Plane climbs and goes right without input

[fnugen]

I just finally got the game running. Now that it is, I have set my controls in the config menus. Thrustmaster T Flight Hotas X (PC/PS3 version). When I go to quick mission and fly, the plane always starts to climb and goes to the right. Even if I set the realism to easy, it does the same. I figured it was set to normal so it's more involved flying. It seems to keep wanting to climb to the right even if I am not holding the flight stick or touching any buttons. Any idea what is causing this?  I tried calibration in windows but nothing changed. 
 

[DD_FT-]

It's 'normal'. Not caused by your joystick - if indeed it's calibrated properly.

 

It has something to do with the forces generated by that big rotating propeller on the front, powered by that big engine.

The propeller always turns in the same direction, the force it causes make the aircraft want to bank to the opposite side ... The more power you add (throttle) the more it banks.

 

As for climbing: Reduce the power setting (throttle), it should climb less steep - and eventually drop the nose and go down.

 

There's other things in play, but this is the simple explanation. Elevator trim and rudder trim can be of help. Prop pitch/rpm are of influence too.

 

(These aircraft  do not really fly straight and level without holding the stick...)

 

Good Luck, Have Fun!

 

[343KKT_Kintaro]

6 hours ago, fnugen said:

I just finally got the game running. Now that it is, I have set my controls in the config menus. Thrustmaster T Flight Hotas X (PC/PS3 version). When I go to quick mission and fly, the plane always starts to climb and goes to the right. Even if I set the realism to easy, it does the same. I figured it was set to normal so it's more involved flying. It seems to keep wanting to climb to the right even if I am not holding the flight stick or touching any buttons. Any idea what is causing this?  I tried calibration in windows but nothing changed. 
 

 

 

"Cliffs of Dover" is a very realistic combat flight simulator, one of the more rewarding sims out there if you use it properly. In real life, real pilots, even in the present day, use a few devices such as the rudder pedals and trim controls so that they can counterbalance the gyroscopic effect of the propeller (DD_FT- just talked about that). This is how they fly straight in whatever direction they want to fly, reducing parasite drag as much as they can.

 

You may find useful to read the following Wikipedia article :

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aircraft_flight_control_system

 

For the moment it is not necessary you read the whole entire article. The first section in this Wikipedia article is titled "Cockpit controls". It is divided in two other subsections: "Primary controls" and "Secondary controls". It will take a few minutes to read those two subsections in the article and this should be sufficient enough for you so that you understand what happens to your aircraft when you are flying on board a virtual plane in the "Cliffs of Dover" simulator.

 

Do not hesitate to use the "free flight" quick missions (Hurricane, Spitfire and 109). You will "air start" in the simulation, already flying, and this will allow you to directly proceed to do some tests with the rudder pedals and with the trim controls.

 

1. You don't know how to use your trim controls in the sim? go to the controls section in the game's menus (joystick/throttle settings and key mapping) and have a look on how your trim controls are mapped. Then reassign the controls as you want them (personally I find that the up/down and left/right positions of hat switches that are located on top of a joystick... work very well for the trim controls). Remember that you have to distinguish between axis controls and button controls. A hat swith on top of a joistick is a set of button controls, usually 8 different positions, but you'll need only four positions for two different trim controls. The third trim control can go to another hat switch if you have it on your joystick.

 

2. You don't have any hardware rudder pedals? Me neither! I use the twist axis in my joystick (which is a Saitek X-52).

 

3. Not all planes have trim controls on their primary controls. Seat in the cockpit of a 109 and you'll see two big wheels on your left hand side. One is for the flaps, the other one is for regulation of the elevator's angle (you control the elevator's angle, thus no trim tab on it). No other trim controls aboard a 109. Seat in the cockpit of a Grumman Martlet Mk III and on the left hand side you'll find three small wheels corresponding to all the trim tabs on your plane. The 109 may allow you to control the elevator trim position... but forces you to permanently use your rudder pedals for the counterbalance of the gyroscopic action of the propeller. The Martlet is a dream, it allows you to trim your plane properly. In any case I love both types of aircraft.

 

Have fun !

[messsucher]

Have to say that all 3 trims is more of a civil plane and ground attack/bomber thing since in dogfights you don't have time in combat to trim the plane to perfection, especially the rudder trim.

[343KKT_Kintaro]

5 minutes ago, messsucher said:

Have to say that all 3 trims is more of a civil plane and ground attack/bomber thing since in dogfights you don't have time in combat to trim the plane to perfection, especially the rudder trim.

 

 

No, not to perfection during a dogfight, but dogfights were occasional and didn't last. Crossings did last and during a crossing, changing the speed and/or the altitude forced the pilots to trim correctly their planes so that they fly as straight as possible, which allowed to spare fuel and time.

 

Furthermore you may trim a lot your elevator on board a 109 during a climb effort... and after that you may forget to set it in an adequate position for an efficient fight after an encounter with a Spitfire. Then you can be sure that you'll not be diving properly if you try to boom&zoom on the Spit.

[fnugen]

I'll play it some more and see if I can get the hang of it. I have played all IL-2 games (except 1946) and even on easy, I had never had this effect that I recall. I used to use an X-52 pro, but it's long gone. I now have the HOTAS X and it's adjustments are limited. I'll read that wiki and fly some more.  I'm sure there are other parts of the game I'll have trouble with once I get into it more.  

 

It's just been a handful of years since I did a flight sim, so it may be a relearning situation. I suppose I should up my life insurance for the dogfight scenarios. I am sure I won't survive too many at the beginning.  ?

