Are occasional gamers not wanted in tank crew?

[Maschinenreiter]

I use Il2, Bodenplatte and Flying Circus every now and then in VR and enjoy it quite a lot.

Now I bought Tank Crew when it was on sale and frankly I am horrified about the completely broken setup.

After about half an hour I was able to move the tank but still am unable to get working key bindings for gun control and useful sights on the different positions - not to mention the engine still dies instantly, when I open the driver hatch.

On Steam it would have been an insta-refund, no doubt.

 

Is this really wanted that way?

I now a few people, who are interested in occasional tank gameplay and who enjoyed red orchestra and its mods.

But I dont now anyone who is willing to spent half a day to sort out such messed settings for a game, that might be put  into use about ten times a month. So each time you start it you need to relearn an unnecessarily overcomplicated (and by that also immersion-breaking) setup ( and as someone having served as a tank commander I allow myself to judge especially that).

 

So again: Is that wanted that way? Is this for die hards only and when some day I got the settings done I will end up with one or two populated servers to chose from with players who have chosen this as their second life ?

Or did I completely miss something and there is some sane, accessible default setting and a lively community of all sorts of players out there?

 

 

 

[MajorMagee]

I started with Tank Crew and getting everything running initially was really not too bad. The crew station command lists are a great place to start, and programming those into my HOTAS made everything pretty simple to control.

 

When I eventually got BOS I found that reconfiguring the controls for flying was relatively difficult. I don't fly very often (CFS3 is still my primary Sim), and it always feels wrong at first because I'm still trying to use tank commands in an airplane.

 

I don't use VR, so perhaps that further complicates things.

[moustache]

... well, welcome to TC, you are not at the end of your surprises...

 

if it can help you...

Edited April 17, 2022 by moustache

[SCG_Neun]

I map everything to a throttle and gaming mouse and have two installs....one for tank and one for VR air.  I am a Multiplayer and we have a lot of fun doing our own missions as a unit. I can't say that I like the interface within the single player mode as it's just too clumsy for me.  You are more than welcome to pm me anytime and you can join us for our Sunday missions...if you have the time and get the controls worked out.  Or I will come online and we can go out together on our server so we can get you quickly assimilated into the game.

 

Also, driver hatch open on Tiger in particular tank will stop since there is no way the driver could actually drive from this position.   I think if you get your controls worked out..you will find the tanks modeled very well and really appreciate the way they handle.

 

Map your accelerate to your throttle in the axis setting.  I use buttons to lock my treads both left and right...for turning, etc.  And map out your other primary functions, such as switching positions, unlocking gun and leaning into site.  I have turret traverse set to my mouse control, check for that in "input" as I recall.

Edited April 17, 2022 by SCG_Neun

[Yogiflight]

2 hours ago, SCG_Neun said:

Also, driver hatch open on Tiger in particular tank will stop since there is no way the driver could actually drive from this position. 

The better solution for this would have been to not give the driver the possibility to open the hatch while driving, instead of turning the engine off.

 

@Maschinenreitermake sure your keys for tanks don't conflict with the keys for the aircrafts. I had it happen yesterday for the third time, that I turned my engines off, while flying, because I had assigned a key to the same button, which I used for turning engine on/off for tanks. This can happen the other way round as well.

[SCG_Neun]

Engine doesn't stop when hatch is opened, tank just stops moving.  At least that's the way I remember it.

[WIS-Redcoat]

It definitely needs some love.  One can tell they took a flight sim and expanded it to ground vehicles.  That said, it’s come a long way and I imagine it’s going to get better when the key mapping changes come into play.  
 

But still…. simple things like pushing a single button to use your binoculars and return them….  Baby steps

 

I’ve found if you take the time to work through it the reward is worth it. 

[MajorMagee]

Here's an example of using the HOTAS to make things a single press of a button.

 

Discussion about tank controls

[ShampooX]

On 4/17/2022 at 12:06 AM, Maschinenreiter said:

So again: Is that wanted that way? Is this for die hards only and when some day I got the settings done I will end up with one or two populated servers to chose from with players who have chosen this as their second life ?

