The Worst of Gaming

[Pringliano]

I myself warped from the scenery boundary twice on one of my last online MP sessions.

 

Initially I wasn't really aware of what was happening to the aircraft since, all of a sudden I lost the controls but it kept maneuvering. There was an alert message about having reached the limits of the Map though...

 

I don't think that IL2 allows for exploits? This is mandatory for such a game, and I strongly hope not to come across any of this in the future. The closer to exploiting we can get right now is using some flight configurations / maneuvers that the RL counterparts of the aircraft we're flying wouldn't survive.

 

I used, looooong ago, another WW2 game - Jane's WW2 Fighters - curiously also winter scenery-based, with astounding graphics and flight dynamics for it's time, but playing online was a no-go for me - all sorts of exploits we could even have difficulty to imagine :-(

Edited June 6, 2014 by jcomm

[6S.Manu]

The sad thing is that these guys are actually adults... many over 30 have really some miserable and childish behaviours.

[Finkeren]

I personally observe the rule, that on "deathmatch" servers, like what we currently have, attack planes and light bombers (IL-2, Pe-2 and Ju 87) are for vulching, though I will usually refrain from doing so, if the other side has real trouble regaining any initiative.

 

If you're in a fighter, you let the guy take off and gain both speed and altitude before attacking. If it's a 1on1 situation, I usually try to even the playing field somewhat before opening fire, but I won't be cross with people who don't return the favor.

[SR-F_Winger]

MP on Lapino could get soo much more interesting if everyone on both sides would actually use the airstart instead of the groundstart and only use the groundstart for landing if at all.

Vulching would become much less and fighting would actually happen above clouds.

For me the best rounds are when i meet an opponent above 4-5k height. This is where it gets interesting.

IMHO a german that starts turning on the deck with a YAK and the current absence of flapfailures has suicidal tendencies:)

We did some turning tests in our squad and the YAK can get behind a 109 with only ONE circle if it deploys flaps. So not really a point to try and turn with a plane that handles so well in low level turnfights as long as its bugged.

[Finkeren]

Winger: I sometimes think you tend to make big issues out of minor details, but in the case of use of flaps in combat, you're absolutely right. I mostly fly Yaks online, and I never ever use flaps in combat, and I consider people who do to be on the same level as vulchers.

[stiboo]

I agree with....

 

 

I personally observe the rule, that on "deathmatch" servers, like what we currently have, attack planes and light bombers (IL-2, Pe-2 and Ju 87) are for vulching, though I will usually refrain from doing so, if the other side has real trouble regaining any initiative.

 

If you're in a fighter, you let the guy take off and gain both speed and altitude before attacking. If it's a 1on1 situation, I usually try to even the playing field somewhat before opening fire, but I won't be cross with people who don't return the favor.

 

 

on many of the old IL2 servers it was this rule... Ground Attack aircraft can...errr ground! attack but fighters no... so this is how I play at the mo..

 

Yes - early days for everything..

 

 

.

[DD_Arthur]

MP on Lapino could get soo much more interesting if everyone on both sides would actually use the airstart instead of the groundstart and only use the groundstart for landing if at all.

Vulching would become much less and fighting would actually happen above clouds.

 

 

Now that is a good idea!

[FlatSpinMan]

Okay. A bunch of people in this thread are being checked out right now and strong action will be taken if deemed necessary.

 

In the meantime, calm down, grow up, enjoy Friday.

[FlatSpinMan]

Some really unneccessary, unpleasant behaviour in this thread. I'm perfectly happy to lock it, remove content, or ban people, if anyone is thinking about continuing in this vein.

[Hawgdog]

I dont like Jets.

 

there.

 

I said it, and stand by it.

 

Prop it or drop it. 

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

Thanks FSM, it was getting a little personal there for a moment.

 

As to server rules - I'm for good game play and don't really need rules for most DF servers. Just pick a different base or airstart and bring a wingman.

 

Objectives in historic servers solve most of these problems as well.

