Is There Such A Thing As "Too Much" GPU for FC VR MP?

[Todt_Von_Oben]

OKAY!  I followed RAKER's instructions and got IL2 BOS & FC1 & FC2 loaded and operational in the new Corsair in one fell swoop.  Couldn't have been easier. 

 

I didn't fly yet; installing controls and VR next.  But I was able to get online at Flugpark and the Flight Recording and Screen Grabs are working.  Everything appears normal; just like it was in my old computer (except)  the half-dozen FR's I'd saved are gone and I haven't loaded my personal skins yet. 

 

Find your activated licenses, click the blue DOWNLOAD tab, and follow the usual Wizard installation prompts.  Easy.  I got it started, came back a half-hour later, and it was done. 

 

I believe I see a graphic improvement in 2D and can't wait to see what it looks like in VR.  But so far so good.

 

Working........   

Edited December 24, 2021 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

LAST CALL!

 

Worked with it on-and-off today.  Got it working in VR; had FC audio but couldn't get past the Oculus home page for a while; then remembered I had a Steam account.  That was the answer. 

 

Flew a QM; Ultra graphics with high everything; Anti-Aliasing at half (2); Clouds high; etc.  About 60fps and no "smearing" at all.  Excellent graphic quality and seamless image integrity now. 

 

I took it to Flugpark and from what I could see it looked as good.  But then the USB for my pedals raised a warning and stopped working.  (Don't exactly have everything set up perfectly; just enough to get it working.) 

 

It's past midnight; satisfied that I got it working in VR.  Next I've got to make a map with all the stick button assignments anyway; so I'm calling it a night.

 

Felt good to fly again.  Been a few months since the Cybertron crashed.  This new rig is nice, thanks again.  

 

One thing I want to do soon is use our Quest 2 headset through the Firewire cable; with the R7-5800X / 3080ti / and 32GB of RAM, I've heard I will see a significant improvement over my CV1.  

 

Prosit!  

 

Edited December 24, 2021 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

 

NEW DESKTOP IMAGE

 

Fills the 49" Samsung perfectly. 

 

On the taskbar: Just enough to maintain, run, and utilize the sim.  Now THAT'S a dedicated gaming computer!  ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 24, 2021 by Todt_Von_Oben

[DD_Arthur]

3 hours ago, Todt_Von_Oben said:

One thing I want to do soon is use our Quest 2 headset through the Firewire cable; with the R7-5800X / 3080ti / and 32GB of RAM, I've heard I will see a significant improvement over my CV1.  

 

Prosit!  

 

 

Good to see you’ve got your new rig running well now Todt.

 

Looking forward to your comparison between the Quest2 and the CV1 as that’s the upgrade I’m looking at too.

 

S!

Edited December 24, 2021 by DD_Arthur

[J2_Bidu]

6 hours ago, Todt_Von_Oben said:

Now THAT'S a dedicated gaming computer!  ?

 

Have fun with your new setup, Todt  Merry Xmas! ?

[Todt_Von_Oben]

Thank you!  You folks made this thread informative for myself or anyone needing help finding or building a gaming computer.  Lots of good info here.  May it help more in the future.  ?

 

I was up 'til early this morning (again) and am feeling pretty well spent right now.  Tonight is Christmas Eve and everything is looking good.  I'm going to kick back and enjoy that warm feeling that comes at the end of a long journey when the goal has been achieved.

 

And for sure; I'll do a graphic comparison of the CV1 and the Quest 2 ASAP.  Gonna have brunch right now, though.  ?

 

Y'all have a wonderful Holiday and Me ka mahalo nui loa e Mele Kelikimaka to all.  ?

[Todt_Von_Oben]

Christmas Day Evening.

 

Up late last night fiddling with it.  Tried getting my stick buttons to work and lost control recognition with the sim.  Had to uninstall and reinstall CH and FC but I got it working again.  No stick button functions except #1 trigger and #3 recycle the gun bolts.  Keypad 5 doesn't center me as well as it did; little things like that to straighten out but I'm up and flying.

 

Went to Flugpark.  Really noticed the difference with the clouds and sunbeams.  No smearing.  I'm on Ultra settings with max Anti-Aliasing and the image is what I would expect it's supposed to be: seamless videographic integrity and continuity. 

 

Went wandering West; attacked a balloon but got my wing shot off and bailed.  I thought it was an SE5A but could be wrong about that.  (See pic)  ?

Edited December 26, 2021 by Todt_Von_Oben

[jollyjack]

Hi TvO. you got it fixed?

otherwise look for dead and no longer needed USB drivers present wit USBdeview.

also you can look for wrong ID# order with JoyID, and change that there.

[Todt_Von_Oben]

11 hours ago, jollyjack said:

Hi TvO. you got it fixed?

otherwise look for dead and no longer needed USB drivers present wit USBdeview.

also you can look for wrong ID# order with JoyID, and change that there.

 

JOLLYJACK

 

Yessir!  I still need to get my stick buttons working but right now I'm flying VR in a CV1 with the CH Fighterstick and throttle, Pro Pedals, with the trigger and bolt-cycling buttons (1 &3) working.  That's it.

