Fuel drop tanks

[cedric029]

Hi community, few months ago I saw news about new fuel system and comming drop tank.  Since late 2020 there is almost no news about it only a screenshot with a bf109 with a drop tank under belly of the plane.  Does anyone knows where the project is at now or is it still comming?  Thank you 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[DBFlyguy]

23 minutes ago, cedric029 said:

Hi community, few months ago I saw news about new fuel system and comming drop tank.  Since late 2020 there is almost no news about it only a screenshot with a bf109 with a drop tank under belly of the plane.  Does anyone knows where the project is at now or is it still comming?  Thank you 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The C-47 squadron that were supposed to be transporting the fuel tanks disappeared several months ago, whereabouts unknown...

[Hoss]

BoN was first priority, fixing and polishing it is whats going on now.  Fuel management is still in the works, I have not heard anyone mention it's a dead horse. Some things had to be set aside to be taken up after BoN was released. there are still planes in the works, fuel management, hopefully Marshal Mode in some form/fashion will be implemented. hopefully the mobilization has not uprooted some of our developers, and I imagine Jason has a lot on his plate at the moment. Enjoy what you have on your plate, it's so full of new stuff to discover.......... and wait for the goodies to come in their time. 

 

Cheers

Hoss

Edited October 5, 2022 by Hoss

[Jade_Monkey]

No news for a while. I really hope this feature is not dropped like it was hinted with Marshall, I'm really looking forward to it.

[Alexmarine]

4 minutes ago, Jade_Monkey said:

No news for a while. I really hope this feature is not dropped like it was hinted with Marshall, I'm really looking forward to it.

 

Dropping them would keep several of the career's units both in BoN and BoBP to almost unplayable levels... Not a great prospect...

[343KKT_Kintaro]

"IL-2 Sturmovik: 1946"... no problem with drop tanks.

 

"IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover"... no problem with drop tanks.

 

"IL-2 Sturmovik: Great Battles"... "Houston we have a problem here".

 

Seriously, there is nothing the development team can do?

 

 

[VBF-12_Pequod]

23 minutes ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

Seriously, there is nothing the development team can do?

 

A little bit harsh, don't you think?

[343KKT_Kintaro]

2 minutes ago, VBF-12_Pequod said:

 

A little bit harsh, don't you think?

 

 

No, I don't. If the reason is the multiplayer mode, this should be modelled at least for the single player mode... or simply blocked in some specific servers... So, my question stands, why not to implement this in the game? In the two other Sturmoviks, '46 and Dover, drop tanks are working very well.

 

 

[DFLion]

I'm very keen to get the drop tanks, especially now we have the Normandy map. Both the Allies and the Luftwaffe carried them leading up to D-day and after. The distances involved flying over the Channel make them mandatory. I am just working on an historic pre-D-Day Spitfire mission where the Spitfires carried 45gal drop tanks. The leader would call 'drop your babies' as an enemy formation approached. I have to divert the Squadron back into the 'Ford' airfield in Southern England because they would not have enough fuel to make it back to their original base which was Biggin Hill. Ford was used a lot when Allied planes ran short of fuel.

I know there is a lot on the IL Team plate at the moment, though it would be good if they could give the drop tanks a priority now.

DFLion

[=FEW=fernando11]

25 minutes ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

 

 

No, I don't. If the reason is the multiplayer mode, this should be modelled at least for the single player mode... or simply blocked in some specific servers... So, my question stands, why not to implement this in the game? In the two other Sturmoviks, '46 and Dover, drop tanks are working very well.

 

 

Why do you think multiplayer is the issue?

[343KKT_Kintaro]

15 minutes ago, =FEW=fernando11 said:

Why do you think multiplayer is the issue?

 

 

I was responding to Alexmarine in, fact. Alexmarine said "Dropping them would keep several of the career's units both in BoN and BoBP to almost unplayable levels... Not a great prospect".

[Jade_Monkey]

40 minutes ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

No, I don't. If the reason is the multiplayer mode, this should be modelled at least for the single player mode... or simply blocked in some specific servers... So, my question stands, why not to implement this in the game? In the two other Sturmoviks, '46 and Dover, drop tanks are working very well.

 

I have no idea about how MP would be an issue related to systems.

 

I also haven't played the previous IL2s but i think they were probably much simpler than what they were shooting for here.

