Suggested Plane List #3

[Jackfraser24]

Hi. I just want to ask about the Hawker Hurricane Mk 1. Was this variant used by the Soviet Air Force or Finnish Air Force? I just want to know because on the original 1946 version there was the Mk 1 variant.

 

Thanks

[jeanba]

Not by the Soviet, but by the Finnish

[AEthelraedUnraed]

I gotta ask - whence this sudden influx of threads asking questions about everything and whatnot? Of course, you're free to ask questions and I consider it a virtue to be eager to learn, but mightn't it be easier to collect all your questions and ask them all together in a single thread?

[Jackfraser24]

Thanks for that suggestion. Sorry if I have annoyed you all. I can have an almost insatiable thirst for knowledge concerning my interests - especially about WW2 planes and where these all these specific variants were used. Wikipedia’s information can sometimes be quite limited, not having information I am looking for. 
 

Thank you

Oh, and websites I am looking for can be hard to find. Where do the development team get there resources from when they use the internet? That would be good to know. 
 

Thanks

[AEthelraedUnraed]

Don't worry - I think almost everyone here shares an interest in WW2 aviation, it's what this game is all about after all. It's just that it's an awful lot of threads that essentially ask the same question ?

 

14 minutes ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Oh, and websites I am looking for can be hard to find. Where do the development team get there resources from when they use the internet? That would be good to know.

I think the Devs probably visit archives and such. A while back, Jason wrote a few posts about visiting a museum in the US to have a look inside a B-25 to do some in-person research for a possible B-25 collector plane.

 

One trick I use for researching Soviet-related stuff is to use the Russian Google, and run it through Google Translate.

[Raptorattacker]

Research is research, with the emphasis on search. If you get into skinning (I dunno, you might be?) then you'll know exactly what I'm saying. Sometimes I can spend half a day just running through stuff before I even put (virtual) pen to (virtual) paper!

 

Rap

?

[ShamrockOneFive]

5 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Wikipedia’s information can sometimes be quite limited, not having information I am looking for. 

 

Wikipedia has a lot of the basics and is a good place to start. Then expand the search out. "Hurricane in Soviet Service" will reveal some articles and information and do enough looking around and you can get some good information. I typed that exact search in using Google and the first hit was this excellent article: https://vvsairwar.com/2018/06/20/the-soviet-unions-hawker-hurricanes/

Edited February 1, 2022 by ShamrockOneFive

[40plus]

29 minutes ago, ShamrockOneFive said:

 

Wikipedia has a lot of the basics and is a good place to start. Then expand the search out. "Hurricane in Soviet Service" will reveal some articles and information and do enough looking around and you can get some good information. I typed that exact search in using Google and the first hit was this excellent article: https://vvsairwar.com/2018/06/20/the-soviet-unions-hawker-hurricanes/

 

I'll add to this by pointing out that Wikipedia articles all have a references section at the bottom that will direct you to the more detailed reference material.

[Jackfraser24]

Were Spitfire Mk 1s used anywhere else other than the 1939-40 phase of the Western Front? 

[LukeFF]

36 minutes ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Were Spitfire Mk 1s used anywhere else other than the 1939-40 phase of the Western Front? 

 

Nope

[Jackfraser24]

Where were Bf 110 C4s used? IL 2 1946 plane list implies it was used on the Eastern Front or the Finnish Continuation War. Is this true?

 

I know Bf 109 E3s are not on the 1946 standard list, but were they used on the Eastern Front too? 

[ShamrockOneFive]

2 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Where were Bf 110 C4s used? IL 2 1946 plane list implies it was used on the Eastern Front or the Finnish Continuation War. Is this true?

 

I know Bf 109 E3s are not on the 1946 standard list, but were they used on the Eastern Front too? 

 

Start here with the 110's operational history.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messerschmitt_Bf_110_operational_history

Edited February 3, 2022 by ShamrockOneFive

[=621=Samikatz]

2 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

I know Bf 109 E3s are not on the 1946 standard list, but were they used on the Eastern Front too? 

 

By Romania, yes

[Jackfraser24]

Thanks. So the C4 B was largely used as a ground attack aircraft? 
 

Where on the Eastern Front exactly?

How many C4s were used on the Eastern Front?

 

How many C4s were were built in total? And how long was that specific production model produced for?

 

And what about the Bf 110 D variant?