Edited October 1, 2020 by fnugen

[messsucher]

1 hour ago, 343KKT_Kintaro said:

 

 

No, not to perfection during a dogfight, but dogfights were occasional and didn't last. Crossings did last and during a crossing, changing the speed and/or the altitude forced the pilots to trim correctly their planes so that they fly as straight as possible, which allowed to spare fuel and time.

 

Furthermore you may trim a lot your elevator on board a 109 during a climb effort... and after that you may forget to set it in an adequate position for an efficient fight after an encounter with a Spitfire. Then you can be sure that you'll not be diving properly if you try to boom&zoom on the Spit.

 

Yeah, but in this game dogfights are constant. Because of that bf 109 thing I want lever for bf 109 pitch thing trim (and of course to all other trims too).

 

I land and take off, and don't use autopilot, so I actually liked allied planes in original IL-2 because you could trim them and it was very worthwhile to do. Somehow I feel in BoX it is more easy to fly with only bf 109 pitch thing trim, and even more so if you use "level flight" or whatever shift-a button, which appear to be not disabled by any difficulty setting. So the trimming in BoX feel more like a chore, and allied planes not so good anymore.

[343KKT_Kintaro]

9 minutes ago, fnugen said:

I'll play it some more and see if I can get the hang of it.

 

 

Wise decision!
 

 

9 minutes ago, fnugen said:

I have played all IL-2 games (except 1946)

 

 

The three IL-2 series of games are the following :

1 - "IL-2 Sturmovik", released in 2001. Since 2006 it has been renamed under the name "IL-2 Sturmovik: 1946". "Pacific Fighters" (2004) is an example of a standalone game in this series, but it is part of the same game anyway.

 

2 - "IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover", released in 2011. The original game of 2011 is abandoned, we currently use the 2017 re-release only, which is titled "IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover BLITZ". The first add-on for BLITZ is "Desert Wings - Tobruk", it was in August. Tobruk is absolutely a "must have", trust me. Not a standalone game as you need to posses "BLITZ" first if you want to run it in your computer.

 

3 - "IL-2 Sturmovik: Great Battles", released in 2013 when the first module in the series, "IL-2 Sturmovik: Battle of Stalingrad" was proposed as a preorder product. The next game in the series was "Battle of Moscow" (2016) and the name "Great Battles" was officially coined in 2017 for the series.

 

The three mentioned items in the above list are the only existing IL-2 games. If you never played "1946" and you are playing "Cliffs of Dover" for the first time... then I conclude that you only have played modules in the "Great Battles" series.

 

 

9 minutes ago, fnugen said:

I'm sure there are other parts of the game I'll have trouble with once I get into it more.

 

 

Sure, but do not give up fnugen, as "Cliffs" is, in my opinion, the best WWII combat flight sim out there.

 

 

To Messucher: yeah, sure, this is why we need the trim anyway, same as real pilots need it, whether they are fighter pilots or not.

 

 

[9./JG52_J-HAT]

Just to make sure, @fnugen, did you check your joystick calibration? I mean the results of the windows calibration, to make sure the axis are centered after you calibrated it.
 

You can do it in game too (controls -> axes, the two green bars on the lower right for the selected input axis). The outputs should be consistent with your inputs (ie. If you leave the stick completely centered, pitch, roll and yaw should show centered too).

 

The effects mentioned in the previous posts are relatively subtle. Like if you leave your stick untouched the plane will start to veer to one side slowly. Specially due to yaw then roll. Removing power will make the nose drop and adding power will make the nose rise, as mentioned. You are not fighting this movements that much when controlling the plane. It shouldn‘t be too different than what you‘ve experienced before with Great Battles (I assume you are referring to this one, as Kintaro mentioned; not Birds of Prey), tbh.

 

Keeping the rudder slightly twisted and the stick slightly forward should do the trick when going fast. But trim the aircraft whenever you can, like the others already said. Pitch trim is especially important for shooting accurately and to get out of dives.

[fnugen]

Thanks a ton guys. Doesn't sound like a setting or my hotas x causing this. It's the game being more accurate than the ones I've played. I have played Birds of Prey and it's fun, but I enjoy sims for the realism, regardless of my level of "suck". I'll keep at it and maybe learn to tame it.   I now have to learn how to take off with the Blenheim. Didn't go so well last night. I guess I got used to the dropped into the plane mid flight situations. It'll come slowly. Also with help from the great group here.   Thanks again. 

[Sokol1]

Blenheim is easy, trim elevator for 'tail heavy" before take-off - will be need re-trim after take-off, if have bombs and 100% of fuel use a bit of flaps ~15/20º.

 

Since HOTAS X have relative few buttons, if you are using POV HAT for camera control, assign trims controls in keyboard arrows - by default is set for aileron, elevator control, what no one use, so delete this assignments without mercy and set elevator and rudder trim, aileron trim is used by few planes (bombers and improperly by G.50)  can Ctrl+left/right arrows.

 

For cruise speed speed settings (coarse pitch, low RPM) you can trim a Spitfire, Hurricane, Blenheim for fly leveled almost "hands off", but he always will drift left or right a bit.

 

Better to do is pick a plane (fighter or bomber) and master his flight, instead jump from type to type.

Edited October 2, 2020 by Sokol1

[343KKT_Kintaro]

fnugen: to fly one Blenheim Mk IV over the Channel in this game... this is quite meritorious, if not very. When you'll manage to satisfactorily fly your Blenheim, just tell me. We'll fly together online if you want, in a dogfight server, and I'll proudly provide some escort on board a Spitfire or a Hurricane.

[danperin]

Don't forget you can also "mouse click" on the trim wheels with your mouse pointer to adjust them since the cockpits are in most part, mouse interactive (with mouse over labels). For me using the interactive feature is always a good way to know the plane better before setting up proper keys.

Edited October 25, 2020 by danperin