Returning to IL-2. Need help with computer

[Cadillac]

Fifteen years ago I was heavily involved in the original IL-2, flying with a squadron on HyperLobby daily.  Well, I've decided to get back into the game.  Much has changed! Can anyone suggest a great rig I could purchase that is pre-built that will allow me to run the game on higher settings?  I'm not a computer guy and I really can't build one.  Rather, I'd like to just buy either a complete desktop system or even a laptop.  Any suggestions?  I can figure out the peripherals later.  For now I'd like to just get the computer/monitor set up.  No VR either.  I did just fine looking around with the mouse back in the day.

 

Thank you.

[cardboard_killer]

That's a tough one. I'd recommend buying the parts then taking them to a local computer shop and have them put it together for you for an extra $100. The problem with most off the shelf computers is that they aren't designed to be easily changed, so you're stuck with the boiler plate. That may be okay, but for a little more than a "gaming" machine, you can buy a machine that will be easy to upgrade and runs better. Plus you get to meet the nerds at the local shop.

 

Edit: if you don't want VR, most new computers are going to run Il-2 handily.

Edited August 5, 2020 by cardboard_killer

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

3 hours ago, Cadillac said:

Rather, I'd like to just buy either a complete desktop system or even a laptop.  Any suggestions? 

 

Don't buy a laptop unless you really need the portability. A desktop will generally perform better for the same price. Plus, it will give you upgrade options down the road.

 

The rest really depends on your location and budget.

Edited August 5, 2020 by Mitthrawnuruodo

[WallysWorld]

I agree with cardboard_killer in that I picked out what parts I wanted and had the shop build the desktop which they did an excellent job of doing. I'd rather do that than buy an off the shelf desktop.

[RAAF492SQNOz_Steve]

My two cents worth..........

Picking up computer parts and assembling it yourself or getting a shop to do it can be good fun but your run big risks of having to do (sometimes) expensive re-work.

I have built my own systems and had "shop specials" in the past and find first attempts as either noisy or requiring additional cooling solutions. Warranty can be a big problem as well.

 

Not everyone wants to put with those risks and I have noted the OP's comments about "I am not a computer guy".

 

This time around, I personally, went for a MSI Trident X Plus desktop PC with a 2080 Ti and what an amazingly well engineered PC it is. Compact, really really quiet and powerful. May not have the full overclock potential of a custom built rig but it performs very well out of the box driving a Rift S at 80 fps (apart from rare instances) and a 3K display at 144Hz when I use that option for IL2.

 

The latest MSI computers (running latest Intel processors) have not yet been released but I expect they will come to market shortly.

 

Another option to consider would be the Dell Alienware  Aurora range of Desktops. You would want to get an R11 version with liquid cooling as the air cooled ones can get really noisy.

 

I would avoid laptops for gaming as even though the specs can sound the same they typically run compromised CPU's and Graphics cards resulting in 30% less performance than a desktop PC. Also much harder or impossible to upgrade graphics cards in the future.

 

Whatever you decide to do, make sure you shop around as you can save 15- 30 % under retail price when deals are occurring. Run-out models can be even cheaper. I got my trident X for not much more than it would have cost to do a build myself and they threw in a free gaming chair as well.

 

Note to OP. Would recommend trying VR, it is amazing!

Edited August 5, 2020 by RAAF492SQNOz_Steve
missed word and comment on VR

[Cadillac]

51 minutes ago, RAAF492SQNOz_Steve said:

My two cents worth..........

Picking up computer parts and assembling it yourself or getting a shop to do it can be good fun but your run big risks of having to do (sometimes) expensive re-work.

I have built my own systems and had "shop specials" in the past and find first attempts as either noisy or requiring additional cooling solutions. Warranty can be a big problem as well.

 

Not everyone wants to put with those risks and I have noted the OP's comments about "I am not a computer guy".

 

This time around, I personally, went for a MSI Trident X Plus desktop PC with a 2080 Ti and what an amazingly well engineered PC it is. Compact, really really quiet and powerful. May not have the full overclock potential of a custom built rig but it performs very well out of the box driving a Rift S at 80 fps (apart from rare instances) and a 3K display at 144Hz when I use that option for IL2.

