strugling with city fires after bombing

[jollyjack]

A lot to ask? Reading manuals, and seeing videos there is a lot of info, but i still can't get the situation right as described below.

 

Got some J78 bombing a city area, linked buildings grouped, and fire effects also linked.

Now what i can't comprehend is how to make a fire and smoke start AFTER the bombs have damaged the buildings.

 

PS i use CMD AttackArea command, maybe i should use CMD Atack instead ... area seems a bit dodgy.

 

Thus can someone help me out by creating a simple (?) example group? So that i understand what various triggers and timers can do in this situation:

 

Ai Bomber flies into the attack zone, drops a bomb on target, building destroyed, and a fire, and or smoke starts after the bomb hits it's target, and lasts for quite some time while the Ai plane continues it's route.

 

I'll try to build another tester starting with that ...

So far i only had the bombing OK, but the fires came too early, lasting too long. Trigger timers etc not set, as i have to figure out still a bit how they work.

[IRRE_Genius]

Re,

 

1) add an entity to the building

2) you need to link your building object event (damaged or destroy) to the mcu play animation/effect

[jollyjack]

entity? country, and event, in block advanced add event? ?

Edited November 9, 2019 by jollyjack

[IRRE_Genius]

Yes

 

Block advanced = add event "on damaged" => target link to MCU "Command effect"

Command effect "start" = action type "start"

MCU "Command effect" => Object link to effect  "city fire" (effect "city fire" need an entity)

 

effect duration is like 5 second (you may be need to use a timer to make a constant effect) => see editor manuel p.290-291

 

Edited November 9, 2019 by -IRRE-Genius

[jollyjack]

it partly works, but i still have city fires burning before the bombs falling that are meant to cause them, i am going to start from the beginning again.

[JimTM]

36 minutes ago, jollyjack said:

it partly works, but i still have city fires burning before the bombs falling that are meant to cause them, i am going to start from the beginning again.

 

If you are using the "Effect Sustainer" (pg. 290 in the manual), you need to object link "Out A1" and "Out D1" to the city fire effects. The city fire effect starts automatically at mission start, so "Out D1" stops the effect at mission start and "Out A1" starts the effect when it is needed.

Edited November 9, 2019 by JimTM

[jollyjack]

Hi Jim, nope, but will give it a try .... tomorrow, day of the Lord, keeps me from getting bored ...

[jollyjack]

OK trying it right now. But what should i link where to the to the Effect Sustainer? This to make the city fires start AFTER the bombs fell. Attack Area to your 'In Start' timer?

Edited November 11, 2019 by jollyjack

[JimTM]

You need a link to the In Start: 0s timer of the Effect Sustainer that indicates if the target is damaged or destroyed. For example, in the case of a single building, that link could be an OnDamaged or OnKilled event message link. If you have multiple buildings, you could use a Multi-Input Counter (pg. 292) to detect when all the buildings are destroyed, in which case the OUT counter should be linked to the effect sustainer. The logic that triggers the effect sustainer is up to you. 

Edited November 11, 2019 by JimTM

[IckyATLAS]

If this can help here is the following process I use for my carpet bombing and setting city Heerlen on fire. (see in the forum Screenshots and Movies my short Heerlen story)

 

1) Decide where you will put the attack areas. For a complete city like Heerlen I have 12 attack areas each related to a group of three bombers (1 leader and two wingmen). Set the dimensions of the attack areas so that they cover the city but do not overlap.

 

2) Set the resistance value of all the blocks inside the attack zones to a very little number. I put 1000 or 0 is also fine. Very easy and quick to do. Just select all the blocks and then you change the value, and all will be changed in one shot. This ensures that there is damage whatever the size of the bomb that hits the area. If you want to have selectivity and preserve certain buildings then change their value to higher values accordingly. I was looking for total destruction.

 

3) Create linked entities for all the blocks that are inside each attack area zone.

 

4) For each Attack Area Zone I have a specific separate logic. This is because every zone does get hit at different moments. And some zones are factories and others are buildings. So the fires will be different. So you have to manage each zone separately.

 

5) Each block inside an attack zone when hit will send a message report "OnDamaged" (blue link) to a counter set to 1.

 

6) The counter is used to act as a dispatcher to target other MCUs and as a filter to be sure that the OnDamage signal is sent only one time.

 

7) The counter links to a Timer that links to a Damage Command. This one links back to all the blocks (or those you want to) inside the damaged zone and set them to Complete destruction. The timer allows you to set some delay between the bombs damage and the total destruction. Which is realistic. Damage takes time after the bombing to be total. If you set the right Resistance value to a block it will be only partially destroyed at the bombing and completely later due to fire etc.

 

(8) The counter links also to another Timer that links to the Fire logic. Depending on which fires you use you can have complex logic like the one to sustain the City Fire. Just know that without any start effect city fire just burns with no smoke column and this is also interesting to use at night bombing where you do not see the smoke columns like in day bombings. So if you have many city fires without smoke, the CPU/GPU will handle this much better and you will have higher FPS. In night bombing you do not need the complex logic to sustain continuous city fire smoke. The timer will allow the fire to start after a certain delay. Do not forget that when buildings are destroyed you get multiple smaller fires automatically generated by the system. They do not last long but let them do the initial effect which is just perfect. Then you start your own fires larger or smaller depending what you want to do.

