Dr. 1 too powerful?

[Zooropa_Fly]

He has been on FC, went back to RoF.

[Yours_truly_Ace]

Seriously now. I have shot down over 60 player aircrafts on the server. Fokker DVIIF, DVII, Albatros, 2 seaters, Halberstatz (or how u write it), no problems.
But the Dr. 1 again: I just had a dogfight with one. I hit him 4 times with seriously good bursts. I saw the hits: hit the engine area a lot, the cockpit area. 
Just a tiny fuel leak. And the "fokker" was flousing and bounching around as usual, stopping mid air and shooting at me and others.
And he got ONE lucky hit in my engine and of course my engine got damaged. 
This Dr. 1 plane has like 200 % health damage. Every other plane I hit starts to vent heavy white smoke or black smoke with the same bursts I give them.
Something is definately off. 

[Cynic_Al]

On 3/7/2020 at 7:01 PM, 127Tom said:

This is not the first time though. I have met several Dr. 1 pilots head on attack, hit them several times but doesn't seem to do much damage.

Also when attacking them from behind the only way of getting them is shooting the pilot it seems. Wings or structure doesn't seem to take much damage.

 

Could you change the title to say "Durable"?

[SeaW0lf]

I flew mostly Camels over the last months and the Dr1 looked just like any other plane. You just have to hit it good and account for lag. That's all.

 

It would be nice to keep it real and don't fall for the multiplayer whining, which is not just obnoxious, but just a skewed opinion in general. Or else bring verified material proving that there is something wrong with it. Mind you that the Dr1 already went through an implacable slander campaign in ROF that lingers to this day. Give the plane a break, she’s as legendary as any other plane in FC and deserves respect.

[J99_Sizzlorr]

2 hours ago, 127Tom said:

Seriously now. I have shot down over 60 player aircrafts on the server. Fokker DVIIF, DVII, Albatros, 2 seaters, Halberstatz (or how u write it), no problems.
But the Dr. 1 again: I just had a dogfight with one. I hit him 4 times with seriously good bursts. I saw the hits: hit the engine area a lot, the cockpit area. 
Just a tiny fuel leak. And the "fokker" was flousing and bounching around as usual, stopping mid air and shooting at me and others.
And he got ONE lucky hit in my engine and of course my engine got damaged. 
This Dr. 1 plane has like 200 % health damage. Every other plane I hit starts to vent heavy white smoke or black smoke with the same bursts I give them.
Something is definately off. 

 

You won't see white smoke out of the Dr.I no matter how often you hit her. She is not liquid cooled.

[No.23_Triggers]

2 hours ago, 127Tom said:

Seriously now. I have shot down over 60 player aircrafts on the server. Fokker DVIIF, DVII, Albatros, 2 seaters, Halberstatz (or how u write it), no problems.
But the Dr. 1 again: I just had a dogfight with one. I hit him 4 times with seriously good bursts. I saw the hits: hit the engine area a lot, the cockpit area. 
Just a tiny fuel leak. And the "fokker" was flousing and bounching around as usual, stopping mid air and shooting at me and others.
And he got ONE lucky hit in my engine and of course my engine got damaged. 
This Dr. 1 plane has like 200 % health damage. Every other plane I hit starts to vent heavy white smoke or black smoke with the same bursts I give them.
Something is definately off. 

Sounds like its your aim that's off. Hit a Dr.I's pilot and they fall just as easily as any other hun plane. I've never noticed Dr.Is being particularly harder to kill...

[Yours_truly_Ace]

My aim is not off; I have 112 kills on the Flugpark server and my aim is 21,5 %.
And like I said; I can see the hits and that he is venting fuel. 
It's just that it takes way more shots for me to shoot down a Dr. 1 than all the other planes. 
I can make a video compilation and you will see.

Edited March 14, 2020 by 127Tom

[HagarTheHorrible]

Given the placement and size of the fuel tank, there would be an expectation, in my mind, that the pilot would be significantly more vulnerable than the fuel tank   Maybe the way the damage model is calculated and the placement of different elements and subsidiary damage affects outcomes.  The next update might shake things up a bit so any debate might be better left until we see the results.

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Tom, you should fly the DR1.  See how durable it is or isn't from the other side.

[OpOctopus]

The few times I have flown the Dr1, my pilot got killed or I overreved my own engine. I never went down because a player shot my engine. I wonder if the radial engines are harder to hit due to its position in far front of the plane? The inline engine is maybe a bigger target? 

I am not a very experienced ww1 pilot but, maybe radial engines are tougher because of their design. Air cooled and compact.

What do you guys think?

[1PL-Husar-1Esk]

Rotary not radial ,they might be more durable - air cooling , no plumbing.

Edited March 14, 2020 by 1PL-Husar-1Esk

[OpOctopus]

8 minutes ago, 1PL-Husar-1Esk said:

Rotary not radial ,they might be more durable - no cooking , no plumbing.

Ok sorry, rotary. Simplest design makes it more durable maybe?

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Maybe the rotary is more difficult to hit because there tends to be a pilot mashed up right behind it in those planes (camel, and to lesser degree DR1)?

