Aircraft theoritycal groung handling optional - With massive engine power like Tempest aircraft

[Rhubard]

I do not complain often in any way in regard with this simulator, I really enjoy it.
But I also have this bit of complaining to do. An aircraft with 2000 HP like the Tempest, that feel as easy to handle like a Cessna on take off, well it is disappointing.

I known that modelling an aircraft that is no longer part of this world is not be easy, and even impossible,  I feel that we could have an option  for a best approximation of it. In my case on take off and landing.

When I read about a pilot experience of a powerful engine on take off, with a spitfire, that it could turn upside down  a plane on take off it you are not gentle with throttle power, I am a bit disappointed with the behavior of certain plane.

I would not mind an option like, die to take off if you don't know what your doing, or practise take off a 100 times before you can do a so so good take off. 

If you wander what I mean about torque on take of, watch this documentary, SPITFIRE the plane that saved the world. Pilot Tom Neil have a very strait definition of it; when engine power is so that an aircraft turn around the propeller rather than the propeller around the aircraft.

Thank you you for considering this option.

 

 

[cardboard_killer]

I believe someone complaining about the ease of taxing and take offs is a first for this forum.

[AEthelraedUnraed]

I don't know about you, but I've noticed a high propensity for ground looping in multiple aircraft, such as the Fw-190 and the Spitfire, if you control them improperly. In fact, many people have complained they ground loop too easily. Is there any specific reason, supported by data, why you believe otherwise?

[DD_Arthur]

Hello Rhubard, yes I agree engine torque effects are under modelled at the moment in my opinion.

Hopefully, in the future the devs can take another look at engine power effects generally.

[Winkysmith]

18 hours ago, Rhubard said:

I do not complain often in any way in regard with this simulator, I really enjoy it.
But I also have this bit of complaining to do. An aircraft with 2000 HP like the Tempest, that feel as easy to handle like a Cessna on take off, well it is disappointing.

I known that modelling an aircraft that is no longer part of this world is not be easy, and even impossible,  I feel that we could have an option  for a best approximation of it. In my case on take off and landing.

When I read about a pilot experience of a powerful engine on take off, with a spitfire, that it could turn upside down  a plane on take off it you are not gentle with throttle power, I am a bit disappointed with the behavior of certain plane.

I would not mind an option like, die to take off if you don't know what your doing, or practise take off a 100 times before you can do a so so good take off. 

If you wander what I mean about torque on take of, watch this documentary, SPITFIRE the plane that saved the world. Pilot Tom Neil have a very strait definition of it; when engine power is so that an aircraft turn around the propeller rather than the propeller around the aircraft.

Thank you you for considering this option.

 

 

Ah, dear Tom. He was such a wonderful orator, wasn’t he? I was fortunate enough to get a print of Mark Postlethwaite’s painting ‘A Stuka In My Sights’ that was actually signed by Tom Neil in pencil. It’s just such an honour for me to own and display it, to tell just a bit of his story to visitors who otherwise wouldn’t have asked about him. He deserves that. All of these great men do. Unfortunately, not many people now care about them and what they did for us.

 

Hoping this finds you all in good health,

William

Edited December 12, 2021 by Winkysmith

[Rhubard]

I Winkysmith,

I didn't know Tom Neil before I watched this documentary yesterday. Really well done.

If Tom's writing is as good as his narrative ability is, then all his book must be wonderful to read.

Here a list for holiday reading;

From Wikipedia,

Neil wrote a number of books on his experiences:

• From the Cockpit: Spitfire (Ian Allan Publishing, 1990)
• Onward to Malta: Memoirs of a Hurricane Pilot in Malta, 1941 (Airlife Publications, 1992)
• Flight into Darkness (Air Research Publications, 2006)
• Questions of Guilt and Other Stories: The Stories of Wing Commander Tom Neil (Red Kite Publications, 2008)
• Gun Button to Fire: A Hurricane Pilot's Dramatic Story of the Battle of Britain (Amberley Publishing, 2010)
• The Silver Spitfire: The Story of his own Personal Aircraft (W&N, 2013)
• Portrait of an Airman: A Dramatic Story of Love, Courage, and Sacrifice amid the Tumult and Trauma of War (Red Kite Publications, 2015)
• Jonathan Kerr: A Story of Heroism, Tragedy, Friendship, and Ambition Inspired (2015)
• Scramble!: The Dramatic Story of a Young Fighter Pilot's Experiences During the Battle of Britain & the Siege of Malta (Amberley Publishing, 2015)
• Acts of Fate (Red Kite Publications, 2017)