 

The latest MSI computers (running latest Intel processors) have not yet been released but I expect they will come to market shortly.

 

Another option to consider would be the Dell Alienware  Aurora range of Desktops. You would want to get an R11 version with liquid cooling as the air cooled ones can get really noisy.

 

I would avoid laptops for gaming as even though the specs can sound the same they typically run compromised CPU's and Graphics cards resulting in 30% less performance than a desktop PC. Also much harder or impossible to upgrade graphics cards in the future.

 

Whatever you decide to do, make sure you shop around as you can save 15- 30 % under retail price when deals are occurring. Run-out models can be even cheaper. I got my trident X for not much more than it would have cost to do a build myself and they threw in a free gaming chair as well.

 

Note to OP. Would recommend trying VR, it is amazing!

 

Thank you (and to all who have responded). I'll take a look at that rig.  Mind you, I"m really not looking to be a "real" IL-2 gamer at this point in my life, so a super hot rig is maybe something I don't need.  I'll probably do off-line stuff for a good while and then maybe transition to online every now and then, once I get up to speed on "flying" again.  As far as online comms, VR, and all that stuff, that will be much later.  I just want an "off the shelf" rig that will run the game at high settings for now.  

 

Thank you all~

[jollyjack]

Some shops offer 'upgrade kits' for gamers, and those can be price- and time-wise quite rewarding. How i got my 2080ti quite fairly priced.

The better (larger?) shops usually have some expert helping you to figure out what you might actually need, and adapt included parts, or add stuff.

I went for a larger powersupply, added RAM, different water cooler with longer hoses for my casing.

But i had my experiences building my own systems (for work) and a good friend-expert advising me.

 

The main choice is Intel or AMD for your mainboard/CPU. SSD seems a must to day, but still expensive.

 

Advice i got last year was AMD for CPU, but i am glad i did not listen. Bought an i7 as i built 3 systems with that type before,

and the oldest one is still running reliable after 10 years. Alas now too slow for IL2, but a friend of mine uses it in an audio studio situation now.

 

BTW go for a water cooler, quiet and dust free almost, as with a good case you can set all fans to blow out, and a general dust filter for the air intake,

mounted at the bottom as on my Fractal case.

 

If you buy all the parts separately from different resources you'll face all sorts of delays, and often putting that stuff together into a working system can be frustrating.

 

Specialists at local shops can build a system according your wishes, but then you'll face probably a higher price, though have a warranty that all parts works together.

Dell can be a good resource for getting a complete working system, at a price though.

 

Get windows LTSC or enterprise, far less hassles and problems from all that bloatware and needless updating full of bugs microsoft throws at you.

No frigging edge or cortana, hurray.

 

Edited August 6, 2020 by jollyjack

[RAAF492SQNOz_Steve]

2 hours ago, Cadillac said:

 

Thank you (and to all who have responded). I'll take a look at that rig.  Mind you, I"m really not looking to be a "real" IL-2 gamer at this point in my life, so a super hot rig is maybe something I don't need.  I'll probably do off-line stuff for a good while and then maybe transition to online every now and then, once I get up to speed on "flying" again.  As far as online comms, VR, and all that stuff, that will be much later.  I just want an "off the shelf" rig that will run the game at high settings for now.  

 

Thank you all~

 

Most pre-built computers, including Dell and MSI, come in a range of specifications so you do have the option of purchasing a lesser specification (and hence much cheaper) computer.

 

The specification required depends very much on the output resolution and refresh frequency that you want to drive your screen at. I would not purchase a desktop PC with a graphics card less than a RTX 2070 Super and for higher resolution screens etc. you would have to graphics settings compromises.

 

Be aware that buying an intermediate level performance PC may complicate you upgrade path in the future.

An example is, high end MSI computers come with a 650 Watt power supply but the intermediate level one, that physically looks exactly the same, only has a 450 Watt power supply.

You could not fit a high end graphics card to a PC with only a 450 Watt PS, it would need an upgrade as well.

