Are the free tanks representative of Tank Crew

[[DBS]Browning]

If they are, I'll save my money as I'm really not impressed by them.

If they aren't representative, it's a horrible advertisement for Tank Crew.

[SCG_judgedeath3]

they are very poor compared to the tanks you have in the game, much more realistic and fully modelled and simulated and each place in the tank is manned, much better damage model and details etc.

[[DBS]Browning]

In that case, I wonder why the Devs have left them in. They made a terrible first impression for me.

 

[THERION]

2 hours ago, [DBS]Browning said:

In that case, I wonder why the Devs have left them in. They made a terrible first impression for me.

 

 

Well, I wouldn't be that harsh - it's like if you play a demo of a game. These demo versions do not always depict the whole content or the possibilities of the full version.

But for those wanting to have a go, it isn't that bad. Sure, these two models are not comparable to the models of the full TC version, but it gives you some kind of a first

impression.

 

Btw. with each update, the dev team also alter these two models too, although you still have only two stations on them to man. I think it is still fair and you can still

be successful on a battle with these two tanks.

[Cybermat47]

The free tanks predate TC.

 

As for why they were left in... well, who wants less content?

[SCG_judgedeath3]

A better option would be to replace them with Panzer III M and the SU 122 as demo tanks.

[No_Face]

4 hours ago, [DBS]Browning said:

In that case, I wonder why the Devs have left them in. They made a terrible first impression for me.

 

Because it represents work and it is never pleasant to put hours of work in the trash.

 

Although below the tanks TC, they give a preview of the ground gameplay.

I own TC and yet I sometimes play multiplayer with the Pz III, for fun.

 

If you already find fun playing with free tanks, then you will find fun playing with TC's.

If these tanks give you the wrong impression, there are youtube videos left to see the interior of the other tanks.

 

Personally, I would really like these tanks to be finalized at the same level as the other.

This would make a better showcase, and owners of 2 TCs would have "2 more tanks" in the hangar. Everyone would be winners. But it costs time and money.

[SCG_Neun]

It's also a good marketing technique to allow someone trying out the game to actually join in a combined arms mission, say with someone like us, using the free light tank which can be a lot of fun and provide our medium to heavy tanks valuable recon information for us out in front of the formation.  Chances are, someone using a free tank at this level, will purchase the game.  But I do understand the other point you make  [DBS] Browning.  I haven't researched it yet, but maybe even some clarification in the Tank Crew game introduction on the Store Site.

Edited January 6, 2021 by SCG_Neun

[LachenKrieg]

1 hour ago, No_Face said:

Because it represents work and it is never pleasant to put hours of work in the trash.

 

Although below the tanks TC, they give a preview of the ground gameplay.

I own TC and yet I sometimes play multiplayer with the Pz III, for fun.

 

If you already find fun playing with free tanks, then you will find fun playing with TC's.

If these tanks give you the wrong impression, there are youtube videos left to see the interior of the other tanks.

 

Personally, I would really like these tanks to be finalized at the same level as the other.

This would make a better showcase, and owners of 2 TCs would have "2 more tanks" in the hangar. Everyone would be winners. But it costs time and money.

I like the free tank models and actually use them a fair bit. Like you, I was hoping that they would finish the free tanks to a more complete state, and was impressed with what was included in the latest patch regarding the free tanks.

 

Additions to free tanks in last patch:

6. Added missing fire effect to old player controllable tanks (T-34 STZ 1942 and Pz.Kpfw.III Ausf. L);
7. Old player controllable tanks (T-34 STZ 1942 and Pz.Kpfw.III Ausf. L) should no longer shoot at targets when considered destroyed (when their marker is removed);
8. Old player controllable tanks (T-34 STZ 1942 and Pz.Kpfw.III Ausf. L) have visual models of the driver and tank commander;
9. The surviving crewmen of the old player controllable tanks (T-34 STZ 1942 and Pz.Kpfw.III Ausf. L) leave if the tank is knocked out;
10. Old player controllable tanks (T-34 STZ 1942 and Pz.Kpfw.III Ausf. L) commanders have a pistol and binoculars;

 

It would be nice to see the templates for these vehicles so that they could also be skinned for missions and campaign game play. IMO, I think both free tanks add a lot of realism to the game as it helps better represent the composition of the armored units that were there.