 

I've got Oculus and Steam.  When I boot up, Oculus shows up first and gets in the way so I just small that window.  Steam is showing the status of my headset, hand controls, and sensors.  That's what I'm working with so I small that window out, too.

 

Don't even have to wake CH Control Manager up.  I just click the red star, set my game settings to VR, and I'm in.  Easier than before.  

 

Working beautifully.  Ultra settings with maxed Anti-Aliasing; the graphics are noticeably better and the image continuity is seamless: no smearing, hesitations, or anything out of the ordinary.  

 

Will use the Q2 asap but I've got chores to do before that.  ?

 

Without checking, I think I've been down about 5 or 6 months.  Noticed some recent complaints about pilots dying too easily in crackups and bullet impact sounds on enemy planes being too loud.  I did crack up once at Flugpark and died but I think I deserved it; haven't tried crashing gently to test the problem yet but will.

 

But I do think the bullet impact noises need adjustment.  Whether I'm at 150 meters or close enough to clink beer mugs; it sounds the same.  WHACKETY WHACK!  Needs a volume-to-distance adjustment, methinks.

 

Also seeing interesting "arc welder" spark effects and what looks like bullet holes in metal on cloth surfaces.  But I'm not complaining.  It adds a certain amount of graphic satisfaction that I like and think should be maintained for user enjoyment.  

 

Anyway, I'm airborne again but still getting things dialed-in.  Such a relief to have it working; been a long time and the road has been a rough one; as I'm sure you know.  Couldn't have done it without the folks on this thread and I hope this helps someone in the same situation I was in.

 

THANK YOU AND HAPPY BOXING DAY!!!  ?

Edited December 26, 2021 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

DOGFIGHTING AGAIN

 

Been about six months.  The first flights I felt a little airsick in QM but got past it quickly.  Planes are flying great!  Graphics with the 3080ti is amazing even in the CV1.

 

Don't have any working buttons yet; can snap my view around or zoom it.  Have the CH controls set up but not mounted on the Scorpion seat like I had before. Need to do a lot of refinements to the rig now.  Nevertheless, I went up on a Server called HOT BALLS "South of Liege" (basically, like the "Hills" map from ROF) to fly the triplane and ran into a decent Camel jockey there.  I don't know what kind of rig he was flying but the fight was fast and very three-dimensional.  He could fly.  We both had good moments.  I don't think I shot him down so much as he spun in.  I hung around and we fought again; that time I spun in.  Good fights.

 

Later, I saw a server called Defend Amiens so I decided to check it out.  Took off solo and headed West.  Almost to the far side of the mud, I saw three planes coming my way.  Couldn't zoom in and (worse) don't really see that well with lens inserts in the CV1.  I closed from in front and below; they might not have seen me.  They were headed East; might be Brits.  When they got close I thought they were Brisfits and fired not only on the leader's belly but also the third in line.  As he passed over I looked up and saw crosses!  Argh!  ?

 

They didn't return fire.  I fell in behind them and meekly followed until I saw three more planes headed our way from the West.  I angled towards them and this time held my fire until I could see the rondels.  I turned briefly with two of them before getting wounded and incurring some damage to my elevator.  I dived away and broke off; trying to limp all the way back across the mud; a long ways. 

 

It was all I could do to maintain approximate heading and sufficient altitude. 

 

I didn't know all the way back that two Brisfits were following me, criss-crossing each other and doing aerobatics. 

 

They fired on me once and I evaded.  I kept getting closer to my side of the mud.  They fired again.  I didn't want to get shot outright and I figured I was close enough on our side of the lines that I could make it so I jumped and they departed the area; rather than use me for target practice.

 

I landed on our side of the mud, about 300 feet from our trenches.  Guess that means I made it.  ?

 

Anyway, good to be back in the air again and sorry for that friendly fire.  I'll get my rig dialed in so I can see better before I come back. 

 

Prosit!  

[Todt_Von_Oben]

OPERATIONAL QUESTION

 

The Corsair computer I bought has glass side doors.  Generally, glass is a good conductor of heat.  Do you think the computer will run cooler with the glass installed, or with the case open?

 

It seems to be running cool enough with the case open but I would like to prevent stuff or critters from getting inside. 

 

And I'd think fan-ventilated cases are designed to run closed for the best air-flow and cooling.

 

I can go ahead and test it but was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on the subject before I give it a try.

 

Prosit!  ? 

Edited December 29, 2021 by Todt_Von_Oben

[dburne]

It should always run cooler with it closed up, if not there is a ventilation problem.

[jollyjack]

3 hours ago, Todt_Von_Oben said:

OPERATIONAL QUESTION

 

The Corsair computer I bought has glass side doors.  Generally, glass is a good conductor of heat.  Do you think the computer will run cooler with the glass installed, or with the case open?

 

It seems to be running cool enough with the case open but I would like to prevent stuff or critters from getting inside. 

 

And I'd think fan-ventilated cases are designed to run closed for the best air-flow and cooling.

 

I can go ahead and test it but was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on the subject before I give it a try.

 

Prosit!  ? 

 

I assembled my own PC. Have ALL fans blowing outwards, including the GPU corsair watercooler positioned at the front.

