Float Planes?

[[APAF]VR_Spartan85]

Hey all!  I'm curious if float planes are possible in our current maps, especially Kuban?  Not sure if there has ever been talks of it as tried searching but didn't find anything.
I know the Pacific is a topic on the very distant horizon.. like reaaaaaaly far away through the giant ice wall...

But with Normandy coming soon and because i love the thought of an endless runway... Is the idea of sea planes/flying boats possible in this engine?  we had it In Rise of Flight.. awesomeness.....

Thanks!

[DetCord12B]

They served primarily in a reconnaissance role and given that naval surface warfare isn't really fleshed out in the series I'm not sure how they'd fit in. Maybe a Battle of the North Sea would be an option down the road as a minor expansion that could include something like that. Then again, it might not even possible as a land-able surface with regards to the current version of the game engine.

 

Love to see them though!

[BlitzPig_EL]

One can dream...

 

[AndyJWest]

Well, as you say, they had floatplanes (and a flying boat) in RoF. And I doubt they've actually removed the functionality from the code, though it would probably need work to update fully. 

 

As for whether they developers can justify a floatplane to the investors (which is what really determines whether it happens), I'd like to think they have a chance at least. Either for WW2 (PBY, Walrus...) or for Flying Circus - the Felixstowe updated to IL-2 GB standards would be even more magnificent than it is now.

[Gambit21]

 

Speaking of 'what if' aircraft that will never pencil out. 'sigh'

[[APAF]VR_Spartan85]

I would love to see the Walrus in game.. would be fun for Normandy map, rescuing planes downed in the water..  

what about the Ju-52 on floats?  The may would be cool..

[DetCord12B]

1 hour ago, AndyJWest said:

Well, as you say, they had floatplanes (and a flying boat) in RoF. And I doubt they've actually removed the functionality from the code, though it would probably need work to update fully. 

 

As for whether they developers can justify a floatplane to the investors (which is what really determines whether it happens), I'd like to think they have a chance at least. Either for WW2 (PBY, Walrus...) or for Flying Circus - the Felixstowe updated to IL-2 GB standards would be even more magnificent than it is now.

 

How exactly would these work within the current BoX offerings? Again, these types of aircraft served very specific functions, and as you're are known for telling people what does and does not work in this series, how exactly would said airframes function within the current environment when said naval aspects aren't present and the game itself lacks dedicated naval warfare components and dynamics?

 

As you are very fond of pointing out, the developers have better things to do than to indulge whims here and there. Beyond that however, the devs are anything if not pragmatic, and they're not known for designing and implementing aircraft that don't fit into any of the current BoX titles and their subsequent nations TO&E's and or battlefield deployment ratios. The investor aspect is nonsense. What an asinine comment, as if this game was somehow completely dependent upon the parent and pitched into the crapper if "the investor" is somehow perturbed. You might wanna take an actual look at the the income stream before making such absurd claims.

 

It's not that I wouldn't like to see one or two or more of them. The fact remains, given a precedent, would they fit into the current BoX lineup. No. No they wouldn't. 

[XQ_Lothar29]

It would not be unreasonable to do some Seaplane to be able to torpedo or hunt submarines, or even to launch mines, in the RoF

the Seaplanes did not make much sense either, there were no naval wars, but they were

made and were successful.

If they wanted, I think they could make pilot rescue seaplanes, which parachute into the sea.
Nowadays, if you jump from the plane over the sea and fall into the water, your pilot drowns instantly. Well, they could

fix this system and leave the Pilots in an inflatable boat or floating with their life jacket with a "maximum time of 20min or 30min" and in that time a

pilot can come to rescue you from the sea.
At the moment we have the Black Sea and the Sea of Azov, but in Normandy, we will have a large part of the Atlantic in the Area that includes

the English Channel, with which the Atlantic communicates with the North Sea.
So it wouldn't be too far-fetched to create Seaplanes for rescue, reconnaissance, mining and torpedo bombers.

would add to my way of seeing another dimension to the simulator.