[LachenKrieg]

On 1/6/2021 at 4:22 AM, [DBS]Browning said:

If they are, I'll save my money as I'm really not impressed by them.

If they aren't representative, it's a horrible advertisement for Tank Crew.

Something that hasn't been asked yet, what is it about the free tanks the OP is not impressed with? It would be interesting to know how they could be improved so that people trying them out would consider buying Tank Crew.

 

 

3 hours ago, =13NVO=Eeafanas said:

I believe that it is necessary to write under each new diary of developers that in the future they MUST transfer the T-34 STZ and Pz 3 L to the same level as the Tank Crew.  Since this will be an EXCELLENT passive advertisement, besides, they can already be regarded as a full-fledged part of the Tank Crew.  And these tanks are also suitable for use in battles in 1941 (the T-34 STZ began to be produced in March 1940, and the Pz 3 L from December 1941).  Among Soviet tankers, the name of the turrets for the T-34 was also common.  for example, on all early T-34s, the upper part was comically called "Turret-pie", and on later T-34s (as in our game, this T-34 as part of the Tank Crew) was called "turret-nut".  We still conditionally divide the early, middle and late main modifications of the T-34) 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

Wasn't the battle of Prokhorovka in 1943?

Edited January 7, 2021 by LachenKrieg

[Enzo38]

OP = Original Poster

[kestrel79]

It seems like every update to improve the 2 stock tanks to bring them more up to par with the Tank Crew thanks. Here's hoping this continues.

[LachenKrieg]

6 hours ago, =13NVO=Eeafanas said:

my translator cannot translate it)

I did not understand the question

@Enzo38 already translated, refers to the person that started the thread.

 

You mentioned that the free tanks could be used for battles in 1941, I wasn't sure if you meant 1943 as in the battle of Prokhorovka, or if you really meant 1941.

[SCG_judgedeath3]

On 1/7/2021 at 7:31 PM, kestrel79 said:

It seems like every update to improve the 2 stock tanks to bring them more up to par with the Tank Crew thanks. Here's hoping this continues.

Can only hope as the damage model of them is as I said very poorly and gives those who play these tanks a big advantage.

Okay well at least its better now than 2 years ago when the free to play tanks had HP gauge style where a Panzer III L could take more hits than a  tiger for example. But to this day these tanks can be exploited and unrealistic in how much damage they can take and behave.