 

So by playing with the two timers the one for total destruction and the other for the fires you can have a very realistic scenario:

 

a) Bombs fall and hit a city block

b) Some buildings get damaged and fires start

c) The fires become much larger and the damage increases

d) Everything is destroyed.

 

9) I have also set AAA flak 37 guns all over the city and searchlights. I leave them to their fate. No control here. Some get destroyed when a 1000 pound bomb hits nearby or not if it is a 100 pound one. 

 

10) I have also put in the city streets a column of vehicles and tanks, and nearby the Railway station a train. Here I also ensure that when the vehicles are in a bombed block zone they get destroyed and up in flames. I have added a specific logic that targets the vehicles with their timer and damage command.

 

11) There is an issue however. Some unique nice buildings like the Railway station of Heerlen as well as another nice large city building cannot be destroyed. It seems they have no model of the destroyed building implemented. They do not react to anything even a complete destruction Damage Command. And you can do nothing because the Delete and Spawn command does not work for blocks. My idea was to Delete the building, then Spawn another building or some of them together that can be damaged so that to mimic a larger destroyed building. 

But this does not work. Devs please can you improve this. Thanks.

 

So if your computer can handle all this like mine  at the most hectic moment where everything is active (goes down to less than 10 FPS when you are in the city streets but not for long), then go for it. In average when over the city during the bombing fires and AAA fire seen from the plane you get 30/40 FPS if you look at the city below. Otherwise you jump quickly to 60/70, and then over 100 FPS.

 

In a few years with new CPUs coming (maybe from AMD this time) and future GPUs, and if Devs start using more cores on a given CPU we may be able to handle this kind of scenario at a constant 60 FPS which is perfect.

 

 

 

 

Edited November 13, 2019 by IckyATLAS

[Hucky]

maybe that helps some people.

 

 

And an ZIP File

City Fire Test.zip

[jollyjack]

Hey, thanks guys, i just found these posts just now searching for "city fire"; sorry 'bout that.

The city fire zip does what i am after BTW.  The way all those MCUs communicate here is certainly food for study on my behalf.

I'll dig a little further in this one tomorrow., and have a look at the extensive instructions list from Icky. Maybe some add-on for Jim's manual?

 

I just tried making up a new mission where again a Ju87 keeps cycling and won't Ai bomb. Messing with height, distances between WPs, type of attack commands etc.

 

----------------------------------------

 

Must confess i was messing around with train simulators a little recently. Figured out that Il2 is far more fun due the FMB ! Aslo the trains BTW ...

That if the devs fix that darn erroneous Ai bombing and cycling in 4.002. But running the above city-zip mission file all seems OK however.

But my added player MC202 neutral plane to the above city fire mission keeps cycling, though i set the route to follow your Ju88 bombers IMO correctly.

 

Sideliner: Train sims are IMO for reality freaks mostly, don't mention the word 'game' on a forum there. They will run you down with a train.

The main drawback of train sims is the long waiting at stations for zombie-passengers to embark, and if you don't do that you'll be punished by red light signals etc.

Blowing some hefty whistle on you as you're dead. Games as TSW 2020 have far better graphics however as the older versions.

Only the ' mission' type were freight hauling jobs and trying to get heavy loads up a hill with supporting locs to add by yourself are nice for a while.

 

Il2 forever, thanks Oleg and al the ones that keep expanding it. .....

 

Edited December 15, 2019 by jollyjack
added

[Beebop]

On 12/13/2019 at 11:33 AM, jollyjack said:

The main drawback of train sims is the long waiting at stations for zombie-passengers to embark, and if you don't do that you'll be punished by red light signals etc.

Sounds like my days of being a Light Rail Operator except the passengers were anything, and everything, but zombies.  ?

[jollyjack]

I must say the 'humans' in IL2 behave quite like these trainsim zombies. They sit around quite a while, or lay flat bellied in a He111.

And if you raise timescale a wee bit, they start swinging in a sort of stoned way.

 

But when you press game exit the passengers in a FC1 2-seater at least suddenly live-up, jump to their feet panicky looking for a way to stay alive a bit longer,

leaving me behind with windows desktop wondering wonder what's up next ...

 

For sure i respect the devs for the running away of ILs humans from exploding situations like tanks and train wagons.

Though I also wonder a bit why they then always fall down on their faces after a few yards of olympic running attemps,

and suddenly disappear before a medic can save their life, even with a parked ambulance nearby. 

 

But lets face it, IL2 is getting better and better .... And for all you renegade FS2020 fans, something not there even LoL

A damage model after a plane crash or a mid air collision? Hurray for Il2, i just survived a Bristol collision while the opponent lost wings etc.

Edited October 6, 2020 by jollyjack