Pico 4 User Experience

[Qcumber]

On 12/14/2023 at 1:48 AM, Sabrefly said:

I should note that the stock IL-2's openvr_api.dll works seamlessly with VDXR runtime and the OpenXR in-game settings. However, I need to verify whether it is compatible with XRNeckSafer. This compatibility is the only potential reason I might choose not to use it

I can run VDXR from the steam version of IL-2 by using the open composite switcher and OXRTK and XRNS work fine. No need for per game install. 

[Sabrefly]

On 12/10/2023 at 11:03 AM, Koziolek said:

I use a powered USB cable for battery charging, switch on Pico, run cmd command and connect

 

 

Gnirehtet is something I found online why looking for a stable connection for pico

here is more explanation then I can do

 

GitHub - Genymobile/gnirehtet: Gnirehtet provides reverse tethering for Android

 

 

 

I connect my Pico 4 to a powered USB/Ethernet adapter using a USB-C cable (male/male). This adapter then connects to an Ethernet switch, which is also linked to my PC. I wonder, is the performance of my connection the same as yours?

Edited December 17, 2023 by Sabrefly

[Koziolek]

I used both methods. Did not see any difference. I have stable 1200 Mb in both of them

[Russkly]

Anyone noticed that, following today's Il2 GB update, you need to replace the stock openvr_api.dll's again in order to access OXRTK, or at least I had to?

 

Default openvr_api.dll's led me through SteamVR, which, even though it's now OpenXR runtime, isn't as good as when using OXRTK.

 

Also I can no longer find the  openvr_api.dll's on the OXRTK website.

 

I had saved them previously, but I could foresee that this could cause problems for some.

 

[DBCOOPER011]

Anyone have any ideas on how to better tweak the settings on this thing? I'm running it on a 4070/12600KF computer with Opencomposite/OpenXR on a Pico 4. If i use any MSAA it will bump me into reprojection, which I'm trying to avoid. Is H.264+ or HEVC 10 bit preferable? Any tips appreciated..

 

[nosscar]

Pico 4 is well known for the really bad facial interface,  get this one instead, is really comfortable, i wear it all day with no discomfort, also cures the light from the sides

[Charger_]

On 12/23/2023 at 2:20 AM, DBCOOPER011 said:

Anyone have any ideas on how to better tweak the settings on this thing? I'm running it on a 4070/12600KF computer with Opencomposite/OpenXR on a Pico 4. If i use any MSAA it will bump me into reprojection, which I'm trying to avoid. Is H.264+ or HEVC 10 bit preferable? Any tips appreciated..

 

Here are my settings i posted for someone else. Try these. Not it has SSW turned off) https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/86858-pico4-what-is-the-best-graphic-quality-settings/

 

[chiliwili69]

On 12/22/2023 at 5:20 PM, DBCOOPER011 said:

Is H.264+ or HEVC 10 bit preferable? Any tips appreciated..

 

I made some questions to ggodin in reddit when I had the Pico4. At that time I resolved to use HEVC but I didn´t tested myself the pros/cons of each. I just took the advice from him.

 

 

 

But it looks your frametimes are quite good. BTW, What is this Overlay you use for it?

[Russkly]

40 minutes ago, chiliwili69 said:

 

I made some questions to ggodin in reddit when I had the Pico4. At that time I resolved to use HEVC but I didn´t tested myself the pros/cons of each. I just took the advice from him.

 

 

 

But it looks your frametimes are quite good. BTW, What is this Overlay you use for it?

 

I think that's the 'Advanced Overlay' in the OXRTK.

 

I've been switching between HEVC 10-bit and 264+ for months now, and I can't really tell the difference.

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

On 12/22/2023 at 11:20 AM, DBCOOPER011 said:

Anyone have any ideas on how to better tweak the settings on this thing? I'm running it on a 4070/12600KF computer with Opencomposite/OpenXR on a Pico 4. If i use any MSAA it will bump me into reprojection, which I'm trying to avoid. Is H.264+ or HEVC 10 bit preferable? Any tips appreciated..

 

How do you find the Pico 4 vs the G2? 

[DBCOOPER011]

On 1/19/2024 at 3:11 AM, drewm3i-VR said:

How do you find the Pico 4 vs the G2? 

 

I'd probably vote for the Pico 4. G2 is getting outdated and has a small sweet spot. Pico 4 has a big sweet spot, great binocular overlap, but still has compression artifacts due to the lack of displayport..

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

12 hours ago, DBCOOPER011 said:

 

I'd probably vote for the Pico 4. G2 is getting outdated and has a small sweet spot. Pico 4 has a big sweet spot, great binocular overlap, but still has compression artifacts due to the lack of displayport..

