GPU / AI price increase scenario - recommendations as to IL-2 PC future build prep?

[puyo3]

[Moderator - please move my post to the appropriate topic if I missed posted this here; I did not see any subject heading clearly pertaining to this matter - p3]

 

As I related elsewhere, I am just re-entering the field of flight simm and am very much in a training phase, will be for some time I trust. I am plugging along with a marginal set-up while I gain experience and know-how both in game and all matters concerning the pc, gpu, cpu, etc. A 2060super gpu should give you some idea as to my borderline pc position at present, especially hoping to move into VR at low setting.

 

I'm not very tech savvy so bear with me - I recently watched an online gaming reviewer/tech persons channel on YT, the topic was the present unfolding AI demand for Nvidia et al high end GPU for AI, more accurately the resources used for gaming gpu being presently and increasingly devoted to or taken up by the very profitable vastly higher capacity/priced GPUs for the AI niche, hence a coming shortage of gaming based/priced GPUs. Along with many commenters in his video, it appears Nvidia is turning away [understandably so profit wise] from gaming level GPUs to the massively profitable AI exploding markets. So another covid like computer components drought may be approaching, and/or significant price hikes [?]

 

The question is should I purchase a GPU card I can find perhaps on sale now to avoid a potential shortage just when I am ready to commit to a new build in a year or so?  I understand [somewhat] that IL-2, DCS, and others use an older architecture that doesn't allow all the modern cp tech advances to be fully utilized, so I would only need to consider cpu/gpu set ups to allow me to fully utilize the present games pc performance capabilities  So which cpu/gpu  would be good choices to allow me to be able to play BOS at higher settings, with VR, into the coming years within the present architecture? Of course no one can predict with absolute certainty, but I would appreciate the knowledge base of this forums' members to advise me in this matter.

 

[I should state it is against my instincts to speculate purchase, hence my seeking the broader knowledge and experience of the BOS community for me to weigh in my decision]

 

Thanks for your time and any insights you can bring.

 

p3

 

 

Edited August 9, 2023 by puyo3
one final note for clarity...

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

If not using VR, then your choices are much easier. I currently run all my games with very good FPS (over 100, Even 200) on average with an AMD system. CPU is the still very good Ryzen 5800X3D and as GPU The Radeon RX 6950XT. With them using 64Gb of DDR4 at 3600MHz. AM4 socket is still going strong and a good X570 motherboard has all you need for gaming.

 

If you would use DDR5 and newer CPUs then the most bang for buck CPU is the AMD 7800X3D on the new AM5 socket. Again the motherboard is up to you what options you need and prefer. Choosing a GPU from newer models can be tedious, but again If you do not need raytracing then AMD has good offerings in the new 7000-series.

 

Going nVidia I would not settle on anything below 3080Ti or 4080 If wanting good performance with headroom. Intel has good processors as well, but their policy of new CPU requiring a new motherboard is just odd, to be polite. 

 

Again, If want to ready more I suggest warmly the site Guru3D. They test with games and other applications without being biased to any brand. Hope this helped.

Edited August 9, 2023 by LLv34_Flanker

[puyo3]

20 hours ago, LLv34_Flanker said:

S!

 

If not using VR, then your choices are much easier. I currently run all my games with very good FPS (over 100, Even 200) on average with an AMD system. CPU is the still very good Ryzen 5800X3D and as GPU The Radeon RX 6950XT. With them using 64Gb of DDR4 at 3600MHz. AM4 socket is still going strong and a good X570 motherboard has all you need for gaming.

 

If you would use DDR5 and newer CPUs then the most bang for buck CPU is the AMD 7800X3D on the new AM5 socket. Again the motherboard is up to you what options you need and prefer. Choosing a GPU from newer models can be tedious, but again If you do not need raytracing then AMD has good offerings in the new 7000-series.

 

Going nVidia I would not settle on anything below 3080Ti or 4080 If wanting good performance with headroom. Intel has good processors as well, but their policy of new CPU requiring a new motherboard is just odd, to be polite. 

