BOBP SP Awards

[Ansirial]

Hi all! It's me or the Air Force Cross is awarded too often in the new career in with RAF?

Everybody has one and somebody have also two bars!

 

In general somebody knows wich is the new criteria both for RAF and USAAF?

[LukeFF]

The AFC (and AFM) is awarded for completing a successful number of missions (like the combat clasps of the Luftwaffe). It wasn't an award given for valor in combat, so this is the only way it can be awarded without any reference to number of planes shot down or ground targets destroyed. 

[Ansirial]

I'm so excited to fly with two more factions in career mode!

Thanks a lot for the clarification, but maybe there is something strange, descriptions says there were only 26 second bars, but only my squadron 2 people have 2 bars, and 1 have 2 bars on AFM.

Do you know criteria for DFC e DFM too? Because also there is a squadron member with a DFM with 2 bars and only a kill.

[Haza]

9 hours ago, LukeFF said:

The AFC (and AFM) is awarded for completing a successful number of missions (like the combat clasps of the Luftwaffe). It wasn't an award given for valor in combat, so this is the only way it can be awarded without any reference to number of planes shot down or ground targets destroyed. 

 

Wow, I never realised that. I always assumed that both the AFC and AFM required some act of heroism and was dependant on rank!

 

Regards

 

 

 

[Ansirial]

Me too, but the only differece was if there is an enemy involvment for DFC - DFM and not for AFC - AFM, if I remember correctly.

 

But I understand that in game would be difficult to track an act of heroism without an enemy involvment... So I agree with the number of mission done.

By the way, I think AFC e AFM are awarded maybe too easily, only an idea maybe I'm in wrong. 

Edited November 15, 2019 by Ansirial

[LukeFF]

16 hours ago, Haza said:

Wow, I never realised that. I always assumed that both the AFC and AFM required some act of heroism and was dependant on rank!

 

No, according to the official description, it is to be awarded for "exemplary gallantry while flying, though not in active operations against the enemy." All sorts of examples of that can be found online, but the bottom line is that it was usually awarded to pilots who had flown for a long time and had done something significant.

 

The awards were dependent on rank: AFC for officers and warrant officers; AFM for enlisted personnel.

16 hours ago, Ansirial said:

Do you know criteria for DFC e DFM too? Because also there is a squadron member with a DFM with 2 bars and only a kill.

 

How many missions has he flown? If you can show a screenshot that'd be great.

Edited November 16, 2019 by LukeFF

[Ansirial]

On 11/16/2019 at 1:57 AM, LukeFF said:

How many missions has he flown? If you can show a screenshot that'd be great.

 

I captured this screen, pilot flew 2 sorties that day. He has been awarded with the second bar after the first one.

I checked in the local DB and he has 59 "sorties" and 31 "goodSorties" that I assume are succesful sorties

Edited November 17, 2019 by Ansirial

[LukeFF]

9 hours ago, Ansirial said:

 

I captured this screen, pilot flew 2 sorties that day. He has been awarded with the second bar after the first one.

I checked in the local DB and he has 59 "sorties" and 31 "goodSorties" that I assume are succesful sorties

 

Thanks! Yes, it sounds like it is being awarded too often. I'll make a report about it. 

[Chief_Mouser]

Every time I start a Tempest career the whole squadron - except me - are awarded the AFC after the first mission. Some of them twice.

[PatrickAWlson]

Looking at historical aces it seems that top aces are more often given top awards that are generally for singular acts of heroism.  Once an ace really gets to the top the powers that be find a way (for the record, I do not view this as a bad thing). Bishop and McCudden were given the VC, Bong and McGuire got the MoH.  I question if the individual achievement would have gotten them that award without the continuous track record of success that preceded it.

 

In PWCG I do something where your odds of receiving the top award are more likely after you have already had success.  The award is still tied to a specific achievement, but said achievement need not be as exceptional as it was 20 victories ago.

[Ansirial]

Just a little other note: I think also I earned DSO a little easily:

12 successful sorties

7 air kill

43 vehicles destroyed

 

Maybe is right, but just for sure I'm reporting it.

Together with DSO I also earned AFC by the way...

 

Waiting to RAF check, I tested a littles USAAF and also seems there is something strange with Air Medal:

For instance it happens it is never awarded without cluster, sometimes it happens it is awarded directly with 3 cluster (even if the pilot did not shot down anyone in that mission).

Here in the screen you can see it awarded twice (1 cluster) even with only a kill.

 

Edited November 19, 2019 by Ansirial

[Ansirial]

I just noticed something has changed after last update. Thanks for the fix.

I see now after the first day there is a sort of normalization of missing awards.

 

By the way something is not completely clear to me.

In the luftwaffe fighter career, where I already earn the gold clasp, today I got a reearned the bronze and the silver one (note the dates).

 

In the U.S.A.A.F career instead I still can't understand how Air Medal is given: 1 air medal per kill as written in the description?

If I will get 30 kills, will I have an Air medal with 6 silver clusters?

At the moment does't seems so (and maybe is right and supposed to be so).

 

To finish I would like to report this:

Two of my mates in the squadron earned Hero of Soviet Union with 11 and 15 air kills.

Don't know if is normal, but seem strange. 

Edited December 1, 2019 by Ansirial

[US63_SpadLivesMatter]

Why can't you guys just be happy for your squadmates??