On the bottom of the case (only air intake) was an all area sliding general filter, on which i added a thin dust filter layer from my wife's cooking vapor contraption.

Have almost no internal dust that way for 2 years now.

Added one extra small fan aimed at the SSD section because of the rather awkward position of one of them for extra cooling.

[Todt_Von_Oben]

4 hours ago, jollyjack said:

 

I assembled my own PC. Have ALL fans blowing outwards, including the GPU corsair watercooler positioned at the front.

On the bottom of the case (only air intake) was an all area sliding general filter, on which i added a thin dust filter layer from my wife's cooking vapor contraption.

Have almost no internal dust that way for 2 years now.

Added one extra small fan aimed at the SSD section because of the rather awkward position of one of them for extra cooling.

My case sounds like yours but you're drawing exclusively from below and venting sideways.  I can see that.  Heat rises.  Makes sense.

 

My prebuilt came with one aft fan blowing out and three forward fans drawing in all I did was swap the MOBO and GPU; the fans are as it arrived.  When I put my hand nearby they don't seem to be moving much air at all.  Still, it doesn't seem hot in there; barely warm at the CPU.  I'll put on the side walls and see what happens.  So far, the rig seems to be handling FC without complaint.  If it gets hot I'll look in to more / larger fans.

 

Prosit! 

 

 

Edited December 29, 2021 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

CHECK THIS OUT! 

 

Five minutes ago, I was online buying a hard-drive USB docking station so I can recover the FC-related files (skins and such) from my old Cybertron.  I came across this Sky Tech Prism; about the same as what I got for $2700 and a little work, but now it's selling for almost $5200 and only has half the RAM!  So add another $150 or thereabouts; somewhere in the neighborhood of $5400.  That means I got mine at half price.

 

I'm getting the kinks worked out but just have to say this is an amazing computer; so much better than what I had.  The graphic quality and video integrity are impeccable.  Color me happy!  

 

?

 

https://www.amazon.com/SkyTech-Prism-Gaming-Computer-Desktop/dp/B0979QN6B3/ref=pd_lutyp_rtpb_1/141-2948669-9941418?pd_rd_w=KrPWe&pf_rd_p=6c79b04b-ecbc-4460-96b6-0cddfcbe676e&pf_rd_r=K50RGK7FV4VQ32YY5B9R&pd_rd_r=381789a4-8818-4f23-97a7-bc57a949e55d&pd_rd_wg=ta6nX&pd_rd_i=B0979QN6B3&psc=1

Edited December 31, 2021 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

08 JAN 2022

 

Building a basic cockpit floorboard for the seat, stick, and pedals; will be flying it tonight. 

 

Bought a $15 USB Hard Drive Dock and saved my ROF and IL2-FC files from the crashed computer.  Personal skins and all.  Whew!  Thought I'd lost 'em.

 

Haven't gotten Quest 2 working yet but the CV1 looks better now with the 3080ti and it flies smooth as a baby zass.

 

Nice cabinet: black tempered glass, circus lights and all.  I added a little bling to it. ? 

 

Edited January 9, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

On 12/28/2021 at 2:37 PM, dburne said:

It should always run cooler with it closed up, if not there is a ventilation problem.

 

DBURNE: I somehow missed your post.  Thanks!  And you're right. ?

 

I've been running it closed and have no overheating problems whatsoever.  I'm sure you're right about it being designed for flow with the case closed; and I think it's also a thermal property of the tempered glass; absorbs the heat and transfers it outside the case.   That was an enlightened choice on the part of the MFGR.  She's running smooth and cool.  ?

Edited January 9, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

You should really scrap the quest 2 and splurge for a reverb g2.

[Todt_Von_Oben]

On 1/10/2022 at 7:56 PM, -332FG-drewm3i-VR said:

You should really scrap the quest 2 and splurge for a reverb g2.

 

Thanks 332FG.

 

I agree, I need a new headset.  My thoughts on that:

 

I haven't been able to get the Q2 working in the new computer yet; I'm flying FC in Steam VR.  Oculus opens automatically when I'm booting up but now it just stays on the sidelines and I have no problem opening up in Steam anymore. 

 

I tried setting up the Q2 in Oculus but it doesn't recognize the USB as being connected.  I try to fix it and they ask for my Oculus password which I don't remember and have to look up; but those files were in the old computer and to get them out of that C drive I have to load many thousands of old Word files into my new computer and I really don't want to do that; so I'm temporarily screwed there.  Q2 got sidelined and I've been using the CV1 because now it's booting up and working flawlessly.

 

Beyond the low graphic quality, the problem is it's small for my face and the headstrap isn't very comfortable.

 

I've looked at the HP headsets but they seem about the same shape and visual range; never tried one so I don't know.

 

But then there's the Pimak 5K for about $750 or the 8K for about $1300 USD.  200-degree field of vision.  Looks larger and more comfortable on the face.  Pupil spacing goes a little wider than the CV1, which is good for me.  Head strap and speakers look good, too.  I've got welding helmets something like that and they are comfortable.  I'm hoping the Pimak will be the same in that regard,

 

I'm thinking the 5K would be excellent and the 8K would be the "wave of the future." 