[II./JG27_Rich]

Play Cliffs of Dover until they use the Stalingrad map

[steppenwolf]

Wouldn't realistic levels of ground fire stop vulching? 

[Finkeren]

Wouldn't realistic levels of ground fire stop vulching? 

 

If it was dense enough. But it would also completely eliminate any reason to fly attack planes and would make the servers a 100% Yak vs. 109 fest.

[Bearcat]

Oh, I think the point was well made.

 

Actually I saw two points.

 

1. The Map border 'thing' can and will be exploited.
2. Players disconnect and reconnect and get their kill.

About 1. This issue was brought up a long time ago and it seems it's here to stay. Hopefully it won't be such a common problem, especially if the large map is more used.

 

About 2. There's no easy answer. If you have a reconnect delay (as suggested) you're also punishing people that have random unintentional disconnects. Plus it still won't stop people that disconnect in order to stop you getting the kill.

 

 

I always did and still do think that the map edge thing is a silly idea.. That is one of the few things about this sim that I will never get used to and never fully accept as something that belongs in a quality sim.. Period. It is hokey at best... I still think that they way moving forward for any sim developer is to take the IL2 formula and expand on it..

[steppenwolf]

Maybe so Finkeren. But part of me thinks that if the 'world' was accurately modeled, along the lines of the AC that is, then certain behaviors would fall into place(much like the FM dictates air tactics). An unrealistic environment will foster unrealistic game play, to my way of thinking anyway.

[Finkeren]

I don't disagree with that steppenwolf, but until we get proper objectives driven MP missions, like we have in RoF, there's really no point flying IL-2, Pe-2 or Ju87 if not to attack the enemy airfield. Take that away, and you're essentially removing them from online play, limiting the action to Bf 109s vs. Yaks with a few LaGGs sprinkled in between. I just don't think it's worth it to discourage a few vulchers, it's not like people are all of a sudden going to start flying realistically. That's gonna take a lot more deliberate designing of online play to achieve that.

[steppenwolf]

Totally. Can't wait to see how they do it.

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

I've been pretty impressed with a couple of Lagg driver's recently. Been seeing them above 3000m and doing OK. Usually as bait for a Yak but still getting off a few rounds in snapshots before heading for the deck.

[Gambit21]

 

Until the full map is available online, and there are missions with actual objectives i won't bother at all.

This

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

I know this is OT but I'm the OP so I just had to tell someone, and my wife and real world friends don't care cuz they aren't simmers. My Falcon Northwest Talon shipped today. Yay, me!!

Edited June 14, 2014 by A1FltTrn=HerrMurf

[SCG_Neun]

I know this is OT but I'm the OP so I just had to tell someone, and my wife and real world friends don't care cuz they aren't simmers. My Falcon Northwest Talon shipped today. Yay, me!!

Oh man, that is so neat.  Nothing like hearing that baby boot up for the first time.  Congratulations.

[oneeyeddog]

I know this is OT but I'm the OP so I just had to tell someone, and my wife and real world friends don't care cuz they aren't simmers. My Falcon Northwest Talon shipped today. Yay, me!!

Good for you HerrMurf. 

[II./JG53Lutzow_z06z33]

The best thing to to is having someone fly high cover over the Base. Not allowing strafing is really unrealistic the Americas loved to strafe German airfields

[LastRightsXIII]

I know this is OT but I'm the OP so I just had to tell someone, and my wife and real world friends don't care cuz they aren't simmers. My Falcon Northwest Talon shipped today. Yay, me!!

Sweeeeeeeet!

[Gambit21]

Passing by a field and strafing it is perfectly acceptable IMO, and if you're crying about someone doing that to you then maybe

stay offline. I hate the word "vulching" when used to describe this. It's strafing, and it happened all the time during the war - get over it.

 

CAMPING over an airfield and continuously strafing those who who spawn and are attempting to take off is another matter altogether.

That's the "vulching" often spoken of.

 

People who cry "vulching" when any strafing at happens though - I have no patience for those guys.

