tailwheel retraction

[jjulukaa]

hello devs, can you address this topic.

the bf109f4's does retract while later models do not.

there are other planes on all sides with this

same discrepancy.

whether it has an actual ingame effect i do not know.

certainly it should have more effect than bomb/rocket hangers.

[Cybermat47]

6 minutes ago, jjulukaa said:

the bf109f4's does retract while later models do not.

AFAIK this is not an inaccuracy. IIRC retractable tailwheels were introduced on the Bf-109 F-0 to improve streamlining, then removed on the G-3 and G-4 onwards to accomodate a larger tailwheel to improve ground handling.

 

As for other aircraft, sometimes features like retractable tailwheels are removed to streamline manufacturing. 

[Ram399]

1 hour ago, jjulukaa said:

the bf109f4's does retract while later models do not.

This is entirely historical- though the K-4's tailwheel does retract to help with reducing drag.

With the exception of the K-4 however, all the models of Bf-109 post G-4 feature a larger and more robust fixed tailwheel construction.
While it was very much a step backwards in terms of development, the Bf-109 was very prone to ground incidents and crashing on takeoff and landing- especially in the hands of inexperienced or poorly trained pilots on makeshift airfields (an ever increasing problem as the war progressed), so the larger tailwheel was implemented to make the aircraft more resistant to hard landings while also providing better ground control on something like a wet grass field.

Also, a fixed tailwheel is easier to make, and the resulting streamline in production was one of the factors which allowed later model Bf-109s to be built en masse.

[LukeFF]

40 minutes ago, Ram399 said:

This is entirely historical- though the K-4's tailwheel does retract to help with reducing drag.

With the exception of the K-4 however, all the models of Bf-109 post G-4 feature a larger and more robust fixed tailwheel construction.
While it was very much a step backwards in terms of development, the Bf-109 was very prone to ground incidents and crashing on takeoff and landing- especially in the hands of inexperienced or poorly trained pilots on makeshift airfields (an ever increasing problem as the war progressed), so the larger tailwheel was implemented to make the aircraft more resistant to hard landings while also providing better ground control on something like a wet grass field.

Also, a fixed tailwheel is easier to make, and the resulting streamline in production was one of the factors which allowed later model Bf-109s to be built en masse.

 

In addition, a lot of the tailwheels on the K-4 were locked in place, due to problems with the retraction mechanism.

[6./ZG26_Klaus_Mann]

2 hours ago, jjulukaa said:

there are other planes on all sides with this

same discrepancy.

The Russians after Barbarossa simplified Production Fighters like the Yak and LaGG by fixing the Tailwheel and omitting many other steps, while from 1943 onwards re-introducing many refinements, which made the Aircraft faster again.

[jjulukaa]

thnx all...i am enlightened.

still funny that the masters of ww2 tech,

would give up say 5kph because of a tailwheel.

really, they spew over mw inj yet ignore this.

kinda doubt it.

my question is....

is the era of ww2 too far ago to get

any accurate data?

much like ww1 data and all before that.

if so, i have a question,

like we have autocad, et al....

why has there been no einstein producing a software,

that allows you to massage all surface areas of a plane

to see the affects?

now racing games lack this as well...no track config changes,

but why are racing games miles ahead of 

flight combat games?

as for flight sim, why?

what satisfaction do u get from meandering the planet?

 

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

No.

[Cybermat47]

56 minutes ago, jjulukaa said:

still funny that the masters of ww2 tech,

would give up say 5kph because of a tailwheel.

Well, the Spitfire was faster than the Hurricane even with the fixed tailwheel, and the British needed as many of them as possible at the beginning of the war, so it makes sense that they’d streamline production like that.

 

As for the Americans, not that many of their designs actually had fixed tailwheels. I think it was mainly their naval aircraft that did.

[DD_Arthur]

7 hours ago, jjulukaa said:

thnx all...i am enlightened.

still funny that the masters of ww2 tech,

would give up say 5kph because of a tailwheel.

really, they spew over mw inj yet ignore this.

kinda doubt it.

my question is....

is the era of ww2 too far ago to get

any accurate data?

much like ww1 data and all before that.

if so, i have a question,

like we have autocad, et al....

why has there been no einstein producing a software,

that allows you to massage all surface areas of a plane

to see the affects?

now racing games lack this as well...no track config changes,

but why are racing games miles ahead of 

flight combat games?

as for flight sim, why?

what satisfaction do u get from meandering the planet?

 

 

Wa?

[Gr3y]

1 hour ago, DD_Arthur said:

 

Wa?

 

Looks like a poem and they often aren't easy to understand.

 

Quote

still funny that the masters of ww2 tech,

would give up say 5kph because of a tailwheel.

kinda doubt it.