7 minutes ago, =621=Samikatz said:

 

By Romania, yes

Thank you for that information too

[BlitzPig_EL]

You know, there are these things called books.  You should try them.

[LukeFF]

3 minutes ago, BlitzPig_EL said:

You know, there are these things called books.  You should try them.

 

That, and have a look around ww2.dk. Lots of things you are asking about can be answered there.

[Jackfraser24]

50 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

 

That, and have a look around ww2.dk. Lots of things you are asking about can be answered there.

Thanks. I will

[Jackfraser24]

Why are the Polish PZL 11s in 1946? Were they on the Eastern Front too?

If so, who used them and why? Poland had fallen so why would another country use them in frontline combat?

Sorry if I accidentally offended anybody 

[JG27_Steini]

31 minutes ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Why are the Polish PZL 11s in 1946? Were they on the Eastern Front too?

If so, who used them and why? Poland had fallen so why would another country use them in frontline combat?

Sorry if I accidentally offended anybody 

 

You ask dozen of questions here about alle theatres and vehicles. Would you please explain why is this the case? I suggest you concentrate on one theme and then move to the next. Also you find very good information on most on wikipedia. As an example, here is a very good article about the PZL.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL_P.11

[Irishratticus72]

[Jackfraser24]

1 hour ago, JG27_Steini said:

 

You ask dozen of questions here about alle theatres and vehicles. Would you please explain why is this the case? I suggest you concentrate on one theme and then move to the next. Also you find very good information on most on wikipedia. As an example, here is a very good article about the PZL.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL_P.11

Sorry. I didn’t mean to irritate. I just love learning from a variety of peoples factual opinions of what some say is true, others say differently. But it helps to give me leads on where to start learning. It’s just how my brain is wired. I am mildly autistic.

[LukeFF]

9 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Why are the Polish PZL 11s in 1946?

 

It was one of the first (if not the first) planes that was made by a third-party modeler for the game.

Edited February 4, 2022 by LukeFF

[AEthelraedUnraed]

7 hours ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Sorry. I didn’t mean to irritate. I just love learning from a variety of peoples factual opinions of what some say is true, others say differently. But it helps to give me leads on where to start learning. It’s just how my brain is wired. I am mildly autistic.

I think what annoys people is that they're all very simple questions that a 1min Google or Wikipedia search could answer. Asking these questions without giving any reason why the answers Google or Wikipedia provide don't suffice, nor stating why you're interested, gives the impression that you're not prepared to do any work (i.e. searching) yourself, while you make us waste time trying to answer unimportant questions. In general, it's considered polite to do a minimum effort to try to find the answer yourself. If Google and Wikipedia cannot answer whatever question you have, then of course you're free to ask them to us

[Jackfraser24]

11 hours ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

I think what annoys people is that they're all very simple questions that a 1min Google or Wikipedia search could answer. Asking these questions without giving any reason why the answers Google or Wikipedia provide don't suffice, nor stating why you're interested, gives the impression that you're not prepared to do any work (i.e. searching) yourself, while you make us waste time trying to answer unimportant questions. In general, it's considered polite to do a minimum effort to try to find the answer yourself. If Google and Wikipedia cannot answer whatever question you have, then of course you're free to ask them to us

Thanks

[Jackfraser24]

Would a Japanese Nakajima Ki 44 be possible to model? Just considering that there are no more air frames around today.

[Nickkyboy99]

On 2/4/2022 at 2:41 AM, Jackfraser24 said:

Why are the Polish PZL 11s in 1946? Were they on the Eastern Front too?

No, but the Polish PZL.23 Karaś was used on the Eastern Front under Romanian service.

 

Would be a nice collector plane for Stalingrad ? 

[Jackfraser24]

Now I know the IL-2 Great Battles creator cannot do everything on this list, and some of these would not be worth their time, money or energy (like bombers or very rare aircraft types) but I just want to ask about if any of these following planes have any place on the Great Battles plane list.