Or did I completely miss something and there is some sane, accessible default setting and a lively community of all sorts of players out there?

I would say the answer is a little bit of both.

1.)  I thank the Lord every day that IL2-TC and the Finnish and AAS servers are the best kept secret in PVP on line combined arms combat simulation.

2.) I can't really speak for single player Tank missions, but PVP is very difficult to master: once you know the controls, then you have to really be proficient in the skills of war fighting.  And due to the low number of players, boredom is an issue for most players who don't have a military background.

3.) SO to summarize, the on line PVP servers are for the hardcore...however once you memorize the tank setings and commands, and you practice them as you would a CQB drill back at the squad house - it all becomes much more rewarding.  I have enclosed and updated version of Moustaches key binds above - they focus a bit more on PVP required keybinds.

 

We love new gamers and occasional gamers are certainly most welcome.  But this game is not like War Thunder, WOT or even Gunner Heat - this game, if you are a tanker, at least on PVP servers, is a religion.  That is if you want to be good, to get that all important first shot......which in our business is life itself..... you have to work for it.  But it's the closest thing to the real thing you will find out there today.

 

[wasoota]

Ouf, new player here too and I have to say I'm struggling as well. I come from SBproPE, SABOW and a bit of DCS so I feel I have a decent threshold for pain, but "needs some love" seems about right.

 

I can see the simulation is there but it's not easy to get into, especially with no tutorial, the seemingly random and clunky keybinds and the the bland quick missions. It feels more like someone made the tanks playable and then left it at that rather than it being a sim in and of itself. SP missions are just you in a field (with engine off) and x number of tanks of type y mindlessly rolling your way. That's barely a gunnery range, much less an armor engagement...

 

Does it really take a bunch of keypresses via command menu to make the driver advance or reverse? That's kind of a core mechanic in a tank.

 

Thanks for the keycharts though, that's a big help. I'll chew on it some more but so far it's been a bit of a letdown I have to admit. Are there any recommendations on youtube?

[moustache]

On 4/19/2022 at 4:46 AM, TheRealShampoo said:

I have enclosed and updated version of Moustaches

Oula, just for clarification, I am not the author of that, but I no longer remember who is the author...

[JG27_Steini]

21 hours ago, wasoota said:

Ouf, new player here too and I have to say I'm struggling as well. I come from SBproPE, SABOW and a bit of DCS so I feel I have a decent threshold for pain, but "needs some love" seems about right.

 

I can see the simulation is there but it's not easy to get into, especially with no tutorial, the seemingly random and clunky keybinds and the the bland quick missions. It feels more like someone made the tanks playable and then left it at that rather than it being a sim in and of itself. SP missions are just you in a field (with engine off) and x number of tanks of type y mindlessly rolling your way. That's barely a gunnery range, much less an armor engagement...

 

Does it really take a bunch of keypresses via command menu to make the driver advance or reverse? That's kind of a core mechanic in a tank.

 

Thanks for the keycharts though, that's a big help. I'll chew on it some more but so far it's been a bit of a letdown I have to admit. Are there any recommendations on youtube?

 

Unfortunately you hit all the points we tried to address in the last 14 months. Without any response. It seems that tank crew is just left behind. We can not expect any quick development. For example IL2 got the career mode after 5 years. Other important features are not working since the beginning. The team has in my opinion not a good list for its features. Other core features had been changed several times, others are ignored. Especially the single player part depends heavy on the community. As you say the SP part of the game is just a shooting range simulation.

