Could you really see exhaust stack flames in daylight?

[KPnutskgwanchos]

Sorry this question drifts in and out of my mind but never thought it quite interesting enough to ask! ... Always thought the stack flames where cool but don't ever recall seeing any sign of them at air shows etc ... would you only really see them in low light (unless shrouded) IRL ?  

[ROCKET_KNUT]

In game you can see nav. lights for miles... Only fair to have visible exhaust stack flames as well, I guess.

[Beebop]

I watched the I-16 fire up it's engine at the Flying Heritage Museum in broad daylight.  During initial ignition there were one or two bright exhaust flames and smoke puffs then nothing after that but it was effin' LOUD!  Those pilots must have suffered hearing loss.  Anyway I didn't see any exhaust flames or exhaust smoke for the duration of it's flight.  Same with every other plane.  Those exhausts should only be visible toward the end of dusk and in the night but only for 100~500 meters.  Beyond that they shouldn't be visible at all I wouldn't think.  (They don't fly those old warbirds at night so can't confirm or deny).

 

They are "Hollywood Eye Candy".  I think they look cool but they are not at all realistic during daylight hours.

 

Here's some actual footage of startups and flying;

 

BF 109G-6, Spitfire MkXVII (she puts on a good initial show with un-burned fuel at startup), P-51D, Hawker Sea Fury, Yak-3, 109G-14, PBY Catalina, T-6 Texan and 2 T-28 Trojans. 

Some smoke, no fire except the G-6 and Spitty.

 

AND;

 

 

These from the Flying Heritage Museum, and some other museums.  The A6M Zero, Ki-43 Oscar, B-25J, B-24 Liberator, B-17G, B-29 Superfortress, DC-3, another PBY, P-47D28. F6F Hellcat, P-40C, P-38, F4U Corsair, F7F Tigercat, P-51B, another P-51D, Hurricane Mk.XIIa, Spitfire Mk.Vc, Spitfire Mk. IXe, Fi-156 Storch, Bf 109E-3, FW 190A-5, the only flyable IL-2M3 in the world, (I have the pilots autograph), I-16 Rata, Po-2/U-2VS.

 

I have had the good fortune and pleasure of seeing most of these plane fly and can attest the exhaust flames and smoke (with the already noted exceptions) were not Photoshopped out of these videos. ?

 

 

As for the nav lights that's discussed ad nauseam elsewhere.

[KPnutskgwanchos]

Some wonderful sights and sounds there BeeBop ... thank you! ? 

[HBPencil]

The visibility of the exhaust in daylight does seem to be over done imo... but just for fun here's a vid of a Spit T.9 being run in the dark.
 

 

[BlitzPig_EL]

A long time ago this incorrect graphic was discussed.  In daylight you should not see exhaust flames/glow at the stacks except on start up.  Same goes for the new "feature" of exhaust "flames" on tanks.  Nope nope nope...  This is a cheesy Hollywood CGI effect that has no place in a simulation.  The effect on aircraft is especially egregious because the "flame" should be nearly constant at all of the stacks, not the single flicker that follows the firing order of the engine as if filmed in super slow motion.  

[Diggun]

Was the thinking behind this not to enable flyers of the Soviet aircraft in the original BoS to be able to tell whether their mixture was set correctly for altitude by observing the colour of the exhaust flames?

[Trooper117]

I've been to many airshows, and apart from initial start up I've never seen visible exhaust flames with the naked eye when the planes are in flight.

Pilots during WWII give accounts of being vectored towards enemy aircraft in low light or at night, but only when close enough could they see the blue exhaust flame to home in on them to engage.

[AEthelraedUnraed]

14 minutes ago, Trooper117 said:

Pilots during WWII give accounts of being vectored towards enemy aircraft in low light or at night, but only when close enough could they see the blue exhaust flame to home in on them to engage.

True, but it's well-attested that exhaust flames were visible at night, were generally the first thing you'd see and often were indeed used to home in on them. In that sense, I'd like to see them a bit more visible at night since I can't remember ever having seen any in-game until I was so close the rest of the aircraft was visible as well.

[BlitzPig_EL]

53 minutes ago, Diggun said:

Was the thinking behind this not to enable flyers of the Soviet aircraft in the original BoS to be able to tell whether their mixture was set correctly for altitude by observing the colour of the exhaust flames?

 

That's what knowing how to read a tachometer is all about.  Adjust mix to give maximum rpm at your throttle setting for the altitude you are at.  Super important on WW1 aircraft because of their very low output engines, and the fact that they exhibit no exhaust flames.

Edited November 22, 2021 by BlitzPig_EL

[Irishratticus72]

My grandfather swore blind that he could see the exhaust flames of German bombers forming up over French airfields during the blitz, from his airfield at Hawkinge. Then again, he also said he once shot down 8 FW190s with just one burst from his cannons, so.......

[Jason_Williams]

The answer is basically no, but we want to make it work like it should in real-life and connect them to the ambient lighting and time of day etc. and this takes some effort. The nav lights are a 3D modeling issue that we don't have time to get to at the moment as we have to update ALL planes that have them.

 

Jason