MP thoughts

[No_85_Gramps]

So I figured I'd try MP for a change as there were quite a few, around ten at times, on the US Expert server. I'll be the first to tell you my nav skills definitely need to be worked on. In flying for around 30-40 minutes I could not locate anyone else and based on the activity it seems everyone else was having the same issue. Only real action was one pilot getting shot down twice by ground fire. Only one or two dogfights actually took place based on the messages popping up on screen.

 

Maybe all that low cloud cover played a part in it, maybe not. Sure felt like I was flying in pea soup at times. I'll do some work on my nav skills (any hints?) as I'm looking to get shot down a lot while honing my flying skills.

[Pringliano]

well, I have the same problem, although I am getting more lucky in IL2 BOS than in DCS World where I am begining to experiment with MP sessions at a very friendly WW2 server dedicated to the P51d and the Dora.

 

In IL2 BOS we certainly have a more realistic overall sensation of being there, and the white helps a bit with the contrast, but it is still very difficult for me to glimpse others, and to get going with the toy I got last month - a TIR 5 :-)

[[JG54]Vyper]

Nav skills, esp on the Stalingrad map, are going to be something that is absolutely necessary to learn/have. I've only been playing in the MP arena for a few days myself...but I've found almost all of the fights to be south of Stalingrad, at/near the Volga at the easterly bend, from the deck to 2km-ish, ROUGHLY in the triangle made by the airfields Voroponovo, Grishin and Beketovka. I've also had a few fights by following the Volga North/South and watching for air traffic.

 

The small map is much easier. Just look in a line connecting the 2 airfields.

 

Nav hints: Find a reference point that is easy for you. The Volga, and the giant black columns of smoke, make excellent reference points for me. Literally I'm just a few minutes from where I want to be once I'm there. 

[LLv44_Mprhead]

Stalingrad map is somewhat problematic if there is only about 10 or less players, it kinda needs to be almost full to work properly. I think this will get better when we get proper objective based missions. Also that will make mp generally more interesting in any case.

[71st_AH_Hooves]

I really have to lol at some of these posts. But for those that are having nav probs. Welcome to WWII. Those guys had alot if issues themselves finding there way. It takes practice and more importantly patience to reach your desired destination. There are fewer people online than id wish. But i always seem to find a fight. I almkst always fly vvs for the challenge. Climb high and out bnz the enemy. And IMHO, the flight models are just fine. Funny how two different opinions can be formed on one game. I guess it all comes down to kills. If you get em, you like the game. If you cant, well look at Ridereds comments.

[BeastyBaiter]

[quote name="RideRed" post="132423" timestamp=

EDITED BY FSM

 

1) Not going to argue that, outside of peak hours it is very sparse. But then again this is on the border of alpha/beta test, that's somewhat expected. I remember when WT had a grand total of about 50 people playing RB/HB and about 5 in FRB/SB at peak hours, and that was in open beta. It has since filled up (ignoring SB mode). Wait until release for a proper MP experience here. What we have atm is nothing more than a net code test tbh.

 

2) Compared to what exactly? Honest question, what are you comparing it to? I've played just about every CFS since 1990, these fm's are by far the best around from what I've seen. Admittedly I've never flown a WW2 fighter, but I have flown numerous RC models and some civy planes too. There are some glitches atm too, such as the overly sensitive 109 rudder but such things are being looked into. I doubt it will be like that at release.

[71st_AH_Hooves]

Maybe no more friends. But it doesnt hurt to have a few wingmen in the game. From the sounds of it. You could have used one in your failed bnz story that you recently regailed us with. And honestly with that attitude i wouldnt want you on my wing. Yeah you might say "big deal i dont want you" but its just those times when you could use a helping 23mm cannon. That just might not come your way. Food for thought.

[SeriousFox]

Look at the map before you start fly, and use compass for navigation. And one more thing. In Stalingrad map, look for the big city and smoke from burning fuel tanks.

[Finkeren]

Compared to CloD most specifically. Flight model feels superb, with excellent aircraft and environment feel. This, currently at least, feels very detached at the aircraft level, I am not receiving as much feedback from the flight model as I am used to. It is a WIP so...

 

It's funny how different subjective experiences can be. While I admit, that ClOD has been improved beyond anything I thought posible by Team Fusion (who can't get enough credit for this) it's FM still lacks much of that "feeling" I get from BoS and even more so from RoF. Planes is ClOD still have that distinct feeling of being "on rails", while the BoS FM perfectly captures the sense of inertia and weight of the aircraft. Then there's the ground handling which BoS absolutely nails, where ClOD is just a slight improvement over the original IL2s ice skating.

 

That doesn't mean, that there aren't issues with BoS FM. Aside from the obvious, and acknowledged, issue with the 109, there might still be something wrong with the way certain parts of stalling is modelled, and I personally still think, that most planes have too little lateral stability. Still I think that the incomplete and untweaked FM of BoS is far superior to the fully developed FM of ClOD.