 

Price doesn't matter to me; I just want the best graphic experience I can get in a comfortable headset that fits better than my CV1.

 

So whatayathink of the Pimak line of headsets? 

 

P.S. What I have done so far is (1) added a plush bucket seat from a Toyota for comfort; (2) got a good 24" rudder bar working on the Pro Pedals; (3) Got a "glow in the dark" keyboard, masked the keys I use frequently, and sprayed the rest of it flat black.  (Easy to find keys at a glance while peeking out the nose gap.)  (4) And I started building the cockpit framework around my floorboard rig; sized like a Dr.1 cockpit according to the plans.  No "skin" yet but have the basic frame parts in place and it really does add to the realism when I can rest my arms on the cockpit coaming sometimes.  Being able to touch really adds to the immersion.  When I'm surrounded by cockpit walls and the padded ends of the Spandaus are in front of me, that should be a good start, I think.  Maybe a left-wall throttle & mixture control after that.  Working...   

Edited January 28, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

My $.02: Go for the Reverb. There will likely be better headsets out soon and you'd be better served just upgrading to another midrange one since foveated rendering and eye tracking are right around the corner for VR.

[Todt_Von_Oben]

52 minutes ago, -332FG-drewm3i-VR said:

My $.02: Go for the Reverb. There will likely be better headsets out soon and you'd be better served just upgrading to another midrange one since foveated rendering and eye tracking are right around the corner for VR.

 

Do you think the new headsets will be available this year? 

 

Unless there's something much better and more comfortable for a large person, I'm actually happy enough with the CV1 to keep flying it while I concentrate on improving my simulator; maybe get the Q2 going because its graphics are better than the CV1. 

 

Having flown them, can you tell my where the HP is better than the CV1 or Q2?

 

ADDIT: My rig so far:  CH controls with a 24" rudder bar and my "Scorpion" joystrick adapted temporarily  to this floorboard.  Changes planned.

 

Glow-In-The-Dark keyboard with all but essential keys blacked-out; for quick reference through the headset nose gap.

 

Plush automobile seat makes the buzzers in Andre's JetPad a lot more comfortable to sit on, though I haven't got it running yet.  Also have the Buttkicker but haven't installed or got it running in this rig yet.  Coming soon.

 

The wooden framing is my first crude attempt at physically defining the shape of a Fokker Dr.1 cockpit around this floorboard; just some 2X2 and 2X4 lumber and a through-bolt clamping it to the headrest.  The blue 2X2 near the camera swings open vertically for entry.

 

This is still in the "crude expedient" phase to see how things fit.  I've flown it a couple times and it already adds realism to the VR experience.  

 

Something more like an actual Dr.1 cockpit section (tube and skin)  is the goal. 

 

Taking it as simply and economically as I can.  But even so, it's already more like climbing into an airplane.  

 

In QM, I got hit by ejecta and lost a wing; just sat back in the cockpit with my arms on the coaming, watching the groundrush.  And yes, it added noticeably to the sense of realism.

 

I'm looking forward to flying the completed motion simulator; but every step along the way makes my FC VR experience just a little bit better.

 

Working...   

Edited January 28, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

1 hour ago, Todt_Von_Oben said:

 

Do you think the new headsets will be available this year? 

 

Unless there's something much better and more comfortable for a large person, I'm actually happy enough with the CV1 to keep flying it while I concentrate on improving my simulator; maybe get the Q2 going because its graphics are better than the CV1. 

 

Having flown them, can you tell my where the HP is better than the CV1 or Q2?

 

ADDIT: My rig so far:  CH controls with a 24" rudder bar and my "Scorpion" joystrick adapted temporarily  to this floorboard.  Changes planned.

 

Glow-In-The-Dark keyboard with all but essential keys blacked-out; for quick reference through the headset nose gap.

 

Plush automobile seat makes the buzzers in Andre's JetPad a lot more comfortable to sit on, though I haven't got it running yet.  Also have the Buttkicker but haven't installed or got it running in this rig yet.  Coming soon.

 

The wooden framing is my first crude attempt at physically defining the shape of a Fokker Dr.1 cockpit around this floorboard; just some 2X2 and 2X4 lumber and a through-bolt clamping it to the headrest.  The blue 2X2 near the camera swings open vertically for entry.

 

This is still in the "crude expedient" phase to see how things fit.  I've flown it a couple times and it already adds realism to the VR experience.  

 

Something more like an actual Dr.1 cockpit section (tube and skin)  is the goal. 

 

Taking it as simply and economically as I can.  But even so, it's already more like climbing into an airplane.  

 

In QM, I got hit by ejecta and lost a wing; just sat back in the cockpit with my arms on the coaming, watching the groundrush.  And yes, it added noticeably to the sense of realism.

 

I'm looking forward to flying the completed motion simulator; but every step along the way makes my FC VR experience just a little bit better.

 

Working...   

There is no comparison between the CV1 and the Quest 2 and there is no comparison between the Reverb G2 and the Quest 2 because it uses a compressed video signal which hurts performance by introducing latency. The Quest 2 also has lower resolution and worse colors than the Reverb G2...and the Reverb G2 is on sale right now for $450, which for that price, cannot be beat. I picked mine up for only $400. When the 4000 series card and ryzen 5800x3d come along, maybe there will be something mainstream that is better but for bow there is no point going higher end than the G2, when modern GPUs can't render the native resolutions of the Pimax 8k or Varjo Aero.