 

Practical examples:

 

Luftwaffe:

- Heinkel He 59 

Spoiler

    

 

 

 

 

- Heinkel He 115 

Spoiler

 

 

-  Heinkel He 60  

Spoiler

 

- Dornier Do18 N

Spoiler

 

 

- Dornier Do24 

Spoiler

Allies:

 

- Short S.25 Sunderland 

Spoiler

 

- Consolidated PBY Catalina

Spoiler

 

- Grumman G-21 Goose 

Spoiler

 

And More exemples

Edited February 7, 2021 by XQ_Lothar29

[AndyJWest]

12 minutes ago, DetCord12B said:

 

How exactly would these work within the current BoX offerings? Again, these types of aircraft served very specific functions, and as you're are known for telling people what does and does not work in this series, how exactly would said airframes function within the current environment when said naval aspects aren't present and the game itself lacks dedicated naval warfare components and dynamics?

 

As you are very fond of pointing out, the developers have better things to do than to indulge whims here and there. Beyond that however, the devs are anything if not pragmatic, and they're not known for designing and implementing aircraft that don't fit into any of the current BoX titles and their subsequent nations TO&E's and or battlefield deployment ratios. The investor aspect is nonsense. What an asinine comment, as if this game was somehow completely dependent upon the parent and pitched into the crapper if "the investor" is somehow perturbed. You might wanna take an actual look at the the income stream before making such absurd claims.

 

It's not that I wouldn't like to see one or two or more of them. The fact remains, given a precedent, would they fit into the current BoX lineup. No. No they wouldn't. 

 

So, we both suggest that we'd like to see floatplanes in IL-2 GB, and then you respond to my post like that? Welcome to my ignore list.

[Ram399]

Living in Florida as a pilot, if I could own any plane in the world it would hands down be a PBY Catalina.
If one were added to the sim I would happily cruise the North Sea for hours on end hunting for U-Boats.


 

[Missionbug]

I think it fair to say that many pilots who ditched in the channel owe their lives to seaplanes, from both sides, besides rescues they were also used for reconnaissance, attacking surface vessels and submarines so should be a integral part of the Kuban and Normandy series and would certainly make for interesting missions providing they are flyable, even just AI though they would be a option for escort missions.

 

The aircraft and their crews performed extremely dangerous and important work so deserve to be represented in the series.

 

Take care and be safe.

 

Wishing you all the very best, Pete.

[Motherbrain]

I'm kind of hoping if we ever get a 1918 version of the channel map like in RoF we could see the Felixstowe and W12 again. I'd love to see seaplanes again.

 

 

 

Edited February 7, 2021 by Motherbrain

[jollyjack]

You can star practicing, there are no floaters, but like jesus: walk on the water (route marked by flames):

 

WATERPLANES JJ.zip

[Avimimus]

9 hours ago, [APAF]VR_Spartan85 said:

Hey all!  I'm curious if float planes are possible in our current maps, especially Kuban?  Not sure if there has ever been talks of it as tried searching but didn't find anything.
I know the Pacific is a topic on the very distant horizon.. like reaaaaaaly far away through the giant ice wall...

But with Normandy coming soon and because i love the thought of an endless runway... Is the idea of sea planes/flying boats possible in this engine?  we had it In Rise of Flight.. awesomeness.....

Thanks!

 

So far as I can tell the units were stationed on the western shore of the Black Sea and refuelled at Sevastopol. However, there were Ar-196 operating with minor axis powers in the Black Sea as well... so it is quite plausible that they would have been used around Kuban - I just wasn't able to confirm it yet (partly on account of not being good at reading German).

 

I do find the idea of doing recon and artillery spotting in an Ar-196 to be pretty appealing.

[Heliopause]

[Enceladus828]

While a seaplane refers to any plane that operates on water, there's a difference between a floatplane and a flying boat.

 

This is a floatplane because it has floats beneath it to provide buoyancy while on the water.

 

While this is a Flying boat (though it has floats on the wings, they provide lateral stability during taxi, take-off, and landing):

 

As well as this (though, because it has landing gear it can be called an amphibian).

 

 

And yes, I would really hope to see some seaplanes added to the game in the near future. My dream plane for IL-2 1946 is a flyable H8K with the actual cockpit, bombardier, and gunner stations?

 

Cheers.

Edited February 7, 2021 by Enceladus

[DD_Arthur]

12 hours ago, DetCord12B said:

 Then again, it might not even possible as a land-able surface with regards to the current version of the game engine.

 

I might be talking out of my backside but wasn't RoF's water technology brought into the game with the Kuban release?