Gotcha, I just don't think we're going to be seeing DP headsets anymore, except ones that are $1,500 and up. I think I'm going to pick up the Pico 4 for cheap and try it out. For me, it's also about streamlining my setup and getting something more reliable, smaller, and with a less troublesome cable. Tired of lugging a huge rig, stick, pedals, hotas, and g2 around...

12 hours ago, DBCOOPER011 said:

 

I'd probably vote for the Pico 4. G2 is getting outdated and has a small sweet spot. Pico 4 has a big sweet spot, great binocular overlap, but still has compression artifacts due to the lack of displayport..

Did you try tweaking settings in Pico Link like the bitrates and what not?

Edited January 21, 2024 by drewm3i-VR

[simfan2015]

I am 100% happy with my PICO 4 for IL-2 Sturmovik !

I fully agree with @nosscar the AMVR interface is the one everyone should check-out.

Disclaimer : some people complain the AMVR interface is not better than the original, but this depends on whether people wear glasses and shape of their heads. There seems to be no "one-fits-all" in regard to HMD ... that applies also to that new Apple HMD  .... you need custom face-scans for it too.

I ordered the AMVR interface from Amazon, knowing I could always get a refund (just in case).

Also, check whether it will be sent from China or ... a shop near you.

I ordered for the AMVR interface for PICO 4 with a 1-day delivery.

Get the "Virtual Desktop" App as well from the PICO store ... it is worth far more than the 20 USD/EUR you have to pay for it.

IMHO The pico 4 is far too cheap for what it gets us !

Edited January 21, 2024 by simfan2015

[DBCOOPER011]

Just tried the new Pico 4 firmware with the new Pico connect app and got good results. Took runway screenshots at 3820X3820 resolution using Pico connect, SteamVR with VD, and OpenXR with VD. Used the new VD update that recently came out and was using wireless. Screenshots below and it appears there is much less latency using the Pico connect. I also got a little bit better FPS for some reason. 

 

 

[ACG_TBird]

Very interesting.... I assume that Pico Connect is still in closed beta, as I can't find it on the Pico website?

[DBCOOPER011]

30 minutes ago, ACG_TBird said:

Very interesting.... I assume that Pico Connect is still in closed beta, as I can't find it on the Pico website?

 I side loaded it with info from the post below. I believe some people report being able to update though..

 

[ACG_TBird]

Thanks - think I'll wait for the official release, though. VD is currently working very well for me.

[Charger_]

Thats encouraging! Any gain is a good gain. I might just hold off until the Pico update is officially released.

 

Was there any improvement in ghosting?

Edited February 1, 2024 by Charger_

[DBCOOPER011]

 

2 hours ago, Charger_ said:

Thats encouraging! Any gain is a good gain. I might just hold off until the Pico update is officially released.

 

Was there any improvement in ghosting?

 

Not a real resident expert on the pico 4, but I didnt notice any ghosting, just normal compression artifacts that VD has as well. They only downside is that you have to use steamvr. No VDXR setting like in VD..

[ACG_TBird]

On 1/1/2024 at 6:30 PM, nosscar said:

Pico 4 is well known for the really bad facial interface,  get this one instead, is really comfortable, i wear it all day with no discomfort, also cures the light from the sides

 

Completely agree re. the AMVR faceplate. The original one wasn't that uncomfortable for me, but this one is so much better.

 

I've coupled it with the KKCOBVR battery - currently less than half the price of the BOBOVR version and more power - which gives me 4+ hours if I need it.

 

 

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

On 1/31/2024 at 6:14 PM, DBCOOPER011 said:

Just tried the new Pico 4 firmware with the new Pico connect app and got good results. Took runway screenshots at 3820X3820 resolution using Pico connect, SteamVR with VD, and OpenXR with VD. Used the new VD update that recently came out and was using wireless. Screenshots below and it appears there is much less latency using the Pico connect. I also got a little bit better FPS for some reason. 

 

 

Is this wireless or with a cable? I am eyeing the Pico 4 to replace my G2 as the small sweet spot is causing me neck pain due to so many head vs. eye movements. It's either that or the Quest 3.

[DBCOOPER011]

1 hour ago, drewm3i-VR said:

Is this wireless or with a cable? I am eyeing the Pico 4 to replace my G2 as the small sweet spot is causing me neck pain due to so many head vs. eye movements. It's either that or the Quest 3.

 

It was on wireless. I tried it with a USB-C cable and got the same results. Pico 4 is a good headset IMO, has pretty good FOV overall, decent resolution, and really good binocular overlap. I haven't tried the Q3 yet, but hear really good reviews on it as well...

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

3 hours ago, DBCOOPER011 said:

 

It was on wireless. I tried it with a USB-C cable and got the same results. Pico 4 is a good headset IMO, has pretty good FOV overall, decent resolution, and really good binocular overlap. I haven't tried the Q3 yet, but hear really good reviews on it as well...

