Typhoon bug | Recorded 14G | Pilot instant killed while pulling out of a dive

[-332FG-Stravinsky]

So this is something that I had been suffering from in the Typhoon while doing high speed strafe runs. I first thought I was the one not managing my speed correctly, since I had some occurrences of ripping a Tempest's wing off in the past. But this is something I'm pretty sure should not happen:

 

My pilot gets intant killed consistently if I manage to get above 360 kph and pull the stick all the way back for as short as half a second. Now I would already be quite surprised if the execution would make the pilot instant black out, as I should probably feel some resistance when initiating a very high G manoeuvre. But having my pilot instant killed made me look at the G meter and as shown at 0:36, it appears to be recording 14G spikes.

 

After some experiment I managed to get my pilot killed once by G manoeuvring in the Tempest as well. Please have a look at it as it renders the Typhoon pretty much useless if it can't pull out of a high speed strafe run.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 15, 2021 by -332FG-Stravinsky

[Legioneod]

You're pulling far too hard/quick on the stick, slow/gentle is the way to do it.

 

Edited December 15, 2021 by Legioneod

[-332FG-Micky-]

How does the elevator even have that much authority to begin with? 14G’s is a bit ridiculous if you ask me. A Raptor doesn’t even pull 14G’s..SMH

[354thFG_Rails]

How about we not have pilots be insta killed while pulling high g? Or better yet maybe.. just maybe look at the FM of planes?

22 minutes ago, Legioneod said:

You're pulling far too hard/quick on the stick, slow/gentle is the way to do it.

 

 

[357th_Dog]

27 minutes ago, Legioneod said:

You're pulling far too hard/quick on the stick, slow/gentle is the way to do it.

 

You're blaming pilot error for a 350 knot dive producing a spike of 14g's? 

 

[-332FG-Stravinsky]

1 hour ago, Legioneod said:

You're pulling far too hard/quick on the stick, slow/gentle is the way to do it.

 

I've got 1100+ hours in the game, I know that pulling all the way back on the stick can make you black out, I know it can compromise the airframe integrity (ie. rip your wing off) . I know a pilot shouldn't die from pulling G in itself.

 

I'm filling a complaint, not asking for tips

Edited December 15, 2021 by -332FG-Stravinsky

[Legioneod]

1 hour ago, 357th_Dog said:

You're blaming pilot error for a 350 knot dive producing a spike of 14g's? 

 

Not really, It was more of a joke. Originally had ?At the end but removed it. Should have kept it in the original comment.

Strange how he could even pull 14g at that speed.

50 minutes ago, -332FG-Stravinsky said:

I've got 1100+ hours in the game, I know that pulling all the way back on the stick can make you black out, I know it can compromise the airframe integrity (ie. rip your wing off) . I know a pilot shouldn't die from pulling G in itself.

 

I'm filling a complaint, not asking for tips

G forces can kill you, but I'm not sure you should have died that quick. Even relatively low g can kill over a prolonged period of time.

[RedKestrel]

Is this something recent from the latest patch or has it happened before that?  From the video the spike looks nearly instantaneous- from 2 straight to 14. No way should you be able to pull that amount of Gs.

 

I would record a track file and post it along with the video in the Technical Issues thread.

[AEthelraedUnraed]

Let's throw some numbers in here. Just before the aircraft falls apart, the dial (which I assume is MPH as it says) shows around 365 MPH, which in scientific terms equals about 163 m/s. With 12.5g (the lowest possible value that would be rounded to 13, minus the one g you get "for free" because of gravity), this gives a turn radius of around 217m (v^2/[9.8*g]). 360 times the speed divided by the total circumference of a 217m circle gives 43 degrees per second instantaneous turn in order to reach an indicated 14G at that speed. I agree that sounds a bit much.

 

That said, why on earth would you pull so hard as to even get remotely close to 14G? Even in aircraft that won't insta-kill you, it may easily throw you into a high-speed stall/spin or damage the control surfaces, if they don't make you lawndart into the ground first because of a loss of control authority. Your statement:

3 hours ago, -332FG-Stravinsky said:

it renders the Typhoon pretty much useless if it can pull out of a high speed strafe run.

is moot; the Typhoon is perfectly capable of pulling out of a high speed strafe run, and does it pretty well too. Just not by yanking the stick back as fast as you can.

 

You're testing the flight model at its very limits. The FM is at its core a discrete-timed physics simulation, and with such high speeds and fast control inputs (from neutral to all the way back in 0.5s) the step size is simply too small to handle the enormous forces that result. Frankly, it doesn't surprise me that the simulation explodes. Each physics simulation has its limits, and apparently you've found IL2's. Personally I think it's a good thing when the FM inaccuracies show up in extreme edge cases rather than the normal usecase, as that means the core model is fine (or at least, it doesn't show it's not).