 

[Sublime]

4 hours ago, Ansirial said:

I just noticed something has changed after last update. Thanks for the fix.

I see now after the first day there is a sort of normalization of missing awards.

 

By the way something is not completely clear to me.

In the luftwaffe fighter career, where I already earn the gold clasp, today I got a reearned the bronze and the silver one (note the dates).

 

In the U.S.A.A.F career instead I still can't understand how Air Medal is given: 1 air medal per kill as written in the description?

If I will get 30 kills, will I have an Air medal with 6 silver clusters?

At the moment does't seems so (and maybe is right and supposed to be so).

 

To finish I would like to report this:

Two of my mates in the squadron earned Hero of Soviet Union with 11 and 15 air kills.

Don't know if is normal, but seem strange. 

Wow.  I never even seen half those medals in game. 

[LukeFF]

6 hours ago, Ansirial said:

By the way something is not completely clear to me.

In the luftwaffe fighter career, where I already earn the gold clasp, today I got a reearned the bronze and the silver one (note the dates).

 

Yes, it's alright. The file has been reconfigured so that it will show your earlier bronze and silver clasps.

 

6 hours ago, Ansirial said:

In the U.S.A.A.F career instead I still can't understand how Air Medal is given: 1 air medal per kill as written in the description?

If I will get 30 kills, will I have an Air medal with 6 silver clusters?

At the moment does't seems so (and maybe is right and supposed to be so).

 

1 Air Medal for each of your first 4 kills (or every 10 missions completed), and then a DFC for your fifth (there is a small bug right now, but it should be fixed in the next update). This reflects how the awards were typically awarded in the ETO by late '43 / early 1944.

 

6 hours ago, Ansirial said:

Two of my mates in the squadron earned Hero of Soviet Union with 11 and 15 air kills.

Don't know if is normal, but seem strange. 

 

Yes, it's fine. The first HSU title was typically given for when a pilot reached 10 air victories.

[Ansirial]

2 hours ago, LukeFF said:

 

Yes, it's alright. The file has been reconfigured so that it will show your earlier bronze and silver clasps.

 

 

1 Air Medal for each of your first 4 kills (or every 10 missions completed), and then a DFC for your fifth (there is a small bug right now, but it should be fixed in the next update). This reflects how the awards were typically awarded in the ETO by late '43 / early 1944.

 

 

Yes, it's fine. The first HSU title was typically given for when a pilot reached 10 air victories.

 

Simply great! I love these details ? 

[danielprates]

Just started a career for the P38. First flight, shot down two 109s (one of them felt more like a shared victory to me). I was awarded both an Air Medal and a Silver Star! That seems too excessive.

[LukeFF]

1 minute ago, danielprates said:

Just started a career for the P38. First flight, shot down two 109s (one of them felt more like a shared victory to me). I was awarded both an Air Medal and a Silver Star! That seems too excessive.

 

Not excessive at all - the Silver Star was commonly awarded for shooting down 2 or more planes in a single mission, and the Air Medal was awarded for each plane shot down.

[danielprates]

19 minutes ago, LukeFF said:

 

Not excessive at all - the Silver Star was commonly awarded for shooting down 2 or more planes in a single mission, and the Air Medal was awarded for each plane shot down.

 

Well, I stand corrected: seems like I should have gotten two air medals! Hehehe.

 

Its both of them at the same time which seems too much. But if they are warrented, ok then! Mo'power to me.

[LukeFF]

17 minutes ago, danielprates said:

 

Well, I stand corrected: seems like I should have gotten two air medals! Hehehe.

 

Its both of them at the same time which seems too much. But if they are warrented, ok then! Mo'power to me.

 

Yes, back then there was a lot of controversy about how the Air Medal should be awarded - up to around 1944, there was a lot of what was referred to as "score-carding", where a pilot simply earned an Air Medal for meeting an arbitrary set of requirements, with the result that a pilot could complete his tour with a chest full of medals. Each numbered Air Force tried to resolve the issue in their own way - some more successful than others, but in the end it was a right mess. The award system for the game more or less follows "official" policy for 8th and 9th AF fighter pilots circa 1943-1944.

 

There's an informative article about the Air Medal and DFC awarding process during WWII linked to at the Wikipedia page about the Air Medal. 

Edited December 6, 2019 by LukeFF

[danielprates]

1 hour ago, LukeFF said:

 

Yes, back then there was a lot of controversy about how the Air Medal should be awarded - up to around 1944, there was a lot of what was referred to as "score-carding", where a pilot simply earned an Air Medal for meeting an arbitrary set of requirements, with the result that a pilot could complete his tour with a chest full of medals. Each numbered Air Force tried to resolve the issue in their own way - some more successful than others, but in the end it was a right mess. The award system for the game more or less follows "official" policy for 8th and 9th AF fighter pilots circa 1943-1944.

 

There's an informative article about the Air Medal and DFC awarding process during WWII linked to at the Wikipedia page about the Air Medal. 

 

Hmmmm. Funny how criteria for decorations can become outdated. I remeber reading in Yeager's memoirs that a certain medal (can't remember which) had a flight-hours criteria set in the 1940s, which was still valid until the Vietnam war. The result was most helicopter pilots being eligible to a medal a day, more or less!