 

While I find the styling of the Dell Alienware  Aurora to not to be to my taste, one great feature they do have is they use the same Power Supply in intermediate and high end systems (but please do check/ confirm this for your country).  The Dell Alienware  Aurora comes fitted with a 1000 Watt PS and is capable of running dual graphic cards (if you can fit them in) so is an example minimising parts that need to be replaced if you really get into IL2 etc. and want to upgrade your graphics card. 

 

Does not really matter if you fly offline or online as far as graphics requirements go, the better the system spec the better graphics settings (and also, importantly, frame rates ) you will be able to apply.

 

Just to cloud the issue further.....  A new range of graphics cards will be released in the next couple of months that are rumoured to have significant performance gains. 

 

In my case, I decided to not wait and went ahead with a PC purchase about 2 months ago but went with a PC that would allow a GPU upgrade if needed.  

 

[Cadillac]

Wow - A lot to chew on.  I'm really a novice with all this computer gear.  I got rid of my last PC desktop ten years ago and have been using a MacBook Pro since.  No gaming or anything like that though.  The Dell approach looks like a pretty good option for me.  I chose the Alienware R11 and just clicked on a few options, and this popped up for a cost of about $2,800.  Is something like pretty good?

• 10th Gen Intel® Core™ i9 10900K
• Windows 10 Home
• NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 2080 SUPER 8GB GDDR6 (OC Ready)
• 32GB Dual Channel HyperX™ FURY DDR4 XMP at 2933MHz; up to 64GB
• 2TB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD

 

 

Edited August 6, 2020 by Cadillac

[Algy-Lacey]

I went to my local PC World and got one of their 'off the shelf'  Acer Predator. It probably cost 10 - 15% more than a built one. It has great cooling well thought out case. It is very quiet, has taken every upgrade that I have thrown at it including processor from i5-6400 to an i5-6600k, memory to 16Gb DDR4, 120Gb SSD as well as a terrabyte Hard Drive and a new 480Gb SSD with IL-2 on it. The graphics card is entry level for VR a, GTX1060 6Gb (Next time I would get a GTX2070 or similar, but I find it runs my Oculus Rift CV1 just fine with ASW at 45fps at medium settings. Very smooth now. I've spent over £1000 in all, but that's still way less than $2,800

 

[SCG_Tzigy]

If Costco an option, check them...

 

Gaming PCs & Computers | Costco https://www.costco.com/gaming-computers.html

[RAAF492SQNOz_Steve]

20 hours ago, Cadillac said:

Wow - A lot to chew on.  I'm really a novice with all this computer gear.  I got rid of my last PC desktop ten years ago and have been using a MacBook Pro since.  No gaming or anything like that though.  The Dell approach looks like a pretty good option for me.  I chose the Alienware R11 and just clicked on a few options, and this popped up for a cost of about $2,800.  Is something like pretty good?

• 10th Gen Intel® Core™ i9 10900K
• Windows 10 Home
• NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 2080 SUPER 8GB GDDR6 (OC Ready)
• 32GB Dual Channel HyperX™ FURY DDR4 XMP at 2933MHz; up to 64GB
• 2TB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD

 

 

Hi Cadillac,

Re: Is this something pretty  good?

 

Well, that depends.

You need to decide what type of screen you are going to use and the display frequency that you will accept (Warning, some big generalizations below):

1. Standard HD screen i.e. 1920 x 1080  - the above PC specification is massive overkill for the screen

2. 2K type 27inch screen (these are popular with lots of gamers but some flight simmers like 34" wide screens) 2560 x 1440 or similar - above PC spec would be a good choice for this type of screen

3. 4k screen or TV,  3840 x 2160 - above spec PC would be marginal to under-powered.

 

The above generalizations are based on decent refresh rates, in my case 60 Hz would be the absolute minimum that I would accept, and 80 Hz and above is preferred.

 

As mentioned before, if you go for the Dell, I strongly recommend getting liquid cooling for the CPU and possibly for the Graphics Card (do not think liquid cooling is available for the 2070 Super Graphics Card) .

