Nvidia’s first 2020 driver update also improves VR game quality

[J5_HellCat_]

We'll see

 

Alongside the frame rate limit, this driver also includes Variable Rate Super Sampling (VRSS). This improves image quality in VR games by separating shading rate and resolution to improve different parts of the frame that you’re focused on in VR.

 

https://www.theverge.com/2020/1/6/21051382/nvidia-geforce-game-ready-driver-update-max-frame-rate-feature-ces-2020

 

 

Edited January 6, 2020 by HellCat_

[Alonzo]

Link from nVidia, for those of us who would prefer to skip The Verge due to its, ahem, shaky tech credentials: https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/news/nvidia-geforce-ces-2020-game-ready-driver/

 

Variable Rate Super Sampling (VRSS) promises to automatically supersample the centre of the VR image, skipping the edges (typically we're not looking at the edges and we're outside the lens sweet spot anyway). Visual illustration:

 

 

So here's the interesting bit for us in IL2:

 

Quote

VRSS is supported by the driver--no game integration required--and can be applied to DX11 VR games or application that have forward renderers and support MSAA, and have been tested by NVIDIA. At the time of writing, over 20 games meet this criteria, including...

 

Any idea whether this works with IL2?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 6, 2020 by Alonzo
Formatting

[dburne]

Won't see in IL-2, at least at this time. It is not tested/supported by Nvidia for this feature.

Currently VRSS only supports around 20 games that Nvidia have tested. IL-2 is not one of them.

Only game I have currently as far as I can tell that is supported by Nvidia for this feature is Robo Recall.

Also note this feature is only for the Turing (RTX) cards.

 

You can easily check in Nvidia Control Panel if a game you have has been tested and supported for this feature, just look in the profile tab at the bottom. It will show VRSS settings one can adjust and apply if it is supported. If it does not show, it is not supported.

 

Edited January 6, 2020 by dburne

[J5_HellCat_]

Hmmmm bummer

 

[dburne]

It is nice - and promising - to see Nvidia giving some love to VR.

If this feature works well hopefully they will test and add a lot more games to the mix.

[Alonzo]

Well, this is software, so we can cross our fingers that some enterprising soul finds a way to force-enable it for untested games. I can see why they want to roll it out slowly and test games with it, but it does leave those of us with niche games (such as IL2) stuck.

 

They've done their usual "poorly labeled graph, no science" image touting the benefits, but it looks like on Boneworks VRSS at 4x supersample is giving 120+ unconstrained FPS vs ~75 with traditional 4x supersample. Of course no-one really runs stuff at 4x (= 2.0 pixel density!!) except on very basic games. The adaptive nature of this is also really interesting -- presumably it drops down the amount of supersample based on what your hardware can handle and what the game is asking for. Could be an essentially-free "increase image quality by enabling this" option.

[dburne]

From the Nvidia driver 441.87 Release Notes:

 

Variable Rate Super Sampling (VRSS) is a new technique to improve image quality in VR games. It
uses NVIDIA Variable Rate Shading (VRS), a key feature in NVIDIA’s Turing architecture, to
dynamically apply up to 8x supersampling to the center of the VR headset display, where the eye is
typically focused. It intelligently applies supersampling only when GPU headroom is available in
order to maintain the VR headset’s fixed FPS and ensure a smooth VR experience. Enable the
feature for over 20 supported VR games from the NVIDIA Control Panel->Manage 3D Settings-
>Variable Rate Super Sampling.

[SCG_motoadve]

So far this driver feels smooth, wish it could benefit from VRSS.

[Alonzo]

Anyone know if IL2 supports MSAA ? We have "multisample" as a config file option, but I don't know if that's MSAA. 

 

The reason I ask is that we can force the NVidia driver to enable VRSS for IL2, but so far on my system I haven't persuaded it to do anything useful. Here's how to enable it:

• Download NVidia Profile Inspector and run it. Wait for it to load the profiles.
• Select the IL2: Battle of Stalingrad profile from the drop-down. Bottom window will populate with values for IL2 (if you have overridden any global values using NVidia Control Panel, you should see things that look correct here).
• Scroll all the way down to the bottom, and set "Unknown" 0x00D5E9C6 to 0x000001. Hit "Apply Changes"
• Now load NVidia Control Panel, select IL2, and the VRSS option is available.

So far I haven't got it to work. The game doesn't crash, but even with 2x AA enabled in game it doesn't appear to be doing anything. I switched off all supersampling (quit Oculus Tray Tool, for example) and with VRSS off, adaptive, or forced on, my GPU still sits at about 40% usage on the runway in a Tempest. I would have expected GPU usage to jump to 100% if this was actually doing something. But I could have screwed up enabling MSAA or something.

 

Anyone else want to take a crack at this?

 

Edited January 7, 2020 by Alonzo
Screenshot

[HagarTheHorrible]

Given that, by dint of them being VR, all the included games are niche, then there should be no problem with implimentation for a small developer like 777, as that seems to be the defining feature of the included game developers.