[fergal69]

What about the AR196?

Spoiler

 

 

Edited February 8, 2021 by SYN_Haashashin

[[APAF]VR_Spartan85]

11 hours ago, XQ_Lothar29 said:

It would not be unreasonable to do some Seaplane to be able to torpedo or hunt submarines, or even to launch mines, in the RoF

the Seaplanes did not make much sense either, there were no naval wars, but they were

made and were successful.

If they wanted, I think they could make pilot rescue seaplanes, which parachute into the sea.
Nowadays, if you jump from the plane over the sea and fall into the water, your pilot drowns instantly. Well, they could

fix this system and leave the Pilots in an inflatable boat or floating with their life jacket with a "maximum time of 20min or 30min" and in that time a

pilot can come to rescue you from the sea.
At the moment we have the Black Sea and the Sea of Azov, but in Normandy, we will have a large part of the Atlantic in the Area that includes

the English Channel, with which the Atlantic communicates with the North Sea.
So it wouldn't be too far-fetched to create Seaplanes for rescue, reconnaissance, mining and torpedo bombers.

would add to my way of seeing another dimension to the simulator.

 

Practical examples:

 

Luftwaffe:

- Heinkel He 59 

  Hide contents

    

 

 

 

 

- Heinkel He 115 

  Hide contents

 

 

-  Heinkel He 60  

  Hide contents

 

- Dornier Do18 N

  Hide contents

 

 

- Dornier Do24 

  Hide contents

Allies:

 

- Short S.25 Sunderland 

  Hide contents

 

- Consolidated PBY Catalina

  Hide contents

 

- Grumman G-21 Goose 

  Hide contents

 

And More exemples

This... and this... 

ability to save downed pilots in the water, reconnaissance, running supplies to ships/ports, hunting subs... 

 

the pilots in water thing, why they just drown and don’t have dingy’s, I think that reasoning was covered already by devs stating either the pilots in our current maps weren’t equipped with them (except now we have the brits and American pilots...) or it’s a recoding that needs to take place...

 

but the idea still remains... adding a whole new role to play in the sim.

point systems, showing off water tech, and just plain fun to fly float planes/flying boats....

and there’s one or more for each side

 

 

3 minutes ago, fergal69 said:

What about the AR196?

 

 

My uncle actually has a model of this in his room, and it’s what sparked this forum page

[Docholiday]

7 hours ago, Motherbrain said:

I'm kind of hoping if we ever get a 1918 version of the channel map like in RoF we could see the Felixstowe and W12 again. I'd love to see seaplanes again.

 

 

 

Yes. For me that would be great too !!!!

Edited February 7, 2021 by Docholiday

[[APAF]VR_Spartan85]

Anywho, thanks everyone who supports the idea and posted pics!  
As a VR operator, another aspect of these beautiful contraptions is I want to experience:)

 

 

[Ram399]

Does this count?
The A-20 is a little confused but its got the spirit:

Spoiler

Might be a bit off topic but has anybody else here encountered this weird buoyancy glitch?
I've only ever seen it twice and only with A-20s, its pretty strange.

[danielprates]

4 hours ago, DD_Arthur said:

 

I might be talking out of my backside but wasn't RoF's water technology brought into the game with the Kuban release?

 

This is what I would like to see someone answer with propriety; if the game engine allows it or not.

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

18 hours ago, DetCord12B said:

How exactly would these work within the current BoX offerings? Again, these types of aircraft served very specific functions, and as you're are known for telling people what does and does not work in this series, how exactly would said airframes function within the current environment when said naval aspects aren't present and the game itself lacks dedicated naval warfare components and dynamics?

 

I think seaplanes would fit in almost as well as the other 'odd' aircraft in the series, namely the Ju 52 and U-2. BOK features just about everything you need to set up various historical seaplane missions.

 

On the Axis side, Do 24 and Ju 52 seaplanes served as transports in the Kuban airlift and performed air-sea rescue duties. Forward bases were in the Kerch area, so the Kuban map would be sufficient. Several other types may have operated in the area, including the He 59, Ar 196, Fw 58, and BV 138.

 

Granted, the units involved were small, so it's hard to justify any development. The ideal area for Black Sea operations would be to the west, between Romania and the Crimea.

