Trying to get to the bottom of a Mig-3 issue

[conure]

Edit: With a bit of forum digging I found my answer here if anyone's interested - 

 

 

Hello all,

 

I recently started flying the Mig3 in a BoM campaign and I've seen online there's a lot of talk about the flaps. I raised this on the Finnish server discord and it resulted in a huge amount of disagreement with no consensus.

 

Perhaps I am doing things wrong, but this is the a description of the issue which makes no sense to me:

(Numbers are made up but I believe the point stands)

1: Approaching airfield to landing and reduce speed, I want 10 degrees of flaps so I hold the extend flaps button, the limiter lowers to 10 degrees, then I release the button and the flaps drop to 10 degrees.

 

2: I'm flying base and I want to reduce flaps to 20 degrees at this point, so I hold the limiter down until 20 degrees and the flaps come up(??), then drop back down to 20 degrees.

3: I'm flying final and I want to reduce flaps to 40 degrees at this point, so I hold the limiter down until 40 degrees and the flaps come up again, then drop back down to 40 degrees.

 

 

Suffice to say there are two points in which I totally lose flaps. I don't think I need to explain how catastrophic this could (and will, on final) be. 

I am left with only one option to effectively land the machine - I slow down and drop full landing flaps, and don't touch them again. I have no fine grained control of flaps and they might as well be an on off switch.

 

Am I doing something wrong / missing a control? If my interpretation of the controls is correct, this is a fundamental flaw in the behaviour which results in a total loss of additional lift during critical phases of flight.

 

The fact it turned into a large debate on discord showed me that people don't seem to know either way.

 

Can anyone clarify this please?

Edited December 14, 2021 by conure

[AEthelraedUnraed]

This is historical. The flap angle on the real-life MiG was only adjustable with flaps retracted.

 

The in-game problem with the MiG flaps is unrelated, namely that the flaps are currently only retractable by setting the angle to 0, while it should be a simple single button press. 

[conure]

15 minutes ago, AEthelraedUnraed said:

This is historical. The flap angle on the real-life MiG was only adjustable with flaps retracted.

 

The in-game problem with the MiG flaps is unrelated, namely that the flaps are currently only retractable by setting the angle to 0, while it should be a simple single button press. 

So if I'm reading what you're saying correctly, in reality a pilot would need to go:
Flaps 20, Flaps 0, Flaps 40, to get to flaps 40? Because you said the flap angle on the mig is only adjustable with them retracted.

 

If so, how would you go from flaps 20 to flaps 40 without losing your lift provided by flaps? I'm unsure of what the game problem vs the real problem is.

 

Thanks for your response.

[AEthelraedUnraed]

2 hours ago, conure said:

So if I'm reading what you're saying correctly, in reality a pilot would need to go:
Flaps 20, Flaps 0, Flaps 40, to get to flaps 40? Because you said the flap angle on the mig is only adjustable with them retracted.

As far as I understand, the real-life flap procedure would go something like this (starting at takeoff):

Set flaps to 20 or so -> Extend flaps -> Take off -> Retract flaps -> Set flaps to whatever setting you plan to use in combat -> Fly for a bit, extend and retract flaps as required -> Go on approach/downwind with flaps retracted -> Set flaps to 40 -> Go crosswind -> Extend flaps -> Land -> Drink Vodka.

 

I admit, it doesn't give the flexibility of the switch-controlled fully adjustable flaps some of the more modern planes have. But I think it's a nice compromise between fully adjustable but slow flaps like in the Bf-109 and the fast/easy to use but not adjustable flaps of e.g. the Spitfire and Yak.

[CAFulcrum]

Isn't it common practice for most planes to put the flaps at one position (full down) for landing?  I would think you'd want maximum drag on the plane, and not to be introducing any further variation in control at that critical point in the flight envelope...

[AEthelraedUnraed]

2 hours ago, CAFulcrum said:

Isn't it common practice for most planes to put the flaps at one position (full down) for landing?  I would think you'd want maximum drag on the plane, and not to be introducing any further variation in control at that critical point in the flight envelope...

For the landing itself, yes, but if I'm not mistaken, it's pretty common to increase the flap angle you proceed from flight to approach to final. That way you can gently reduce speed and altitude without as large a sudden effect on lift that the flaps of e.g. the Spit, Yak or Mig can have.

[IckyATLAS]

This is my personal point of view and just as a gut feeling.

If we consider a fighter plane in combat zone, the most dangerous situation is during takeoff and landing. If attacked in that situation you are a sitting duck and will be shot down 90% of the time. You are slow with very limited maneuverability and cannot fight back.

So this means that when you want to land (ex. short on fuel) with potentially enemy fighters around better be it short and quick. This means you keep speed and then cut engine, down flaps max and on the runway you go and stop, get out and take cover.

The Mig3 maybe has the flaps being designed with that in mind, and not for progressive flaps motion.