 

Again, If want to ready more I suggest warmly the site Guru3D. They test with games and other applications without being biased to any brand. Hope this helped.

 

Thanks for the detailed info reply, I am not ready at the moment for any complete build per se [though I did ask for recommended hardware, so thanks for that], just wanted to know if anyone could validate or rebut the report I related above re a possible shortage of GPU in the coming year due to resources being diverted to an explosion of investment/developement in the AI world. The only component I am immediately concerned about is to purchase a GPU now to have the proverbial 'bird in hand', if in fact GPU prices will skyrocket and or supplies dry up.

I expect to go with VR, or would want the ability to have at least good performance in BOS/DCS [Is raytracing greatly important to these simms?]

 

I appreciate the AMD/Nvidia selections you recommended, I've heard good reports with these items, but just to know if there is any merit in the approaching AI tsunami assault on gaming GPU availability. 

 

So for anyone who happens upon this post, to boil down my query here, yes or no on a coming GPU shortage?    

 

Thanks for anyput.

 

p3

Edited August 10, 2023 by puyo3

[cardboard_killer]

Brevity = wit.

[LLv34_Flanker]

S!

 

I doubt there will be shortage of GPU like when cryptomining was hot. 

[Art-J]

That's a crystal-ball-level question.

 

Noone can validate or rebut these reports. Or should I say noone can predict a scale of impact on GPU availability in a year or two, even though there WILL be some impact for sure. We all have access to the same articles and videos, though, so your guess is as good as anyone elses.

 

Unlike crypto, the AI development is here to stay for long, but how fast it's going to start affecting standard (gaming) GPU prices - don't even think anyone can estimate that. The only thing one can do now is monitor the prices all the time and react accordingly.

 

Predicting with flight sims in mind is even more futile activity:

a) Current Il-2GB iteration - everything so far shows its core development ended for good, so performance is going to stay where it is. Plenty of reference data available from guys playing it on 2D and VR;

b) Upcoming new project from 1C guys - nobody but devs knows anything about it, so can't plan GPU purchase for it;

c) Current iteration of DCS - it's still optimization mess and requires brute-forcing through performance issues, especially when going VR. Buy the strongest GPU you can afford now, still rely on compromise gfx settings. Find the sweet spot and enjoy it... until next update chops another few percent of fps and you have to tweak again;

d) Upcoming iterations of DCS - multithreading preview version is still a shamble, nobody knows when it's going to be considered "mature enough" by ED and replace the old exec. We know Vulkan and DLSS are coming, but they've been coming for years and thus can arrive anywhere between now and 2030. Even when they do, who knows how they'll affect performance and quality (no, X-Plane comparisons are not relevant).

 

P.S. - none of aforementioned sims use raytracing. Only MSFS does, to some extent.

 

Edited August 10, 2023 by Art-J

[puyo3]

On 8/10/2023 at 7:19 AM, Art-J said:

That's a crystal-ball-level question.

 

Noone can validate or rebut these reports. Or should I say noone can predict a scale of impact on GPU availability in a year or two, even though there WILL be some impact for sure. We all have access to the same articles and videos, though, so your guess is as good as anyone elses.

 

Unlike crypto, the AI development is here to stay for long, but how fast it's going to start affecting standard (gaming) GPU prices - don't even think anyone can estimate that. The only thing one can do now is monitor the prices all the time and react accordingly.

