CoD pre-order for another DLC

[Buffo002]

I want to ask. Could there already be a pre-order for CoD for another DLC? It doesn't matter that it will be a long time, but I think it would be good for us and for you TF team.   

[343KKT_Kintaro]

A pre-order now this means that cash flow would start immediately and that agreements and contracts would have been already signed in connection with the upcoming DLC (signed... or revised based upon those that have been signed when the last DLC, Tobruk, happpened). I don't think it's that easy, Buffo, my impression is that 1C and TFS certainly have plenty of different things to discuss before we enter in the pre-order phase. Remember 2020 : the pre-order phase lasted one week only before release :

 

 

 

[Dagwoodyt]

Any activity that diverts resources from completion of the "visual update" package seems counterproductive. It's difficult to see how commitment to a new DLC would be of benefit while the update status remains a WIP.

[Buffo002]

It's a pre-order. I did not write the finished product. I also bought IL-GB (Flying Circus - Volume II, IL-2 Sturmovik: Battle of Normandy - Premium Edition) over a year of pre-order and so far it's not done, no one has said that they have it done I know very well that it is still in a state that is not finished. And I mainly asked the developers, I think they know what and how.

Edited March 20, 2022 by Buffo002

[343KKT_Kintaro]

Buffo, you're right, nor Dagwoodyt neither myself are developers of TFS. But, please, let me give you my opinion: the Great Battles series doesn't work at all as the Dover series works. Something happened in 2011 and now, in my humble opinion, when it comes to talk about the Dover series the 1C people are showing tons of prudence before they allow a pre-order date or, even more simple, an important announcement that would be dealing with the development.

 

I may be wrong but my feeling is:

 

1) That we'll get the visual update before the end of 2022. By "visual update" I mean more than only "visual": updated version of SpeedTree, implemention of TrueSky (new weather engine and new clouds), 4k textures, and VR hardware compatibility.

 

2) Same, the announcement of the upcoming new theatre of operations will happen before the end of 2022.

 

3) We'll get the new DLC before the end of 2023, with a pre-order phase starting one week before the full release.

 

The above list of three items is 100% speculative. The real course of future events is much more of a mistery to me.

 

 

19 minutes ago, Buffo002 said:

And I mainly asked the developers, I think they know what and how.

 

 

No problem, let's wait for their response.

 

 

[Sokol1]

2 hours ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

By "visual update" I mean more than only "visual": updated version of SpeedTree, implemention of TrueSky (new weather engine and new clouds), 4k textures, and VR hardware compatibility.

 

 

?

[343KKT_Kintaro]

Dear Sokol1, The future weather engine (which will be brought by TrueSky) is not only a visual feature. At this point, "Cliffs of Dover - Blitz" already presents turbulences at some altitudes if the server where you are flying presets them. Not a visual feature. Regards.

Edited March 20, 2022 by 343KKT_Kintaro
wanted to add something

[DD_Arthur]

3 hours ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

3) We'll get the new DLC before the end of 2023, 

 

[343KKT_Kintaro]

13 minutes ago, DD_Arthur said:

 

 

Dear DD_Arthur, I invite you to re-read the part that reads "The above list of three items is 100% speculative. The real course of future events is much more of a mistery to me."

 

Other than that... how do you do my friend? Having fun in these forums?

 

[Dagwoodyt]

I suggest to go back to the OP. The OP never defined the imagined DLC content. As such DLC might constitute a single aircraft or a full new product with map and new gameplay features. How much development funding would accrue from offering a single aircraft vs a full new theater of operations? Trivial funding from a single aircraft seems likely. Even then the fact remains that there is no full time staffing to backstop a proposed DLC. That reality would dampen confidence in any DLC proposal floated. The downside of offering a DLC at this time has already been explained to the OP. What we don't have is an explanation of how TFS would benefit from making commitment to a thus far undefined DLC project.

