Does anyone else thing the low speed handling in this game is a bit much? Especially going uphill.

[JtD]

8 hours ago, Drum said:

Dynamic is a force (or flight model) that stimulates change or progress within a system or process.  Versus what would otherwise be considered a static force (or flight model) which is from a predetermined database of figures.

 

That's a definition, but not an explanation. BoX FM is based on a predetermined database of figures (and algortihms working with it) just like any other flight sim game. How's that dynamic where all everything else isn't?

[Drum]

20 minutes ago, JtD said:

 

That's a definition, but not an explanation. BoX FM is based on a predetermined database of figures (and algortihms working with it) just like any other flight sim game. How's that dynamic where all everything else isn't?

I'm loosing it in my old age I see, but I truly thought your question wasn't rhetorical, sorry.  ?

[JtD]

No, I seriously don't get how a computer game level flight model can be considered dynamic, in particular if all other FM's are supposedly not (i.e. static). How do you make that distinction?

 

Part of my job is to test vehicle dynamics, so I'm sort of aware of the definition. I just don't see how it applies to something that is hardcoded on my computer.

Edited August 13, 2021 by JtD

[LColony_Kong]

9 hours ago, Drum said:

Dynamic is a force (or flight model) that stimulates change or progress within a system or process.  Versus what would otherwise be considered a static force (or flight model) which is from a predetermined database of figures.

There is no such thing. At least not within the scope of how you articulated it here.

 

All flight sims use tabulated data.  The main difference is in the degree of complexity. All of them are based on tabulated data of some kind, but that does not mean they cannot model changing conditions, if by that your meant things like changes in altitude or angle of attack etc.

         The biggest change between old sims and newer ones is the number of components they split the air frame into when modeling aerodynamic forces. The newer sims, such as DCS, break the model into hundreds (or more) parts and then the whole flight model ends up being the sum of those parts. Older models tended to more macro modeling, such as an entire wing instead of breaking that up into many elements.

 

We dont really know exactly how il2 is done.

 

However, the newer high detail modeling does not always yield better results. We know this because you can compare DCS to older sims. When done right, the DCS style of model can yield some pretty amazing things. The appeals is that you can potentially get very accurate performance regarding things like top speed, but also organically generate all of the nuanced little characteristics that were mostly lacking in the older sims. Were talking things like adverse yaw, specific landing behaviors unique to each plane, very specific stalling behaviors etc. The problem with the many element flight modeling is that it can be hard to also get the general performance of the airplane right, which is why we see DCS jets go through multi-year cycles of FM tuning before they come out "right". When heatblur made the F-14 they specifically talked for instance about how changing one aspect of the FM caused cascading issues throughout the model and they had to figure out how to get everything to even out.

 

Its hard to say what kind of FM il2 uses. The game has had numerous issues over the years that point in either direction. IL2 appears to have many of the long term tuning issues that DCS has, such as the oddball high alt performance we have, complete lack of compression for the first half to the games lifespan, wonky flap behavior, the infamous wobble, and some very odd rudder induced roll that wasnt fixed until 2.0ish. On the other hand, il2 doesn't tend exhibit the hyper accurate micro behaviors DCS has. There is a well known video comparing the P-51 between games to IRL landing footage. But il2 does tend to get basic performance figures right, especially as time has gone on.

 

 

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

40 minutes ago, JtD said:

No, I seriously don't get how a computer game level flight model can be considered dynamic, in particular if all other FM's are supposedly not (i.e. static). How do you make that distinction?

 

I'm not aware of any such distinction.

 

In my mind, a non-dynamic (i.e. static) flight model would have all time derivatives equal zero, which obviously isn't useful for a game.

[Denum]

Tried DCS TF51 and blew my engine in a high AoA full throttle move. Also had very little control.

 

I really liked that! 

 

And the sounds. Sweet baby jesus! 

 

That's definitely on my I wish list for iL2.

Edited August 17, 2021 by Denum

[354thFG_Drewm3i-VR]

I really wish this would get looked at someday.

 

Edit: found this video. Has any of this been addressed yet? I think some has, but I'm not sure: 

 

 

Edited February 5, 2022 by -332FG-drewm3i-VR

[Rache-der-Boote]

On 2/3/2022 at 12:10 PM, drewm3i-VR said:

I really wish this would get looked at someday.

 

Edit: found this video. Has any of this been addressed yet? I think some has, but I'm not sure: 

 

No, most of these issues still remain. And I'm surprised this video has been allowed to exist for this long. I posted it and it got deleted almost immediately.

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

Yak panter found that propeller has been to effective according to data he provided.