Edited January 28, 2022 by -332FG-drewm3i-VR

[RAAF492SQNOz_Steve]

The HP G2 would be a very good upgrade from the CV1, for IL2.  The Aero would be an amazing upgrade but your bank account will take a big hit.

 

Apparently, the Aero can maintain quite high fps in IL2 when using a RTX 3090 (disclaimer: my Aero has not been delivered yet so I am on relying on others comments). Some have reported that it does even better than the G2.

[Picchio]

5 hours ago, -332FG-drewm3i-VR said:

there is no point going higher end than the G2, when modern GPUs can't render the native resolutions of the Pimax 8k or Varjo Aero.

 

Finally, the one sensible statement...

[cellinsky]

7 hours ago, -332FG-drewm3i-VR said:

there is no point going higher end than the G2, when modern GPUs can't render the native resolutions of the Pimax 8k or Varjo Aero.

I get constant 60 frames on my 8KX on ultra settings, wich is very much ok for me. For competitive flying, its maybe to low. It boiles down to personal preferences. For me its the immersion that counts. I agree there is no point in going any higher in any way with current hardware. But I think, there is much room for left for optimizing render engines for VR in general.

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

20 hours ago, cellinsky said:

But I think, there is much room for left for optimizing render engines for VR in general.

This statement hits the nail on the head. The big problem with VR is not current hardware, but the neolithic game engines of IL-2 and DCS. For kicks, I recently picked up a laptop (I'm moving so I was trying to see if I could get by with downsizing to a laptop) that I have since returned for reasons other than performance.

 

Desktop specs:

Ryzen 5600X @ 4.85 GHZ (280 mm liquid cooled)

32 GB 3800 MHZ @ CL15

RTX 3080 FE 10 GB GDDR6X

1 TB SSD

 

Laptop specs: 

i7-11800H (undervolted to -.50mv core and cache)

RTX 3070 laptop 110-125W (8 GB DDR6)

16 GB 3200 MHZ Ram @ CL22

1 TB SSD

 

Results? I could still run the Reverb G2 with the laptop at native resolution on high/ultra settings, with about 20 less FPS on Finnish at a time. Granted the desktop was smoother for sure, but both suffered from warping, ghosting, and stuttering at times. Bottom line: since the latest hot fix, IL-2 VR performance is in the toilet no matter your specs. DCS Channel Map with mods now runs better for me, even online! We really need MUCH better software. You can only brute force ancient game engines so much (like at FSX).

Edited January 29, 2022 by -332FG-drewm3i-VR

[Todt_Von_Oben]

LATELY: Been working on the Dr.1 cockpit shell and joystick mod; finally got around to getting the Q2 working with IL2 Flying Circus. 

 

Recognition issues between Oculus and Steam complicated the boot-up; again.  (I'd fixed that with my CV1.)  Had the OEM cable plugged in but only saw the option to go with Airlink.  Still, a lot of (often frustrating) back-and-forth to get it working.

 

The image looked a little better but the mask is too small for me; glasses are a problem; the headphones suck and the headstrap is horrible.  I could pay extra to upgrade most of that but then I'm still stuck with a dinky headset and mediocre graphics.  Nope.  It's my wife's, anyway.  She does Beat Saber and wears it riding roller coasters in our Yaw motion simulator.

 

LATEST: I flew the Q2 yesterday, didn't like the graphics enough to overlook all the other deficiencies, and went back to the CV1 today.  I'll fly that until I find a better headset.  Thanks for your info.  Working....   

Edited February 22, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

On 1/28/2022 at 1:49 AM, cellinsky said:

I get constant 60 frames on my 8KX on ultra settings, wich is very much ok for me. 

 

Thanks for your reply. 

 

I've been seriously looking and the HP G2 is great except for the size; I'd happily buy it but it's too small for my face and doesn't have the pupil-spacing I need.  I also would like a wider field of vision; tired of flying around feeling like Mike Nelson. 

 

Thanks to the folks on this thread, I now have a new gaming computer with a hot and upgradable CPU / GPU combo; so I've been looking at the Pimak 5K and 8K headsets for their potential performance; but mostly because of their physical size and visual range.

 

The 5K  has much higher FPS than I'll ever need; but lower resolution than I'd like. 

 

The 8KX looks great at 90 FPS but can only get that "native" with an RTX 3080 (or higher) GPU.  

 

I've also read the 8KX settings are adjustable via an app called PiTool.  Some say it can be a PITA if you have to dial in the settings for every game you play.  But I only fly FC so that's not a problem for me; and I like the idea of being able to fine-tune the performance.

 

QUESTIONS:

 

1. When you get 60 FPS on Ultra Settings, what GPU card are you running?

 

2. Have you experimented with your settings via PiTool, yet?

 

If you could answer these for me, it would help my research a lot.