 

Predicting with flight sims in mind is even more futile activity:

a) Current Il-2GB iteration - everything so far shows its core development ended for good, so performance is going to stay where it is. Plenty of reference data available from guys playing it on 2D and VR;

b) Upcoming new project from 1C guys - nobody but devs knows anything about it, so can't plan GPU purchase for it;

c) Current iteration of DCS - it's still optimization mess and requires brute-forcing through performance issues, especially when going VR. Buy the strongest GPU you can afford now, still rely on compromise gfx settings. Find the sweet spot and enjoy it... until next update chops another few percent of fps and you have to tweak again;

d) Upcoming iterations of DCS - multithreading preview version is still a shamble, nobody knows when it's going to be considered "mature enough" by ED and replace the old exec. We know Vulkan and DLSS are coming, but they've been coming for years and thus can arrive anywhere between now and 2030. Even when they do, who knows how they'll affect performance and quality (no, X-Plane comparisons are not relevant).

 

P.S. - none of aforementioned sims use raytracing. Only MSFS does, to some extent.

 

 

Thanks much for laying things out. Agreed re no way of knowing, it was just the immediate market impact I was concerned with, as the online gaming channel source I was referencing seemed to indicate an imminent event. Many of his commenters were of making purchases anticipating this apocalypse, so I wanted to run it by BOS knowledge base to weigh in, so thanks again, much appreciated.

p3

On 8/10/2023 at 2:02 AM, cardboard_killer said:

Brevity = wit.

Understood, will work on that.

 

p3

[RossMarBow]

On 8/9/2023 at 1:49 PM, puyo3 said:

[Moderator - please move my post to the appropriate topic if I missed posted this here; I did not see any subject heading clearly pertaining to this matter - p3]

 

As I related elsewhere, I am just re-entering the field of flight simm and am very much in a training phase, will be for some time I trust. I am plugging along with a marginal set-up while I gain experience and know-how both in game and all matters concerning the pc, gpu, cpu, etc. A 2060super gpu should give you some idea as to my borderline pc position at present, especially hoping to move into VR at low setting.

 

I'm not very tech savvy so bear with me - I recently watched an online gaming reviewer/tech persons channel on YT, the topic was the present unfolding AI demand for Nvidia et al high end GPU for AI, more accurately the resources used for gaming gpu being presently and increasingly devoted to or taken up by the very profitable vastly higher capacity/priced GPUs for the AI niche, hence a coming shortage of gaming based/priced GPUs. Along with many commenters in his video, it appears Nvidia is turning away [understandably so profit wise] from gaming level GPUs to the massively profitable AI exploding markets. So another covid like computer components drought may be approaching, and/or significant price hikes [?]

 

The question is should I purchase a GPU card I can find perhaps on sale now to avoid a potential shortage just when I am ready to commit to a new build in a year or so?  I understand [somewhat] that IL-2, DCS, and others use an older architecture that doesn't allow all the modern cp tech advances to be fully utilized, so I would only need to consider cpu/gpu set ups to allow me to fully utilize the present games pc performance capabilities  So which cpu/gpu  would be good choices to allow me to be able to play BOS at higher settings, with VR, into the coming years within the present architecture? Of course no one can predict with absolute certainty, but I would appreciate the knowledge base of this forums' members to advise me in this matter.

 

[I should state it is against my instincts to speculate purchase, hence my seeking the broader knowledge and experience of the BOS community for me to weigh in my decision]

 

Thanks for your time and any insights you can bring.

 

p3

 

 

 

No GPU prices are only trending down

 

AI isn't gonna do much, gaming cards can't do AI work by design 
this is completely different to what happened with crypto/supply shortages

 

Buy a second hand 3080 or 3080 ti - if you put some effort into it you can buy a card still under warranty from a place like ebay
Its the best deal around at the moment

All the current gen cards are a awful deal and are just designed to get old stock moving

 

With AMD and Nvidia making most of their money sell to server companies, and Intel only starting to make GPUs 
gaming cards are just an afterthought 

 

 

Also just to reinforce a point 
IL-2  and DCS are CPU limited
to explain further
even with a 4090 you will not get good fps unless you have a CPU that has good single core performance
I'm going to guess that your CPU is slowing you down more than your 2060s
I run a 5700xt myself which is very similar in performance to a 2060s and I'm CPU limited running a full oc'd 5600x

Edited September 17, 2023 by RossMarBow