IL-2 radiator bugg(all variants)

[Roland_HUNter]

 

[102.R.dd_Misi]

I've read all the books from several pilots, the radiator was the weakest point of the Il-2s and they were aiming at the radiator whenever it was possible. It looks like if there is a hitbox behind/around the radiator that protects it. Thank you for testing it, I hope it will be corrected soon. 

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

Looks like you didn't hit it with enough AP rounds to trigger the oil leak effect, and the fragments  from the HE explosions doesn't seem able to go through the armored tabs of the radiator. The 13mm belt is pure HE, and the 20mm belt is only 1/3 AP.  Also I don't know if the game models the changing opening between the armored tabs at different radiator open percentage.

If you try with other weapons like the M2 .50cal and MG 17 7.92mm which have all AP rounds you can pierce them easily and cause the oil leak.

Adding AP rounds to the MG 131 is something that's needed, since the belt didn't consist of pure HEI in real life as it does in game, in the late war the explosive round was being discountinued in favor of armor piercing and dedicated incendiary rounds.

According to the Luftwaffe handbook  LDv 4000/10

1943 belt:  AP, HEI, HEI

1944 belt:   I , AP  though in case there is low supply of those rounds, old stock of HEI, API that's no longer in production should be used.

Edited September 8, 2020 by -=PHX=-SuperEtendard

[Roland_HUNter]

4 hours ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

Looks like you didn't hit it with enough AP rounds to trigger the oil leak effect, and the fragments  from the HE explosions doesn't seem able to go through the armored tabs of the radiator. The 13mm belt is pure HE, and the 20mm belt is only 1/3 AP.  Also I don't know if the game models the changing opening between the armored tabs at different radiator open percentage.

If you try with other weapons like the M2 .50cal and MG 17 7.92mm which have all AP rounds you can pierce them easily and cause the oil leak.

Adding AP rounds to the MG 131 is something that's needed, since the belt didn't consist of pure HEI in real life as it does in game, in the late war the explosive round was being discountinued in favor of armor piercing and dedicated incendiary rounds.

According to the Luftwaffe handbook  LDv 4000/10

1943 belt:  AP, HEI, HEI

1944 belt:   I , AP  though in case there is low supply of those rounds, old stock of HEI, API that's no longer in production should be used.

You are right, but there was many 20 mm hit,and I think 1-3 20mm AP should be enough for the oil leak effect.


And the MG 131 has AP/HE in the weaponry menu. I checked the mission file:

[Gustav_Hagel]

4 hours ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

Looks like you didn't hit it with enough AP rounds to trigger the oil leak effect, and the fragments  from the HE explosions doesn't seem able to go through the armored tabs of the radiator. The 13mm belt is pure HE, and the 20mm belt is only 1/3 AP.  Also I don't know if the game models the changing opening between the armored tabs at different radiator open percentage.

If you try with other weapons like the M2 .50cal and MG 17 7.92mm which have all AP rounds you can pierce them easily and cause the oil leak.

Adding AP rounds to the MG 131 is something that's needed, since the belt didn't consist of pure HEI in real life as it does in game, in the late war the explosive round was being discountinued in favor of armor piercing and dedicated incendiary rounds.

According to the Luftwaffe handbook  LDv 4000/10

1943 belt:  AP, HEI, HEI

1944 belt:   I , AP  though in case there is low supply of those rounds, old stock of HEI, API that's no longer in production should be used.

IL2 radiators are bugged, since the new DM patch arrived players noticed that, also IL2's don't leak water.

Edited September 8, 2020 by SCG_Gustav_Hagel

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

45 minutes ago, -[HRAF]Roland_HUNter said:

You are right, but there was many 20 mm hit,and I think 1-3 20mm AP shouldbe enough for the oil leak effect.

And the MG 131 has AP/HE in the weaponry menu. I checked the mission file:

 

Yes an 20mm AP penetration should give the leak effect, about the 20mm fragmentation I don't know how that's considered in game currently, would be good to have different levels of fragmentation getting inside depending on opening level in the radiator tabs and the distance from the impact.

About the 13mm rounds, I'm afraid the menu info isn't correct. If you take a 109 and fire the 13mm against the ground in slow motion all the impacts are HE, there are no AP type impacts. But then if you take the He 111 H-16 top MG 131 you will see that it has both AP-HE belt instead:





 

35 minutes ago, SCG_Gustav_Hagel said:

IL2 radiator is bugged, since the new DM patch arrived players noticed that, also IL2's don't leak water.

