Lets make this game even better/realistic...

[Crious]

Hi,

I am playing this game quite enough time to have a view about positives and cons. Generally is a very good game. I enjoy almost every minute i put on it. I will not mention the countless features i like in the game. My time is valuable and other reader's too. So i ll concentrate to the things i think it could be better

First and foremost i have to admit that dogfighting is not my preferred type of engagement and why it should be?

I like most sneaky attacs from enemys below six. But there is a problem.

Opponents almost always can hear me even if i am 100m behind them which is a bit unrealistic.

Anyone who have fly a small aircraft knows that it is almost impossible to hear his instractor with out a head set due to aircrafts own engine noise.

In addition to that American p 51 pilots have testaments that they couldn't hear even the noise of their firing .50 cals. guns.

My proposal is to reduse the distance where the ambushed pilot can hear to less than 20 meters if his engine is in any settings above idle. This way sneaky attacks would be possible and more realistic.

Secondly i would like to refer in a scenery which is happening more often lately. Two weeks ago i had a fight in my fw 190 with a p 51 . I suffered a pk but thats not what i am complaining for. I was almost sure that i didn't gave my Opponent the opportunity to fire shooting the profile of the aircraft. He was shooting almost by my six o'clock.  I didnt here bullets hitting the aircraft. I only got a pk. I was almost sure that there was only one bullet hitting me ( the pilot) and nothing else. Finnish log confirmed an even worse assumption.  The bullets were not one but TWO directly to the pilot. No bullets to the aircraft. Some how pilot operated like a magnet for them. Is there something wrong?

With respect to il2 great battles team

Best regards 

335th_GRAlbatros

Edited October 28, 2022 by 335th_GRAlbatros74

[coreyhkh]

Good points

[Avimimus]

 

I agree with your first point about AI being too reliable at spotting threats (I almost wrote good, but the fact is that they should sometimes be this good - just be a bit more imperfect due to looking in the wrong direction, fatigue, target fixation etc.) I'm not sure if it is entirely due to sound though.

 

 

8 hours ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Secondly i would like to refer in a scenery which is happening more often lately. Two weeks ago i had a fight in my fw 190 with a p 51 . I suffered a pk but thats not what i am complaining for. I was almost sure that i didn't gave my Opponent the opportunity to fire shooting the profile of the aircraft. He was shooting almost by my six o'clock.  I didnt here bullets hitting the aircraft. I only got a pk. I was almost sure that there was only one bullet hitting me ( the pilot) and nothing else. Finnish log confirmed an even worse assumption.  The bullets were not one but TWO directly to the pilot. No bullets to the aircraft. Some how pilot operated like a magnet for them. Is there something wrong?

 

The sim models bullet penetration (e.g. a high velocity AP round from a 37mm Sh-37 can travel the length of a bomber and kill the pilot). It also models fragmentation from high explosive rounds (e.g. a round can land near the pilot and the pilot can be hit by the fragments).

 

I'm tempted to suspect that you simply had bad luck - that the 0.50 cal burst happened to hit your pilot. IMHO, IRL the squishy bits are often more vulnerable to damage then the steel of the aircraft is.

[SCG_motoadve]

8 hours ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Secondly i would like to refer in a scenery which is happening more often lately. Two weeks ago i had a fight in my fw 190 with a p 51 . I suffered a pk but thats not what i am complaining for. I was almost sure that i didn't gave my Opponent the opportunity to fire shooting the profile of the aircraft. He was shooting almost by my six o'clock.  I didnt here bullets hitting the aircraft. I only got a pk. I was almost sure that there was only one bullet hitting me ( the pilot) and nothing else. Finnish log confirmed an even worse assumption.  The bullets were not one but TWO directly to the pilot. No bullets to the aircraft. Some how pilot operated like a magnet for them. Is there something wrong?

With respect to il2 great battles team

This is happening way to often and really ruining this simulator, all the DM is useless since we get one bullet pilots kills all the time, and usually the first bullet.

[[CPT]Crunch]

The air mounted fifty cal's have a charted drop of 16 inches out to 1000 feet, not surprising your getting noggin knocked at the maximum effective ranges.  They're not passing through the airframe at distance, just the brain bucket, learn to respect them.

 

If your flying a lot of German lately you should take note most of the .50's are impacting the upper and even forward surfaces of your wings with the new detailed hit modeling.  There's quite an arch to them.