[343KKT_Kintaro]

TFS already stated that the new version of SpeedTree, the implementation of TrueSky (with a new weather engine and new clouds), the 4k textures, and the VR compatibility... are features that will be implemented BEFORE the upcoming DLC is available.

 

Now, Dagwoodyt, if we want to go back to the OP, let's admit that nowhere in the present thread did somebody imagine the content of the future DLC. Both you and myself presented to our friend Buffo two different reasons why it shoudn't be expected that a pre-order phase starts from now. And, again, we are no developers, we are not in the TFS teams... so, again, those were our respective opinions only. Responding to a colleague in the forums by simply giving our humble opinions, this is fair enough to me, as I hope it is to you too. Regards.

 

[DD_Arthur]

1 hour ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

Other than that... how do you do my friend? Having fun in these forums?

 

Hello Kintaro and thank you for asking.  Me and mine are very well in these very strange times and I hope you and yours are too

 

Yes, I saw your caveats but none the less; DLC next year............!? 

 

However, the visual update including Trusky and VR,  I think will arrive before the autumn is out this year.  That will be very good news for the game.  Hopefully TF will be able to make that leap of imagination and do some actual PR instead of the semi-paranoid, knowledge-is-power trip they've been on since MysticPuma left TF. 

 

I think the announcement of any future DLC will be further delayed by circumstances currently beyond the control of TFS or 1C and Jason.  

 

 

 

 

[Dagwoodyt]

If Steam DB graphs are to be believed successful implementation of the Visual Update Package is crucial. Absent that, floating new DLC offerings could look like grasping at straws. I cannot imagine much benefit to TFS from doing that.

Edited March 20, 2022 by Dagwoodyt

[343KKT_Kintaro]

"floating new DLC offerings"? what offerings? Buffo asked one clear question, a question not dealing with offerings, only if whether or not we can start paying for the promised DLC from now.  And I'm sure he's out there, whitnessing all of our opinion exchanges. He may not agree with me but, from my point of view, which is based on what we know about the development at this point, at the moment it is too soon to launch a prepayment phase (I may be wrong though). Other than that, only TFS could bring more nutritious informations to the thread, but, same as Buffo keeps silence, TFS must be keeping silence as well (must be too funny to read our vague speculations, and even more funny to read how a simple question... so quickly evolves into an off topic).

 

PS: I read your response DD_Arthur. Thank you for the input.

 

 

[Dagwoodyt]

In fairness to TFS and just to be clear: I never interpreted the DW-T "preorder" as a real preorder. It seemed just a way to encourage sales around the release week. There was nothing wrong with doing that. DW-T was clearly already done as seen in pre-release videos. The current thread revolves around effects of TFS advertising a proposed DLC the scope of which the OP did not define.

Edited March 21, 2022 by Dagwoodyt

[Missionbug]

I think Buzzsaw mentioned some time ago that there was something contractually with 1C that precluded any kind of pre-order for any forthcoming titles in the Blitz/Tobruk series of D.L.C.

 

Take care and be safe.

 

Wishing you all the very best, Pete.

[Mysticpuma]

I hear the graphics update is still a long way off

Anyway, it will get here when it gets here....what else can we do? ?

[Avimimus]

On 3/20/2022 at 9:49 AM, Dagwoodyt said:

Any activity that diverts resources from completion of the "visual update" package seems counterproductive. It's difficult to see how commitment to a new DLC would be of benefit while the update status remains a WIP.

 

Well... maybe: Release the visual update and announce the DLC at the same time? To maximise excitement? That is what I might do - even if it meant delaying the graphics update a bit.

[343KKT_Kintaro]

1 hour ago, Avimimus said:

 

Well... maybe: Release the visual update and announce the DLC at the same time? To maximise excitement? That is what I might do - even if it meant delaying the graphics update a bit.