[PatrickAWlson]

On 12/12/2021 at 8:04 AM, DD_Arthur said:

Hello Rhubard, yes I agree engine torque effects are under modelled at the moment in my opinion.

Hopefully, in the future the devs can take another look at engine power effects generally.

 

Never flown a real plane, but I can't imagine what else they should do to make ground handling and takeoff harder.  In fighters I have to apply nearly full rudder at the start to keep from spinning out on takeoff.   I cannot get the Ju88, He111, or the Hs129 off the ground for the life of me.  The torque is so string it overcomes the rudder and you have to toe tap the brakes to get them airborne.  By the time I do get to level flight - if I get that far - I have done irreparable harm to the engine.  

 

These planes were flown by 20 something year olds who did not have hundreds of hours of flight time.  They could not have required master pilots to taxi out and get airborne.

[Denum]

Unfortunately there is a pretty serious lack of P-effects in game. 


The P51 and Griffon shouldn't be able firewall the throttle at low speed, same with the 109s hanging on the prop at full throttle and maintaining full control. 
 

 

Even the differences between the FMs can be quite surprising at times. Aircraft like the P47/Typhoon genuinely punish you if flown poorly. Spitfire tends to do inverted flat spins if you push to many negative Gs while slow.

Mean while I can take the A3/109s and ham fist them at 500ft and get away with it. 



Would love to see it all updated but it may not ever happen.

Edited December 13, 2021 by Denum

[DD_Arthur]

2 hours ago, PatrickAWlson said:

Never flown a real plane, but I can't imagine what else they should do to make ground handling and takeoff harder.  

 

These planes were flown by 20 something year olds who did not have hundreds of hours of flight time.  

 

It does not need to be harder,  just more realistic in my opinion.   The allied twenty-somethings did have hundreds of hours of flight time btw.

[Rhubard]

I DD_Arthur

exactly what I have in mind, more realistic, in any possible way.

But more realistic will make it a bit more of a challenge to fly, and more fun.

Denum really dig what engine torque will do to you.

And i realize that this game purpose is to have realistic combat experience, so I the line of Denum, I get that it is not a priority and might never be implemented.

But if you dream about it.... they will.. you know the rest.

[Denum]

It's all about time and money.

 

They need to make enough to justify the time for it. 

 

?

 

Tell your friends it's time to sim! 

Edited December 14, 2021 by Denum

[[F.Circus]FrangibleCover]

And here I am trying to work out the coded message in the blue highlighted words. Dakota confirmed again?

 

Light blues are "Cessna approximation behaviour"... One of the high wing army cooperation aircraft? I bet they handled like a Cessna.

[VA_Kamicosmos]

As someone who has flown small aircraft, yeah you need to use the rudder to keep the plane straight on takeoff, even with a mere 150 horsepower.  And the planes I've flown have all been tricycle gear, with a steerable nose wheel.  Taildraggers are a whole different thing.  There's a reason you get a Tailwheel endorsement on your license!

 

The HS129 is tricky, I balled it up a couple times till I learned to just use the brakes while taxiing.  Get that tail off the ground asap so you can use the rudder once it becomes effective.  I have yet to land it successfully, but I've only flown it 4 times (just picked it up a few days ago in the sale) I'm not sure why it's so tricky to handle though, especially with the counter rotating, underpowered engines.  Maybe it's the single tail?  I'll have to try the ME110 and see if it's ground handling is better with it's twin tails.

 

The 109 feels 'right', I guess.  You have to dance back and forth a bit, you don't just hold Left Rudder and go.  Add in a bit of a crosswind, and it can get exciting on two wheels!