DCS

[scram77]

4 minutes ago, 9./JG27golani79 said:

 

You might wanna hold till full release back because I´m not sure if it is for you (it will be Early Access when it is "released").

I believe Heatblur have said that the F14 will be mostly full complete on release including a new carrier and the A-6 too, along with a campaign.

[Danziger]

1 hour ago, 19RAF_scram77 said:

I believe Heatblur have said that the F14 will be mostly full complete on release including a new carrier and the A-6 too, along with a campaign.

Oh so they are just taking the money right now and releasing it whenever? I thought I was buying into some kind of early access?

[JG5_Zesphr]

15 hours ago, Danziger said:

Oh so they are just taking the money right now and releasing it whenever? I thought I was buying into some kind of early access?

Well it happens with every DCS module. The release will be this year unless something really [Edited] happens. They release it in to early in so many weeks from now usually giving it to some YT people in the mean time to give intro vids 

Edited October 11, 2018 by Bearcat
Language

[Danziger]

On 10/10/2018 at 5:31 AM, Guccigang_Zesphr said:

Well it happens with every DCS module. The release will be this year unless something really shit happens. They release it in to early in so many weeks from now usually giving it to some YT people in the mean time to give intro vids 

What? I saw people posting their screenies in the screenshot section. I thought preorders already had access. So they take money from chumps that have to wait another few months while they hand it over to youtubers for free to spam it all over the web? Oh well, never again.

 

This goes back to what I was saying about Jason. I am really happy that he doesn't believe an all of this super hyping [Edited] up years before it's ready kind of thing.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Bearcat

[Bremspropeller]

9 hours ago, Rolling_Thunder said:

I'm seriously tempted by the F14 due to the scale of the module, carrier, campaigns, possible map and the state of near completion at release. A refreshing change and hopefully a bar that other 3rd parties and ED will aim for. Hopefully heatblur can achieve their goals for release

 

And it will come with four different Forrestal-class carriers and an AI A-6E TRAM.

And then there's the possibility of making the A-6 flyable in the future. The All Grumman Airwing might, after all, become a thing.

 

I'd love Razbam to come out with the A-7, though. Unfortunately, they lately seem to jump into a clusterduck of semi-finished modules.

[DerNeueMensch]

22 minutes ago, Guccigang_Zesphr said:

Well it happens with every DCS module. The release will be this year unless something really shit happens. They release it in to early in so many weeks from now usually giving it to some YT people in the mean time to give intro vids 

 

What makes you so certain? They said they will release the Tomcat almost feature complete and they said that they would rather not crunch over christmas and therefore didn't confirm a release this year - the Hornet also came into public early access two months after presales had started - they said this winter so might be march next year tbh, looking at former statements on releases might only even be next summer...

[9./JG27golani79]

57 minutes ago, Danziger said:

What? I saw people posting their screenies in the screenshot section. I thought preorders already had access. So they take money from chumps that have to wait another few months while they hand it over to youtubers for free to spam it all over the web? Oh well, never again.

 

This goes back to what I was saying about Jason. I am really happy that he doesn't believe an all of this super hyping shit up years before it's ready kind of thing.

 

Where is the problem?

It clearly states Preorder - ED and 3rd parties always have testers out of the community who are allowed to publish footage of the module at a certain stage of development.

There are also testers out of the community for IL-2 - the only thing is they don´t post anything or probably aren´t allowed to do so.

 

Nobody needs to preorder - if someone chooses though you get a discount on the module and early access.

Still you could always just wait for the full release of the module.

 

Don´t see where the big difference lies with DCS. For IL-2 - you also were able to preorder / prepurchase Bodenplatte and the other operations before and had to wait for stuff being released.

 

oO

 

And those screenshots on the latest pages of the screenshot topic look like the official ones.

Edited October 10, 2018 by 9./JG27golani79

[Danziger]

With IL*2 you preorder just as a new development cycle starts. Preorder of Bodenplatte, Tank Crew, and Flying Circus began with the start of development. Content is released as it is created. There is no taking money for something that they give out freely for "testers" (more like hype train fuelers) to post pretty pictures and videos while everyone else still has to wait for release. If it is done enough for their buddies to spam it all over the web, it's done enough for paying customers. Anyway, if that is how ED/DCS/HB want to do it that is their business. Next time I will save my money. 