[DD_Arthur]

45 minutes ago, Avimimus said:

 

I agree with your first point about AI being too reliable at spotting threats (I almost wrote good, but the fact is that they should sometimes be this good - just be a bit more imperfect due to looking in the wrong direction, fatigue, target fixation etc.) I'm not sure if it is entirely due to sound though.

He’s talking about ‘sound radar’ in multiplayer.

You can hear an enemy approach. It needs fixing.

[Crious]

19 minutes ago, [CPT]Crunch said:

The air mounted fifty cal's have a charted drop of 16 inches out to 1000 feet, not surprising your getting noggin knocked at the maximum effective ranges.  They're not passing through the airframe at distance, just the brain bucket, learn to respect them.

 

If your flying a lot of German lately you should take note most of the .50's are impacting the upper and even forward surfaces of your wings with the new detailed hit modeling.  There's quite an arch to them.

Nevertheless hitting with 2 bullets only the pilot and not the aircraft is to precise to be true at least. Anyway i referred to my post in two points that i consider developers can  make them better espesially the first one. As for the shells drop its not only the .5 cals that should behave this way but i havent hear something like this for another gun/shell combination...

[Talisman]

9 hours ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

 

In addition to that American p 51 pilots have testaments that they couldn't hear even the noise of their firing .50 cals. guns.

 

Douglas Bader says his guns were very noisy in the cockpit and shook the aircraft (Supermarine Spitfires, Hispano Cannons and Browning .303 Machine Guns with Douglas Bader :: Guns.com)

 

When the Germans then began to equip some of their Luftwaffe airplanes with armor, Supermarine reconfigured the Spitfire with two 20mm Hispano cannons, and four Browning .303s. He recalled the first time he used the cannons while engaging a Messerschmitt BF-109 fighter over the English Channel, saying that its use was so “bloody noisy, as to make one go deaf.” Aside from the noise associated with the cannons, he also recalled the vibrations felt in his airplane every time he depressed the button to fire off a few 20mm rounds, “it very nearly shook you apart.”

 

Edited October 28, 2022 by Talisman

[Crious]

1 minute ago, DD_Arthur said:

He’s talking about ‘sound radar’ in multiplayer.

You can hear an enemy approach. It needs fixing.

Yeap thats what i am referring to. 

2 minutes ago, Talisman said:

Douglas Bader says his guns were very noisy and shook the aircraft (Supermarine Spitfires, Hispano Cannons and Browning .303 Machine Guns with Douglas Bader :: Guns.com?

 

When the Germans then began to equip some of their Luftwaffe airplanes with armor, Supermarine reconfigured the Spitfire with two 20mm Hispano cannons, and four Browning .303s. He recalled the first time he used the cannons while engaging a Messerschmitt BF-109 fighter over the English Channel, saying that its use was so “bloody noisy, as to make one go deaf.” Aside from the noise associated with the cannons, he also recalled the vibrations felt in his airplane every time he depressed the button to fire off a few 20mm rounds, “it very nearly shook you apart.”

 

"First time he used the cannons" NOT the mashine guns. As for the vibration its very logical especially with a wing cannon armament ...

[Talisman]

5 minutes ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Yeap thats what i am referring to. 

"First time he used the cannons" NOT the mashine guns. As for the vibration its very logical especially with a wing cannon armament ...

I get the vibrations as I use a Gametrix JetPad on my flight sim chair

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman

[AEthelraedUnraed]

Well, honestly, anecdotal data such as this doesn't really mean anything. It's entirely possible that two bullets hit you.

 

To really draw any conclusions at all, you'd need to gather statistical data from thousands of hits, including geometric data, and compare the amount of PKs with what would be expected based on where the aircraft would be hit. Really hard to do properly even if you have the data; quite impossible if you base it on anecdotes.

[[CPT]Crunch]

13 minutes ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Nevertheless hitting with 2 bullets only the pilot and not the aircraft is to precise to be true at least. Anyway i referred to my post in two points that i consider developers can  make them better espesially the first one. As for the shells drop its not only the .5 cals that should behave this way but i havent hear something like this for another gun/shell combination...

Why is this not possible?  Need to show a pattern of this happening regularly and what is the circumstance it's happening in.  We know zilch about the parameters it happened in.  Until than shit happens, he'll get over it.

