Sopwith Camel "invisible" fuel level

[greybeard_52]

[Zooropa_Fly]

You could never see that thing properly in RoF either.

Best bet is a quick flash of the HUD if you need to.

 

S!

[LukeFF]

Not a bug - you just have to move your head around to see where the top of the fuel level is.

[RNAS10_Mitchell]

It's not a bug, just a poor representation.  Would be nice if they could revise it.  And I don't mean it's placement in the cockpit.  I mean it's fuel load representation.  Can be difficult to actually see how much fuel us in the tube regardless of viewing angle.  And it seem to go from completely full, to almost empty in minutes.

Edited July 8, 2023 by RNAS10_Mitchell

[US41_Winslow]

The fuel gauge does not work through most of its range.  It shows that the tank is full until about half the fuel is used and indicates that it is empty when about 1/4 is left.

[LukeFF]

3 hours ago, US41_Winslow said:

The fuel gauge does not work through most of its range.  It shows that the tank is full until about half the fuel is used and indicates that it is empty when about 1/4 is left.

 

I'll pass the report up the chain. 

[czech693]

Discussed before.  I don't agree with the synopsis.  I think it is a fuel flow gauge since it doesn't decrease with fuel consumption.  In my opinion it shows that the pressurized lower fuel tanks is flowing to the upper tank (important information for the pilot).  Once fuel is exhausted in the lower tank it would only take a few seconds for the air pressure to push the remaining fuel in the tube out, at which point you would know that you only have the upper tank remaining.  If it were showing the fuel level in the lower tank the level in the tube would go down gradually.  Kermit's video of the Snipe is not equivalent.  The Snipe has a upper fuel tank in front of the cockpit and that fuel gauge can be direct reading much like a Model T or Model A vehicle.

 

Edited July 8, 2023 by czech693
spelling

[US41_Winslow]

2 hours ago, czech693 said:

In my opinion it shows that the pressurized lower fuel tanks is flowing to the upper tank (important information for the pilot).  Once fuel is exhausted in the lower tank it would only take a few seconds for the air pressure to push the remaining fuel in the tube out, at which point you would know that you only have the upper tank remaining.

The tube definitely indicates the amount of fuel left to some extent.  When the fuel level is in a certain range, it does give a reading other than full or empty.  After reading through the thread you linked, the conclusion it comes to seems believable.  By the way, the air pressure gauge on the lower right of the instrument panel indicates the pressure in the main tank.

[czech693]

I took the Camel up with 50 liters.  Tube was empty.  Took it up with 60 liters (about 13 imperial gallons total).  Bottom pressurized tank holds about 30 imp. gallons and top gravity tank holds about 7 gallons.  So, since bottom tank is under pressure it feeds the top tank and the top tank stays full until it empties.  Therefore, bottom tank would have had 6 gallons to start with.  Tube was showing full with only 6 gallons in the bottom tank.

 

Ran it at full throttle.  Just under 2 minutes the level in the tube dropped to 2/3's.  After about 2 more minutes it dropped to 1/3.  Another 2 minutes and it was about 1/10.  A minute later it was empty and the engine still running.  Took about 7 minutes to empty the fuel out of the bottom tank.  So, the tube isn't showing the remaining amount in the botltom tank, only that tank is sending fuel to the top tank.  So once you see it going down it means you're near the last few gallons in that tank, but when it's full you have no idea how many gallons in the bottom tank.

 

Yes, I'm aware of the air pressure gauge.  The pressure gauge is showing that there is air pressure coming from the pump on the strut.   However, the pump could be providing adequate pressure but if there is no fuel in the tube, your bottom tank is empty, or there has been a malfunction like a broken or clogged fuel line.  Either way you would have to assume you only have what's in the top tank and that's only going to get you ten miles or so.

 

So, you're right.  It does show the fuel amount to some extent.  Basically, it's telling you that the bottom tank is just about empty.

Edited July 9, 2023 by czech693

[TG-55Panthercules]

15 hours ago, czech693 said:

 Bottom pressurized tank holds about 30 imp. gallons and top gravity tank holds about 7 gallons.  So, since bottom tank is under pressure it feeds the top tank and the top tank stays full until it empties.  [At some point] you only have what's in the top tank and that's only going to get you ten miles or so.

 

Something seems a bit off with these numbers. Is there another, larger tank in the Camel that hasn't been mentioned yet, or does the plane really only carry a total of 37 gallons?  If the upper tank holds about 7 gallons and that really only gets you 10 miles, then the Camel would only be able to go about 52 miles and stay aloft maybe 30-40 minutes?  Doesn't seem right.

[czech693]

I got those capacities from another site, but the IL-2 technical spec's say 168 L, which is 37 imperial gallons.  The Bristol is considered to have a huge amount of fuel and it holds 170 L.  I meant to say 10 minutes not 10 miles, which was a WAG on my part since I burnt up 6 gallons in 6-7 minutes at full throttle, I figured the 7 gallons in the top tank could probably last 10 minutes if you throttled back to 90 mph or so.  37 gallons would go a lot further at a cruise setting.  I'm sure someone has all the fuel consumption numbers. I didn't want to enter that arena and have a bunch of comments.  Past threads seem to agree that 50 L is enough for one hour of flight at a cruise setting.

 

My point is that I believe that the fuel in the tube is the flow to the top tank, and when you see it going down it is the last bit of fuel from the lower tank, which is why it doesn't move most of the time, and then goes down relatively quickly.  I don't believe it shows the lower tank capacity.

[greybeard_52]

Thank you all for the abundance of replies, which have progressively focused the topic.
I too had noticed during my tests a very low fuel level, disproportionate to the amount put in the tank, but I thought I was mistaken. Now, putting together what you have highlighted with the fact that I clearly see two fuel caps behind the cockpit, one marked for gravity and the other for pressure, everything is clear. I never imagined such a system! Even less did I know it! I love learning these things from simulators!

Edited July 10, 2023 by greybeard_52