Edited February 8, 2021 by Mitthrawnuruodo

[Luftschiff]

I love the seaplanes, the torpedo bombers and the flying boats with a fiery passion. WW1, Interwar, WW2- I don't care, bring 'em on!

[migmadmarine]

I think SAR missions could be scripted too, define a search zone on the map, and somewhere have a lifeboat or a pilot in a raft (model would need to be made I imagine) in that zone, and set a trigger for the aircraft that would require landing along side, removing the object once completed. Might be largely doable in the editor currently, though I don't know. 

[76IAP-Black]

Best idea ever to implement a floatplane and add a campaign for it. 

Like supply missions, rescue, spotting and hunting

Edited February 12, 2021 by 76IAP-Black

[[APAF]VR_Spartan85]

Wowzers... especially with the way srs on combatbox interacts!   Brings a whole new level of play to the game.. 

requesting call signs, missions and reporting positions!   
you could easily report last position when going down and that would assign SaR mission to your location...

 

I hope other servers adopt the tech to do this.. 

 

we need every plane that can be, on floats   

Could also be used to capture downed pilots to gather intel

[Majakowski]

I would love to finally see seaplanes. A few things that have been said come with a little difficulty.

 

There was the point that one said pilots should float 20-30 minutes until SAR must reach them. Depending on various inaccuracies in reporting one's position this hard limit could be quite difficult. As after taking of and taking say 10 minutes to the search area, that tiny dingy has to be found. I have made myself some anti-submarine missions in CloD were I knew the general direction of the sub but in the end it was not less than one hour on any attempt, that I made out the spot in the sea and that already was with a roughly planned search pattern and timing the legs. Now for a "target" that is even tinier and thus seen even later.

 

Even reaching the general direction of a little rubber boat in an area with no landmarks whatsoever requires some serious navigation if it wasn't for the well known "this is your definitive target"-mail stamp on the minimap. Maybe those "non-boomboom-zoomzoom"-requirements keep us from getting this as it is considered boring? The aspect of actually flying the aircraft straight and level for more than two minutes isn't too well appreciated by some.

 

Next point: Scripting rescue missions in today's editor would also lead to some pain for the mission creator as randomization of origin or waypoint is kind of....not intuitive.... to do in editor. So the mission builder who does those missions for his own entertainment would already know the exact positions which takes all the fun. I for example resort to a self made "randomizer" in which I load the mission files and edit the waypoints within some boundaries without having the map visualize and therefor betray the altered location.

 

On the pro side: I think seaplanes could after all be a very sleek and thankful project as nobody in the "seaplane bubble" expects 19 billion different semi-identical Walrus variants. Even a handful of planes would already be almost overdone, many were used throughout the entire war and hadn't that selective pressure.

 

But altogether some bittersweet taste would remain even if we see seaplanes some day. In Multiplayer they would be sitting ducks and considering the lack of coordination in general I doubt that SAR would be much of a thing. Especially not for those treading water except for example those survivors could be converted into AI after surviving impact on water and the human pilot could respawn as usual. Then again it would be a charme if those survivors could be rescued by both sides, determining the final status of the pilot eighter captured or rescued depending on who got there first and allowing them to continue their virtual lives on the respective servers. But I drift off into Shangri La i guess...

 

Then there would be the Singleplayer issue. Going out to get butchered by a neatly scripted fighter squadron or Superman-flak lol.

[Noisemaker]

11 hours ago, Majakowski said:

I would love to finally see seaplanes. A few things that have been said come with a little difficulty.

 

There was the point that one said pilots should float 20-30 minutes until SAR must reach them. Depending on various inaccuracies in reporting one's position this hard limit could be quite difficult. As after taking of and taking say 10 minutes to the search area, that tiny dingy has to be found. I have made myself some anti-submarine missions in CloD were I knew the general direction of the sub but in the end it was not less than one hour on any attempt, that I made out the spot in the sea and that already was with a roughly planned search pattern and timing the legs. Now for a "target" that is even tinier and thus seen even later.

To be fair, subs don't pop smoke or launch flares to let you know where they are when you're near.

[PatrickAWlson]

On 8/15/2021 at 4:44 AM, Noisemaker said:

To be fair, subs don't pop smoke or launch flares to let you know where they are when you're near.

 

That's a mission design problem.