[Crious]

6 hours ago, [CPT]Crunch said:

Why is this not possible?  Need to show a pattern of this happening regularly and what is the circumstance it's happening in.  We know zilch about the parameters it happened in.  Until than shit happens, he'll get over it.

S**t happens but i havent seen an opponent to suffer from my guns this way...

[354thFG_Rails]

It’s funny that no one is crying about 20mm killing in 1-2 hits but 50’s are a problem apparently. I don’t know what people expect an AP round to do other than be able to kill the pilot or knock the engine out. It’s a fairly heavy round traveling really fast. It’s going to go through a plane made out of ALUMINUM. 

[Crious]

8 minutes ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

Well, honestly, anecdotal data such as this doesn't really mean anything. It's entirely possible that two bullets hit you.

 

To really draw any conclusions at all, you'd need to gather statistical data from thousands of hits, including geometric data, and compare the amount of PKs with what would be expected based on where the aircraft would be hit. Really hard to do properly even if you have the data; quite impossible if you base it on anecdotes.

Yes i get your point but not only for this gun/shell combination...

[Denum]

PKs to me are meh whatever

 

It's how it went down in real life also.

 

There's ways while flying to mitigate it also. So I've been able to reduce my PKs pretty substantially. 

 

I do agree some engines are much to loud. Almost like it's backwards or something. Behind me, very loud. In front, quiet. 

 

It's bizarre.

Edited October 28, 2022 by Denum

[Crious]

5 minutes ago, 86th_Rails said:

It’s funny that no one is crying about 20mm killing in 1-2 hits but 50’s are a problem apparently. I don’t know what people expect an AP round to do other than be able to kill the pilot or knock the engine out. It’s a fairly heavy round traveling really fast. It’s going to go through a plane made out of ALUMINUM. 

You missed the point

[Jade_Monkey]

44 minutes ago, DD_Arthur said:

He’s talking about ‘sound radar’ in multiplayer.

You can hear an enemy approach. It needs fixing.

Yeah, I've experienced it and has saved my ass a couple of times.

 

Essentially you hear the opponent's engine as they close up and you can take evasive action if you react quick enough.

[Feldgrun]

53 minutes ago, Talisman said:

Douglas Bader says his guns were very noisy in the cockpit and shook the aircraft

 

I haven't enjoyed the jerking of my reticle when firing 20mm cannons in a Bf 109 E-3 in Cliffs of Dover Blitz, but perhaps it's more realistic.

[354thFG_Rails]

33 minutes ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

You missed the point

Don’t think so. I clearly understand what you’re talking about in the original post. I find it funny people crying how there’s to many pk’s in game. That’s all I’m referring to

[Hitcher]

For some reason all the british engines are twice as loud as other engines... can hear the wrahhhhhhh and glubglubglub of Merlin's and Sabres from miles away but DB and klimov engines are only heard when the guy is 50 meters away. ?‍♂️

 

Some pilots really expecting the pilot to tank bullets like:

[Avimimus]

1 hour ago, DD_Arthur said:

He’s talking about ‘sound radar’ in multiplayer.

You can hear an enemy approach. It needs fixing.

 

Oh, well in that case... I don't think I've ever heard an enemy aircraft (at least while my engine was running and my canopy is closed). At least since they updated the sound engine in, I think, BoM days? But then, that could be my hearing or sound settings... or it could be different in single-player.

 

  

1 hour ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Nevertheless hitting with 2 bullets only the pilot and not the aircraft is to precise to be true at least.

 

Not if the opponent was aiming for the engine or the wing  In that case they missed.

 

[CountZero]

11 hours ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Hi,

I am playing this game quite enough time to have a view about positives and cons. Generally is a very good game. I enjoy almost every minute i put on it. I will not mention the countless features i like in the game. My time is valuable and other reader's too. So i ll concentrate to the things i think it could be better

First and foremost i have to admit that dogfighting is not my preferred type of engagement and why it should be?

I like most sneaky attacs from enemys below six. But there is a problem.

Opponents almost always can hear me even if i am 100m behind them which is a bit unrealistic.

Anyone who have fly a small aircraft knows that it is almost impossible to hear his instractor with out a head set due to aircrafts own engine noise.

In addition to that American p 51 pilots have testaments that they couldn't hear even the noise of their firing .50 cals. guns.

My proposal is to reduse the distance where the ambushed pilot can hear to less than 20 meters if his engine is in any settings above idle. This way sneaky attacks would be possible and more realistic.