[Tuesday]

First flight of the F-14 was 21 December; that is also the first day of winter (This product launches in Early Access during this winter).  I won't be surprised if they take advantage of that date for release.

 

It will be near feature-complete (F-14B model first, the 'A' model will release later as it has different engines which they have posted numerous times about).

 

I would be very quick to suggest that the company developing the F-14, Heatblur, is very much like 1C/777 with IL-2; in terms of reliability and quality of product.

 

Two models of the plane, two campaigns, at least 12 single player missions, training missions, and a number of assets such as carriers included in the purchase.

 

...as far as I am aware, most of the media copies given to testers/reviewers expire on the day it releases.

Edited October 10, 2018 by Tuesday

[DerNeueMensch]

It's not about taking advantage of a release date it's about is it already near feature-complete on the 21. Dec. Sure, they might be ready before christmas - but I wouldn't get my hopes up. They really want to nail the release, so they will not make compromises on the quality just for a convenient release date. This 21. Dec. thing is already the next hypetrain bound to be derailed.

They also said 100% release before Christmas 2017 except if someone dies, so...to be fair they decided to redo all the interior and exterior models with a new technology (if I'm not mistaken) but still...not the best track record if it comes to release dates (same goes for ED)... 

Oh, yeah and they also stated that it was not done yet so definitely not all features that they want to be implemented on release are functional. If they were they would have already announced the 21st of December as release. So my bet would be late February. 

[=362nd_FS=Hiromachi]

I dont mind if it will be derailed a bit. Better late and complete than early and bugged. I hope it will come before end of this year, if not. So be it. Waiting for any Pacific sim to be developed now for over 14 years made me very patient and forgiving. Or maybe its just because I like Cobra

[dburne]

29 minutes ago, Danziger said:

With IL*2 you preorder just as a new development cycle starts. Preorder of Bodenplatte, Tank Crew, and Flying Circus began with the start of development. Content is released as it is created. There is no taking money for something that they give out freely for "testers" (more like hype train fuelers) to post pretty pictures and videos while everyone else still has to wait for release. If it is done enough for their buddies to spam it all over the web, it's done enough for paying customers. Anyway, if that is how ED/DCS/HB want to do it that is their business. Next time I will save my money. 

 

That is the beauty of it, everyone has a choice whether they want to buy into early pre-release orders of DCS products or not. Just like they have the same choice whether to buy into IL-2 Early Access orders or not.

 

I really do not see any issue here whatsoever.

[=362nd_FS=Hiromachi]

37 minutes ago, Danziger said:

Next time I will save my money. 

Can always demand them by yourself. They have HQ in Szczecin, so maybe they will accept a visitor.

[9./JG27golani79]

29 minutes ago, Danziger said:

With IL*2 you preorder just as a new development cycle starts. Preorder of Bodenplatte, Tank Crew, and Flying Circus began with the start of development. Content is released as it is created. There is no taking money for something that they give out freely for "testers" (more like hype train fuelers) to post pretty pictures and videos while everyone else still has to wait for release. If it is done enough for their buddies to spam it all over the web, it's done enough for paying customers. Anyway, if that is how ED/DCS/HB want to do it that is their business. Next time I will save my money. 

 

Battle of Bodenplatte - Preordered December 21st 2017.

April 6th 2018 - First WIP screenshots of G-14 and Mk IX

June 28th - G-14 and Mk IX available for early access

 

DCS F-14 - Preorder starts on October 7th 2018

Early access set for Winter 2018

 

So really - where is it any different?

In both cases you make an advance payment and have to wait for the finished product - but you get early access to content whereas the full release is set for a later date.

Wouldn´t you preorder you weren´t able to access the early access content.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Danziger]

4 minutes ago, 9./JG27golani79 said:

 

Battle of Bodenplatte - Preordered December 21st 2017.

April 6th 2018 - First WIP screenshots of G-14 and Mk IX

June 28th - G-14 and Mk IX available for early access

 

DCS F-14 - Preorder starts on October 7th 2018

Early access set for Winter 2018

 

So really - where is it any different?

In both cases you make an advance payment and have to wait for the finished product - but you get early access to content whereas the full release is set for a later date.

Wouldn´t you preorder you weren´t able to access the early access content.

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is no content available for the F14. They say they want to release it this winter. What is the point of preordering for early access if there is no early access?

[Rolling_Thunder]

3 hours ago, 9./JG27golani79 said:

 

You might wanna hold back till full release because I´m not sure if it is for you (it will be Early Access when it is "released").