Okay what advantages and what is so bad with those tanks?
1: The interior is lacking, darkened out to hide details, cant see the radio operators or the crew members inside, nor can play those stations.
2: Cant close the commander vision ports and cant use them, can only either go inside the gunner sight or button up.
2 1/2: In the past and maybe to this day as I see some videos where people manage to do this but not sure how: can from commander position traverse the turret and aim and shot without having to go inside the gunner station, which is a big advantage compared to TC tanks that you have to go inside the gunner sight to do this.
3: As the tanks arent as modelled they cant be as damaged or behave damaged when they get hit, no fuel burning if you damage the fuel tanks or damage the commander visors or commander cupola and all the small details that you have in the TC tanks.
4: Persicope and alternative stations and hatches cant be used or opened in these tanks.
5: The tanks can take strange amount of damage which would had destroyed the TC tanks but these can still function and work on.
6: They have also weird penetration ability, with the free to play T-34 you can knock out panther tanks frontally with ease if you know where to aim while the TC T-34-43 model cant. (this isnt historical to any degree and is unfair advantage).
7: I maybe shouldnt tell this as its ruining the fun for many but there are ways to become unkillable or near unkillable in the Panzer III L and T-34 41 models: Turn your tank around and show the enemy tanks or AI the back of your tank, and the best they can do is to destroy your engine, but your crew and the rest of the tank are fine and can keep fighting and cant be killed in certain cases, in singple player missions the AI will think after the engine is destroyed that you are dead and starts to drive forwards as you dont exist anymore, but you can kill all the enemy AI tanks as they come closer, and they wont do anything if you shot them either. Played a single player mission where one shall defend against an attack of panthers and tigers and by using this trick I found a spot and got immobilised and then I killed them as they drove past my tank.
In multiplayer this is a even bigger advantage, although its not happening as often as in the past but it do happen time to time.(Some people claim this tro be historically accurate and correct for the T-34 and the engine is able to protect one from tank shells....Which its not unless you use HEAT ammo or modern frag shells. Ask any tank instructor if you are in the tank corps like myself and they will laugh, no tank unit will ever use such tactic nor in ww2. The engine is made of aluminimum or soft metal, its not armour nor face hardened armour, so AP rounds will go through the engine like butter as steel metal dont really stop much besides small arms fire, I can buy that from certain angles and luck the AP round might explode inside the engine bay but then big pieces of the engine will be blown up and the next AP round wont be stopped and go inside the crew compartment and kill them.) Engines dont stop AP rounds or can make one unkillable. the normal TC tanks you get killed in if you try this trick.
8: The free to play tanks with all the mentioned above makes those tanks a bit better in some ways than the TC tanks and is why I see some players after 2 years still sticking to these tanks and not buying TC, if unemployed people manage to buy Tank crew after 5 months of saving and some dont buy it for over 2 years then there is a problem, here is an example of the reaction when the TC t-34 came out: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/51875-the-new-t34/.

Here are two videos, one I made when playing a single player mission and the other a quick mission and can see here the bad damage model of the tank, I havent had the time to make a recording of the Panzer III L but it too has its damage model issues and can be exploited, hence I never want to play these tanks:

Here on a multiplayer server where I found a panther and tried this, he couldnt kill me even with 2 hits in the rear of my tank and my crew and tank was fully operational, but sadly the enemy tank got taken out by a pilot so couldnt get to shot him or wait for him to shot me some more but doubting it would had done anything:

So thats the sum up on the free to play tanks and to me they give a bad impression of the game and is very unealistic and they are nowhere near the realism of tC tanks are and needs major work to be as good and fair to play as the TC tanks.

[No_Face]

I'm very surprised, for me the free tanks were very vulnerable (this is my experience with Quick Battle) and usually get killed in one hit.

I did not know all these "advantages".

[SCG_judgedeath3]

2 minutes ago, No_Face said:

I'm very surprised, for me the free tanks were very vulnerable (this is my experience with Quick Battle) and usually get killed in one hit.

From the front and sides its like you say, most shots will kill one, besides a few times when the damage model acts up, but try reversing and you wont be as easily killed in quick missions

[No_Face]

You should submit a topic in the bug section, with video as proof so they can fix it.

[SCG_judgedeath3]

Do you have a link to it?

[No_Face]

Hmmm? I am not sure I understood. ?

Start a new topic "TC - Damage Bug with Free T-34" for example in the section linked below.

https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/forum/89-technical-issues-and-bug-reports/

[SCG_judgedeath3]

Thats what I wanted, thanks, will do! ?

[LachenKrieg]

6 hours ago, SCG_judgedeath3 said:

Can only hope as the damage model of them is as I said very poorly and gives those who play these tanks a big advantage.

Okay well at least its better now than 2 years ago when the free to play tanks had HP gauge style where a Panzer III L could take more hits than a  tiger for example. But to this day these tanks can be exploited and unrealistic in how much damage they can take and behave.