Secondly i would like to refer in a scenery which is happening more often lately. Two weeks ago i had a fight in my fw 190 with a p 51 . I suffered a pk but thats not what i am complaining for. I was almost sure that i didn't gave my Opponent the opportunity to fire shooting the profile of the aircraft. He was shooting almost by my six o'clock.  I didnt here bullets hitting the aircraft. I only got a pk. I was almost sure that there was only one bullet hitting me ( the pilot) and nothing else. Finnish log confirmed an even worse assumption.  The bullets were not one but TWO directly to the pilot. No bullets to the aircraft. Some how pilot operated like a magnet for them. Is there something wrong?

With respect to il2 great battles team

Best regards 

335th_GRAlbatros

You were hit by 4x0.50

this say 2 http://stats.virtualpilots.fi:8000/en/sortie/log/3033633/?tour=56

but this is more correct http://stats.virtualpilots.fi:8000/en/sortie/3033633/?tour=56

 

Also its MP, you cant have relaiable test there devs said for last 2 years when .50 cal were garbage.

So what you say is pointless as you need to show 1000s of SP tests and prove that something is wrong with 2 out of 4 . 50 cal bullets going like magnets to your pilot. 

 

Like in this example you were not just hit by 3 bullets http://stats.virtualpilots.fi:8000/en/sortie/log/3020547/?tour=56

but it was 5 20mm http://stats.virtualpilots.fi:8000/en/sortie/3020547/?tour=56 and 1 12.7mm

 

Stats displaying bullets are not made by devs, they are mod, they work on not perfect game log, they can be wrong, i dont know how you expect devs to do anything about magnet pilot killing bulets when even you dont know how many bullets hit your airplane, and dont do any tests in SP, but just have fealings, and from last two years of AP bullet problems we know felings dont mather, you have to show tests like guys complaining about bad AP ammo showed.

 

i think this is all just BS and there is nothing wrong with AP, problem is ppl got used to AP doing nothing for last two years and now they are suprised when they get pk by AP bullets. On top devs made pilots more wonerable and this was expected as resoult of it.

 

 

[Talisman]

1 hour ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Yeap thats what i am referring to. 

"First time he used the cannons" NOT the mashine guns. As for the vibration its very logical especially with a wing cannon armament ...

 

Just checked out the book 'First Light' by Geoffrey Wellum (a great read).  First Light by Geoffrey Wellum | Goodreads

 

He is flying a Spitfire in the Battle of Britain (during the month of September 1940) using 8 x .303 mg (no cannon).  He is attacking a German Dornier bomber and says the following on page 148:

 

"I press the gun button and all hell is let loose: my guns make a noise like tearing calico.  The tracers from my Dewilde ammunition cross with other tracers, return fire, very close, ignore it.  I get a fleeting impression of hits and explosions on the glass nose of my Dornier and of Brian's Spitfire breaking away, its oil-streaked belly visible for a fraction on a second.  Keep firing, Geoff, hold it.  For Christ's sake break off or you'll hit him; too close, this.  I stop firing, stick hard over.  I even hear his engines as he flashes by inches overhead.  Bloody hell, this is dangerous!"

 

Later in the book in 1941 he is air testing the new cannons and on page 250 he says:

 

"The cannons, being new to us, are exciting.  The first time I fired them on an air test I was amazed at the noise and the recoil and the damage the shells did to the ground target."

 

Geoffrey could hear his 8 x .303 mg and also heard the engines on the enemy aircraft as he flew so very close!

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman

Edited October 28, 2022 by Talisman

[CountZero]

1 hour ago, 86th_Rails said:

It’s funny that no one is crying about 20mm killing in 1-2 hits but 50’s are a problem apparently. I don’t know what people expect an AP round to do other than be able to kill the pilot or knock the engine out. It’s a fairly heavy round traveling really fast. It’s going to go through a plane made out of ALUMINUM. 

1. It was not doing that for last two years

2. pilots needed to take double of bullets then now, before 5.001 he would be alive when 2 x .50 hit his pilot

"26. Aircraft DM: the several years old ‘crew health cheat’ (they required four point-blank 7.62 bullets in the torso or two in the head to be killed) has been removed. Now their ability to sustain damage is much more close to reality."

3. axis airplanes have 1/3 of belt AP, while allied airplanes 100% or 50% of belt is AP.