About the water radiator I haven't tested it, in principle it's kinda difficult to get to from behind since it's internal in between the engine and the cockpit, the rounds should go through multiple layers of armor, fuel and fuselage internals to get to it. Maybe trying to fire at it from the side it could be tested, but the wing is in the way from the side as well





 

Edited September 8, 2020 by -=PHX=-SuperEtendard

[Roland_HUNter]

4 minutes ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

 

Yes an 20mm AP penetration should give the leak effect, about the 20mm fragmentation I don't know how that's considered in game currently, would be good to have different levels of fragmentation getting inside depending on opening level in the radiator tabs and the distance from the impact.

About the 13mm rounds, I'm afraid the menu info isn't correct. If you take a 109 and fire the 13mm against the ground in slow motion all the impacts are HE, there are no AP type impacts. But then if you take the He 111 H-16 top MG 131 you will see that it has both AP-HE belt instead:





 

About the water radiator I haven't tested it, in principle it's kinda difficult to get to from behind since it's internal in between the engine and the cockpit, the rounds should go through multiple layers of armor, fuel and fuselage internals to get to it. Maybe trying to fire at it from the side it could be tested, but the wing is in the way from the side as well





 

If all the nose MG131 are HE at the moment in the game, that is a bug aswell. If you check the ammo logo for the MG131 in the weaponry menu, you ll see blue and orange.
I don't know how the IL-2 radiator was damaged, but it was a well known weakspot in the WW2.

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

There are 2 radiators as with most other planes, the water radiator is the internal one I showed in the pic, the oil radiator is the external one that's below and visible from the outside.

Edited September 8, 2020 by -=PHX=-SuperEtendard

[Roland_HUNter]

1 hour ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

There are 2 radiators as with most other planes, the water radiator is the internal one I showed in the pic, the oil radiator is the external one that's below and visible from the outside.

I don't know. There was oil leak from many AP, but very hard to achieve it. I let it to decide for the devs its normal or not.
PS. the under hitbox - when hitting the nothing - is interesting aswell.

[sniperton]

6 hours ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

If you try with other weapons like the M2 .50cal and MG 17 7.92mm which have all AP rounds you can pierce them easily and cause the oil leak.

A quick test with the Jug speaks for the opposite (SP).

Unlimited ammo, close bursts into the radiator, stray bullets damaging the engine lead to oil leak after some time, but the radiator seems to be invulnerable despite dozens of direct hits with M2 .50cals.

Edited September 8, 2020 by sniperton

[Roland_HUNter]

4 hours ago, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

Maybe trying to fire at it from the side it could be tested, but the wing is in the way from the side as well

 

[-=PHX=-SuperEtendard]

4 hours ago, sniperton said:

A quick test with the Jug speaks for the opposite (SP).

Unlimited ammo, close bursts into the radiator, stray bullets damaging the engine lead to oil leak after some time, but the radiator seems to be invulnerable despite dozens of direct hits with M2 .50cals.

With nose guns it's easier to hit it from behind, you can try with the P-39 to try the .50 cals or other fighters, here for example with a 109's rifle caliber guns:
 

1 hour ago, -[HRAF]Roland_HUNter said:

 

Nice video, yeah looks like going from below with the heavy caliber AP is the best way to get the water rad. About the ghost hits in your previous video that's hitting the propeller blades, they have a hitbox, but sadly there is no propeller damage in game (only splash damage to other parts of the airframe).



Tested with the 20mm in the 109 and yeah it needs at least two hits with 20mm AP to get the leak effect, I think with one it should be enough.  Direct HE hits don't seem to have effect even if repeated, it could be more vulnerable to this depending on the armored tabs opening as well
 

 

Edited September 9, 2020 by -=PHX=-SuperEtendard

[Roland_HUNter]

On 9/9/2020 at 3:27 AM, -=PHX=-SuperEtendard said:

With nose guns it's easier to hit it from behind, you can try with the P-39 to try the .50 cals or other fighters, here for example with a 109's rifle caliber guns:
 

Nice video, yeah looks like going from below with the heavy caliber AP is the best way to get the water rad. About the ghost hits in your previous video that's hitting the propeller blades, they have a hitbox, but sadly there is no propeller damage in game (only splash damage to other parts of the airframe).



Tested with the 20mm in the 109 and yeah it needs at least two hits with 20mm AP to get the leak effect, I think with one it should be enough.  Direct HE hits don't seem to have effect even if repeated, it could be more vulnerable to this depending on the armored tabs opening as well
 

 

Awesome job! Thank you for the help!