Okay what advantages and what is so bad with those tanks?
1: The interior is lacking, darkened out to hide details, cant see the radio operators or the crew members inside, nor can play those stations.
2: Cant close the commander vision ports and cant use them, can only either go inside the gunner sight or button up.
2 1/2: In the past and maybe to this day as I see some videos where people manage to do this but not sure how: can from commander position traverse the turret and aim and shot without having to go inside the gunner station, which is a big advantage compared to TC tanks that you have to go inside the gunner sight to do this.
3: As the tanks arent as modelled they cant be as damaged or behave damaged when they get hit, no fuel burning if you damage the fuel tanks or damage the commander visors or commander cupola and all the small details that you have in the TC tanks.
4: Persicope and alternative stations and hatches cant be used or opened in these tanks.
5: The tanks can take strange amount of damage which would had destroyed the TC tanks but these can still function and work on.
6: They have also weird penetration ability, with the free to play T-34 you can knock out panther tanks frontally with ease if you know where to aim while the TC T-34-43 model cant. (this isnt historical to any degree and is unfair advantage).
7: I maybe shouldnt tell this as its ruining the fun for many but there are ways to become unkillable or near unkillable in the Panzer III L and T-34 41 models: Turn your tank around and show the enemy tanks or AI the back of your tank, and the best they can do is to destroy your engine, but your crew and the rest of the tank are fine and can keep fighting and cant be killed in certain cases, in singple player missions the AI will think after the engine is destroyed that you are dead and starts to drive forwards as you dont exist anymore, but you can kill all the enemy AI tanks as they come closer, and they wont do anything if you shot them either. Played a single player mission where one shall defend against an attack of panthers and tigers and by using this trick I found a spot and got immobilised and then I killed them as they drove past my tank.
In multiplayer this is a even bigger advantage, although its not happening as often as in the past but it do happen time to time.(Some people claim this tro be historically accurate and correct for the T-34 and the engine is able to protect one from tank shells....Which its not unless you use HEAT ammo or modern frag shells. Ask any tank instructor if you are in the tank corps like myself and they will laugh, no tank unit will ever use such tactic nor in ww2. The engine is made of aluminimum or soft metal, its not armour nor face hardened armour, so AP rounds will go through the engine like butter as steel metal dont really stop much besides small arms fire, I can buy that from certain angles and luck the AP round might explode inside the engine bay but then big pieces of the engine will be blown up and the next AP round wont be stopped and go inside the crew compartment and kill them.) Engines dont stop AP rounds or can make one unkillable. the normal TC tanks you get killed in if you try this trick.
8: The free to play tanks with all the mentioned above makes those tanks a bit better in some ways than the TC tanks and is why I see some players after 2 years still sticking to these tanks and not buying TC, if unemployed people manage to buy Tank crew after 5 months of saving and some dont buy it for over 2 years then there is a problem, here is an example of the reaction when the TC t-34 came out: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/51875-the-new-t34/.

Here are two videos, one I made when playing a single player mission and the other a quick mission and can see here the bad damage model of the tank, I havent had the time to make a recording of the Panzer III L but it too has its damage model issues and can be exploited, hence I never want to play these tanks:

Here on a multiplayer server where I found a panther and tried this, he couldnt kill me even with 2 hits in the rear of my tank and my crew and tank was fully operational, but sadly the enemy tank got taken out by a pilot so couldnt get to shot him or wait for him to shot me some more but doubting it would had done anything:

So thats the sum up on the free to play tanks and to me they give a bad impression of the game and is very unealistic and they are nowhere near the realism of tC tanks are and needs major work to be as good and fair to play as the TC tanks.

In Tank Crew there are two ways to knock an enemy unit out, you have to either destroy the engine, or kill the driver.

 

For the issue where the tank destroyed your engine and then quits firing, it seems like the problem is somehow connected to the DM for the engine not being active in the free tanks. The damage model for the driver seems to be active because when you get penetrated frontally, the tank is considered knocked out I am assuming because the driver has been killed, and the mission ends.

 

What should have happened in your video is your tank should have been recognized as destroyed once the engine was knocked out, your view should have reverted to the "spectate" screen, and the mission should have ended. 

 

But I agree, they really need to bring the free tanks up to par if they want to be able to use them as a sort of way to advertise for the Tank Crew module. Looking at other platforms like WoT's, and WarThunder, having fully functioning free tanks actually sells more premium tanks.

Edited January 9, 2021 by LachenKrieg