 

Thank you!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 23, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

Well, I thought it through, checked what was available, and bought the Pimax 8KX bundled with a DIY upgrade to the DMAS earphones for about $400 less than that would cost if I'd bought both as one unit; and the only guy offering that wouldn't ship to Hawaii.  So....

 

Altogether, this cost me about $1100.00 USD after tax and shipping. 

 

 

I know the G2 only costs a fraction of that and has great graphics and sound; but I'm tired of getting my face squished and seeing the VR world through a 90-degree window.

 

From what I've read, I believe my new Corsair has enough juice to make the 8KX work.  So for better or worse, it's done and we'll soon see how it turns out.

 

Prosit!  ?

Edited February 23, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[cellinsky]

On 2/23/2022 at 10:13 AM, Todt_Von_Oben said:

QUESTIONS:

 

1. When you get 60 FPS on Ultra Settings, what GPU card are you running?

 

2. Have you experimented with your settings via PiTool, yet?

 

If you could answer these for me, it would help my research a lot.

 

I can tell you how I setup things lately in IL2 (or DCS for that matter).

I have a Ryzen 8500X CPU, an  RTX 3090 and 32 GB Ram @ 3200. I do no overclocking and my GPU runs at a modest 75 degrees C on full power.
That said, here my current settings:

Pitool: HMD @ 75 Hz, Render Quality 1.0, FoV small (it is still way more than my G2 and the view is a square not a tube). Everything else on default.
SteamVR: 100% = 3056X3160 pixels per eye
IL2: Ultra, MSAA 2x, 100km Horizon, Terrain blurred, Sharpen on

With this settings I get a shimmer-free, clear picture at a constant 75 frames. More important: frametimes hover around 13.5 milliseconds wich is my target for 75 Hz. Dogfights are super smooth and aiming is precise. Picking ground tartgets is harder, but still very much ok. Sometimes I use normal fov, but then frametimes are higher and turns are no more butter smooth but still ok. I found going smaller fov is not an immersion killer for me,  because it is still much more than all other headsets I own (G2, Vive Cosmos). Hope this helps.

Edited February 24, 2022 by cellinsky

[Todt_Von_Oben]

5 hours ago, cellinsky said:

Hope this helps.

 

WOW!  Yeah!  Thanks!

 

You obviously know more about this than I do.  When my Pimax arrives I'll refer to your specs when I'm setting it up.  I'll probably have more questions.  thanks for the help.

 

While waiting on the headset, I'm working on my simulator.  Been experimenting with cheap ways to modify a CH Fighterstick to something more like a Fokker yoke.  Might look funny but the hand grip and lever trigger add to the immersion and the finished product will be a lot like the real thing. 

 

Here's the one I'm working on now; 1/2-inch copper tube.  Gotta make some handle grips next but wood is too heavy.  Going to try to make something out of foam.

 

Also bought some nifty foam padding (childproofing for furniture) that I can put on the plywood edges of my replica cockpit coaming to simulate the upholstery.  Just washed the truck and getting ready to go buy the plywood.  

 

Coming right along.  Thanks again for your help.

 

Prosit! 

 

ADDIT:  For more information about my shadetree projects, there's Dogfight Diary.  Enjoy!   https://www.facebook.com/todtvonoben

 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[chiliwili69]

11 hours ago, cellinsky said:

HMD @ 75 Hz

 

This is a nice thing of the Pimax8KX. it runs at 75Hz.

The amount of pixels that you need to move (3056x3160x2=19.3 million) is very similar to the G2 at 100% (19.5 million) but the big difference is that the Pimax does at 75Hz (versus 90Hz). So the threshold to not entering in reprojection is 13.33 ms (1000/75) versus 11.11ms (1000/90), and only these 2 ms of difference make a huge impact on performance, both for CPU and GPU. 

I hope future VR devices with large amount of pixels could provide different frequency modes (like Index 80Hz, 90Hz, etc) so this can help to reduce the load to GPU.

[Todt_Von_Oben]

You guys have forgotten more about this stuff than I'll ever know.  Thanks for the help.  When my 8KX arrives I'll no doubt have more questions.  Meanwhile, I'm learning from everything you post.  Mahalo! 

 

PS: Cellinski, l really like your avatar: "The Giant Claw."  LOL!  I grew up on old SciFi movies and actually saw that one in the theater when I was a kid.  Great stuff!  Prosit! ?

Edited February 25, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

Received the PIMAX 8KX today.

 

Setup was butt-simple.  Plugged it in, downloaded Pitool, opened Steam, opened Flying Circus and I was in.

Used the settings I had for the CV1: Ultra settings looking for 80 FPS.  Flew a few QM; no problems with the VR.  Smooth operation; no smearing, lagging, or freezing.  But WOW!  the range of vision and image detail are greatly improved over the CV1 or Q2.

 

I kicked it down to High settings to see what it would do; it froze twice and I had to restart my computer to get out of it.  No idea what that was all about but I'm only flying Ultra settings now and there's no freezing at all.  

 

I've got a pretty good GPU and I've heard  Pitool can be adjusted to get more performance out of the headset.  That'll be one of the next things I look into.  

 

But I've gotta say, right out of the box and pretty-much plug and play; the PIMAX 8KX has already relegated my CV1 and Q2 to the closet shelf.  I'm happy with it as-is and optimistic that I can squeeze even better performance out of it.

