Roger what?

[MoToad]

First time flight in the Jug today. Surprised to hear a lot of 'Roger that'. Something that didn't appear till the late fifties. Would not be surprised to hear a bunch of Roger what? replies. Kinda like Who's on first and What's on second.

[Monksilver]

Roger was in use during WW2. It comes from phonetic alphabet in use then. R = Roger, R being used as short hand in Morse for received. So a bit like Viet Cong being VC and then Victor Charlie, ultimately Charlie. In the 1950's the NATA phonetic alphabet came in, R then being Romeo. 

 

So 'Roger that' is appropriate for 1944 ops.

[MoToad]

Nope. No Roger that in '44. Only Roger.

[Gambit21]

1 hour ago, MoToad said:

Nope. No Roger that in '44. Only Roger.

 

Source?

 

[[DBS]Browning]

Searching googles archive of print material, the earliest "Roger that" I can find is from 1970,although there is a "we Roger that call" from 1966. 

Just "Roger" as a radio call appears first in 1944.

 

It could be that the phrase was in use before it appeared in print, but it will be hard to prove that it was and impossible to prove that it wasn't. 

Edited February 17, 2021 by [DBS]Browning

[Feathered_IV]

So saying you are rogering something had a totally different meaning in WW2?

[MoToad]

I sourced Google, Wiki and the like. Roger Wilco was the common catchphrase back then. I believe Wilco was short for will comply. My whole reason for this was because every modern movie and tv show has a lot of 'Roger that' in it. And when I heard the American pilots using it I just thought wait a minute. But, no biggie. Hell, go see Dunkirk if you want to see how bad inaccuracies can get.

Edited February 17, 2021 by MoToad

[Gambit21]

40 minutes ago, MoToad said:

I sourced Google, Wiki and the like. Roger Wilco was the common catchphrase back then. I believe Wilco was short for will comply. My whole reason for this was because every modern movie and tv show has a lot of 'Roger that' in it. And when I heard the American pilots using it I just thought wait a minute. But, no biggie. Hell, go see Dunkirk if you want to see how bad inaccuracies can get.

 

This is all very silly.

 

First of all, "roger wilco" was not a "catch phrase", it was short for "Roger, will comply"

 

You've also failed to provide a reliable source stating that no pilot ever thought of adding the word "that" after "roger" until such and such a year.

FYI Google and Wikie are not going to get you very far around here, especially with a claim like this.

 

 

Quote

Roger that dates back to US radio communication as early as 1941, 

 

In fact I can post a page of them if I wanted...from your Google methodology.

 

I have plenty of WWII aviation books on my shelf, and I can assure you that "roger that" was used in WWII as I've seen it on more than one occasion.

I'm not about to go paging through all of them to figure out if was in Robin Old's book, or in Hell Hawks, or one of my 352nd histories or multiple.

Also, I absolutely KNOW that I've heard Bob Powell, Don Bryan, Don McKibben etc use this on occasion during our interviews some years back.

 

Adding "that" to a phrase does not constitute an "invention" of any sort.

This like saying nobody every thought of saying did you hear that? Or did you see that? until such and such a year, and that before 1955 it was only "Did you hear?" and "Did you see?"  

 

The fact of the matter is that radio comms, especially during WWII (and frankly much later than that) were as varied as the pilots who spoke them.

There was no established comms brevity convention like the armed forces have now, and for the most part pilots simply talked how they talked.

 

Unfortunately I can't call up Bob, Don etc to ask them as they've all passed, but even if they were still around I'm sure they'd think it was an awfully stupid question.

 

It's a good thing we're not in a squadron, and that I'm not your CO MoToad, or your new call sign would be ReToad. 

All with tongue firmly implanted in cheek of course...but you sorta walked into it with this one. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 17, 2021 by Gambit21

[No_85_Gramps]

Roger, wilco, over and out...

 

 

[Gambit21]

7 hours ago, [DBS]Browning said:

Searching googles archive of print material, the earliest "Roger that" I can find is from 1970,although there is a "we Roger that call" from 1966. 

Just "Roger" as a radio call appears first in 1944.

 

It could be that the phrase was in use before it appeared in print, but it will be hard to prove that it was and impossible to prove that it wasn't. 

 

 

In other news, “It’s a trap!” was never used in the Star Wars universe before about the middle of the Clone Wars - when “It’s a” was invented by Admiral Scmoozley Scnarkson. Apparently before this invention it was simply “trap!”

 

[JG27_Steini]

Is that "Roger that" response new to the whole game or only a P47 or campaign message. Thank you.

[Steambat]

Roger - I have received your transmission

Over - end of transmission, awaiting reply

Out - end of transmission, no reply required