How is the performance vs a G2 at 1.0 resolution? If I understand correctly, the render resolution of the Pico 4 is much lower than the G2 but it does have compression artifacts supposedly. I'm really torn between the two (Quest 3). I tried the Quest 3 before and had mixed results. I am going to be getting a new PC though and will have a 4090 laptop so it will be very powerful and basically a 4080 desktop. I ended up going back to the G2, but I just can't handle the limited sweet spot anymore because I'm constantly moving my head online for hours and it's just hurting my performance and neck (despite having a swivel chair). As a last ditch effort, I was going to try a new facial interface. Wish there was a decent, affordable PC VR solution with modern optics and resolution...I miss my Rift S. I really don't want wifi/bluetooth signals by my skull for hours on end. I know these can be turned off though.

 

 

Edited February 3, 2024 by drewm3i-VR

[DBCOOPER011]

8 hours ago, =DW=_Drewm3i-VR said:

How is the performance vs a G2 at 1.0 resolution? If I understand correctly, the render resolution of the Pico 4 is much lower than the G2 but it does have compression artifacts supposedly. I'm really torn between the two (Quest 3). I tried the Quest 3 before and had mixed results. I am going to be getting a new PC though and will have a 4090 laptop so it will be very powerful and basically a 4080 desktop. I ended up going back to the G2, but I just can't handle the limited sweet spot anymore because I'm constantly moving my head online for hours and it's just hurting my performance and neck (despite having a swivel chair). As a last ditch effort, I was going to try a new facial interface. Wish there was a decent, affordable PC VR solution with modern optics and resolution...I miss my Rift S. I really don't want wifi/bluetooth signals by my skull for hours on end. I know these can be turned off though.

 

 

 

I use my Pimax Crystal primarily now for flight simming as my G2 is boxed up. But if I recall correctly, the Pico 4 has about the same or a little bit better performance then the G2, and has a much bigger sweet spot. I think all 3 headsets (G2, Pico 4, Q3) have about the same render resolution at/or around 2160 per eye, except with the G2 having fresnel lenses and the others having pancake. The Pico is an awesome headset and it would be the best IMO if it had a DP connection. The only negative I found for it is the compression artifacts. They are there no matter how high I bump the resolution up, although I only really notice it in sim type applications. A lot of other games the Pico 4 is perfect.

[ACG_TBird]

36 minutes ago, DBCOOPER011 said:

 

I use my Pimax Crystal primarily now for flight simming as my G2 is boxed up. But if I recall correctly, the Pico 4 has about the same or a little bit better performance then the G2, and has a much bigger sweet spot. I think all 3 headsets (G2, Pico 4, Q3) have about the same render resolution at/or around 2160 per eye, except with the G2 having fresnel lenses and the others having pancake. The Pico is an awesome headset and it would be the best IMO if it had a DP connection. The only negative I found for it is the compression artifacts. They are there no matter how high I bump the resolution up, although I only really notice it in sim type applications. A lot of other games the Pico 4 is perfect.

 

Given a good enough WiFi 6 connection, I wonder if the degree of compression artefacting in the Pico 4 is affected by the power of the GPU / CPU? No noticeable compression here on a 4090 and 13900K

[DBCOOPER011]

11 minutes ago, ACG_TBird said:

 

Given a good enough WiFi 6 connection, I wonder if the degree of compression artefacting in the Pico 4 is affected by the power of the GPU / CPU? No noticeable compression here on a 4090 and 13900K

 

I have a 7800X3D/4090/Wifi 6 setup and notice it primarily on far distant objects and on the horizon. I can definitely notice it coming from a DP headset to one that that doesn't have DP. Its hard to notice in non sim games though.

 

 

[ACG_TBird]

Perhaps I'm just lucky... or my eyesight is too poor to see it!

 

I would love to see a new consumer priced headset with DP, but I don't think that's going to happen. To me, the Pico 4 is a big step up from the Q2 I had before, which in turn was a massive leap from the wired Rift S I used to use.

 

And in the UK, the Pico 4 can often be found new and sealed on Ebay for the bargain price of £250-275! I picked up a second one for £230 in case anything happens to the one I'm using, as I can't see me switching to another headset any time soon.

[Charger_]

What i refer to as "ghosting" is the graphical anomoly of where an obect moves across the screen and its not smooth - it leaves a trail like effect. 

 

In the Pico 4 (wireless wifi 6 / 4080 / 5800x3d) i get this when another aircraft passes close by going in a different direction. Its the only time i see it.

 

Im not sure if that is called "compression artifacts" 

[DBCOOPER011]

3 hours ago, Charger_ said:

What i refer to as "ghosting" is the graphical anomoly of where an obect moves across the screen and its not smooth - it leaves a trail like effect. 

 

In the Pico 4 (wireless wifi 6 / 4080 / 5800x3d) i get this when another aircraft passes close by going in a different direction. Its the only time i see it.