 

Well if I dont get my refund I will probably keep using it just to get my moneys worth.

 

I really think you should do that. If you just relax a bit and take the time to learn the finesses of the particular way the DN engine models flight, I think you might grow to love it. And if you've got criticisms, they're more than welcome, as long as they are presented in a calm and constructive manner. That's part of the idea of the Early Access: To get as broad a feed back as posible, without involving thousands of people as testers.

[Georgio]

It's funny how different subjective experiences can be. While I admit, that ClOD has been improved beyond anything I thought posible by Team Fusion (who can't get enough credit for this) it's FM still lacks much of that "feeling" I get from BoS and even more so from RoF. Planes is ClOD still have that distinct feeling of being "on rails", while the BoS FM perfectly captures the sense of inertia and weight of the aircraft. Then there's the ground handling which BoS absolutely nails, where ClOD is just a slight improvement over the original IL2s ice skating.

 

That doesn't mean, that there aren't issues with BoS FM. Aside from the obvious, and acknowledged, issue with the 109, there might still be something wrong with the way certain parts of stalling is modelled, and I personally still think, that most planes have too little lateral stability. Still I think that the incomplete and untweaked FM of BoS is far superior to the fully developed FM of ClOD.

 

 

I really think you should do that. If you just relax a bit and take the time to learn the finesses of the particular way the DN engine models flight, I think you might grow to love it. And if you've got criticisms, they're more than welcome, as long as they are presented in a calm and constructive manner. That's part of the idea of the Early Access: To get as broad a feed back as posible, without involving thousands of people as testers.

 

Spot on Finkeren 

[Brano]

There is no real MP until we get Objective driven missions.Until then it is just Test server,nothing less,nothing more.Any objections to this fact are just redundant.

[Soarfeat]

Hey Gramps,

 

What helped me with navigation ( Stalingrad map ), was to just get a piece of scrap paper and sketch out the important ( prominent landmarks --river and city , and of course air bases ) and just use this as a reference as I fly ( I don't like pulling up the in game map as I fly, kinda ruins the immersion and also for some reason I stay better oriented with approximate headings to areas and back home by viewing this ).I am sure there may be a way to maybe make a copy of the map for occasions such as this but I just have not looked into this yet.  Hang in there ( things will get more comfortable as you fly around ), the all frozen areas I will admit does make it easy to get disoriented at first.  

As far as getting shot down as you learn--don't worry about that, I believe it is the humbling part of this learning curve. I say this because just yesterday I switched from flying the 109 to the Yak and was on the European server and I believe I broke the record for being shot down in one mission ( 11 times---  ) -- Quite humiliating but fun for sure !!!

Well said above post Finkeren !!!

 

Cheers--sf--

[LLv24_Zami]

It's funny how different subjective experiences can be. While I admit, that ClOD has been improved beyond anything I thought posible by Team Fusion (who can't get enough credit for this) it's FM still lacks much of that "feeling" I get from BoS and even more so from RoF. Planes is ClOD still have that distinct feeling of being "on rails", while the BoS FM perfectly captures the sense of inertia and weight of the aircraft. Then there's the ground handling which BoS absolutely nails, where ClOD is just a slight improvement over the original IL2s ice skating.

 

That doesn't mean, that there aren't issues with BoS FM. Aside from the obvious, and acknowledged, issue with the 109, there might still be something wrong with the way certain parts of stalling is modelled, and I personally still think, that most planes have too little lateral stability. Still I think that the incomplete and untweaked FM of BoS is far superior to the fully developed FM of ClOD.

 

 

That pretty much sums it

[No_85_Gramps]

Thanks to all for the advice. I did not expect it to raise issues with the game itself. I have been practicing navigating and managed to find some foes in MP. Of course I did not do so well...but that I expected. Just need to devote some more time to my flying skills. I must say though that I am extremely happy with the game, I knew going in it was an alpha and I'm patient enough to see where we end up! Happy Flying!

[Frequent_Flyer]

Were going to end up flying " Around and Around, in the Cold, Rain and Snow !"

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Someday, a simmer in the future will assist in pulling my virtual Bf109 from a virtual lake where it was lost in a virtual snow blind crash and poor navigation in BOS.

Edited July 2, 2014 by A1FltTrn=HerrMurf

[No_85_Gramps]

Were going to end up flying " Around and Around, in the Cold, Rain and Snow !"

And maybe a prayer to St Stephen...

[Frequent_Flyer]

And maybe a prayer to St Stephen...

Me and My Uncle say one everyday.

[javelina]

Someday, a simmer in the future will assist in pulling my virtual Bf109 from a virtual lake where it was lost in a virtual snow blind crash and poor navigation in BOS.