 

So it simple to see they will have wrong fealing its just happening to their 109s or 190s

Edited October 28, 2022 by CountZero

[BraveSirRobin]

1 hour ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Shit happens but i havent seen an opponent to suffer from my guns this way...

So this “bug” only results in your death, but it’s never going to happen to me?  In that case, I don’t see any problem here.

[Denum]

11 hours ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

I was almost sure that i didn't gave my Opponent the opportunity to fire shooting the profile of the aircraft. He was shooting almost by my six o'clock. 

 

Are in South America?

 

The Finnish Server is located up in Finland so you may have a really high ping, so on your end it looks like a miss, but on servers it's a hit. 

 

It can cause alot of grief unfortunately. 

[SCG_motoadve]

9 minutes ago, Talisman said:

Geoffrey could hear his 8 x .303 mg and also heard the engines on the enemy aircraft as he flew so very close!

 

Maybe so if he cut throttle and passed very very close to the other plane.

I have done many hrs of real life formation flying and never ever can hear another engine.

 

And hearing an another's airplane engine coming from behind , absolutely NO way, very arcadish IMHO.

[Mmaruda]

The noise of the guns would probably be different for different aircraft depending on how loud the engine is. That said, IL-2 1946 had a modpack that did exactly what the OP is suggesting. Firing 6 50. cals on the Pony was more like a hum than guns firing, the plane did shake a lot as well. Can't remember if it was Ultrapack or some early version of HSFX that had this, but I don't think people liked it all that much. After all it's just a game and a huge part of any game with guns is satisfying sounds when you fire them. This is why Doom's shotgun is iconic and Quake's shotgun is a big ball of meh. As for hearing the engine sound of someone who is on your six... Ehh maybe I need to see a doctor, but I don't hear planes behind, which is why a turn my head on a regular basis. If someone is passing you head on, that's a different story. 

[Crious]

1 hour ago, Denum said:

 

Are in South America?

 

The Finnish Server is located up in Finland so you may have a really high ping, so on your end it looks like a miss, but on servers it's a hit. 

 

It can cause alot of grief unfortunately. 

No i am leaving in Greece. I know what you mean but that was not the case. Thanks for your polite respond 

1 hour ago, CountZero said:

You were hit by 4x0.50

this say 2 http://stats.virtualpilots.fi:8000/en/sortie/log/3033633/?tour=56

but this is more correct http://stats.virtualpilots.fi:8000/en/sortie/3033633/?tour=56

 

Also its MP, you cant have relaiable test there devs said for last 2 years when .50 cal were garbage.

So what you say is pointless as you need to show 1000s of SP tests and prove that something is wrong with 2 out of 4 . 50 cal bullets going like magnets to your pilot. 

 

Like in this example you were not just hit by 3 bullets http://stats.virtualpilots.fi:8000/en/sortie/log/3020547/?tour=56

but it was 5 20mm http://stats.virtualpilots.fi:8000/en/sortie/3020547/?tour=56 and 1 12.7mm

 

Stats displaying bullets are not made by devs, they are mod, they work on not perfect game log, they can be wrong, i dont know how you expect devs to do anything about magnet pilot killing bulets when even you dont know how many bullets hit your airplane, and dont do any tests in SP, but just have fealings, and from last two years of AP bullet problems we know felings dont mather, you have to show tests like guys complaining about bad AP ammo showed.

 

i think this is all just BS and there is nothing wrong with AP, problem is ppl got used to AP doing nothing for last two years and now they are suprised when they get pk by AP bullets. On top devs made pilots more wonerable and this was expected as resoult of it.

 

 

Gently speaking I am not expecting devs to do anything about magnet pilot killing bullets.  I only referred to that asking a question looking for answers.  What i am expecting from them to do however is look once more the radar engine warning noise and from what i read here, in mp chatting, srs, and discord i am not the only one.

[Denum]

22 minutes ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

No i am leaving in Greece. I know what you mean but that was not the case. Thanks for your polite respond 

It's also possible who shot you had a bad connection also. FvP would definitely be the closest for you. 

 

Unfortunately it's just an issue with the game I find. Unless they can do something to help minimize server weirdness it's just part of playing online. 

 

It goes both ways though. I've had times where large calibre guns did no damage also. 