 

(bold text style by my own hand)

 

You know, Avivimus, TFS already announced that the visual and weather package will happen before the release of 6.0. So, apparently, things won't happen differently than how they said they will happen. At any rate, I think the TFS guys are right: the beta testing phase will be followed by a more widespread use of all of this new features (SpeedTree updated, TrueSky implemented, 4k textures, VR implemented), widespred use which in some way will contribute to a further improvement for the game before the arrival of 6.0. If everything goes well, obviously. Fingers crossed.

 

I am in solidarity with you Puma. We'll need to be patient but I'm sure that the wait will be worth it. "Desert Wings - Tobruk" brought evidence of the skill level in the TFS teams. I don't care if some pretend I'm a self-appointed attorney. I'm trusting TFS because I'm very happy with what they've done and there's no reason to believe they won't do it again.

 

[Canvas25]

Like a Bruckner symphony - it's truly wonderful, but you have to pace yourself.

[Blitzen]

Um….DLC??

[343KKT_Kintaro]

1 hour ago, Blitzen said:

Um….DLC??

 

 

What's wrong with using the acronym "DLC", Blitzen? I'm sure you already know that "DLC" stands for "downloadable content". Obviously we refer to the add-ons in the Dover series.

 

The DLCs in the Great Battles series are standalone games, you don't add them to a basic game. You need a basic game ("Cliffs of Dover - Blitz") in the Dover series if you want to run "Desert Wings - Tobruk". As a conclusion, the DLCs in the Great Battles series are "modules"... but the term "module" doesn't apply to the DLCs in the Dover series... In "Dover" they are "expansions"... or "add-ons"...

 

To whoever doesn't agree with the above... speak now or forever hold your peace...

 

 

[Mysticpuma]

I would suggest a moderator change the title of the thread......in case people get all excited and the like ?

[Dagwoodyt]

50 minutes ago, Mysticpuma said:

I would suggest a moderator change the title of the thread......in case people get all excited and the like ?

No mass indignation evident thus far   ?

[JS81Knows]

DLC announcement was delayed by the sale of 1C. So perhaps a few things to sort out. Hope the buyer is a positive force for all.

Edited March 27, 2022 by JS81Knows

[343KKT_Kintaro]

1 hour ago, JS81Knows said:

the sale of 1C

 

 

I didn't know that! Thank you JS81Knows. I just looked for more information in the internet and learned that 1C Entertainment belonged to a Polish company until late February, when it had been purchased by Tencent. That latter is, following Wikipedia, "the largest company in the video game industry in the world based on its investments". In any case, 1C Company remains Russian, based in Moscow.

 

 

1 hour ago, JS81Knows said:

Hope the buyer is a positive force for all.

 

 

Agreed!

 

 

[Redwo1f]

Hmmm, Il2 GBS lists "1C Game Studios" as publisher, CLOD still lists "1C Entertainment". Jason was adamant about the two being separate entities - that 1C Game Studios was NOT 1C Entertainment. 1C Entertainment was apparently acquired by Tencent. Team Fusion +1C Maddox Games as Developers.

 

Are we sure there hasn't been a split now between the two series? Are they both still under the same corporate umbrella? -- it doesn't look like it anymore, though not sure.

 

Edited March 27, 2022 by Redwo1f

[343KKT_Kintaro]

1 hour ago, Redwo1f said:

Hmmm, Il2 GBS lists "1C Game Studios" as publisher, CLOD still lists "1C Entertainment". Jason was adamant about the two being separate entities - that 1C Game Studios was NOT 1C Entertainment. 1C Entertainment was apparently acquired by Tencent.

 

 

I admit I'm not sure how these things work nor how they are set or arranged. In connection with the Great Battles product, which is developed by 777 Studios, apparently  the rights holder of the label "IL-2 Sturmovik" is Gaijin Entertainment Corporation: click here.

 

 

1 hour ago, Redwo1f said:

Team Fusion +1C Maddox Games as Developers.

 

 

I think Maddox Games no longer exists. Contractuallty, I think that Team Fusion Simulations is the sole developer at present.