[343KKT_Kintaro]

8 minutes ago, Jade_Monkey said:

 

I have no idea about how MP would be an issue related to systems.

 

I also haven't played the previous IL2s but i think they were probably much simpler than what they were shooting for here.

 

 

Please Jade_Monkey read my previous message: as I said, it is not me who suggested that the multiplayer mode is the issue.

 

About the other IL2, which you never played apparently, you say "were" but you should say "are" for they are still in use (you'll find their respective forums on the tabs bar above). And they are not simpler, they are different. '46 has lesser graphics but presents plenty of advantages you'll not find in the two others. Same for Dover and Great Battles, each one has its onw advantages and disadvantages.

 

Going back to the drop tanks: somebody suggested the problem in Great Battles is that the game, with drop tanks, would be unplayable. My response to that is that if this is true, at least in single player mode there shouldn't be any problem... but I'm no developer so I can't be sure.

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

4 minutes ago, Jade_Monkey said:

 

I have no idea about how MP would be an issue related to systems.

 

I also haven't played the previous IL2s but i think they were probably much simpler than what they were shooting for here.

CloD has complex fuel systems. Like in the Ju 88 and Bf 110 with different tanks you can pump fuel from one to the other, select different fuel cocks and all that. But the drop tanks are relatively simple compared to that. For example in the German fighters they feed into the main tank and that‘s it. When they are empty your main fuel level starts dropping.

 

In American types you would have a fuel selector to make the switch. Something that is modeled in CloD, for example, as the fuel cocks and pumps.

 

I really don‘t know why, but it isn‘t because it was easier before GB.
I am guessing it is because the way the game engine handles fuel - ie simpler - makes the implementation in GB harder now. Since probably they needed to start from scratch, so takes a lot more work.

[Alexmarine]

2 minutes ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

 

Going back to the drop tanks: somebody suggested the problem in Great Battles is that the game, with drop tanks, would be unplayable. My response to that is that if this is true, at least in single player mode there shouldn't be any problem... but I'm no developer so I can't be sure.

 

Not at all, the issue is specifically for SP as in the career mode, with historical airfields and distances to frontline sectors, a lot of times players will get tasked with missions outside or at the very edge of the "internal fuel only range" of their planes. Ironically given that we don't have external fuel tanks even trying to recreate Bodenplatte operation itself, with some german units will basically be impossible taking into account historical flight paths and targets (plus ToT)

[Enceladus828]

2 hours ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

"IL-2 Sturmovik: 1946"... no problem with drop tanks.

 

"IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover"... no problem with drop tanks.

 

"IL-2 Sturmovik: Great Battles"... "Houston we have a problem here".

 

Seriously, there is nothing the development team can do?

 

 

Also add CFS3 to no problem with drop tanks.

 

It's likely taken so long to implement drop tanks for IL-2 GBs because it was based on/has its roots in a WW1 game engine (Rise of Flight) where Drop Tanks, radio comms, but more importantly hydraulics, retractable landing gear, etc., etc., just weren't there or were very primitive in WW1. From my knowledge, when developing BoS, the devs took the RoF game engine, modified it for WW2 and built BoS. Therefore, a lot of "Good to have" things in CFS3, IL-2 1946 and CloD like Drop Tanks, radio comms, oxygen masks, pilots exiting their aircraft after landing had to be sacrificed so that the basic necessities of a WW2 aircraft could be added. They weren't given any middle step between WW1 and WW2 such as adding parachutes for pilots and a few other things, and were only given under 2 years to develop BoS. It's a great achievement by 777 Studios/1CGS for pulling that off.

 

The coding is likely very different in GBs from the 3 previous games that it's quite difficult to not only add Drop Tanks but greatly improve the aircraft fuel systems and will take longer than expected. The devs stated in 2017 that they hoped Drop Tanks would be added at the end of the BoBP development cycle (late 2019) but it's proven more difficult than they expected.

Since clickable cockpits will never be an option, they may be implementing something where you push the Tilde button and through the keyboard number buttons can cycle the fuel selector positions and fuel pump positions.

 

That's my 2 cents on this.

Edited October 5, 2022 by Enceladus

[VBF-12_Pequod]

1 hour ago, Jade_Monkey said:

I also haven't played the previous IL2s but i think they were probably much simpler than what they were shooting for here.

 

IIRC in IL-2 1946 if you have a fuel leak it'll empty all your tanks, one after another.

