you are certain it would be extremely popular, it’s because that thing is far more difficult to do than you assumed.  

[[CPT]Crunch]

Difference in difficulty in doing something, as opposed to doing anything.

[Trooper117]

2 hours ago, Padda said:

I think Invasion of Italy would not be the best choice for new expansion.

 

They have already said they won't do Italy... unless of course they are telling porky's ?

[Heinzbaby]

1941-43 Channel Front

We're almost there - we have some of the aircraft and a map.

add the missions and pilot careers 

...make a good DLC

[SCG_Faerber]

Since Italy is off the table perhaps a North Africa expansion could be in the cards, specially after the 1C split.

Focusing on some earlier birds would be cool

Cr.42
SM79
Macchi 200
109-E4
Stuka B

x

Spit Mk. IIa
Martlet maybe
Wellington
Blenheim
Beaufighter ?

Would be perfect.

[Enceladus828]

We got Desert Wings-Tobruk for North Africa but that doesn’t exclude an El Alamein TC or a Battle of Tunisia installment.

[357th_KW]

Even just a couple collector aircraft would allow for some really fun Mediterranean themed missions.  The Macchi MC200 and MC205V should both be pretty doable since the 202 is already in the game.  And the MC200 actually saw fairly large scale use on the eastern front.

 

With the Spit F.IX on the way, the big missing pieces on the Allied side are a Spit Vc Trop, some later version P-40 (F/L, K etc - the K saw plenty of Soviet use as well) and an early P-38 (F or G).

 

The two Macchi's plus a late P-40 and an early P-38 would be a nice set of collectors.

[ITAF_Rani]

Yes Battle of Tunisia 1943( BOT), could be a nice theatre:

 

Mc 205

SM 79

Mc 200

Cr 42 ( or D.520? )

SM 81 ( Transport mission from Sicily to Tunisia)

 Vs

P 38 F

Spit Mk Vc 

Beaughfighter

Blenheim

P40 F  

 

A possible map could be

 

 

Edited August 30, 2023 by ITAF_Rani

[Sandinourcoffee6]

At the moment the only stand in for Malta is the Isle of Wight.The Isle of Wight is 1.2 times larger but Malta is much more densely populated.

yes it would be great to have  a Malta and Sicily map but it would be a huge task and take years to do