 

Fingers crossed for a future update.  The only fly in the ointment might perhaps be that Il2 isn't designed for VR from the ground up.

[apollon01]

What I have seen so far for other sims:

 

DCS - works but in reverse ?

https://www.reddit.com/r/hoggit/comments/elzaed/dcs_vr_variable_rate_super_sampling_sorta_worksish/

 

Prepar3D - does not seem to do anything

https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/569089-game-ready-driver-44187-introduces-vr-performance-features/?do=findComment&comment=4167610

 

X Plane 11 - does not work

https://developer.x-plane.com/2019/12/the-vulkan-metal-public-beta-will-be-in-2020/

(towards the bottom  of the page - just search for VRSS)

 

So the Il2 GB seems to be on the same boat for the moment.

 

 

Btw. is this going to help me at all since my motion reprojection indicator usually shows that the output is CPU bound?

Edited January 9, 2020 by apollon01

[YoYo]

I checked VRSS in IL-2 Today, but I didnt notice any difference in picture (HP Reverb). Antialiasing is 2x in my sim.

Edited January 9, 2020 by YoYo

[FTC_ChilliBalls]

so, anyone know whether IL-2 uses deferred or forward rendering?

 

DCS uses deferred rendering according to the reddit post apollon01 posted.

Does that mean Il 2 does so too?

 

  Edit:

On 10/11/2019 at 5:15 PM, Jason_Williams said:

 

I will not tolerate such extreme comments that say our clouds are BROKEN. They are NOT BROKEN, you simply do not understand why there is this issue. I don't want to get into a huge technical discussion here, but we know why this happens and it's unavoidable with how we currently render our scenes. I'm sure I have explained this before. It's simply a technical limitation because of how we draw the clouds and the planes. The only way to try and alleviate this issue is to change how we render all our scenes and employ what is called 'deferred rendering', which in theory will work. Remember I have ONE graphics programmer and he wears many hats and his work touches many aspects of the product so he is always swamped. He is well aware of this issue with clouds and he also hopes he can find the time to eventually work on deferred rendering. 

 

Jason 

 

So apparently the game uses forward rendering, since there´s only the two AFAIK and the absence of one implies the other.

Maybe we want to bring this to the devs attention?

Would be awesome if this actually worked.

Edited January 11, 2020 by So_ein_Feuerball

[YoYo]

Thats true, VRSS will only work with games that uses forward renderer.

I dont know how they are renderer in IL-2, perhaps not forward.

[apollon01]

6 minutes ago, YoYo said:

Thats true, VRSS will only work with games that uses forward renderer.

I dont know how they are renderer in IL-2, perhaps not forward.

 

 

[YoYo]

Wow, nice to see it!!!

[=SFG=capt_nasties]

having used ACC which is an Unreal Engine title and uses deferred rendering in VR I hope they get deferred rendering working better in VR for IL2.  its absolute garbage, on ACC.  even my i9900k @ 5050 and 2080 @2000 cant hold 90 fps on low settings....

[21.Gr.CT.Ludovisi]

On 1/14/2020 at 7:36 AM, capt_nasties said:

having used ACC which is an Unreal Engine title and uses deferred rendering in VR I hope they get deferred rendering working better in VR for IL2.  its absolute garbage, on ACC.  even my i9900k @ 5050 and 2080 @2000 cant hold 90 fps on low settings....

I totally agree: with i7-9700k+RTX2080 ACC in VR is horrible for both  fps and quality.

I play pCARS2 forcing NVIDIA VRSS and... it is incredible: full details with great smoothing and what quality!

[SCG_Fenris_Wolf]

I've read a lot of voices now on deferred rendering, especially in the jump from AC to ACC, and the DCS transition, and I don't know whether this is a good idea anymore. If VR performance had to suffer, this would not be received very well. ?

[=SFG=capt_nasties]

I imagine the developers know what % of their user base is on VR and I am willing to bet its a larger percentage than we all think just based on my conversations in discord with pilots. 

 

What are the benefits of deferred rendering?   ACC is a hog even on single screen.  It does look absolutely amazing but you need a 2080 + to run it on high even on single screen .  

[dburne]

I think if 1CGS made the move to DR, they would do it quite well based on their history with such things.

[blitze]

Not sure if anyone has had VRSS running on Il2 but the concept seems similar in principle to Pimax's  Fixed Foreated Rendering.  This with the current state of Il2 is about 50% stable.  When enabled it will allow, especially in Large FOV, for you to push SS right up and the effect is a very nice center view with it softening on the edges.

 

Some have complained that when FFR was used the edges were pixelated and blocky and that is true - if you run your normal SS settings in VR.  If you ran 1.5x SS what your normal settings would be, then the effect is quite nice.  Either way, VRSS and FFR are I think good steps towards high fidelity VR in large FOV VR environments.

 

Another thing I have noticed with SteamVR is that I can push App SS up really high and get decent performance, now running 300% on Il2 but I have Video SS at 44% (PiTool 1.25, Normal FOV).  If I push Video SS up and bring App SS down, even at the same final render target resolution - the performance in VR nose dives considerably.