I certainly won't put down any money on a DCS product until it is released and I have read other customers feedback. I won't be basing any decisions on anything posted on the ED forums as any negativity is quickly shut down.  I've been burned too many times (shame on me) in the past with that platform. I'm hoping heatblur have learned from other third parties and EDs mistakes of taking money for a product that is a long way, years and counting, from completion.

I will happily pay full price for what the F14 package offers. I said I hope heatblur reach their goals at release not just for the F14 but also for the other 3rd parties. They are going to have to take a good hard look at what they're offering for the same kind of money. If heatblur can release what they say, not only will their reputation grow, the other 3rd parties reputations will diminish. Maybe, hopefully, it starts a trend where the usual DCS customers stop funding half finished unprofessional products that has become so common place and a trademark of that platform.

[Tyberan]

I don't understand their reasoning of of the pre order news now with an unknown release date. Maybe it's a cash flow thing so they can get them over the line. I would be tempted if the pre order included a set release date say one month from now but content on waiting.

 

If they were smart they could tie in a free weekend like they did with f18. I was on the fence with that until I tried it, honestly it's most fun I've had in DCS in ages.

Edited October 10, 2018 by Tyberan

[9./JG27golani79]

22 minutes ago, Danziger said:

There is no content available for the F14. They say they want to release it this winter. What is the point of preordering for early access if there is no early access?

 

They release it into early access this winter - the full release will be at a later point.

 

Most of the major features of the F-14B will be in early access so you can learn the aicraft and use it in multiplayer, quick missions or user made missions.

 

From the Heatblur site:

NOTE: Some features may not be available immediately at Early Access.

* The F-14A and the TARPS pod will follow later during the Early Access period and the tutorials and campaigns will be implemented and expanded during this early access as well.

 

 

 

Edited October 10, 2018 by 9./JG27golani79

[Finkeren]

Wow. The F-14 still isn’t out yet? It has been talked about for years and I have seen so many shots of it, that I just assumed, that it had been released a while ago.

[Danziger]

Ahh so EA starts in "winter" and the full release is still nowhere in sight. 

[=362nd_FS=Hiromachi]

Gee, relax dude.

 

13 minutes ago, Finkeren said:

Wow. The F-14 still isn’t out yet? It has been talked about for years and I have seen so many shots of it, that I just assumed, that it had been released a while ago.

Yeah, its in development for about 4 years, but not yet released.

[Legioneod]

1 hour ago, Danziger said:

There is no content available for the F14. They say they want to release it this winter. What is the point of preordering for early access if there is no early access?

 

51 minutes ago, Danziger said:

Ahh so EA starts in "winter" and the full release is still nowhere in sight. 

 

What are you on about? It is the exact same thing as Bodenplatte so I don't see what the problem is, are you just looking for something to complain about?

 

When people pre ordered Bodenplatte they didn't have any content and they were never told/promised a release date (it's also still not fully released), yet no one complains.

 

Heatblur is basically doing the exact same thing with the F-14 yet you're complaining about it.

51 minutes ago, =362nd_FS=Hiromachi said:

Gee, relax dude.

 

Yeah, its in development for about 4 years, but not yet released.

I think that has alot to do with them changing things and redoing them a few times. I've also read that ED can cause plenty of delays when they update the game/engine which causes 3rd parties to have lots of problems.

 

I don't like ED but I do like the 3rd party devs, too bad they don't come to Il2 and do work for them instead, maybe they'd have a lot less problems and delays?

[Danziger]

12 minutes ago, Legioneod said:

 

 

What are you on about? It is the exact same thing as Bodenplatte so I don't see what the problem is, are you just looking for something to complain about?

 

When people pre ordered Bodenplatte they didn't have any content and they were never told/promised a release date (it's also still not fully released), yet no one complains.

I think maybe you weren't here that day when people were whining about preorders. 

Bodenplatte does have a release timeline. People knew what they were in for. 

Preordering anything from DCS is risky. Third party developers come and go taking money and delivering half finished modules or nothing at all. DCS WW2 was a scam that ED had to straighten out as much as they could afford to. I made the mistake of seeing videos and pictures posted by people other than HB and thought it was already in EA. It won't happen again. 

[9./JG27golani79]

Preordering from any company can be risky because even the biggest companies can go bankrupt.