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

That's fine, except in an air-quake server who will you get to circle the homebase in case someone strafes it?

Usually all pilots spawn, fly to the zone of engagement, and then respawn. No?

Me, actually. I often hang over the airfield, especially if I can see several friendlies spawning. I always depart on a 270 and check all of the quadrants for those taking off as well as myself before departing to the combat zone - usually climbing on a tangent instead of direct. (D@mmit, now I have given away my departure tactics )

 

I agree strafing is different than vulching but, AGAIN, not the primary purpose of the OP as has been stated by me (OP) and several others in this thread.

[II/JG17_HerrMurf]

I'm an airquaker by circumstance but a teammate by nature.

[mondog]

 

 

It will end up with someone proposing a set of daft rules about only attacking ground targets with bombs or rockets, or making home fields "off limits"

or other such "gamey" solutions.

 

 

That was the worst part of the old IL2 community and some of the servers - usually the ones which also allowed outside view and the F6 aces. I much preferred the Warclouds method: Vulch all you want, just be prepared to face a ton of AA fire. 

[II./JG53Lutzow_z06z33]

That was the worst part of the old IL2 community and some of the servers - usually the ones which also allowed outside view and the F6 aces. I much preferred the Warclouds method: Vulch all you want, just be prepared to face a ton of AA fire.

Exactly strafing runs are fun I do low passes down the enemy runways in my 109 all the time in the old il2, but I don't fire my guns so I don't get banned. Its pretty funny to see all the planes scatter when I make my runs

[Bruce1833]

Buncha cry babies. The game isn't done and the servers aren't final.

[SOLIDKREATE]

I think the addition of the Stalingrad map into MP solved this issue. Now that my throttle works, I've been having a good time. I still think they need to add the Bf-109F-2. I think that variant was more abundant during the BoS.

[TJT]

 I still think they need to add the Bf-109F-2. I think that variant was more abundant during the BoS.

 

No, it wasnt....

[JtD]

Back to vulching, I don't really see this as a bad thing. There need to be limits/options in order to not unnecessarily annoy other players, but it is a valid tactical option. And also one historically relevant to a Stalingrad scenario. The Soviets even had tanks vulching .

 

Anyway, as far as gaming goes, one of my favourite Il-2 online moments was a vulching sortie. A teammate and myself went up in a pair of Il-2's and went for one of the two blue airfields. Though neither of us made it back, we wreaked havoc at the enemy airfield and shared more than two dozen kills between us, completely neutralizing it for several minutes. There were some rules in place that restricted vulching, but anyone to fire at any of us was fair game, and there were plenty of 109 jocks who thought gear up in a 109 means the Il-2 was automatically outclassed. We showed them wrong. I'm absolutely for fair play and all, but this was a moment I wouldn't have wanted to miss for the shear fun of it.

[=LG/F=Kathon]

Weird how there are so many replies in this thread talking about vulching, when vulching wasn't really the point of the topic. 

Conversations do tend to naturally evolve, that's why forums can be frustrating places sometimes with people complaining that certain posts have drifted into Off-Topic territory.

[Praetor]

If you get vulched, it's your own fault.  Do you think fighting at 2k was the norm?  Take off from an airbase that isn't 5k from your enemy's. 

[MikeDitka]

In spite of all the jumping to conclusions, all OP proposed as a solution was another airfield with ground start much further afield from the front.

 

Why anyone wouldn't want this (especially since it's extremely common in RoF) is beyond me...

[Praetor]

Two close airfields at 15k each would also be interesting....

[FuriousMeow]

Topic is pretty much moot due to the Stalingrad map with multiple airfields of varying distances and locales. So, this topic went from relevant to don't matter no more because of the full Stalingrad map in rotation.

 

There's tons of airfields far enough from the action that if you get vulched, its pretty much your own fault on the Stalingrad map.

[MarcoRossolini]

I'm against vulching by fighters but ground attack aircraft are fine, it's what they're for!