Edited March 14, 2020 by J28w-Broccoli

[SeaW0lf]

45 minutes ago, TrlggerSlip said:

I never went down because a player shot my engine.

 

It is not uncommon to get a "damaged engine" warning on both Dr1 and Camel. It all depends on who I'm fighting with, the level of lag (works both ways) and sheer bad luck. As people are mentioning, it requires some experience with the new Flying Circus damage model. People who were accustomed to folding wings and Hail Mary shots in Rise of Flight will have to adapt here, because the new damage model is way more realistic than what we had in ROF.

Edited March 14, 2020 by SeaW0lf

[OpOctopus]

Like I said, I don't have a lot of experience in FC. My personal experience is not really relevant. 

I'm just wondering if the fact that the Dr1 has a rotary engine, makes it a bit more tougher.

[Cynic_Al]

On 3/10/2020 at 4:56 AM, 127Tom said:

He use about 5 % fuel so his Fokker DVIIF only last about 20 seconds after  he is smoking. 

I hope Mamochka joins FC. Will be hilarious to hear all the complaints about ramming (me included).

 

Just get him into a fuel-locked server and the N17 soon spells the end of his DVIIF.  Perhaps one day the same will happen in FC.

[HagarTheHorrible]

If discrepancy there is, it might very well be related to the penetration modelling.  Everything is so closely grouped, in the DR 1, that if you hit one thing there’s a good chance that you will hit something else.  If penetration modelling is imperfect then various elements might be inadvertently shielded by other closely grouped  less critical parts.

[OpOctopus]

9 minutes ago, HagarTheHorrible said:

If discrepancy there is, it might very well be related to the penetration modelling.  Everything is so closely grouped, in the DR 1, that if you hit one thing there’s a good chance that you will hit something else.  If penetration modelling is imperfect then various elements might be inadvertently shielded by other closely grouped  less critical parts.

So can the new DM of next patch fix this?

Edited March 14, 2020 by TrlggerSlip
Missed a word

[SeaW0lf]

17 minutes ago, TrlggerSlip said:

I'm just wondering if the fact that the Dr1 has a rotary engine, makes it a bit more tougher.

 

I would say the opposite. SE5a and Spads can run with a damaged engine forever if I'm not mistaken, not the same for a D7 or a Dr1 for example. You basically have to cut the engine to almost a stop to have some longevity to reach the lines or even the airfield. And I never noticed that a Dr1 is harder to have its engine damaged, like I already said.

 

So no, I don't think it is tougher. If it is something, I would say it is more prone to seize and being terminally damaged than inline engines. The hit box might be smaller, as it should be, but that’s it. I don’t think we have any advantage regarding an quasi-indestructible engine or plane.

8 minutes ago, TrlggerSlip said:

So can the new DM of next patch fix this?

 

I see nothing wrong with it, so I don't think the new DM will fix anything. It could improve things, for sure, but this for all planes.

[OpOctopus]

Ok! Yes I have noticed that the Se5 (my most flown aircraft) engine can run with damage for some time.

I feel the DM is just fine. Different from Rof but, I have no complaints to make. Really enjoy FC

Edited March 14, 2020 by TrlggerSlip

[Yours_truly_Ace]

I may be infected with too much experience from RoF. Been flying it since 2009 to this day.
But the damage model and stuff in RoF just feels right. In FC it feels either too easy or too hard in sertain areas.
Some planes I shoot at just bursts into flames in seconds. While the Dr. 1 I have to empty half of my rounds almost. 
In RoF I never get this feeling. In RoF is like: "ah I see those hits were good and I get the result expected of that".

Anyway. Let's see how this game turns out in the future. It sure is fun
 

[HagarTheHorrible]

56 minutes ago, 127Tom said:

I may be infected with too much experience from RoF. Been flying it since 2009 to this day.
But the damage model and stuff in RoF just feels right. In FC it feels either too easy or too hard in sertain areas.
Some planes I shoot at just bursts into flames in seconds. While the Dr. 1 I have to empty half of my rounds almost. 
In RoF I never get this feeling. In RoF is like: "ah I see those hits were good and I get the result expected of that".

Anyway. Let's see how this game turns out in the future. It sure is fun
 

 

I stopped playing RoF, BECAUSE, in part,  I thought the D.M was a joke.  Having enjoyed RoF immensely, for a couple of years, I became very disillusioned with it.

[JGr2/J5_Klugermann]

So much detritus. IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT DON'T PLAY IT !!!

[No.23_Triggers]

Nah, me and my wingmen have knocked out scores of Dr.Is in one or two passes, in flames or otherwise. In my experience they go down just like any other plane. 

[1PL-Lucas-1Esk]

The Dr.I has a very thick wings. Maybe that can have some impact on the effectiveness of the gun fire. But if you will aim in some vulnerable parts, like engine, tank and pilot, it will go down, just like any other plane.

[OpOctopus]

On 3/7/2020 at 5:19 PM, No56_Waggaz said:

Chaps, don’t engage her from the level and aim for the meat and metal!!

I think this summarizes it all.

Words of great wisdom.

Edited March 15, 2020 by TrlggerSlip