 

Im not sure if that is called "compression artifacts" 

 

I guess ghosting could be reference to chromatic aberration, kind of the doubling of the same colored image. What I see in the pico is more of graphical pixelation or graininess of the image. I can up the resolution and antialiasing to the extremes and still see the pixelation, mainly at distance. Its a night and day difference with my crystal, or with the G2 in the sweet spot, then with my pico. Other then sim games, its perfect. I guess it is what it is though..

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

1 hour ago, DBCOOPER011 said:

 

I guess ghosting could be reference to chromatic aberration, kind of the doubling of the same colored image. What I see in the pico is more of graphical pixelation or graininess of the image. I can up the resolution and antialiasing to the extremes and still see the pixelation, mainly at distance. Its a night and day difference with my crystal, or with the G2 in the sweet spot, then with my pico. Other then sim games, its perfect. I guess it is what it is though..

Yeah, this shimmering/aliasing of the distant horizon is what put me off the Quest 3. The G2 has some too (it's also an IL-2 problem), but it's 100% better. The Quest 3 was so distracting. It sounds like the Pico is similar.

 

Also, thanks so much for your input and testing...I find your information invaluable, along with Chiliwili's and others. It's so hard to make a decision without having a month to play with different headsets and all of the settings and accessories required  to get the most of them. The G2 is so much better for plug and play.

Edited February 4, 2024 by =DW=_Drewm3i-VR

[ACG_TBird]

I did get shimmering on the horizon, but largely solved that by using Nvidia Inspector to change the negative mipmap bias to a negative number, such as -0.3.

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

3 hours ago, ACG_TBird said:

I did get shimmering on the horizon, but largely solved that by using Nvidia Inspector to change the negative mipmap bias to a negative number, such as -0.3.

Now this is an interesting tweak. Any other recommended tweaks?

[ACG_TBird]

Can't claim credit for it (see thread below), but it worked wonders for me in conjunction with the blurred landscape filter

 

 

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

22 hours ago, ACG_TBird said:

Can't claim credit for it (see thread below), but it worked wonders for me in conjunction with the blurred landscape filter

 

 

So i tried -1, -.5, and -.25 and it seemed to make it worse. The -.25 was the best with my Reverb G2. Not sure why it seemed to have made aliasing worse?

[ACG_TBird]

Can only answer for my Pico 4, I'm afraid

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

4 hours ago, ACG_TBird said:

Can only answer for my Pico 4, I'm afraid

I guess I'm just trying to understand what negative LOD bias is and why it helps in some cases.

[simfan2015]

Was anyone successful running DCS with the new Pico Connect BETA software in PICO OS 5.9.x ?

DCS works fine in VR using Virtual Desktop but I can't play DCS in VR using PICO Connect. 

Using the new BETA PICO Connect software 10.0.x though DCS either hangs or starts DCS in 2D.

I am using DCS as well as IL-2 Sturmovic 's standalone versions bought on the respective websites (not Steam).

I would love to get DCS and IL-2 running with PICO Connect to compare visuals and performance.

Thanks for your input. 

[Blitzen]

Is buying the Virtual desktop worth it ? I am having endless problems trying to get the headset and PC to connect. I think I've tried all the downloadable Pico apps including the newest 'Business Streaming" one but thus far haven't really gotten close ,wirelessly,even with the Steam Pico link.I am so ready to re-package it all and send to back...I hate to throw money at the "desktop" but will if it makes a difference.

openxr discord app?

[Panzerlang]

6 hours ago, Blitzen said:

Is buying the Virtual desktop worth it ? I am having endless problems trying to get the headset and PC to connect. I think I've tried all the downloadable Pico apps including the newest 'Business Streaming" one but thus far haven't really gotten close ,wirelessly,even with the Steam Pico link.I am so ready to re-package it all and send to back...I hate to throw money at the "desktop" but will if it makes a difference.

openxr discord app?

The Virtual Desktop app was far superior to Pico's own bit of cack, I think the Pico one limited the resolution in some kind of fubar way. I also found the wireless function to be very sub-par and went for the direct lan-cable to router route. Lol. Once I had that sorted (and it was a bit of a struggle) I found the Pico to be like a G2 on steroids and am still seriously considering dumping the Crystal and going back to it.

If it helps...you have to buy the extra bits of course but so worth it.

[ACG_TBird]

Second the recommendation for Virtual Desktop. Far, far better than Pico's Streaming Assistant, athough there's some anecdotal evidence that the Pico Connect beta may be even better for Il-2. I'm not a fan of Steam VR, though.

 

Strangely, I couldn't get the ethernet connection method to work at all. However, I now have a small, dedicated WiFi router just for the Pico and about 2m metres away, and the connection is great. Pretty much everything maxed (on a 4090) and fps never drops below 72.