Need a new stick, need advice

[Finkeren]

My two year old Saitek X52 has bought it. A part has come loose at the base that keeps locking up the stick, and I can't seem to reattach it no matter what.

 

Therefore I'm looking to buy a new stick. As happy as I was with the throttle and the multitude of buttons, hats and sliders on the X52, the stick itself just always felt clunky and fragile.

 

I've heard a lot of good things about the Thrustmaster Warthog set, and I think I can afford to buy one next month. But I want to be sure before I hand over that amount of cash. Therefore I'd like to hear from people who have experience with both controllers. 

 

* How to the sticks feel compared to one another, smoothness and precision-wise?

 

* Is the Warthog sturdier than the X52?

 

* Are there enough sliders/wheels on the Warthog to match the X52, and are they conveniently placed (on the X52 I could control throttle, mixture, rpm/pitch, FOV zoom, wheel brakes, supercharger and flaps with just the throttle set without moving my left hand. I'd like to be able to do the same with the Warthog.

 

* The X52 conveniently has 2 hat-switches on the stick, which I use for looking around and head movement seperately (I don't use TrackIR) Will this be posible with the Warthog?

 

*How well does the Warthog rest on a smooth surface? (I don't wanna have to drill into my expensive lackered desk to make it hold in place)

 

Is the Warthog the right thing for me, Or should I go for something else?

[BlackDevil]

MSFFB2

[Finkeren]

Not going to buy 2nd hand, and those old sticks have way too few buttons and sliders. I'll gladly trade for a slightly inferior stick without FFB. I just need something smooth and sturdy with LOTS of buttons.

[Dakpilot]

MSFFB2

 

+1

 

enough buttons on your throttle    find a new "old stock one, smoothest sturdiest stick around

 

Cheers Dakpilot

Edited June 9, 2014 by Dakpilot

[Bando]

Well, I have an MSFFB2 and it's a very pleasant stick.

I just like to build a simpit (well, sort of) and ordered a warthog. It's still in the pipeline, so no comment yet.

About MSFFB2; the ffb in ROF is a lot better than the ffb in BOS. My opinion, but there you have it.

I'm anxiously awaiting my warthog and hope it is what I expect it to be, once I ordered the extension from Sahaj.

 

Good luck in deciding.

[Felix58]

Had a similar situation myself.

 

I bought the Warthog stick and a 7.5 cm extension from Sahaj.  I use the X52 throttle.  

 

For prop sims this is probably about as good as it gets!

[Aracno]

* How to the sticks feel compared to one another, smoothness and precision-wise?

 

Warthog win hands down both in smoothness and precision but is more heavy, sometime if you are doing a very long flight could be tiring for your hands; extension and center position can help a lot.

You will notice the passage through the centre due to the 4 spring but its not a big problem, just noticeble.

I use it for aerobatic formation flight without problem but sometimes after a 40 minutes of intense training my right hand feel really hot.

 

* Is the Warthog sturdier than the X52?

 

Yes,  like comparing a toy and and a professional instrument.

 

* Are there enough sliders/wheels on the Warthog to match the X52, and are they conveniently placed (on the X52 I could control throttle, mixture, rpm/pitch, FOV zoom, wheel brakes, supercharger and flaps with just the throttle set without moving my left hand. I'd like to be able to do the same with the Warthog.

 

Maybe a lack of rotary on the throttle, but i was not happy with x52 throttle rotary, so i dont miss them.

 

* The X52 conveniently has 2 hat-switches on the stick, which I use for looking around and head movement seperately (I don't use TrackIR) Will this be posible with the Warthog?

 

Yes, you have one with 8 position (the grey one) and two with 4.

You also have one for the thumb finger.

 

 

*How well does the Warthog rest on a smooth surface? (I don't wanna have to drill into my expensive lackered desk to make it hold in place)

 

Its a lot heavy, the problem could be if your desk is robust enought ......

Edited June 10, 2014 by Aracno

[Finkeren]

Thanks Aracno, that's precisely the feedback I was looking for. I think I'll settle for the Warthog and part with the small fortune it costs.

 

Thanks to the rest of you for your input as well. I guess I'm propably gonna be missing out, but until they put MSFFB2 back in production I won't be getting one. I've been burnt one too many times buying second hand hardware.

[Aracno]

It's a lot different from other joystick, and because of its cost i suggest you to try it, if possible, before ordering.

With the joystick the feeling is important and maybe you feel better with a more light one while i feel better with a heaviest one.

[Finkeren]

Not much of a chance to try it, I'm afraid. But everything you've said so far whets my appetite. I have always found every stick I've ever owned to be far too light, both in movement of the controls and in the weight of the controls themselves.

[Matt]

My Warthog is now getting four years old and it did see a lot of use. So i would definately consider it quite sturdy overall. However, the plastic gimbal is really cheap and i'm pretty sure that it will wear out eventually. Of course in the long run, the base of the Mamba could be used, but that's also not cheap.

 

Also i would not use the Warthog without a stick extension anymore, but to use an extension, you would need to build some sort of a center stick mount. It just gives a lot more control and makes maneuvering easier (if a bit slower).

 

When i was still using it without stick extension, i still had to screw it to the desk, because the stick itself is pretty long already and the leverage was enough to make the base lift during hasty maneuvering.