 

 

[DD_Arthur]

9 hours ago, JS81Knows said:

DLC announcement was delayed by the sale of 1C. 

 

 Lol.

[343KKT_Kintaro]

"Laughing out loud", DD_Arthur? What's so risible? In the first place: is it true?

[DD_Arthur]

2 hours ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

"Laughing out loud", DD_Arthur? What's so risible? In the first place: is it true?

 

Whats so risible? We’re deep into “my source are the voices in my head” territory here.

 

Btw, the rights to The Sturmovik brand are owned by 1C-777 not Ganjin. You better check your link.

 

[343KKT_Kintaro]

In all fairness DD_Arthur, the link I shared above seems to be more in connection with the relationship between the product (the Great Battles series) and the user (we the players). Now, on second thoughts, the page gives me the impression that it is something like the "terms of use" at the footer of a website. In this instance it deals with the website, but also the present forums and, obviously, the game itself (please reread it). The game itself, I mean the Great Battles series. Indeed, 777 Studios possesses the code of "Rise of Flight" (and the further development of "Rise of Flight" which is the "Great Battles" game) but not "Cliffs of Dover", not "IL2-1946", nor any other game under the brand "IL-2 Sturmovik". The line that reads "This product is sold subject to a patent license from Gaijin Entertainment Corporation", in fact, doesn't unveil the content of the licence. The content could be the name "IL-2 Sturmovik", including all the games in the series since 2001, but this would be the name only, the "IL-2 Sturmovik" brand, not all the source codes that are present in the vast array of games in this family since 2001.

 

Please note something that is important: if we check the credits in the two last generations of "IL-2 Sturmovik" games, there's no mention of "1C-777". Nowhere. "Great Battles" (the credits link in the game reads "About") mentions Jason Williams as the President of 777 Studios, described as the development company. In the "Cliffs of Dover" game, the "Credits" page mentions jason Williams as "1C Games Studio Representative and Liaison". For the year 2012 the team of developers is mentioned as Maddox Games and since 2017 and the Blitz edition, the developers are the guys of Team Fusion Simulations.

 

My suspicion is that "1C-777" is only a company created after agreements between 1C Entertainment and 777 Studios for purposes of commercial exploitation only. Nothing to do with rights over source codes, games, brands, etc. and this is why there's this mention of a license provided by Gaijin. Since 2010 Jason Williams was able to set teams and develop a WWII aviation game out of his "Rise of Flight". Only 1C Entertainment could name it "IL-2 Sturmovik" so this is what they did: they signed an agreement with Jason. Thus, in my opinion, even if I admit I could be wrong, 777 Studios DOES NOT possess the brand "IL-2 Sturmovik". It may still be somewhere in a strongbox, at 1C Entertainment... but apparently the strongbox went straight to China one mont ago... If not, then Gaijin could be rights holder of the brand... in Budapest! to be honest I have no idea, all of this is nothing but speculation.

 

My dear DD_Arthur, I'll be happy to read your calm and polite response when you return from the amazing holiday you are having so deep in this funny territory you just mentioned.

 

 

[Dagwoodyt]

We are approaching the one year anniversary of the "new module" announcement delay announcement. IDK though whether it would really matter if a new module announcement were delayed for another year.  ?

Edited March 28, 2022 by Dagwoodyt

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

2 hours ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

My suspicion is that "1C-777" is only a company created after agreements between 1C Entertainment and 777 Studios for purposes of commercial exploitation only. Nothing to do with rights over source codes, games, brands, etc. and this is why there's this mention of a license provided by Gaijin.

 

Patents, trademarks, and copyrights are distinct types of intellectual property.

 

The Gaijin patent is probably related to some technology licensed for use in the game, such as this.

 

A search of US trademarks shows that 1C-777 does own the Il-2 Sturmovik name.