But I guess it's only ED with DCS and 3rd parties who are evil whereas it is ok with other companies xD

 

Devs at ED dont give release schedules anymore as they can change. Everyone who has some knowledge regarding software development will know that. But people were always bitching around when there was a delay. So there ist that.

 

 

 

Edited October 10, 2018 by 9./JG27golani79

[Gambit21]

2 hours ago, 9./JG27golani79 said:

Preordering from any company can be risky because even the biggest companies can go bankrupt.

But I guess it's only ED with DCS and 3rd parties who are evil whereas it is ok with other companies xD

 

Find me a single post here where someone remarks about how they’re OK with other companies short-changing them. This thread is about DCS - the end.

[Archie]

I suspect the F 14 will be the best module release to date, and I'm hoping to really spend some time learning the aircraft. 

[Legioneod]

5 minutes ago, Archie said:

I suspect the F 14 will be the best module release to date, and I'm hoping to really spend some time learning the aircraft. 

Agreed.

[9./JG27golani79]

2 hours ago, Gambit21 said:

 

Find me a single post here where someone remarks about how they’re OK with other companies short-changing them. This thread is about DCS - the end.

 

It was about preordering and early access - apparently, for some users, preordering and getting early access is not the same when it is done by company x and company y.

It was then brought into the discussion that it is a risk to buy a DCS early access module.

 

I simply pointed out that every preorder can be a risk regardless which company.

 

Nothing more, nothing less.

 

 

[Rolling_Thunder]

4 hours ago, 9./JG27golani79 said:

Preordering from any company can be risky because even the biggest companies can go bankrupt.

But I guess it's only ED with DCS and 3rd parties who are evil whereas it is ok with other companies xD

 

Devs at ED dont give release schedules anymore as they can change. Everyone who has some knowledge regarding software development will know that. But people were always bitching around when there was a delay. So there ist that.

 

 

 

I wouldn't say they were evil. Incompitent yes, evil no.

ED and their 3rd parties stopped giving release dates because they always missed them.  Nothing to do with complaints more to do with looking more and more incompitent with every missed release. The majority of Ed's third parties are nothing more than mod teams charging full price for their part time hobby. Its disgraceful that ED continues to allow that to continue. But if folk are willing to part with their money for a half a$$ed module it will never change. So there is that.

[Gambit21]

I get it.

I’ll only add that theoretical risk aside - we're dealing with vastly different actual track records here.

[Danziger]

Also is M3LLC aka Leatherneck ever going to finish the MiG-21? It's really beginning to seem like the HB side of LN was doing all the work on the MiG-21. HB was apparently doing the Viggen behind the scenes before the split while M3 was doing? I remember the hype train with the MiG-21. Then after the split it seems like M3 just kinda dropped off while HB has been hyping the Viggen and F-14 in the style they did with the MiG-21.

[dburne]

6 hours ago, Archie said:

I suspect the F 14 will be the best module release to date, and I'm hoping to really spend some time learning the aircraft. 

 

You and me both. I am pretty excited about this one.

[Jaws2002]

6 hours ago, Rolling_Thunder said:

I wouldn't say they were evil. Incompitent yes, evil no.

ED and their 3rd parties stopped giving release dates because they always missed them.  Nothing to do with complaints more to do with looking more and more incompitent with every missed release. The majority of Ed's third parties are nothing more than mod teams charging full price for their part time hobby. Its disgraceful that ED continues to allow that to continue. But if folk are willing to part with their money for a half a$$ed module it will never change. So there is that.

 

 

You've been sour for ten pages... Cheer up bud.

 

It's not fair to blame ED and other partner studios for the screw up that Ilya did. Let's face it. Ilya had no clue how much work is needed to make the planes he thought he could make, to the DCS level and for the price he sold them for.  He had zero experience with DCS and specially the business part of it.  

I'm there with you, I also "pledged" a few bucks for planes that are not done yet, but I, for one, am thankful to ED for fulfilling a promise someone else made. They could have told us to go pound sand when ilya's team, RRG Studios, folded, but they didn't. 

 

 

 

You can do whatever you want, but your anger is directed at those who try to fix someone else's f*ck up.

 

I'll get that tomcat and fly it like i stole it.

 

EDIT...I didn't play DCS for two months and now i have to download 21 gigs.....F@#)*&@)$_@$$

Edited October 11, 2018 by Jaws2002

[Gambit21]

7 minutes ago, Jaws2002 said:

EDIT...I didn't play DCS for two months and now i have to download 21 gigs.....F@#)*&@)$_@$$

 

That right there is enough to scare me away with my crappy connection.