[343KKT_Kintaro]

1 minute ago, VBF-12_Pequod said:

 

IIRC in IL-2 1946 if you have a fuel leak it'll empty all your tanks, one after another.

 

 

Yes, and this has been fixed in the two next IL2s, Dover and Great Battles... which brings us to my point: every game in the IL-2 series has something to offer. For example we'll spent years before we reach the number of flyable aircraft and theatres of operations that are available in the '46 game. If ever Dover and/or Great Battles do catch '46 up in such domain (number of aircraft and maps).

 

Other than that, the developers in the Great Battles series might surprise us someday with a better fuel management in the game (drop tanks, fuel transfer pumps, etc.). Fingers crossed.

 

 

[EAF19_Marsh]

Start with visual, dummy, simple tanks and evolve from there?

[CountZero]

Drop tanks were shiped to MSFS by mistake, it will take time to get them back here.

[Guest deleted@83466]

You can’t make a baby in 1 month by getting 9 women pregnant —-Warren Buffett.

 

 

Edited October 6, 2022 by SeaSerpent

[senseispcc]

This is question asked again and again and one of the reason why the pacific theater is so far away (but not only). Let us see that it shall one day implemented but is it really necessary with the size of the maps?  Or missions?! 

[343KKT_Kintaro]

6 hours ago, SeaSerpent said:

You can’t make a baby in 1 month by getting 9 women pregnant —-Warren Buffett.

 

 

 

 

Bring me the 9 women! I'll try just in case!

 

 

[BOO]

22 minutes ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

 

 

Bring me the 9 women! I'll try just in case!

 

 

Knock yourself out 

[343KKT_Kintaro]

Younger than 35 please, we talk about making babies...

 

By the way... where is Jason?

 

 

[IckyATLAS]

2 hours ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

Younger than 35 please, we talk about making babies...

 

By the way... where is Jason?

 

 

Looking for the drop tanks, lost somewhere around Nellis airbase.

[BOO]

One of the “things” (I’ll not say issues as it’s quite minor) with the fuel management, if done correctly on the larger aircraft, will be the additional buttonage required. 
 

I dunno if that’s going to be a thing of if it’s just drop tanks on fighters.   Anyhow

 

 I recall the ju88 in clod has 4 working fuel cocks and an multi button management panel for transferring fuel.  The 110 2 multi position levers plus cocks. one or both also has a  switches for the different tanks readings. Clods clickity  pits help greatly here as one is not having to remember multiple buttons   Not sure to what extent GB intends to go with the management  modelling over and above drop tanks but I can’t see being as involved. for this reason.  The damage modelling in clod also prevented the mass drain effect 
 

Now some may say it’s all ott. However, it does come into play when some rude boi has smacked up your 88.
 

In SOW, I  often home over the channel on one engine and holed tanks simply because I had the ability to pump around and manage the fuel as comprehensively as I did. Without it I’d have lost the aircraft (and muh stats) 
 

So I’d say it is a thing to be desired in GB as it’s not just about getting from a to b and back to a but the what ifs as well l, especially in the bigger stuff. 
 

 

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

TBH I‘d be happy if drop tanks added an amount of fuel on top that got drained first. Really simple stuff. No fuel management, nothing.

And you could jettison the tank if needed and lose the amount left in it.

If the drop tank gets hit, you lose its fuel. If the main tank gets hit, you lose if from there (and everything that goes in it from the drop tank, obviously). This should be doable now that we are getting DVD for all a/c, since hits are registered where they happened.

 

 

[=621=Samikatz]

I have a guess that once a feature is implemented it's very hard to completely redo it later for this game. We were meant to get drop tanks initially only on the Bf-109 series which have a very simple implementation, but controls are already in game for fuel tank selection, operating fuel gauages, etc. My guess is they've changed their mind and are just going to do every plane in one big release, hence it taking much longer

[JG1_Vonrd]

The best use for a drop tank...

[Stonehouse]

17 hours ago, BOO said:

One of the “things” (I’ll not say issues as it’s quite minor) with the fuel management, if done correctly on the larger aircraft, will be the additional buttonage required. 
 