 

Really astounded by how good it looks.  The vision is so wide, I can pretty much turn my head and look behind about as far as I can in real life.  No more "SCUBA Mask Blues."  Yippee!

 

The earphones definitely do suck and the headset is a little heavier than the CV1 but the headstrap makes up for it.  I've got better earphones and a leather comfort pad; so no worries!  

 

Giving this one high marks.  Me likey!  ? ?

 

Edited March 6, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[IckyATLAS]

Thank you very much for sharing your experience. I was interested on the Pimax 8KX, but there were many comments related to the eye lenses, distortion etc. 

With the Pimax do you need to have fixed base stations like with the Valve Index or other similar systems or is it all in the Helmet and no additional hardware needed.

Can you move the lenses to adapt to you eyesight or is the optical setup fixed which means you can do no adjustment like +/- a few diopters.

Is it either you have perfect eyesight otherwise it is a no-go.

How much FPS have you got with Ultra settings, and do you play at max res. Can you also tell us about your CPU/GPU configuration if possible.

And finally how long can you play without starting to have some head/neck tiring issues.

Thanks again for your comments.

[Todt_Von_Oben]

11 hours ago, IckyATLAS said:

Thank you very much for sharing your experience. I was interested on the Pimax 8KX, but there were many comments related to the eye lenses, distortion etc. 

With the Pimax do you need to have fixed base stations like with the Valve Index or other similar systems or is it all in the Helmet and no additional hardware needed.

Can you move the lenses to adapt to you eyesight or is the optical setup fixed which means you can do no adjustment like +/- a few diopters.

Is it either you have perfect eyesight otherwise it is a no-go.

How much FPS have you got with Ultra settings, and do you play at max res.

Can you also tell us about your CPU/GPU configuration if possible.

And finally how long can you play without starting to have some head/neck tiring issues.

Thanks again for your comments.

 

IckyATLAS:  You're welcome.  To answer your questions as best as I can:

 

1. For a sit-down sim like Flying Circus: no need for a base station or controllers.  I just plugged mine in, found the floor, got it centered at the proper height, and it works fine.  Playing other games might need the base station and controllers, but IL2-FC does not.

 

2. Yes, the pupillary adjustment of the 8KX is done through a small rotary knob on the right side of the headset.  It gives a digital readout in the HMD saying how far apart the setting is, and I found it more accurate than the CV1.  I used to fly the Oculus at full width (70mm) and thought I needed wider; part of the reason I bought the 8KX is because it goes to 72mm.  After adjusting, the view became sharpest and clearest at 68 mm.  So, better adjustability than the CV1.

 

There's a difference in vision, though.  In the CV1 it seemed like everything was in focus.  In the 8KX, the center part of the view is in focus, but it's a little blurry out towards the edges.  This adds a split second to how long it takes your eyes to adjust when moving your head quickly; but that's all more like real human vision, I think.  Anyway, you get accustomed to it quickly and, even if the outer parts of the image aren't in perfect focus, that extra peripheral range helps a lot.  

 

I'm still seeing the tiniest suggestion of the dreaded "screen door effect" but it's almost negligible and I've heard adjusting the settings in Pitool can practically eliminate screen door altogether; but that's something I haven't proven to myself yet.

 

3. No need for perfect vision; you can even wear glasses in this headset.  That's how I did it at first and the glasses fit inside the headset WAY better than they do in the CV1.  The glasses are slightly uncomfortable, though; I'll be using my contacts today and see how that goes.

 

4. I'm targeting and getting 80 FPS at ULTRA settings.  My one and only test lowered to HIGH settings produced a game-freeze and loss of video image twice so I stopped doing that and went back to ULTRA.  No problems since then.  Smooth operation, not seeing any saw-toothed edges on the wires; just really nice.  And this is the default settings.  I have yet to experiment with adjustments in Pitool but will soon.

 

5. The computer I am flying now is the one I put together with the help of the folks in this thread; how I got there is defined in previous pages.  I have a Corsair Gaming Computer with an Asus TUF Gaming X570-Plus WIFI MOBO; an R7-5800X CPU; and an Evga RTX 3080ti GPU. 

 

(And THANKS AGAIN to the folks on this thread for hipping me to all that because when my old Cybertron took a dirt-nap I had no idea what to look for or buy.  Because of y'all, I shopped around and put together a $5K computer for about $2700 USD.  Whereas otherwise I would have made some big mistakes, but for the help I got here.  Muchly appreciated!) 

 

There's hotter CPU and GPU  combinations available; some of the folks in this thread are flying them and can tell you more than I.  Cool thing is, I can easily upgrade if I ever need to, say, go to an R9 and a 3090.  But so far I'm doing fine with this setup and I think it's going to be good enough for me. 

 

6. As far as how long can I play before it becomes uncomfortable: I haven't done an endurance test yet.  It's a little heavier than the CV1 but the better headstrap makes the weight tolerable.  My attitude is kinda Spartan about such things; I just wear it and eventually I get used to it.  I get into the sim and the weight of the headset doesn't bother me.  I haven't tried "Neck Safer" yet but I can turn my head and look behind a lot better than I could with the CV1 "horse blinders" on.  ?  That's about all I can say; it's okay for me but "your mileage may vary."  ?