 

With passing of time Nazis were giving up on more and more things like retractable tailwheels, materials, new aircraft models, pilots training etc.

[[CPT]milopugdog]

2 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

 

Wa?

Now now; don't bring my state into this. We might have made B-17s and B-29s, but that doesn't have anything to do with this tailwheel hubbub.

[Irishratticus72]

10 hours ago, jjulukaa said:

thnx all...i am enlightened.

still funny that the masters of ww2 tech,

would give up say 5kph because of a tailwheel.

really, they spew over mw inj yet ignore this.

kinda doubt it.

my question is....

is the era of ww2 too far ago to get

any accurate data?

much like ww1 data and all before that.

if so, i have a question,

like we have autocad, et al....

why has there been no einstein producing a software,

that allows you to massage all surface areas of a plane

to see the affects?

now racing games lack this as well...no track config changes,

but why are racing games miles ahead of 

flight combat games?

as for flight sim, why?

what satisfaction do u get from meandering the planet?

 

 

[[CPT]Crunch]

18 hours ago, jjulukaa said:

if so, i have a question,

like we have autocad, et al....

why has there been no einstein producing a software,

that allows you to massage all surface areas of a plane

to see the affects?

To a limited extent this is already being done, real-time computational fluid dynamics, not just for testing but the flight model itself to a degree is no longer table based.  In an unnamed sim with jets.

[AndyJWest]

1 minute ago, [CPT]Crunch said:

...real-time computational fluid dynamics...

 

Not 'real-time'. Assuming you are talking about DCS, they used CFD to generate target performance values to aim for when building the flight model, since the relevant historical data wasn't available.

[BlitzPig_EL]

Would any of our PCs be able to do real time fluid dynamics calculations and still be able to run the rest of the sim?

 

Seeing as anything more than a handful of AI multicrew aircraft will grind things to a crawl, I think not.

[AndyJWest]

I'm not entirely sure that ' real time fluid dynamics calculations' are even a thing. Given the uses to which they are generally put, doing it at 'real-time' speeds is probably unnecessary. 

[Cybermat47]

14 hours ago, TrueGrey said:

With passing of time Nazis were giving up on more and more things like retractable tailwheels, materials, new aircraft models, pilots training etc.

I don’t think he was talking about the Nazis. With the British inventing radar (and making it compact enough to fit on destroyers and aircraft) and active sonar, and the Americans creating the nuclear bomb, I’d say that they were much more the masters of technology than the Germans, whose most impressive inventions came too late to have a significant impact.

[Strewth]

 

 

24 minutes ago, [Pb]Cybermat47 said:

and the Americans creating the nuclear bomb, I’d say that they were much more the masters of technology than the Germans

 

Considering the Germans developed heavy water and most of the nuclear bomb progress, where the US used defecting scientists to bring it into its final form; I would say that the German technology was way ahead of most others for the time.
It was mainly too many enemies on too many fronts, as well as a serious lack of supplies and materials that hindered the Germans the most.
If you need to refer to German V's American technology, just read about the tank battles, as well as many other major advancements.

Cheers.

Edited April 27, 2021 by TOG_Strewth

[DD_Arthur]

1 hour ago, AndyJWest said:

 

A little relevant reading: https://physicstoday.scitation.org/do/10.1063/PT.6.4.20180926a/full/

 

I’m not quite sure how relevant this list actually is.

Leo Zsilard and Edward Teller were Hungarians yet they appear on this list.

 

Heavy Water is a very American discovery.  

 

Despite a plethora of utter bollox being available on 

t’  interwebs, the Germans had absolutely no clue as to how to make a nuclear weapon.

 

However, it does make a great story for stupid people.

[BornToBattle]

On 4/26/2021 at 1:01 AM, jjulukaa said:

thnx all...i am enlightened.

still funny that the masters of ww2 tech,

would give up say 5kph because of a tailwheel.

really, they spew over mw inj yet ignore this.

kinda doubt it.

my question is....

is the era of ww2 too far ago to get

any accurate data?

much like ww1 data and all before that.

if so, i have a question,

like we have autocad, et al....

why has there been no einstein producing a software,

that allows you to massage all surface areas of a plane

to see the affects?

now racing games lack this as well...no track config changes,

but why are racing games miles ahead of 

flight combat games?

as for flight sim, why?

what satisfaction do u get from meandering the planet?

 

Thanks for reminding me...wonder what raaaid has been up to lately?

[AEthelraedUnraed]

On 4/26/2021 at 8:01 AM, jjulukaa said:

what satisfaction do u get from meandering the planet?

Oh Amazon, thou river wide
Meand'ring onwards, proud your stride
Twisting round this blue-green ball
Immeasurable thy daily flow!
Occasionally I wonder though:
Great may be your joy and pride
But why dost thou meander so?

 

And I haven't even had my first beer of the evening yet...