I'm glad the new visual damage made me realise that....

[Peachy9]

17 hours ago, McDuff said:

OK... I started this thread and I'm not having a go at developers trying to improve this game in any way.. I love this game... I am also not having a go at the physical damage modelling which is great but I do care about the pretty poor visual damage modelling...To even have one of those 2 inch plate hole decals on my plane is wrong...Don't understand why some can't see this..

 

 

I think you were pretty clear in your second post mate - it looks shite and detracts from the rest of the game which is great

[PatrickAWlson]

On 10/24/2022 at 4:22 PM, oc2209 said:

Let's assume for the sake of simplicity that the current BoX visual damage model can't mimic COD's. Forget why and how.

 

So then the question becomes: how to make a flat decal look plausible?

 

As I said, the 30mm does a better job than the 20mm:

 

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Notice how the 30mm texture and shape draws the eye downward into the hole. Also note the 12.7mm HE in the lower right corner of the screen. It doesn't look too bad at that size, with the lighting fully on it to give some metallic impression.

 

However, in the dark, and much larger, the 20mm hole becomes the weakest of the bunch:

 

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It takes on the '2-inch' steel look much more, the larger it gets.

 

In proper lighting, however, it looks okay from certain angles:

 

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So, I'd say that a few tweaks to the 20mm HE hole could improve it. Reduce the size slightly, and lower the ridges along its edge.

 

Agree with you.  To start with, just make the holes look like they are punching through a thin sheet of aluminum instead of an early war panzer.  Thin out the metal in the decal.  After that, see how it goes.

 

I disagree with  a knee jerk "make it look like the other sim" approach.  The other sim probably just has some representational decals that show a certain percentage of hit points lost.  The GB team is trying to represent what really hit you and where.  That is something worth keeping.

[Spinnetti]

I thought the OP picture was a joke  CLOD does this SOoooo much better. Can't they lift that from that game?

[Dauntless]

Different engine. 

[Mmaruda]

I never really saw this in the sim until today. Got bounced by a Yak and he made some holes in my 190. I eventually got him and as I was returning home leaking oil I noticed these holes in my wing. Yeah it kinda does look like tank armor holes, but not quite. It's one of those things that don't annoy you, until someone tells you it's not right and then they annoy the hell out of you. I think it can be somewhat fixed by just making the inner part of the hole lighter color maybe? Just so that it looks like aluminum bent inwards rather than thick steel. Also weirdly enough, two fist size holes in my wing didn't really change the flight feel. I was wondering why it's not pulling to the right. The plane was perfectly stable.

 

EDIT: Something just came to my mind regarding this - could this be a bug? I mean the game did have damage decals for large fuselage holes, maybe it's just using the wrong ones?
In any case, I think it's commendable that the devs are trying to improve what has already been a stand out damage model. First pass is always rough, I'm sure it's going to get better with time.

Edited October 27, 2022 by Mmaruda

[Thorne]

For those of you who are concerned about the quality of DvD -

 

This system was just released, and is a quantum leap over the previous damage visual indicators. For aircraft that have their internals modelled, the system looks pretty good. For aircraft that don't yet - I would assume that those are coming as time allows.

 

As anyone who builds things for a living, or for a hobby will tell you, making new systems and objects is an iterative process. For a first version DvD is incredible, and there's plenty of room to tweak and improve it over time.

[kestrel79]

Yeah just like everything in this sim, it's always getting improved. I'm sure this will eventually get updated.

[MAJ_stug41]

I did notice on the 410 when I got a big hole in the wing root that I could see a larger rib and its detail, so the capability is certainly there to show these details like clod. I have also seen several times holes large enough to see completely through the structure.

If the stringers and other stuff inside the wing were visually modeled, I think box would have near clod detail here.

 

It always looked like clod went through the effort to model panels and surfaces as different materials such that they responded correctly to damage, but throwing a bit more detail in to box would be a great start.

[RyanR]

23 hours ago, Thorne said:

For those of you who are concerned about the quality of DvD -

 

This system was just released, and is a quantum leap over the previous damage visual indicators. For aircraft that have their internals modelled, the system looks pretty good. For aircraft that don't yet - I would assume that those are coming as time allows.

 

As anyone who builds things for a living, or for a hobby will tell you, making new systems and objects is an iterative process. For a first version DvD is incredible, and there's plenty of room to tweak and improve it over time.

 

 

The DVD system seems very "tunable". The wooden/fabric structures are already different than the metal structures. You just need a different "decal" for wings. Decals can be tweaked in size/shape/texture/depth.

 

BoX also has a lot of internal model geometry. They just don't use artificial light to make it more visible. In other words, most of it falls in deep shadow.

 

Finally, while visually stunning, the pre-cooked damage in Clod is nothing new. A certain set of hit parameters triggers "damage model X". You could easily replace that "damage" with a penguin magically appearing. It's purely cosmetic, whereas the DVD crater is the actual hit. CloD has a rich set of these models on each plane.... since they've not really developed much since the BoB. OK, so CloD models every bullet hole... so does BoX.

 

Ultimately, what people want is some sort of FEA driven damage model. Where the damage is computed and the extensively modeled geometry is given the material properties from which they're made, and responds to an explosion. For each hit, it would take an hour to generate the result. Slow gameplay indeed.

 

Obviously from my opinions, I think DVD is pretty cool... but needs some tweaks on metal wings. Maybe go with a full alpha transparency in some places. I think it looks fantastic on VVS wooden foils. In a way, it gives the end user a chance to "debug" what's happening.

 

-Ryan

 

 

[Crocogator]

I just enjoy the fact that I know where I've been hit and usually, by what sort of gun. That alone is better than CloD

[Lusekofte]

36 minutes ago, Crocogator said:

I just enjoy the fact that I know where I've been hit and usually, by what sort of gun. That alone is better than CloD

In clod you got message what systems are hit and how bad. You can actually evaluate your situation. It’s system is far more complex than gb in dm 

All cfs got it’s advantages and disadvantages 

 

[Hotaru_Ito]

It's not perfect but it's honestly the best visual damage implementation I've ever seen. Not necessarily the best LOOKING, but the best all-around, since it looks decent and actually indicates where, by what, and even from what direction you've been hit.

 

Somehow the "two-inch steel" thing doesn't bother me, it just looks like thin metal skin that's been bent inward. Of course it would be cool if it could be bent outward instead, but I'm not sure that's possible with decals.

 

I mostly wish we had the option to disable the old damage system. It's kind of weird having to pick out the "real" bullet holes from all the "fake" ones.

[Zyfe]

I personally love the DVD, and while it could be better, I think it's current state is pretty great.  I love pausing the action and examining the damage that I've done, or checking how close I was to getting pilot killed.   

 

Nice work devs.