I'm picturing Bear Grylls, and a future TV series, (rather Tellie for my cousins across the pond). :-)

It's funny how different subjective experiences can be. While I admit, that ClOD has been improved beyond anything I thought posible by Team Fusion (who can't get enough credit for this) it's FM still lacks much of that "feeling" I get from BoS and even more so from RoF. Planes is ClOD still have that distinct feeling of being "on rails", while the BoS FM perfectly captures the sense of inertia and weight of the aircraft. Then there's the ground handling which BoS absolutely nails, where ClOD is just a slight improvement over the original IL2s ice skating.

 

That doesn't mean, that there aren't issues with BoS FM. Aside from the obvious, and acknowledged, issue with the 109, there might still be something wrong with the way certain parts of stalling is modelled, and I personally still think, that most planes have too little lateral stability. Still I think that the incomplete and untweaked FM of BoS is far superior to the fully developed FM of ClOD.

 

 

I really think you should do that. If you just relax a bit and take the time to learn the finesses of the particular way the DN engine models flight, I think you might grow to love it. And if you've got criticisms, they're more than welcome, as long as they are presented in a calm and constructive manner. That's part of the idea of the Early Access: To get as broad a feed back as posible, without involving thousands of people as testers.

My friend, you're insight and input is always solid.

 

-Jav

[Finkeren]

Someday, a simmer in the future will assist in pulling my virtual Bf109 from a virtual lake where it was lost in a virtual snow blind crash and poor navigation in BOS.

 

Yeah, Imagine how much Internet archaeology will have progressed by then

[No_85_Gramps]

Me and My Uncle say one everyday.

Just remember the Big Boss Man is listening. Probably enough humor. But I wonder who else knows what we've been talking about...

[1./KG4_Blackwolf]

As an attack/bomber pilot I dont want to find the enemy. I want to fly as low or as high as needed to avoid any fighters. If I can sneak in low or be so high you cant see me coming then I'm doing it right. So that means I have to know where I'm at, going and how to get home. Navigation to me is number one after knowing how to fly. This is a very hard map to navigate IMO. You can go full screen and zoom in but it won't help if you don't know where you're at.

 

Practice over and over, learn the roads, rivers and towns and the different headings..thats the only way.

[Zappatime]

I flew the Stalingrad map last weekend for the first time in MP, I took a slightly wrong heading and got completely lost for about 10 minutes, but it is rewarding when you figure out where you are and get back on track. If there's low numbers on the server that map is a very lonely place although that's also part of the fun of the hunt. I fly the other map a lot in the PE2, where I happily provide cannon fodder for the swarm of 109s that I attract like wasps round a jam jar, the fun there is getting through to their airbase and bombing the place to bits :-)

[Finkeren]

I think people underestimate how big a difference the release of the Stalingrad map in MP has already affected MP.

 

Last night I was in several fights above 3000m, which happened completely naturally. On Lapino, you'd have to work together with your opponents to create such a situation.

 

Now we need some objectives and people getting used to flying in squads and soon we'll have at least the posibility for action like when RoF is at its most exciting.

[Tab]

I saw coordinated Il2 squads with Yak cover even on Lapino map. They made at least a couple of runs to the german HQ near the german air respawn. You just need to find some like-minded persons and make up a plan. The objectives are there, they're just not specified in the briefing (but marked on the map). Coordinated Il2-raids in Stalingrad are not rare too. On the russian forum there are several threads where people team up for such il2 missions. Maybe we can get one going here too.

The only hindrance is auto-balance imho. Oh, and a right TeamSpeak server infrastructure could help squad-finding a bit better (or maybe even in-game voice comms).

Edited July 4, 2014 by Tab

[Finkeren]

Well, the ground objects are there, but there are no true objectives. There's no way to "win" a round and no indication that your attacks accomplish anything.

 

As for forming squads. I'm glad you've seen it. All I ever see are fighters (most often German ones) cooperating to a certain degree and using a bit of bait tactics, that's it so far.

 

I think the short distances and fast action makes it next to imposible to assemble a squad on the fly. You'll have to make appointments in advance.

 

The team balancing system doesn't help either. There has to be something that can be done about it forcing people to shift back and forth. I think team balance is important. It's just not succesfully implemented yet.

[Matt]

If there would only be the Stalingrad map avaliable (preferably different missions on that map), a few more ground units/targets and auto balance turned off, MP could be really great already.

[SYN_Speck]

Just remember the Big Boss Man is listening. Probably enough humor. But I wonder who else knows what we've been talking about...

 

Some folks look for answers... others look for fights.

Some folks up in treetops, just looking for their kites!

 

 

Yeah, risking further OT but had to let you know there are a few more of us around!

[Frequent_Flyer]

Just remember the Big Boss Man is listening. Probably enough humor. But I wonder who else knows what we've been talking about...

It is more likely you find a China Cat Sunflower on the Mountains of the Moon than anyone else understands.