Edited April 20, 2022 by JG27_Steini

[ShampooX]

I too have been a bit disappointed by the attention shown to the TC module since I started playing a little over a year ago.  It seems as if very little time is given to advancing the TC part of the game.  I've been asking for something as simple as darker Panzer camouflages in the Official Skin Folder - there are a ton of player developed skins already in use in Custom Folders - something seemingly very simple to achieve, with no reply.  It's nice to have the AA vehicles and I pre-ordered the StuG....but those take a long time to develop and deliver.  On the flip side however, War Thunder is noted for it's constant updates and in my experience there,  for every improvement made, two things that once worked well then become broken.  So maybe from that perspective  it's good the Dev's don't do much with TC.  This is the background for my other post asking if TC has peaked.  It certainly seems like it's an after thought in the GB portfolio, which is too bad because with a little more work it could be the dominant Tank Sim/Combined Arms Sim on the market today.  Even with it's current shortcoming's, it's still the best of the bunch IMHO.

[wasoota]

Well, at least I'm somewhat reassured that it's not just me, but I wish I was wrong... I'll give MP a try some time. I mean it would be legitimate to say it's just intended for online play because they lack the ressources to do a whole AI and everything for ground warfare as a small studio. It's just that it's advertized as being on the same level as their flight sims, which is clearly is not...

 

Fair enough though, it may get some improvements yet. Fingers crossed.

[MajorMagee]

Start with these missions

 

Gunnery Ranges Sorted By Tank Type

[ShampooX]

wasoota - once you try Finnish or Advance and Secure, you'll find single player very boring.  See you out there soon!!

[JG27_Steini]

3 hours ago, TheRealShampoo said:

wasoota - once you try Finnish or Advance and Secure, you'll find single player very boring.  See you out there soon!!

 

Multiplayer is good, but is has its flaws. Whenever a plane detects you, it is over. On each map there are some well known tank spots. If you kill a tank, it comes back with a plane. Can be very frustrating. 

[SCG_judgedeath3]

2 hours ago, JG27_Steini said:

 

Multiplayer is good, but is has its flaws. Whenever a plane detects you, it is over. On each map there are some well known tank spots. If you kill a tank, it comes back with a plane. Can be very frustrating. 

Try then our more historical type of missions we in SCG do on sundays online with objectives, semi military tactics from the time period and unit tactics, no such issues there.  

[JG27_Steini]

3 hours ago, SCG_judgedeath3 said:

Try then our more historical type of missions we in SCG do on sundays online with objectives, semi military tactics from the time period and unit tactics, no such issues there.  

 

I'd love to, when do play your missions? 

[moustache]

As a general rule, if you don't want to get bored with TC, you have to turn to Mods and custom missions/campaigns from modders...

[SCG_Neun]

1 hour ago, JG27_Steini said:

 

I'd love to, when do play your missions? 

JudgeDeath and I will be absent from this coming Sunday's mission which rotates from Finnish Server, SCG Tank Duel, and semi-historical campaign missions, every Sunday 1:15 EDT for 4 hours.  This coming Sunday SCG will meet within the Finnish Server, our next Campaign style mission a continuation of Battle for Moscow, will be on May 1st.  These are tough missions with needed comms and close cooperation between squads/zugs and we will be using MkIII/M tanks with no skirts throughout the mission.  PM either myself or JudgeDeath for further information.  We'd love to have you join us and try it out.  Our Tactical Tank Duel missions are great for developing tactics, and improving navigation and tank selection skills.     https://www.simulatedcombat.group/missionoverview#

Edited April 21, 2022 by SCG_Neun

[ShampooX]

19 hours ago, JG27_Steini said:

 

Multiplayer is good, but is has its flaws. Whenever a plane detects you, it is over. On each map there are some well known tank spots. If you kill a tank, it comes back with a plane. Can be very frustrating. 

Steini go to my FVP stats page (tanker) and see how many planes I've killed vs, how many have killed me this month.  I think my Air KD is like 32 or something.  I've had multiple planes and tanks trying to find me and if you are smart and you know how and when to move and hide, and where to hide, when to use HE vs APHE, ping distances for spawns and temps, etc etc. even if they are using "the render zone" against you, you can still prevail.  My favorite part of the PVP on Finnish is getting chased by a couple planes and tanks.  So it's far from over - in fact I think it's the best part of the game.  