I'd be starting from scratch.

 

Give me a Top Gun campaign on the Nevada map (with A4's) and I'll consider it.

[Jaws2002]

That was the size of the compressed folder....looks like the unpacked size is 60 gigs..

 

I have just Il2 and DCS on this 256 GB SSD and it's filling up...  this reminds me of FSX with a ton of addons.

Edited October 11, 2018 by Jaws2002

[Rolling_Thunder]

31 minutes ago, Jaws2002 said:

 

 

You've been sour for ten pages... Cheer up bud.

 

Let's face it. Ilya had no clue how much work is needed to make the planes he thought he could make, to the DCS level and for the price he sold them for.  He had zero experience with DCS and specially the business part of it.  

 

Yeah, and you would think ED would have a clue about how much work was needed to make the planes they thought they could make. It is, after all, their company. But here we are in 2018, 4 years after wages told us, back in June 2014, that the project would be complete in a year. 

As a basic outline, here are our current development intentions:

August 2014 – Fw 190 D-9 Dora 
October 2014 - BF-109K 
December 2014- Spitfire IX 
March 2015 - P-47D-30 
May 2015 - Normandy Map with period AI units

 

 

Hell Ilya and crew produced the majority of the 109 and a large part of the 190 before they were fired.

So let's face it. Wags has no clue how much work is needed to make the planes he thought he could make, to the DCS level and for the price he sells them for. 

 

[Jaws2002]

1 hour ago, Rolling_Thunder said:

 

 

Hell Ilya and crew produced the majority of the 109 and a large part of the 190 before they were fired.

So let's face it. Wags has no clue how much work is needed to make the planes he thought he could make, to the DCS level and for the price he sells them for. 

 

I had the 190 before  Ilya announced his DCS adventure..

[=362nd_FS=Hiromachi]

11 hours ago, Danziger said:

Also is M3LLC aka Leatherneck ever going to finish the MiG-21? It's really beginning to seem like the HB side of LN was doing all the work on the MiG-21. HB was apparently doing the Viggen behind the scenes before the split while M3 was doing? I remember the hype train with the MiG-21. Then after the split it seems like M3 just kinda dropped off while HB has been hyping the Viggen and F-14 in the style they did with the MiG-21.

When you clearly lack information than perhaps you should read more before spreading more uninformed posts ? There was no HB side of LN, too much hoggit misleading assumptions I guess. LN was comprised of current M3 members and Cobra that leads now Heatblur. Current Heatblur was largely built with new people, some time before split. Once split happened Cobra and new guys moved on to complete F-14 (on which entire LN worked, since it dates back to 2015), while also taking Viggen (on which Leatherneck worked, not some non-existing Heatblur back in the day). 

M3 kept MiG-21 which btw. apart from A-10 is the oldest advanced jet in game. Actual work on MiG-21bis started before 2013 by what was known then Beczl Studios. Beczl who was as  far as I'm aware a maintnance worker on actual Hungarian MiG-21s, managed the project, but eventually left company after causing some trouble and project was completed under Leatherneck Simulations.

MiG-21bis is finished and feature complete, though it has various bugs due to sheer fact that it is the oldest module and much of the art assets were built on version 1.2 of DCS.  The days of pre-PBR and no VR users. Not to mention code, SDK and DCS engine changes. 

HB is doing great, no doubt, especially since they got far newer modules to work with. I can't wait to get F-14 in my hands and fly over Persian Gulf in Iranian livery. But it's always best to know what you are talking about, before actually posting mate.  

[Feathered_IV]

5 hours ago, Jaws2002 said:

That was the size of the compressed folder....looks like the unpacked size is 60 gigs..

 

Yeah, I had the sudden urge to reinstall and give the Sabre another try.  60gb of space and a choice of 150kbs download connection via http or a torrent that would choke and crash after 15 minutes.  I had to uninstall and not worry about it.

[Danziger]

8 minutes ago, =362nd_FS=Hiromachi said:

When you clearly lack information than perhaps you should read more before spreading more uninformed posts ? But it's always best to know what you are talking about, before actually posting mate.  

That is why I was asking a question and not stating a fact. It is always best to read and comprehend someone's post before being a jerk. Thank you for answering my question, though. So from what you say, one man from LN became HB took two modules with him and hired a whole new team?