Edited October 28, 2022 by Denum

[TWC_Ace]

I completely agree with the topic starter. And there are more things to say. Some FMs are questionable, on example Hurricane and P51B. Its just not normal to be able to turn like mad without almost no input rudder. Also in general, FM seems a bit off in terms of handling. Planes does not seem to have enough weight (unlike in DCS on example), its to easy to do crazy maneuvers without serious punishment. Like we are flying RC planes. This is maybe due to FM beaing originaly modeled for Rise Of Flight. Also visualy cockpits are less detailed than in Cliffs of Dover or DCS. Sounds are lackiong too, both internal and external sounds. As you mentioned in RL there is no chance pilot would hear tempest engine from the cockpit of another plane and with tempest coming from 6 200m away! Also ground need a lot of rework, trees seems dull, same height, houses look like dummies etc. Only in last patch nav lights visiblity was corrected but just for some extent. In RL, in clear sunny day nav light cant be seen clearly even from closer distances. In game it was miles away. And it was abused like every other error in the game (super dirable flaps in yaks etc) Also game engine is very limited AFAIK. There is no chance we will se PTO or anything simmilar unless devs dont migrate to another game engine. Competition will do that as we heared, so why wouldnt there guys? After all the backbone, the heart of the any combat sim community are multiplayer pilots. These should be able to put their observation without being constantly spitted on as it was in the past on this forum. Lets make this sim better or lets forget about it and move on.

I was there when REd BAron came out, I was there with Il2 demo back in 2001, I was there to help Oleg, I was there when the first ROF started, I was beta core tester. When we struggled to make the ROf engine work online. Im simming for almost 30 yrs so bear with me and at least listen what I have to say.

 

 

Edited October 28, 2022 by =VARP=Tvrdi

[453=Whittle]

16 hours ago, 335th_GRAlbatros74 said:

Opponents almost always can hear me even if i am 100m behind them which is a bit unrealistic.

Yeah, it's rubbish and has been as long as I can remember. The Hurricane and Mosquito have by far the loudest engines. It's disappointing that this obvious unrealism and inconsistency has been ignored for so long, especially because it impacts badly on gameplay.

 

 

Quote

I suffered a pk but thats not what i am complaining for. I was almost sure that i didn't gave my Opponent the opportunity to fire shooting the profile of the aircraft. He was shooting almost by my six o'clock.  I didnt here bullets hitting the aircraft. I only got a pk.

 

PKs have gone through the roof recently... It seems a bit too likely (at least in the 109, judging by several PKs in a row for a number of us). But you can't get combat reports from real pilots who suffered this, so it's not possible to know what's realistic. The stats pages mention that they aren't necessarily accurate due to lack of data from the game, so I wouldn't place much importance on the number of hits listed.

 

Secondly you can't reliably judge whether your opponent can or cannot hit you when pulling lead, because in mulitplayer you are often seeing where other planes were a few hundred milliseconds ago, and they are shooting at where your plane was the same time ago. This explains why planes often appear not to be pulling enough lead to hit you, and yet they do. The game uses client side hit detection, so if a player sees their shots hit their target, then the game regards them as hits (there is no better way to do it). If the game calculates a PK at the same time as hits, there's no reason for you to hear hits.

[=RS=EnvyC]

ITT: "bullet the size of my thumb moving at 3k ft/second went thriough a quarter inch of aluminum and into my brain and I died, this seems incorrect"

[Crious]

9 hours ago, =VARP=Tvrdi said:

I completely agree with the topic starter. And there are more things to say. Some FMs are questionable, on example Hurricane and P51B. Its just not normal to be able to turn like mad without almost no input rudder. Also in general, FM seems a bit off in terms of handling. Planes does not seem to have enough weight (unlike in DCS on example), its to easy to do crazy maneuvers without serious punishment. Like we are flying RC planes. This is maybe due to FM beaing originaly modeled for Rise Of Flight. Also visualy cockpits are less detailed than in Cliffs of Dover or DCS. Sounds are lackiong too, both internal and external sounds. As you mentioned in RL there is no chance pilot would hear tempest engine from the cockpit of another plane and with tempest coming from 6 200m away! Also ground need a lot of rework, trees seems dull, same height, houses look like dummies etc. Only in last patch nav lights visiblity was corrected but just for some extent. In RL, in clear sunny day nav light cant be seen clearly even from closer distances. In game it was miles away. And it was abused like every other error in the game (super dirable flaps in yaks etc) Also game engine is very limited AFAIK. There is no chance we will se PTO or anything simmilar unless devs dont migrate to another game engine. Competition will do that as we heared, so why wouldnt there guys? After all the backbone, the heart of the any combat sim community are multiplayer pilots. These should be able to put their observation without being constantly spitted on as it was in the past on this forum. Lets make this sim better or lets forget about it and move on.