[JG27_Steini]

2 hours ago, TheRealShampoo said:

Steini go to my FVP stats page (tanker) and see how many planes I've killed vs, how many have killed me this month.  I think my Air KD is like 32 or something.  I've had multiple planes and tanks trying to find me and if you are smart and you know how and when to move and hide, and where to hide, when to use HE vs APHE, ping distances for spawns and temps, etc etc. even if they are using "the render zone" against you, you can still prevail.  My favorite part of the PVP on Finnish is getting chased by a couple planes and tanks.  So it's far from over - in fact I think it's the best part of the game.  

 

No doubt it can very funny and challenging. After my last 1 hour run to a good spot killing a few T34, one of the tankers just took an IL2 and bombed me. The invested time/fun ration is very poor. A plane has only planes as natural enemy, but everything will stop a tank.

[ShampooX]

9 hours ago, JG27_Steini said:

 

No doubt it can very funny and challenging. After my last 1 hour run to a good spot killing a few T34, one of the tankers just took an IL2 and bombed me. The invested time/fun ration is very poor. A plane has only planes as natural enemy, but everything will stop a tank.

LOL.  I feel ya bro.  Well that is because on FVP at least, the Russian pilots and tankers work very well together.  For some reason this is the opposite case on the German team.  I'm told it has something to do with the plane sets, but the Germans mainly only fly at higher altitudes and dog fight, while the Russians dominate the 1-2K alt space and thats why they also win nearly all the maps because they actually play the game the way it's supposed to be played.  Whenever you see a plane down low on FVP, 95% of the time it will be Russian.....so you just naturally get good at hiding and scanning proactively the skies.  Anyway, I've been a 100% German player and I'm seriously considering switching to the Russian side on the next Map just to see what the teamwork is like.  I bet it's more fun.

[JG27_Steini]

On 4/22/2022 at 5:32 PM, TheRealShampoo said:

LOL.  I feel ya bro.  Well that is because on FVP at least, the Russian pilots and tankers work very well together.  For some reason this is the opposite case on the German team.  I'm told it has something to do with the plane sets, but the Germans mainly only fly at higher altitudes and dog fight, while the Russians dominate the 1-2K alt space and thats why they also win nearly all the maps because they actually play the game the way it's supposed to be played.  Whenever you see a plane down low on FVP, 95% of the time it will be Russian.....so you just naturally get good at hiding and scanning proactively the skies.  Anyway, I've been a 100% German player and I'm seriously considering switching to the Russian side on the next Map just to see what the teamwork is like.  I bet it's more fun.

 

This is the case since 20 years. IL2's dominating the battlefield, while german fighter dominate the sky. We win the dog fights, but loose the battle.  

[InsolentDuck]

People posting talking about complexity of commands, I don't know if it's a new thing since I've come on board, you can add settings to the default or change those on the keyboard: W/S/A/D can be used for directional movement just like they are used to in War Thunder... Custom binocular settings and the rest.
I have set the directional movement to the left joystick on the controller, and turret rotation to the right joystick.
I am using an Xbox Controller with a chat pad added... The only problem I have had is getting either left or right trigger recognized... I have put in a support ticket with both IL2 and Steam, because I'm not sure if one or the other is where the problem originates.  Setting change of crew station, open and closing hatches, reducing range setting I have assigned to the rocker pad.  I also have binoculars set to the B key on the keyboard and the controller.
In my situation, I cannot sit at a dedicated station, and have to keep the family member I am caring for in sight at all times and have to keep errands quick or return between different destinations... so Track IR5 is a must, can't do VR apparatus.  Keyboard on my lab and controller make getting up and responding immediately to situations. 
I still have to use the keyboard for function keys, and have used the rocker on the Hotas Throttle quadrant for zoom.... So options abound.
The only thing I find unusual is the "tree" that has to be gone through to designate targets, change ammo type, and other crew/formation commands... I have had some difficulty designating targets, one time I could get it working but not the next.
I do have a problem occasionally with the ESC Key not working to get into menus or review station notes, or just exit. I have to go to task manager and leave entirely... maybe the way I'm doing things makes it go into "brain lock".