 

I also have the MS FFB2 which i was using before the Warthog and i tried it a few times now to check how FFB works in BoS but i don't think i could ever go back to it. Which doesn't mean that i think that the FFB2 is bad or that the Warthog is better, but they are just completely different sticks and basically can't be compared in any way.

 

One disadvantage the Warthog has, is the lack of sliders/rotaries. But i can't blame Thrustmaster for that, it's based on the A-10 controls and it doesn't have more sliders or rotaries on those controls. If you're using all sliders and rotaries on the X-52, then you will probably miss some of those when you get the Warthog and you'll need to get used to putting things on buttons instead (or buy an extra throttle quadrant).

[Aracno]

 

 

When i was still using it without stick extension, i still had to screw it to the desk, because the stick itself is pretty long already and the leverage was enough to make the base lift during hasty maneuvering.

 

 

 

Never had this problem, but probably depend on the desk surface and the way we use the joystick.

[Finkeren]

When i was still using it without stick extension, i still had to screw it to the desk, because the stick itself is pretty long already and the leverage was enough to make the base lift during hasty maneuvering.

 

 

That's been an issue with the X52 as well, but I kinda got used to it and could avoid it 99% of the time. Unless the Warthog has an extraordinarily strong spring, I think I can manage. If push comes to shove the Warthog has a completely flat base, so I can fasten it with a plastic vice without having to drill through the desk.

[Matt]

Never had this problem, but probably depend on the desk surface and the way we use the joystick.

I guess you're right. It depends on the position of the stick, the higher it is, the more likely it probably becomes, because there's no downward force. I usually had it pretty high on my desk.

 

I rarely had this problem myself, but even a few times is enough. I basically only used two screws to attach it to the desk and could mount and unmount it in a matter of seconds, so it was not really a problem for me and it's reassuring to know that you can throw it around without worrying about that.

 

That's been an issue with the X52 as well, but I kinda got used to it and could avoid it 99% of the time. Unless the Warthog has an extraordinarily strong spring, I think I can manage. If push comes to shove the Warthog has a completely flat base, so I can fasten it with a plastic vice without having to drill through the desk.

It's not nearly as bad as on the X-52 (i used that stick aswell for a short amount of time) and it might not affect you at all.

 

However, compared to the X-52, the Warthog does really have an extraordinarily strong spring.

[Finkeren]

LOL! I completely glossed over the fact, that the Warthog is not a twister stick   I guess I'll have to get some pedals as well, then? Any recommendations? Are the cheapish Saitek Pro Flight good enough to be useful?

Else, can someone recommend a good, sturdy twister stick with 2 hat buttons?

[Aracno]

Some day i hate and some day i love my saitek pedals, but they are better than nothing anyway.

Personally i have removed the center detent and i use a very smooth curve for it, you will need to get used, but this is common with every pedals if you come from a twisting joystick.

[LLv44_Mprhead]

I am using CH pedals and they are ok imo.

[pilotpierre]

For longevity I dont think CH products can be beaten.

[andyw248]

I used to have a CH fighter stick for about 7 years and was happy with it, but the Warthog beats it when it comes to precision. However, the Warthog as it ships comes with pretty strong springs, that didn't work for me so I ordered one of the stick extensions. I think if you want precision the stick extension is a must. I have a 15cm extension and it works great. I also mounted it in front of the legs of a cheap wooden kitchen chair, which works great as well - the grip is now right above my knees, just like in a fighter plane.

 

I also use the CH pedals, and I've been happy with them since 2006 or so. Precision is not as important for pedals as it is for the stick; maybe the CH pedals are precise, maybe not, I don't know and I don't care, it just never seemed to be a problem.

[dburne]

I use the Warthog along with Saitek Combat Pedals, and this year I added a CH Throttle Quadrant to give me some extra sliders.

I too have not had any problem with the joystick lifting on me, due to it's heaviness.

Very happy with my setup.

[sop]

I used CH products for a long time, and while they are great and last forever they do feel a bit arcade compared to warthog hotas setup, button "feel" wise at least don't think I could go back.

Edited June 14, 2014 by sop

[racingslippers]

I really like my VKB Mamba. Action not too heavy. Faultless precision. Interesting new grips on the way.

[VR-DriftaholiC]

I wouldn't give up force feedback for anything except maybe trackIR, it's that game changing. You can buy 2 MSFFB2 for less than a TM Warthog

Edited June 14, 2014 by driftaholic

[Soarfeat]

CH products here as well. Had a Logitech G940 that I rewired  ( Throttle quadrant ) to get rid of the spiking trim wheels and other problems that were due to poor thin wire choices and design and after using this for a couple of years decided to try the CH stuff I got on sale for a really good price. l. I find the CH Fighterstick, Throttle and Throttle Quadrant along with the pedals to be quite good, however I do miss the force feedback. The Fighterstick is very precise in my opinion and the Pro Throttle works very well also. The design has not changed much over the years but CH products have stood the test of time as they say.

Best of luck on your decision,

cheers-sf-

[II./JG53Lutzow_z06z33]

I just bought the warthog flight stick and its the best stick I've ever owned its all metal construction makes it feel so real. It was worth the $280