Spoiler

Word Mark	IL-2 STURMOVIK
Translations	The English translation of "STURMOVIK" in the mark is "ground-attack aircraft".
Goods and Services	IC 041. US 100 101 107. G & S: Entertainment services, namely, providing a computer game online or over a wireless network for single player and multiple player use. FIRST USE: 20141022. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 20141022
Standard Characters Claimed
Mark Drawing Code	(4) STANDARD CHARACTER MARK
Serial Number	85282768
Filing Date	March 31, 2011
Current Basis	1A;44E
Original Filing Basis	1B;44D
Published for Opposition	June 4, 2013
Registration Number	4731731
Registration Date	May 5, 2015
Owner	(REGISTRANT) 1C ONLINE GAMES LTD. LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY CYPRUS 4th Floor 32 Kritis St, Papachristoforou Building Limassol CYPRUS (LAST LISTED OWNER) 1C-777 LIMITED COMPANY CYPRUS 32 KRITIS STREET PAPACHRISTOFOROU BUILDING, 4TH FLOOR LIMASSOL CYPRUS 3087
Assignment Recorded	ASSIGNMENT RECORDED
Attorney of Record	Jeffrey R. Cadwell
Priority Date	March 4, 2011
Disclaimer	NO CLAIM IS MADE TO THE EXCLUSIVE RIGHT TO USE "STURMOVIK" APART FROM THE MARK AS SHOWN
Type of Mark	SERVICE MARK
Register	PRINCIPAL
Affidavit Text	SECT 15. SECT 8 (6-YR).
Live/Dead Indicator	LIVE

 

[343KKT_Kintaro]

5 hours ago, Mitthrawnuruodo said:

A search of US trademarks shows that 1C-777 does own the Il-2 Sturmovik name.

 

 

Thank you Mitthrawnuruodo. I did some further research in the equivalent European bureau of patents, and found that "IL-2 Sturmovik" is a registered trademark in the registration offices of countries in the EU and outside the EU like the UK, the USA, Thailand, Brazil, India, China and Corea. A few examples as follows:

 

- The American registration of "IL-2 Sturmovik" is for 1C-777, based in Cyprus.

- The Chinese registration is for 1C EUROPE B.V, based in the Netherlands.

- The British registration of the brand is for 1C Online Games Ltd., based in Cyprus (not the same address as 1C-777 though).

- India and Brazil bureaus keep the brand for 1C EUROPE B.V, based in the Netherlands.

 

Different companies in different countries, all of them holding the same trademark, funny uh? My point is that 1C-777 doesn't own the trademark and that the level of property  of these companies must be something like "granted permission for doing business with"... or something similar.

 

[Guest deleted@7076]

-Deleted-

 

Edited September 12, 2022 by Varrattu

[Dagwoodyt]

34 minutes ago, Varrattu said:

Come on, one more and 10 posts with no discernible benefit for the reader are reached...

 

~V~

 

True, but give credit for the amount of effort they are putting forth   ? 

[JV69badatflyski]

Why search on the local Db's when you can have all the info worldwide.
From Wipo's DB:

[343KKT_Kintaro]

53 minutes ago, JV69badatflyski said:

Why search on the local Db's when you can have all the info worldwide.
From Wipo's DB:

 

 

Thank you Bada, that was lovely.

 

Would you kindly complete the meanings of the prefixes, please?

 

KR stands for Korea.

JP is Japan

VN is... Vietnam?

IN is India

US is United States

EM?

WO?

CA is... Canada?

 

[JV69badatflyski]

Hi Kintaro, 
Easiest way is to follow the link provided and to start a search, you'll see on the right a table with all countries related to your search, by hoovering with the mouse you'll see what the acronyme correspond to.

EM= EUIPO = european eunion
WO = Wipo = WORLD, planet earth. Moon excluded,  only crypto's have a Moon Trademark 

Edit:
see the post by J.Williams =
 

Edited March 29, 2022 by JV69badatflyski