I was there when REd BAron came out, I was there with Il2 demo back in 2001, I was there to help Oleg, I was there when the first ROF started, I was beta core tester. When we struggled to make the ROf engine work online. Im simming for almost 30 yrs so bear with me and at least listen what I have to say.

 

 

Thanks for your reaction.

FM for some planes especially the British ones is questionable.

Tempest and hurricanes is the firsts that come in mind.

Why ? Maybe there is a reasonable answer.

What a pilot read on an aircraft speed indicator is indicated air speed (IAS) but what we read in all (?) flight sims are in reality calibrated air speed (CAS).

The difference between these two is due to the way sensors is positioned to the aircraft and their interaction with the aircraft in several parameters of flight.

I am not expecting from sim developers to model the differences correctly. The problem is that almost every aircraft has different IAS and CAS.

THE BIGGEST PROBLEM WITH THE BRITISH (mostly) air speed  indicators is that they are reading LOW espesially the hawker ones.

Furthermore all critical flight data like turn radius climb rate glide speed is based in calibrated stall speed.

IF what WE read in british cockpits is IAS AND NOT CAS witch i suppose we do then British planes is overperform espesially tempest with a difference between IAS and CAS stall speed for almost 10 miles per hour.

Developers has two ways to fix that either to let IAS as it is but correct the stall speed accordingly or two change IAS with CAS and the related stall speed.

As for the magic flaps for yaks (but not only for them) you are absolutely right.

I would like to clarify this. I am not walking on Developers shoes i dont know their badget, time table, human resources, technical difficulties. What i know (from their latest interview) is their focus on the current game engine. Time and competition will tell if they are right or wrong. What i can do is to give them feedback in order to make their products better and thats what i am doing...

[CountZero]

So it seams by some luck devs atleast made 109 and 190 FM great, but they need to make british airplanes better by reducing their speed and not so good at turning, american guns better so they dont kill german pilots and well be able to make game more realistic.

 

[CUJO_1970]

Yes, all is OK, everything as it should be as long as they take a close look at the 109 no need to look further behind curtain.

 

[Talisman]

22 hours ago, Mmaruda said:

The noise of the guns would probably be different for different aircraft depending on how loud the engine is. That said, IL-2 1946 had a modpack that did exactly what the OP is suggesting. Firing 6 50. cals on the Pony was more like a hum than guns firing, the plane did shake a lot as well. Can't remember if it was Ultrapack or some early version of HSFX that had this, but I don't think people liked it all that much. After all it's just a game and a huge part of any game with guns is satisfying sounds when you fire them. This is why Doom's shotgun is iconic and Quake's shotgun is a big ball of meh. As for hearing the engine sound of someone who is on your six... Ehh maybe I need to see a doctor, but I don't hear planes behind, which is why a turn my head on a regular basis. If someone is passing you head on, that's a different story. 

 

I must say that I don't hear engines behind in the air from attacking aircraft either, so perhaps I need to see a doctor too, lol. 

My IL-2 in-game sound setting is at 70% which I still find very loud but allows me to hear my squad mates on ts3 communications.  I did not realise that the rear sound radar bug was still an issue.

I like my in-cockpit engine sounds loud for more realistic immersion, especially as I use haptic feedback earphones.

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman  

Edited October 29, 2022 by Talisman

[357th_KW]

Certain aircraft are extremely loud and can be heard from 1000 meters or more away over the sound of your own engine - Spitfires, Hurricane, Typhoon, Tempest, Mosquito, P-38, P-47.  This was actually fixed at one point, and then returned after a few updates.

[Talisman]

24 minutes ago, 357th_KW said:

Certain aircraft are extremely loud and can be heard from 1000 meters or more away over the sound of your own engine - Spitfires, Hurricane, Typhoon, Tempest, Mosquito, P-38, P-47.  This was actually fixed at one point, and then returned after a few updates.

 

Wow never had that experience.  (No Axis planes on that list, lol.)

 

Do you hear them when you are in the same aircraft or only when flying an Axis plane?

 

What are your sound volume settings?

 

Sounds like I am flying a different flight simulation than some.

 

Happy landings,

 

Talisman

Edited October 29, 2022 by Talisman