 

I haven't fought the 8KX in MP yet because my latest "custom Fokker yoke modification" for my CH Fighterstick is coming apart and triggering the guns at awkward moments.  But I will; soon as I fix that.  It will be interesting to see how the 8KX and CV1 compare in terms of (1) range of vision, and (2) ability to detect and identify aircraft at a distance.  Thanks for your interest; more when I know...

 

Film at eleven...  ?

 

Edited March 6, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[Todt_Von_Oben]

After experimenting with the PIMAX 8KX for two days I'm sending it back for a refund.

 

The big appeal for me was the wider field of vision.  Yes, it's wider; but only the center is in focus.  You can adjust that somewhat but the overall image is blurry where the CV1 is clear from side to side.  There's more of a need to turn your head with the 8KX, whereas I can simply shift my eyes to look in other directions with the CV1 and everything will be the same clarity.

 

Ads said "Say goodbye to God's eyes and the Screen Door!"  For me, the screen door is smaller but still there.  The God's eyes are same as ever; and that's okay.  I like how they look.

 

The 8KX headset is bigger and heavier; the headstrap helps somewhat but it kind of reminds me of those braces Forest Gump had on his legs as a kid; kind of a mechanical contraption.  I was never able to get it anywhere near what I could call "comfortable" with glasses or my contacts on. 

 

But what really blows it for me is the fact that, without a base station and sensors, I can't look over the side of my cockpit without the image moving with me.  That is a real immersion killer when you're flying a cockpit simulator in VR.  To make it do that, I'd have to buy a base station and sensors.  Don't think I'm happy enough with the rest of it to shell-out the extra dough.

 

I got my DIY Fokker yoke soldered together and test-flew it at Flugpark as a server I created; not actually online with other pilots.  My ability to see and identify enemy planes was really no better and sometimes actually worse with the 8KX: depending on the settings.  

 

Also dependent on settings: sometimes I did experience smearing and tearing of the video image.  That's something my old CV1 has never done since I started flying the 3080ti.  It's rock-solid in that regard.

 

Plus, the PIMAX earphones super-suck.  I bought the "install it yourself" replacements and a leather face shield for comfort; but all the other factors considered, it's all going back.

 

I think the 8KX has a lot going for it; just not for my cockpit simulator with the computer I'm flying now.  

 

I'm once again thinking about the HP REVERB G2; and those of you who recommended it can say "I told you so!"  ? 

 

G2's got about the same horizontal visual range as the CV1 but I hear the image is better.  Still, if it also needs a base station and sensors to secure me in the pilot's seat, that will factor into my decision to buy.

 

Meanwhile, I'm going back to my good ol' CV1.  The graphics ain't great but they ain't that bad; I can fly and fight with it.  More importantly, the action is smooth as a baby zass in QM and MP; and I don't "float around in the cockpit" when I need to look down over the side of the fuselage.

 

Prosit!  ?  

Edited March 7, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben

[dburne]

Reverb G2 is a great headset for flight sims. It uses inside/out tracking built into the headset so no base stations required. It has a smaller sweet-spot (no edge to edge clarity) but the heart of the image looks really good.

Edited March 7, 2022 by dburne

[kissTheSky]

I agree on G2. 
 

Despite the small-ish sweet spot, G2 is the best bang for buck for performance, relative ease of setup, and user experience.

[Todt_Von_Oben]

You're right; the graphic quality of the G2 is way better than the CV1.  I want to buy it but there's one thing standing in my way.

 

To maintain VR immersion in my cockpit simulator, I need the virtual cockpit walls to "stay put" when I grab the coaming and pull myself over for a look-see down the fuselage.  I can do that with my CV1 because it has external sensors. 

 

(If you've seen my video, DER JAGDFLEIGERS, there's a good example of that when I first got hit by the Scout and followed him West, lost visual against the ground clutter, and stuck my head out the side of the plane for a look.  You can hear the difference in how much relative wind is hitting me in the face when my head is outside the cockpit.  I need to maintain that kind of immersion.) 

 

But that wasn't possible with the headset-mounted cameras of the PIMAX; the cockpit walls just "moved away" from me when I leaned in that direction and I couldn't see the sides of my plane or the Earth below.  That's the main reason I sent it back.  

 

Now I'm wondering if it's like that with the internal cameras of the G2.

 

If so, all still may not be lost. 

 

The G2 works with the Steam Valve Base Station and Controllers. So, cutting to the chase asap... (whew!)  

 

QUESTION: Will using the G2 with the Steam Base Station enable the same kind of "fixed" cockpit environment as I have now with the CV1 and External Sensors?

 

It's kind of an abstract concept; don't know how well I described it but if you understood what I'm talking about, any info about this would sure help.  Thanks!

 

ADDIT:  To clarify, I guess what I'm wondering is Will I need a Steam Base Station to play FC in "Room Scale" with the Reverb G2?  Or is RS just a setting I can select in Steam or the G2 settings?

 

?

Edited March 9, 2022 by Todt_Von_Oben