 

Or American fighter variants like the:

• P 38 (E, F, G, H, J (more sub variants), L,
• P 39 (C, D, F, K, L (more sub variants), M, N or Q)
• P 400
• P 40 (B, C, F, K, M, N, Tomahawk or Kittyhawk)
• P 47 (D (more sub variants); C, G, M & N)
• P 51 (more B, C or D sub variants, K, H

Or American Bombers like the:

• A 20 (B (more sub variants), C, G, H, or J)
• A 26 (B, C,
• B 25 (B, C, D (more sub variants), G, H, or J)
• B 26 (B, C, F or G)

Or British Fighters like the:

• Hawker Hurricane Mk-I and IV
• Hawker Sea Hurricane
• Supermarine Spitfire Mk- Va or c, Mk- VIII, Mk- IXc or Mk- XVI
• Supermarine Seafire
• Bristol Beaufighter
• deHavilland Mosquito Mk IV

Or British bombers like the:

• Vickers Wellington
• Fairey Firefly
• Fairey Swordfish
• Fairey Barracuda
• Blenheim
• Beaufort

Or Soviet Fighters like the:

• I 16 (more variants)
• I 153
• MIG 3 (more variants)
• LaGG-3 (more variants (before and after the Series 29 (Series 4-66)))
• La 5 (more variants)
• Yak 9 (way more variants)

Or Soviet Bombers like the:

• Tu TB-3
• Tu SB-2
• Tu 2
• IL 4 (main soviet medium bomber)
• Su 2
• Pe 2 (more variants)
• Pe 3
• Pe 8

Or German Fighters like the:

• Bf 110 C or D
• He 162
• He 219
• Me 210
• Me 163
• Do 335
• Ta 152

Or German bombers like the:

• Hs 123
• He 111 (H (more sub variants before the H-6, before the H 16 and then subsequent sub variants) P (P-1 to P-6)
• He 115 or He 177
• Ju 86
• Ju 87 (B (B-1 or B-2) or D-5)
• More Ju 88 A sub variants (A-1 to A-17) G, S series)
• Ju 188 or Ju 388
• Or the Do 217 (E, K, M, J or N)

Or Italian fighters like the:

• Fiat C.R.42
• Fiat G.50
• Macchi M.C.200
• Macchi M.C.202 (other variants)

Or Italian bombers like the:

• Fiat B.R.20
• CANT Z.506
• CANT Z.1007
• SM.81
• SM.79
• SM.84

I know that is a lot of questions but I'd like to hear what you think. Thank you

[PatrickAWlson]

On 2/3/2022 at 5:50 PM, BlitzPig_EL said:

You know, there are these things called books.  You should try them.

 

I ask questions too.  If I had to buy hundreds of dollars worth of books and read them all, hoping to gain the snippet of information I need in the moment, I wouldn't do it.  I will sometimes spend a non-trivial amount of time searching the internet but quite often this information is quite esoteric and not easily found.

[Jackfraser24]

Why the Ta-152 should be passed for consideration.

• Beautiful aircraft. Many people will want to have one in their hanger.
• About ~150 were built. Not many. All the more special.
• Did play some roles in the last months of the war. They protected Me-262s while they were taking off and landing.
• Would be useful in Bodenplatte and in a hypothetical Berlin module to protect Me-262s from enemy fighters.
• Very fast plane with a maximum speed of 752 km/h. The Fw-190 D-9 only had a maximum speed of 690 km/h. When Kurt Tank flew the aircraft himself he was intercepted by American P-51s but he escaped simply by flying the plane at full throttle.
• Decent range of about 1,200 km. The Fw-190 D-9 had less than 840 km.
• Good rate of climb (20m/s at full capacity).
• It’s cannons could pack a strong punch.

[Jackfraser24]

Why the Curtiss Tomahawk should be passed for consideration. 

• Would appeal to Warhawk fans. One version would just not compensate for the 12,000+ P-40 units manufactured.
• Would be historically relevant for Moscow and Stalingrad. There were more Tomahawks used in Moscow than the P-40E variant.
• In the hands of a skilled pilot, it was a match for the Bf-109 E/F variants.
• Would help diversify the 1941-42 VVS lend lease aircraft further. Right now we only have the P-40E and the Hurricane Mk.II, (sorry if I have missed anything out). 
• Nevertheless it was a very challenging aircraft to fly, as it was prone to maintenance problems. Could withstand clumsy  landings. 
• We need more 1941-42 aircraft in general. 

[Jackfraser24]

Why the Ju-86 should be passed for consideration.