I dunno if that’s going to be a thing of if it’s just drop tanks on fighters.   Anyhow

 

 I recall the ju88 in clod has 4 working fuel cocks and an multi button management panel for transferring fuel.  The 110 2 multi position levers plus cocks. one or both also has a  switches for the different tanks readings. Clods clickity  pits help greatly here as one is not having to remember multiple buttons   Not sure to what extent GB intends to go with the management  modelling over and above drop tanks but I can’t see being as involved. for this reason.  The damage modelling in clod also prevented the mass drain effect 
 

Now some may say it’s all ott. However, it does come into play when some rude boi has smacked up your 88.
 

In SOW, I  often home over the channel on one engine and holed tanks simply because I had the ability to pump around and manage the fuel as comprehensively as I did. Without it I’d have lost the aircraft (and muh stats) 
 

So I’d say it is a thing to be desired in GB as it’s not just about getting from a to b and back to a but the what ifs as well l, especially in the bigger stuff. 
 

 

Some of the new key mappings are already there I believe just not functional as far as I can tell. 

[BOO]

6 minutes ago, Stonehouse said:

Some of the new key mappings are already there I believe just not functional as far as I can tell. 

That would seem manageable. Not sure how stuff like this works in VR iif you can’t fit it on your hotas. But I’m not sure how clickoits work in VR either. I guess there’s workarounds for everything. 

[Soilworker]

To be fair IIRC they're updating the entire fuel system of which drop tanks are a part, not just adding them to what we have. 

 

I can imagine it could be on the back burner while they're working on all the stuff for planned 5.002, etc. 

[DD_Crash]

3 hours ago, BOO said:

That would seem manageable. Not sure how stuff like this works in VR iif you can’t fit it on your hotas. But I’m not sure how clickoits work in VR either. I guess there’s workarounds for everything. 

Voice attack on a push to talk button. Simples

[BOO]

Just now, DD_Crash said:

Voice attack on a push to talk button. Simples

I refuse to talk to the thin air. I would feel stupid enough snorkelling about in my living room as it was.  This is where the ”immersive realism” of VR drops on its bottom for me. I don’t want my 110 to come with Alexa.  
 

Are there means to still click on stuff in VR? Like a pointer or a glove? I know that wouldn’t help GB but I’m thinking of other stuff. 
 

I feel I’m slowly coming round to VR but it’s a different language

[DD_Crash]

If you like DCS there is this

https://pointctrl.com/

 

[BOO]

15 minutes ago, DD_Crash said:

If you like DCS there is this

https://pointctrl.com/

 

Thanks crash. I do tend to be a click monkey in DCS. For simpler cockpits I guess a few button boxes and muscle memory would suffice. 

[Skycat1969]

18 hours ago, BOO said:

I refuse to talk to the thin air. I would feel stupid enough snorkelling about in my living room as it was.

I've been using Voice Attack with IL-2 Great Battles+Tank Crew for almost two years. To me it is the most intuitive way to operate most features in IL-2 aircraft and vehicles. It's like reading items from a checklist w/ simulated muscle memory. To be fair, I play single player and alone in my space.

 

I've tried the Ultraleap motion controller in DCS and few other sims and it's very hit-or-miss for convenience and reliability in my experience. As for VR hand controllers, I don't much like using them because they are an additional peripheral I must either have in my hand or within easy reach. Mouse pointer is my preferred method of interaction with DCS, P3D and MSFS cockpits.

 

VR has its challenges regarding how you interact with your aircraft but overcoming these is worthwhile and rewarding. There is no substitute for wrapping an entire aircraft around you--having the cockpit above, below, and behind you all at once. Gunsights actually make sense. Landings are a perceptual experience. 

 

Edited October 8, 2022 by Skycat1969

[GADDY]

The late war bodenplatte patrol runs I'm currently flying, mean I can barely limp back over the front lines before having to find a field to put down in. My squad are calling 'Bingo fuel' over the patrol are - never mind getting back - so I just wonder how we are expected to fly long distances, then patrol the triangle, before attempting to get back. I've tried all sorts, to attempt to do it, including flying ridiculously slowly, but all to no avail. It's a little disheartening to have a couple of victories, only to realise your main headache will be trying to limp back over the front lines before making use of the nearest decent field. I even tried to make it to the nearest American airbase - and it was close - but still, no cigar. Drop tanks would be a great relief.

[Mysticpuma]

I remember 13 years ago helping Monguse create a video showing HSFX 4.2 for IL2, with drop tanks released, watching them tumble and unspent fuel leaking out. 

Quite incredible!