This all whilst running Il2 on Ultra Graphics Settings with shadows and clouds on high and mirrors on medium.

 

I don't understand the relationship between Video SS and App SS in SteamVR but it seems setting Video to near SteamVR recommended (Auto) and driving App up is the way to go.

[Talisman]

On 1/21/2020 at 8:10 PM, blitze said:

Not sure if anyone has had VRSS running on Il2 but the concept seems similar in principle to Pimax's  Fixed Foreated Rendering.  This with the current state of Il2 is about 50% stable.  When enabled it will allow, especially in Large FOV, for you to push SS right up and the effect is a very nice center view with it softening on the edges.

 

Some have complained that when FFR was used the edges were pixelated and blocky and that is true - if you run your normal SS settings in VR.  If you ran 1.5x SS what your normal settings would be, then the effect is quite nice.  Either way, VRSS and FFR are I think good steps towards high fidelity VR in large FOV VR environments.

 

Another thing I have noticed with SteamVR is that I can push App SS up really high and get decent performance, now running 300% on Il2 but I have Video SS at 44% (PiTool 1.25, Normal FOV).  If I push Video SS up and bring App SS down, even at the same final render target resolution - the performance in VR nose dives considerably.

This all whilst running Il2 on Ultra Graphics Settings with shadows and clouds on high and mirrors on medium.

 

I don't understand the relationship between Video SS and App SS in SteamVR but it seems setting Video to near SteamVR recommended (Auto) and driving App up is the way to go.

 

Thank you, sounds interesting blitze

 

I am running my 5K+ at Small FOV, PiTool render quality 2, Steam App SS 20% and Video 422%, but will try your suggestion of reducing Video and driving up App instead.

 

Sorry about that, got confused by memory, lol.  My settings are General (at the top) settings per eye 20% and Video Per Application settings 422%, so that would fit with your theory I think.  PiTool render quality 2 and FOV small means I get a great picture

 

Happy landings,

 

56RAF_Talisman

Edited January 25, 2020 by 56RAF_Talisman

[blitze]

17 hours ago, 56RAF_Talisman said:

 

Thank you, sounds interesting blitze

 

I am running my 5K+ at Small FOV, PiTool render quality 2, Steam App SS 20% and Video 422%, but will try your suggestion of reducing Video and driving up App instead.

 

Sorry about that, got confused by memory, lol.  My settings are General (at the top) settings per eye 20% and Video Per Application settings 422%, so that would fit with your theory I think.  PiTool render quality 2 and FOV small means I get a great picture

 

Happy landings,

 

56RAF_Talisman

Talisman, if running low Vid SS then you can jack up App SS but I found (as I run a stand alone Il2 and a separate Steam Il2) that my settings for what I was using (stand alone client) was not applying in the App SS settings.  When I woke up to this fact and then remedied the situation - either Video or App SS when high will do the same and reduce frame rate.

 

I really wish FFR worked in Il2 as I notice it helps a bit in DCS with Large FOV.  One day but by then I will probably have a RTX 3080ti or 5900XT or what ever AMD's high end part will be.  Time will tell and hopefully either part will not cost the kidney a 2080ti did as that pricing was fn ridiculous.

[Talisman]

4 hours ago, blitze said:

Talisman, if running low Vid SS then you can jack up App SS but I found (as I run a stand alone Il2 and a separate Steam Il2) that my settings for what I was using (stand alone client) was not applying in the App SS settings.  When I woke up to this fact and then remedied the situation - either Video or App SS when high will do the same and reduce frame rate.

 

I really wish FFR worked in Il2 as I notice it helps a bit in DCS with Large FOV.  One day but by then I will probably have a RTX 3080ti or 5900XT or what ever AMD's high end part will be.  Time will tell and hopefully either part will not cost the kidney a 2080ti did as that pricing was fn ridiculous.

 

Thanks blitze, good to talk.  I was lucky and managed to get a 1080ti at a good price before the supply dried up.  The new stuff from Pimax is looking good and overall I think the future looks bright for VR

 

Happy landings,

 

56RAF_Talisman

[Solmyr]

On 1/14/2020 at 7:36 AM, capt_nasties said:

having used ACC which is an Unreal Engine title and uses deferred rendering in VR I hope they get deferred rendering working better in VR for IL2.  its absolute garbage, on ACC.  even my i9900k @ 5050 and 2080 @2000 cant hold 90 fps on low settings....

 

Wow, I didn't try it yet (I had bought ACC only to support Kunos, I'm not interested in modern cars at all) but what you say puts an end on such a test..

 

Though Kunos guys are good developpers I'd say... But with ACC they were grabbing too much of a modern technology maybe ?

Edited January 29, 2020 by Solmyr

[=SFG=capt_nasties]

ACC looks terrible in VR despite what all the click bait YT videos will tell you.  I have an extremely strong PC and still cannot make it look evenclose to the quality or performance of AC......it looks worse and runs worse.