 

For the 2K screen  option you could get a reasonable result by backing off the PC specification a bit

• 10th Gen Intel® Core™ i7 10700KF (with liquid cooling, should be a couple of hundred dollars cheaper than the  i9 10900K )
• Windows 10 Home
• NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 2080 Super 8GB GDDR6 (OC Ready) with Liquid Cooling   OR  RTX 2070 Super if you wanted to save quite a bit and in exchange for accepting lower refresh rates on the display
• 16GB Dual Channel HyperX™ FURY DDR4 XMP at 2933MHz; up to 64GB (most Games do not benefit from more than 16 Gb of RAM)
• 512Mb or a 1TB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD (depends if PC only used for flight simming)

It also, obviously, depends on what you have to spend.   

I live in Australia and cannot see the Dell U.S. site so do not know if they run frequent discounts that may save you 10 - 20%. Perhaps someone else can comment on this.

 

[Cadillac]

13 hours ago, RAAF492SQNOz_Steve said:

Hi Cadillac,

Re: Is this something pretty  good?

 

Well, that depends.

You need to decide what type of screen you are going to use and the display frequency that you will accept (Warning, some big generalizations below):

1. Standard HD screen i.e. 1920 x 1080  - the above PC specification is massive overkill for the screen

2. 2K type 27inch screen (these are popular with lots of gamers but some flight simmers like 34" wide screens) 2560 x 1440 or similar - above PC spec would be a good choice for this type of screen

3. 4k screen or TV,  3840 x 2160 - above spec PC would be marginal to under-powered.

 

The above generalizations are based on decent refresh rates, in my case 60 Hz would be the absolute minimum that I would accept, and 80 Hz and above is preferred.

 

As mentioned before, if you go for the Dell, I strongly recommend getting liquid cooling for the CPU and possibly for the Graphics Card (do not think liquid cooling is available for the 2070 Super Graphics Card) .

 

For the 2K screen  option you could get a reasonable result by backing off the PC specification a bit

• 10th Gen Intel® Core™ i7 10700KF (with liquid cooling, should be a couple of hundred dollars cheaper than the  i9 10900K )
• Windows 10 Home
• NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 2080 Super 8GB GDDR6 (OC Ready) with Liquid Cooling   OR  RTX 2070 Super if you wanted to save quite a bit and in exchange for accepting lower refresh rates on the display
• 16GB Dual Channel HyperX™ FURY DDR4 XMP at 2933MHz; up to 64GB (most Games do not benefit from more than 16 Gb of RAM)
• 512Mb or a 1TB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD (depends if PC only used for flight simming)

It also, obviously, depends on what you have to spend.   

I live in Australia and cannot see the Dell U.S. site so do not know if they run frequent discounts that may save you 10 - 20%. Perhaps someone else can comment on this.

 

Thank you very much for your very detailed responses.  I have A LOT to rummage through with this whole idea of "getting back in".  

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

33 minutes ago, Cadillac said:

Thank you very much for your very detailed responses.  I have A LOT to rummage through with this whole idea of "getting back in".  

 

Keep in mind that the enthusiasts on this forum like to push high-end hardware that could be totally overkill for your needs.

 

For a good experience at high settings on a 1080p display, you don't need an expensive system with the latest Intel processors and RTX 2070 GPUs.

 

Don't feel pressured into spending 2,800 USD unless you really need the performance to drive a 4K monitor or VR device.

[Jaws2002]

16 hours ago, Mitthrawnuruodo said:

 

Keep in mind that the enthusiasts on this forum like to push high-end hardware that could be totally overkill for your needs.

 

For a good experience at high settings on a 1080p display, you don't need an expensive system with the latest Intel processors and RTX 2070 GPUs.

 

Don't feel pressured into spending 2,800 USD unless you really need the performance to drive a 4K monitor or VR device.

 

 

RTX 2070 is not a 4k gaming card. I have an overclocked 1080Ti, that's probably more powerful in this game than a 2070, and 1440P is the best i could get out of it. 

 

 

Anyway. First consumer Nvidia 3000 cards are coming in September and I'd wait for those, even if i'd want to buy a 2000 seris card. The prices for current cards will drop considerably, once their replacements are out. You may be able to get a 2080 Super in September/October,  for the price of 2070 now.

 

 

Edited August 8, 2020 by Jaws2002

[Gambit21]

I should mention that I’m currently running a 1080 and get steady 60 FPS at 4K in most situations. (Clouds on medium)