 

Still, as RedKestrel says, you could record a track and post it in the Technical Issues thread. With edge cases like these there's usually something that can be done to mitigate or work around the problem, even if that comes in the form of ugly "if (speed > 150mps) { control_force.clip_to_half() }" statements.

[-332FG-Stravinsky]

2 hours ago, RedKestrel said:

Is this something recent from the latest patch or has it happened before that?  From the video the spike looks nearly instantaneous- from 2 straight to 14. No way should you be able to pull that amount of Gs.

 

I would record a track file and post it along with the video in the Technical Issues thread.

Can't say for sure. Like I said I've had wings ripped off flying in the Tempest in the past after recovering from overhead attack on bombers. I had myself instant killed only once before the night of the recording flying the Typhoon, by doing strafe runs on a target. One approach I had to pull out a little late and I died instantly, made me second question myself at first but I forgot about it. Thought maybe it was AA that had shot me.

 

The video has been recorded on our server, so I was sure it wasn't AA this time around. Will follow the advice. Thanks

[616Sqn_Johnny-Red]

@-332FG-Stravinsky Your concern is legitimate but should be raised as a bug report rather than a complaint:

 

 

Remember to follow the published guidelines at the start of the thread and to properly evidence your observation of anomalous or dysfuctional gameplay with tracks, video, screenshots, TacView data, etc.

 

Good luck with your report:

[-332FG-Stravinsky]

3 hours ago, 616Sqn_Johnny-Red said:

@-332FG-Stravinsky Your concern is legitimate but should be raised as a bug report rather than a complaint:

 

 

Remember to follow the published guidelines at the start of the thread and to properly evidence your observation of anomalous or dysfuctional gameplay with tracks, video, screenshots, TacView data, etc.

 

Good luck with your report:

Thanks will record more data and publish it in there

[Roland_HUNter]

I tried with the Tempest, instant 13+ G, wing broken, but the pilot is alive.

[ACG_Dickie]

Please fix.  Tails came off these,  pilots were poisoned by CO, but wings coming off.........

[-332FG-Stravinsky]

20 hours ago, Roland_HUNter said:

I tried with the Tempest, instant 13+ G, wing broken, but the pilot is alive.

 

I managed to kill my pilot from Gs only once in the Tempest and it was after ripping a wing off when the aircraft started yanking itself down the sky.

[=420=Syphen]

In real life I don't even think the pilots would have the physical strength to produce that instantaneous force in the elevator at those speeds.

[Denum]

On 12/18/2021 at 5:28 AM, =420=Syphen said:

In real life I don't even think the pilots would have the physical strength to produce that instantaneous force in the elevator at those speeds.

 

Probably couldn't.

 

It's strange you can do the same in the 109/190 and live though.

 

Still need to try it again and see if I can blast 14gs

[FTC_Prancing]

On 12/16/2021 at 9:40 PM, ACG_Dickie said:

Please fix.  Tails came off these,  pilots were poisoned by CO, but wings coming off.........

Must be a cock-up, will fix.

[Ryanair_buffoon5321]

Had the same glitch. In reality I pulled probably around 6 g's is my guess. Instead game said 14 g's, wing ripped and instant died. I am sorry I do not have proof but I am 100% sure this is real and a glitch with the typhoon right now. Please fix this the Typhoon is unplayable at the moment. 

[PopsiclePete]

Just died to it myself online, so checked in offline, and it seems like the typhoons “limiter” has been disable for the pitch controls? ?‍♂️
 

If you watch the stick in the cockpit, it seems to be pulled 100% instantly, as if you were on the ground. Whereas the stick movement in the tempest, spitix, and 190a3 are limited by the speed.

[JG27*PapaFly]

The Typhoon is not the only plane with that "feature". I've successfully killed myself with high g in Tempest and Spitfire, too. Works best when coming out of negative g with too much stick pressure. This is similar to why you'd sometimes apply left rudder just before pushing right rudder for a hammerhead i.e. you add aerodynamic load to one side of the plane so you use it to assist the following maneuver. I assume several other planes might give you suicidal pitch authority when pulling out of a negative alpha attitude.

 

This makes me love my 190s even more. I've never been able to pull such goofy gs there, so they are really well balanced in terms of pitch authority vs speed.

[357th_KW]

Now that we have custom input profiles, I started putting a 20% input curve on the various RAF planes that suffer from this malady.  I found it makes a big difference, and makes them much easier to fly without accidentally ripping wings off etc.