• Would be a cool aircraft to have. Nobody makes an aircraft so good to fly like 1CGS.
• Would appeal to Hungarian players because it was used extensively with the RHAF. 
• War Thunder doesn’t have an actual Ju-86 yet (they have a Saab B3C, but it’s just not the same).
• Would Have a purpose in Moscow and Stalingrad by creating pilot career missions.
• Could carry 907kg worth of bombs, meaning a light load for a plan with 1,000 hp engines (Ju-86 R).
• Range of 1,577 km/h. Plenty of range for short range bombing of  facilities or mobile ground targets.
• Service ceiling of 12,999 metres, meaning could be used as a high altitude bomber (R).
• Had 3 turrets for crew to defend themselves. One at the nose, one rear facing on near the tail the and one retractable turret on the belly. Adequately defended.

[Jackfraser24]

I think we need a lot more early Eastern Front aircraft (1941-42) like the:

 

Soviet

• Bell P-400
• Curtiss P-40 B/C
• Curtiss P-40M
• Douglas A-20C
• Ilyushin DB-3b
• Ilyushin DB-3M
• Ilyushin DB-3T
• Ilyushin DB-3F
• IL-2 series 1
• IL-2 series 2
• IL-2 series 3
• IL-4
• LaGG-3 series 4
• LaGG-3 series 35
• MiG-3 bis
• MiG-3 (additional series)
• Pe-2 series 1
• Pe-3 
• Pe-3 bis
• Pe-8
• Polikarpov I-15bis
• Polikarpov I-153 M-62
• Polikarpov I-153 P
• Polikarpov I-16 Type 5
• Polikarpov I-16 Type 6
• Polikarpov I-16 Type 18
• Polikarpov R-5
• Polikarpov R-10
• Tupolev SB 2M-100A
• Tupolev SB 2M-103
• Tupolev TB-3 4M-17
• Tupolev TB-3 4M-34R

Axis

• Bf-109 E-3
• Bf-109 E-4
• Bf-110 C
• Bf-110 D
• Do-17 Z
• Fiat G.50
• Fw-189 A-2
• Fw-190 A-4
• He-111 H-2
• He-111 H-3
• Hs-123 A-1
• Hs-129 B-1
• Ju-86
• Ju-87 B-2
• Ju-88 A-14
• Mc-200 series 1
• Mc-200 series 3
• Mc-200 series 7
• Me-210 Ca-1
• Me-323
• Re.2000
• Re.2001
• Re.2002

Edited August 11, 2022 by Jackfraser24

[Jackfraser24]

Why the Me-323 Gigant should be in the game.

• Would appeal to players who like to fly cargo planes.
• It was a pretty big plane.
• This plane has six engines. “It’s a completely different kind of flying.” - Airplane!, 1980
• Was used on the Eastern Front after the end of the North African campaign.
• Durable towards machine gun damage due to it being made predominately out of wood.
• Had it’s own defensive armament - 5 7.92mm machine guns.
• Would be good to have a German transport aircraft other than the Ju-52.

[BOO]

3 minutes ago, Jackfraser24 said:

Why the Me-323 Gigant should be in the game.

• Would appeal to players who like to fly cargo planes.
• It was a pretty big plane.
• This plane has six engines. “It’s a completely different kind of flying.” - Airplane!, 1980
• Was used on the Eastern Front after the end of the North African campaign.
• Durable towards machine gun damage due to it being made predominately out of wood.
• Had it’s own defensive armament - 5 7.92mm machine guns.
• Would be good to have a German transport aircraft other than the Ju-52.

I think the JU52 with its 3 engines causes enough bafflement for many even it 2 throttles can operate it well enough. 6 (six) engines would likely limit its appeal simply as a result of their managment. I also understand that the aircraft employed 2 flight engineers to sync the engines. Not sure how that would be incorporated or modelled.

 

Next up, use. In MP, if your are up high looking down, in many situations the aircraft below appear a silvery white. For fighters its not too bad, for Ju52s its death. For the 323 with would be akin to a floating lake passing underneath. Add to that its about as agile as continent and I cant see anyone needing to learn to land it.

 

22/04/43 puts the notition of durability to fire into question. 17 lost from a flight of 26. Turkey shoot. By the times its in service Many allied hunters were using cannon and very heavy calibre MGs.

 

Its big. Skins are 4K. Its size would likley yeild the same type of resolution the old 2K skins did on the bombers. Not very appealing 

 

Its extinct. There is nothing much left of these monsters to take reference from unless you want to do mix air diving. Not imposible to recreate in some fashion but unlikley an ideal subject.